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Electronico6 posted:But regardless more of these card games should have their lead designers talk trash to reddit fools. They'll figure out sooner or later like other devs that what people really want to hear is "we are listening to you, thanks for your valuable game design advice, you're special", not actual developer insights where they might be wrong.
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Sep 23, 2017 11:37
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Captainicus posted:5 games in a row against enemies packing scorch when I'm trying to play resilient Unseen Elder deck...don't tell me scorch is back and is going to be in every deck, I liked not having to be concerned about playing multiple same strength units like henselt -> drummers or multiple ghouls eating fiends. Don't run Unseen Elder. There's a reason most consume decks switched to Dagon and trying to fight the tide is ridiculous. Take it from a guy who wasted way too long playing Fringella gambit, any deck that relies on getting a single big resilient unit on the board is going to be really streaking and unreliable. Standard meta these days seems to be at least one targeted removal card in every deck, plus mass removal if you have low tempo or are playing control. Without gold immunity, you're a sitting duck. Either try to bait out their removal early and hope for the best, or run a different deck. As for Scorch, it's a pretty solid counter for a lot of Nilf Spies and NR decks, so expect it to stick around in the meta.
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Sep 23, 2017 12:26
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Yeah, I initially decided to give it a go because the only removal I was seeing was artefact compression and as long as I didn't get hit by radovid, it would go well... but I was probably wrong about that. I'm sure as soon as I change it around I'll go straight back to only playing against point-amassing enemy-ignoring decks, though!  I don't really like the monsters leaders at the minute... it feels like dagon weather just gets cleared if you aren't playing an all in lots of weather deck, unseen elder is mostly used to take things out of one row so they don't get igni'd or hailstormed, and eredin isn't useful outside of a frost deck. It doesn't feel like skellige, NR, or scoiatel where you get a good choice of utility.
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Sep 23, 2017 14:17
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Dagon weather will always be pretty solid because of the way weather clear works. He has a body and even if someone clears weather the very next turn, you still get that tick of damage If your opponent uses clear skies, that's a whole turn that won't get them anything besides maybe like a 3 point silver mage. The only times you might actually lose tempo by playing Dagon is when they have targeted weather clear with a body, like a Standard Bearer, they have some other counter like Zoltan, or they're in a position where they can just ignore the ticking weather and out-tempo you. Even if Dagon is the only weather card in the deck and you're not running foglets, I'd still say he's a stronger play than Unseen Elder and certainly much harder to punish. I've played against plenty of Dagon decks that just ran him, Woodland Spirits, water hag, and a solitary foglet. At that point, it's not really a "weather deck," it's just a deck that happens to have weather as part of its toolkit. Eredin seems fine too, but only really makes sense in the Wild Hunt deck and I feel like the WH synergy isn't quite where it needs to be yet. Dagon just has a cool thing he does and, aside from maybe wanting to run a foglet, doesn't really require you to commit a bunch of other cards to making him work, which is the main advantage he had even before they broke UE. Dagon isn't going to win the game for you single-handedly anymore (unless your opponent is out of weather clears), but he's still stupidly easy to get value out of and is popular for a reason.
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Sep 23, 2017 14:39
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Yeah, that's probably fair enough, and it isn't crazy to fit one foglet into a deck for a bit of extra points in the event of no clear. I'll probably just stop using UE and swap over to dagon, it is probably more useful than slightly bigger nekkers.
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Sep 23, 2017 14:51
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Haha I turned on the twitch steam of the GwentSlam tournament just in time to watch the game crash in the middle of a match. Apparently this is the second time it has happened today. Sounds like it is the "player one is looking in a graveyard when player two plays a card that pulls from the graveyard" bug.
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Sep 23, 2017 17:49
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ESPORTS ready game
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Sep 23, 2017 17:54
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Mill highest winrate deck at 4k+ MMR get rid of this archetype in a game like gwent please
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Sep 23, 2017 19:52
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frajaq posted:Mill highest winrate deck at 4k+ MMR It's a sort of cool idea, the only thing remotely close to a counter to hyper thinning decks. It's just so loving slow though.
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Sep 23, 2017 21:47
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I think mill is fine and belongs in the game as a counter current to hyper-thinning decks that would otherwise be too absurdly reliable. Card games are supposed to get replayability and variety through the random element of which cards you draw and which you don't, but Gwent has unusually small deck sizes compared to most card games (so people could draw their golds consistently?) and as tutors and thinning have gotten more prevalent, it has gotten easier to build a deck that will never leave your most valuable cards sitting undrawn at the bottom. These decks are inherently more consistent, but also less interesting to play with and against. Mill is a useful check on that trend, but the problem it has right now is it itself is a very consistent deck because of all its drawing. I think the way forward is probably to make Avelach more limited and give mill other tools to make up for it.
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Sep 24, 2017 01:47
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I really dislike the idea of specific decks that counter other ones with very consistent winrates against their counter. "Oh, I queued into emhyr and drew badly, time to forfeit." Give us more tools like Avalach, The Guardian, etc that punish thinning in general. Don't make specific counter archetypes that make for rock paper scissors matchups.
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Sep 24, 2017 01:59
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I'm too low rank to actually play against any mill decks, but I am left wondering if magne division is going to get an adjustment of some kind...
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Sep 24, 2017 02:30
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I took a couple of weeks off so I'm fairly low ranked at the moment. Decided to try a mill deck to see what the fuss is about. 3/5 opponents had more cards than me.
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Sep 24, 2017 09:05
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I got hit by the graveyard bug in my last match to get into Master Rank 
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Sep 24, 2017 10:02
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Rethaz getting mad on Reddit again, after saying things in Twitch chat https://www.reddit.com/user/rethaz https://www.reddit.com/r/gwent/comments/7256qi/rethaz_answers_questions_about_gwents_balance/ quote:[–]rethaz [+7] 15 points 47 minutes ago*
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Sep 24, 2017 18:03
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Minrad posted:Rethaz getting mad on Reddit again, after saying things in Twitch chat Rethaz is a brave man for going after both Twitch chat and Reddit. All he needs now is some twitter feuds. It seems too that CDPR changed the mulligan system and didn't tell anyone, so the image on the OP is wrong now. It no longer works like that. Instead when you blacklist a card during the mulligan, the copies that were in the deck(not the ones you mulligan) get moved up on the list, or something? The mulligan in this game is both the best and the worst at times.
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Sep 25, 2017 10:30
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edit: Why the hell would they change mulligans and not say anything about it? It's something people have been clamoring for, even if the change isn't exactly what they wanted.
Various Meat Products fucked around with this message at 14:09 on Sep 25, 2017 |
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Sep 25, 2017 13:52
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I assume they made one part of the obvious change - when you mulligan a card it's only put back in after the final mulligan. Given that he's being sly, though, I assume that blacklisted copies are still drawn around meaning that you're still more likely to draw a blacklisted card post-mulligan. There are decent reasons for preserving this behavior. The alternative behavior, of removing all blacklisted cards from the deck and shuffling them in post-mull, would lead to some weird interactions. For example, having your opponent play the Guardian round 2 would make you draw your first copy of the lesser guardian, then mulling it would shuffle both copies of lesser guardian into the deck randomly. I don't know whether it's worth the trade off, but whatever, people seem capable of living with it. I think rethaz is usually funny but he's very childish about the mulligan thing and expecting players to empirically determine what their mechanic is. Like this response though: quote:rethaz: Golden Weather is a weird one, they go from being overpowered to "Garbage" without us making changes to them and I imagine the same will happen in the next patch, guess we will see
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Sep 25, 2017 14:03
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I'll update the OP. Does anyone know exactly how the mulligan system works so I can update correctly?
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Sep 25, 2017 14:32
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ShowTime posted:I'll update the OP. Does anyone know exactly how the mulligan system works so I can update correctly? Some dude on reddit is crushing some numbers, so far his conclusions are this: quote:Conclusion: The original mulligan bug (The one that makes you 2x as likely to redraw Crones, etc.) is likely gone. Unique cards will only be drawn with the same frequency as every other card. The mulligan bug that remains isn't really a bug - it relates to the other copies of the card in your deck moving up in the deck, while not being able to be drawn due to blacklisting. I guess it's going to take sometime until more people actual do more tests, but we do know now via Rethaz that mulligan no longer works like it use to.
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Sep 25, 2017 14:44
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Various Meat Products posted:edit: Why the hell would they change mulligans and not say anything about it? It's something people have been clamoring for, even if the change isn't exactly what they wanted. To dramatically win an internet argument against someone who is complaining about at a thing that has actually been stealth fixed? The way they do and don't disclose information is so bizarre, its reactive instead of proactive. In a perverse way it encourages people to complain because that seems to be the best method to gain additional information about the game.
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Sep 25, 2017 16:46
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Electronico6 posted:Some dude on reddit is crushing some numbers, so far his conclusions are this:
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Sep 25, 2017 16:52
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Subvisual Haze posted:To dramatically win an internet argument against someone who is complaining about at a thing that has actually been stealth fixed? People didn't figure out blacklisting during the first 3-4 months of CB. Once Swim and others started to write and make videos about it, people started to notice that you tended to draw muligan cards more often. Because nobody knew better it was called a bug. People are still calling it Mulligan Bug today, despite Rethaz saying it was working as intended, because ofc it has to be a bug, why would a dev do that.  The game is filled with these weird interactions that aren't documented, and the only way to figure them out is extensive testing. Like how Nilfgaard Knight doesn't actually do what it says it do. He doesn't reveal a random card on your hand, he reveals a random card based on colour. So if you have bronzes, he will always reveal a bronze, if you have Silvers or Golds but no bronzes, he will always reveal the silver. Same thing with what triggers before what. Like during Gwentslam, none of the casters knew what triggered first, drought weather effect or Dol Blathana Trapper fireball trap.(And I can't remember what triggered first now either )No Wave posted:Sweet. That's exactly what I'd assumed. The simplest solution is to reshuffle blacklisted cards as you draw them instead of drawing around them - you could even graphically show this occurring. But it does have some gameplay consequences (the Guardian being the simplest example). As is this mull change solves a significant part of the problem. Cantarella too, as an example that is played more often. If you decide to not draw the first card, that one goes to the bottom, if the deck is shuffled, then welp.
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Sep 25, 2017 17:27
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Shuffling the deck entirely is a terrible solution and those suggesting it are plebs (Nekker Warrior is the best example of how bad a suggestion this is). Shuffling only blacklisted cards back into your deck if they're on top of your deck during mulligan instead of drawing around them is however sane though it still has some implications.
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Sep 25, 2017 17:36
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Electronico6 posted:The game is filled with these weird interactions that aren't documented, and the only way to figure them out is extensive testing. Like how Nilfgaard Knight doesn't actually do what it says it do. He doesn't reveal a random card on your hand, he reveals a random card based on colour. So if you have bronzes, he will always reveal a bronze, if you have Silvers or Golds but no bronzes, he will always reveal the silver. Holy smokes, is this actually true? That'd make a deck with nilfgaard knights, combined with footsoldiers and fire scorpions, way better than it seems. I haven't played nilfgaard knight in forever, nor have my opponents, so I've never noticed this...
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Sep 25, 2017 17:49
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Captainicus posted:Holy smokes, is this actually true? That'd make a deck with nilfgaard knights, combined with footsoldiers and fire scorpions, way better than it seems. I haven't played nilfgaard knight in forever, nor have my opponents, so I've never noticed this... It's how it works and nobody seemed to have noticed until Lifecoach started to goof around with reveal, 4 weeks ago or so. I think Garunah also came to a similar conclusion early on last season, but he never did the testing like Lifecoach. At first he was convinced that there was a hidden bonus that Nilfgaard Knights revealed cards that benefited from the effect(Foot Soldiers, Scorpion). After a bunch of test runs, he concluded that there was no hidden bonus and that the Knight did randomly reveal a card but there is a order of reveal, first bronzes, if no bronzes then silvers, if none then golds. Once you know this, it's the sort of thing you will never not notice, and start to take in account. This means if your hand is 1 spotter, 1 knight and Geralt, you can just go ahead and concede, there is no 50-50.
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Sep 25, 2017 18:07
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Duckbox posted:I think mill is fine and belongs in the game as a counter current to hyper-thinning decks that would otherwise be too absurdly reliable. Card games are supposed to get replayability and variety through the random element of which cards you draw and which you don't, but Gwent has unusually small deck sizes compared to most card games (so people could draw their golds consistently?) and as tutors and thinning have gotten more prevalent, it has gotten easier to build a deck that will never leave your most valuable cards sitting undrawn at the bottom. These decks are inherently more consistent, but also less interesting to play with and against. Gwent is usually touted by its users as having very little RNG relative to other card games. The problem with minimizing RNG (small decks, lots of tutor effects, start the game with cards in hand instead of slowly drawing them over the course of the game, nerfing golds so their presence in opening hand doesn't determine matchups) is that it can very easily make matches feel very same-y in how they play out and exacerbate minor power variations between cards/decks.
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Sep 25, 2017 19:09
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Oh hey outta nowhere Dev Stream tomorrow for next patch. NR and hailstorm nerfs most likely, maybe more stuff on the tech patch CDPR has been teasing for over a month, or that ale festival thing. https://twitter.com/PlayGwent/status/912690610880073733
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Sep 26, 2017 16:03
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Come on anti-graveyard hate for Skellige
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Sep 26, 2017 20:37
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I am not betting on it, but it would be nice to see a little love for Unseen Elder. I love monsters but am sick of being forced to play Dagon with my consume cards to be competitive.
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Sep 27, 2017 00:45
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Weirdly, making the other monsters competitive could actually be a significant boost to Dagon. With current meta, people are usually running at least one weather clear because the silver mages are all really good cards anyway, but the other weather clears are more unreliable/low tempo, so you don't want to run them unless you have to. Gold weather by itself isn't really prevalent enough to force people to run more than one or two clears (and only "became" good because people were skimping on clears), but given that Dagon was already a top-tier leader and now he's the only one most Monsters run, you can expect to be playing against a Dagon deck like a third of the time. This means that those otherwise sub-par clear effects like Griffin and Standard Bearer become much safer to include because getting to immediately shut down your opponent's weather in one game is probably going to matter more than playing a slightly low tempo card in the next two. Put Unseen Consume (or some hypothetical non-frost-based Eredin) back in the mix and the rate at which you run into Dagon decks drops dramatically, which means (assuming no other weather decks become ubiquitous) that anti-weather tech becomes less benefit with more cost. People don't want to tech against a leader they only see every ten games or so, so they stop running clears, but that of course means that murdering people with weather monsters becomes a valid strategy again, which would make Dagon more popular, which would make people tech against weather again, which would make Dagon less popular, which would make people stop running weather tech, which... huh. So I guess that's why weather is unbalanceable.
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Sep 27, 2017 11:50
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Mahakam Ale Festival is a series of six challenge missions that give ore, powder, and a portrait+title+frame. Gold cards are now immune to hailstorm First light boosts all damaged allies by 1 under weather in addition to clearing all weather. Restore sets base power of a bronze or silver unit in graveyard to 10 then puts it in your hand, woah. Heavy Cavalry are now 7 power, but are also agile. Prince Stennis is now 3 power, 3 armor. Shani now grants 2 armor instead of 5. Neneke agile, can no longer shuffle special cards. Lots of minor power adjustments and cards gaining agility, very "eh" on that change personally. 20 new cards with next new season, sounds like Thronebreaker isn't gonna be released until later. Also there's some big changes planned for the end of the year as well as huge tech changes that will let you use deck builder and collection together. Minera fucked around with this message at 20:31 on Sep 27, 2017 |
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Sep 27, 2017 20:21
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restore is the skellige special silver, right?
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Sep 27, 2017 20:32
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Yeah it's a pretty nice buff. Obvious use is getting a 10 power Queensguard but you can also use it on niche things like rezzing a discarded Priestess to make it a 9 power sigrdrifa, buff dorregray or gremist and then rez one with sigrdrifa later for an insane amount of value, or you can just hit an axeman. Depending on priority it should still buff a base skirmisher to 13, I think.
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Sep 27, 2017 20:40
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So restore becomes pretty similar to a spy, but better? Seems kind of sketchy.
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Sep 27, 2017 20:49
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Woodlands Spirit not nerfed and mill untouched? excuse me?
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Sep 27, 2017 21:18
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Restore looks like the most busted card ever made (not exaggerating). Zero power spy that puts a buffed minion into your hand from your graveyard? Am I reading that correctly? Edit: Oh you then play a card from your hand. Kind of awkward implementation tho card might be good. Disaster averted. No Wave fucked around with this message at 21:27 on Sep 27, 2017 |
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Sep 27, 2017 21:21
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Restore still works the same way it has since the last patch, it will just set base strength of the unit in question to 10 instead of strengthening it by 2 now. Presumably that's to prevent it being used on giant Skirmishers.
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Sep 27, 2017 21:42
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dennyk posted:Restore still works the same way it has since the last patch, it will just set base strength of the unit in question to 10 instead of strengthening it by 2 now. Presumably that's to prevent it being used on giant Skirmishers. It has the potential to be a really big Skellige finisher. If you discard a Priestess of Freya, you can as your last play restore it as a 10 point unit, and then use the Freya to res your big Skirmisher/Queensguard/Greatsword. 10+ your best res is a pretty good play. Maybe even enough to make Kambi work!
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Sep 27, 2017 23:39
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I'm thinking everything being agile or near everything being agile is to weaken the effects of weather and such, right? Prevents or diminishes situations in which you need to take a bunch of weather damage against a white frost or gold weather because you have to put something of medium strength on a row on its own. I don't mind the game being taken in this direction, personally, it doesn't bother me when ballistae end up on the melee row and berserkers on the siege row.
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Sep 28, 2017 05:26
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