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admanb posted:Why would you run 1e if you don't think mediocrity is fun? Because I'm lazy and don't want to convert the adventures to something more modern.
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# ? Sep 26, 2017 21:04 |
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# ? Jun 5, 2024 05:16 |
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You would have an easier time converting a module into a higher-powered game than you'll have trying to turn 1e into a higher-powered game.
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# ? Sep 26, 2017 21:23 |
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Hypnobeard posted:I'm working on a 1e game, with the intent of running TAGDQ, but I'm not particularly interested in running bare 1e. I've come up with some house rules, and I'd like some other eyes to look them over and point out unexpected things that I'm missing. I'm writing my own retroclone with the same basic idea (mediocrity is annoying), and looking at this I don't think you've really touched on what makes characters mediocre at low levels. The real culprits are ultra-low HP (a cat is a genuine threat; though max HP helps here it doesn't mitigate it entirely) and the difficulty to hit anything (an 18/00 Str fighter with double weapon specialization--the creme de la 1st-level creme--is hitting a lowly AC 7 kobold opponent only 65% of the time, or an AC 6 Goblin 60%; most other characters, including all non-rangers/fighters, are never getting it that good). A single 5% bonus to XP is going to be effectively meaningless and just result in more math for you to perform at the end of every session. At the same time, a single-class human with a high Prime Req stat (which is the next thing to automatic thanks to your ability score method) getting +20% XP might encourage a certain one-dimensionality to your party.
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# ? Sep 27, 2017 00:01 |
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If you want to remove mediocrity from 1E I would start with something like Scarlet Heroes/Godbound's Fray dice and HD damage.
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# ? Sep 27, 2017 00:10 |
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Xotl posted:I'm writing my own retroclone with the same basic idea (mediocrity is annoying), and looking at this I don't think you've really touched on what makes characters mediocre at low levels. The real culprits are ultra-low HP (a cat is a genuine threat; though max HP helps here it doesn't mitigate it entirely) and the difficulty to hit anything (an 18/00 Str fighter with double weapon specialization--the creme de la 1st-level creme--is hitting a lowly AC 7 kobold opponent only 65% of the time, or an AC 6 Goblin 60%; most other characters, including all non-rangers/fighters, are never getting it that good). I'm mostly looking to avoid the issues that the usual die methods for ability generation run into. I'm perfectly fine with characters that have above-average or maxed prime reqs. That idea was actually why I set the point total where I did. I'm not sure I'm willing to go all out on HP, doing something like doubling HP at first level or adding Con to the total, so some fragility may be inevitable. As for low hit probabilities, that's somewhat inherent in 1e, I think. I'm looking to give starting characters a leg up, not redo the game entirely. If I was, I'd either make a heartbreaker or play something else entirely, with better math. That's a good point about the bonus XP. I'll cap the bonus at 10%, which gives humans a slight advantage in that they basically always get some bonus even if the class doesn't normally allow it. Hopefully there will still be some diversity in the party, though I'm not really worried if there isn't. Fiddly math at the end of sessions is a thing for RPGs of the era, no?
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# ? Sep 27, 2017 02:08 |
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These look all good to me, Hypnobeard. The only thing I would watch out for is that HP is still going to be low. When I ran AD&D I had hit points maxed out per HD.
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# ? Sep 27, 2017 03:08 |
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Scarlet Heroes is literally about making 1e AD&D characters more powerful. I think you should check it out.
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# ? Sep 27, 2017 04:23 |
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You're supposed to roll the HP for monsters in older editions, right? Like, not every orc has 16 HP--if they have 2 HD, wouldn't the HP on individual orcs range from 2 to 16?
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# ? Sep 27, 2017 11:49 |
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A Strange Aeon posted:You're supposed to roll the HP for monsters in older editions, right? Like, not every orc has 16 HP--if they have 2 HD, wouldn't the HP on individual orcs range from 2 to 16? Correct. This was still the case even up to 3e. In modules, oftentimes the monster HP would already be rolled for you, so a statline might have something like "3 Orcs, 2, 5, 9 HP; 2 HD". The HP amounts are the actual HP amounts that they have after the rolling 2d8 in hit dice, but they still tell you the hit dice because that's relevant for stuff like to-hit rolls.
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# ? Sep 27, 2017 11:53 |
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I always thought rolling monster hp was the dumbest thing back when I played 3e, but once I started playing older editions I realized I actually really like it. For each monster I can just use one die to track the number of HD a creature has left and another for the current HD and avoid needing to write down anything on paper. It's an elegant mechanic that just becomes weird nonsense the moment you introduce CON bonuses.
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# ? Sep 27, 2017 18:08 |
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OtspIII posted:I always thought rolling monster hp was the dumbest thing back when I played 3e, but once I started playing older editions I realized I actually really like it. For each monster I can just use one die to track the number of HD a creature has left and another for the current HD and avoid needing to write down anything on paper. It's an elegant mechanic that just becomes weird nonsense the moment you introduce CON bonuses.
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# ? Sep 27, 2017 18:53 |
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PRINCIPIA APOCRYPHA: Apocalypse Engine-style Rules And Principles For Running OSR Games
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# ? Sep 27, 2017 19:45 |
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Megazver posted:PRINCIPIA APOCRYPHA: Apocalypse Engine-style Rules And Principles For Running OSR Games I'm eager to discover whether this will be amazing, or a trash fire.
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# ? Sep 27, 2017 20:05 |
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I like rolling monster hp as they lose it, as it smooths out damage rolls.
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# ? Sep 27, 2017 20:06 |
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I've been looking into running a 4E campaign but the general sense that I'm getting is that D&D Insider is no longer a functional option unless I'm already actively subscribing to it. Is that accurate? I have 6 books of it including all 3 core books so I'm definitely not out of options if that's the case, but the campaign be over Skype with some remote players so I'm hoping there are some options available that let players access the rules without being in the same physical room as me and reading the same physical books as me
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# ? Sep 27, 2017 20:50 |
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Jenny Angel posted:I've been looking into running a 4E campaign but the general sense that I'm getting is that D&D Insider is no longer a functional option unless I'm already actively subscribing to it. Is that accurate? I have 6 books of it including all 3 core books so I'm definitely not out of options if that's the case, but the campaign be over Skype with some remote players so I'm hoping there are some options available that let players access the rules without being in the same physical room as me and reading the same physical books as me You actually can still subscribe to Insider; rumors of its demise have been greatly exaggerated. But if all you want is the character builder, there are other options.
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# ? Sep 27, 2017 21:43 |
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dwarf74 posted:Heya! FYI, there's a dedicated 4e thread here I tried doing that because I wanted access to the old Dragons and Dungeons, but there didn't seem to be a way to do it.
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# ? Sep 27, 2017 21:50 |
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dwarf74 posted:Heya! FYI, there's a dedicated 4e thread here Ah sorry, I missed that during my search, and thought it had all migrated over here due to the thread title. I'll ask over there
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# ? Sep 27, 2017 22:00 |
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Megazver posted:PRINCIPIA APOCRYPHA: Apocalypse Engine-style Rules And Principles For Running OSR Games So this is, in fact, pretty good. And although I know I will regret this, I would like to know what "I’m also wary of the apparent tension between nominal PbtA playstyles and OSR playstyles, especially in the light of recent blog posts from prominent folks in the respective communities." is supposed to mean.
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# ? Sep 27, 2017 23:33 |
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It's probably Zak S or maybe James Raggi drama again, I dunno. I recommend just ignoring it.
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# ? Sep 27, 2017 23:43 |
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Megazver posted:It's probably Zak S or maybe James Raggi drama again, I dunno. I recommend just ignoring it. Zak had a post recently that was blunt and acerbic about narrative games in the way that Zak posts always are, but I don't think it generated a particularly high amount of drama. Probably just making a big deal out of nothing tbh.
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# ? Sep 27, 2017 23:48 |
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OtspIII posted:I always thought rolling monster hp was the dumbest thing back when I played 3e, but once I started playing older editions I realized I actually really like it. For each monster I can just use one die to track the number of HD a creature has left and another for the current HD and avoid needing to write down anything on paper. It's an elegant mechanic that just becomes weird nonsense the moment you introduce CON bonuses. I don't really see the appeal of what you're describing here. However, there is a very good reason to roll monster HD. One of the major reasons why RPGs Randomized (and, importantly, hidden) monster HD serves the same effect -- players don't know exactly how many turns it'll take to kill a monster, they only have a rough, intuitive idea from their description and any monsters they've killed of the same kind before. But doing it this way means you don't have to gently caress about with random outcomes (that is, to-hit and/or damage rolls), only random preconditions, which is good for the pace of combat, eliminates boring turns where you don't accomplish anything despite making the tactically correct choice, and so on. Naturally, D&D doesn't actually take advantage of this upside.
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# ? Sep 28, 2017 00:04 |
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Megazver posted:It's probably Zak S or maybe James Raggi drama again, I dunno. I recommend just ignoring it. Good advice. I'll do so.
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# ? Sep 28, 2017 01:22 |
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admanb posted:Zak had a post recently that was blunt and acerbic about narrative games in the way that Zak posts always are, but I don't think it generated a particularly high amount of drama. Probably just making a big deal out of nothing tbh. at this point I wouldn't consider it out-of-line to just throw in that disclaimer anytime you make an even slightly innovative proposal about the OSR paradigm, just to be safe.
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# ? Sep 28, 2017 02:44 |
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Oh, Zak S you say? http://falsemachine.blogspot.com/2017/09/gently caress-all-of-you.html?m=1 I watched this thing slowly blow up since Monday: Someone cool leaves G+ because of Zak, Zak gets defensive and goes full Zak, and then Patrick drops that. Good times in the OSR y'all! FIGHTING-MAN fucked around with this message at 06:09 on Sep 28, 2017 |
# ? Sep 28, 2017 06:07 |
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Seriously, can't that guy just gently caress off already? His cellphone "game" for white wolf was atrocious. Easily one of the worst games on steam. Like how hasn't he lost all respect anyone ever had for him? Why would you give him money after he produced "huff their rear end like a cigarette?"
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# ? Sep 28, 2017 06:17 |
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Why do these people making dank elf games need all these personal problems I'm glad this doesn't usually affect DCC. To even know this stuff goes on I usually have to read it here
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# ? Sep 28, 2017 08:38 |
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Babylon Astronaut posted:Seriously, can't that guy just gently caress off already?
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# ? Sep 28, 2017 15:39 |
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FIGHTING-MAN posted:Oh, Zak S you say? This is the best summary of Zak's personality and behavior I have ever seen.
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# ? Sep 28, 2017 18:47 |
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Halloween Jack posted:He runs a blog called "D&D with Pornstars" and he's part of the segment of the OSR that sells bad sex RPGs to nerds who buy bad sex RPGs instead of just leaving their house and talking to girls. So a certain sub-sub-subset of geeks will always be willing to huff his rear end like a cigarette on the Internet. Like alg said, this isn't even a OSR thing, it's a weird fraction of D&D/D20 fandom that still lives in a time warp where reading Heavy Metal is apparently their only sexual outlet.
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# ? Sep 28, 2017 20:47 |
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FIGHTING-MAN posted:Patrick drops that. Good times in the OSR y'all! I feel a lot of pity? sympathy? for Patrick here because he's about to come to the realization that he can either remain dominated by and continue to abet a literal sociopath, or be driven out of the hobby by him. Megazver posted:PRINCIPIA APOCRYPHA: Apocalypse Engine-style Rules And Principles For Running OSR Games On another interesting note, this list also led me to "Searchers of the Unknown" which is the realized version of my theorized no ability score heartbreaker. DalaranJ fucked around with this message at 01:32 on Sep 30, 2017 |
# ? Sep 29, 2017 19:19 |
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What modern ready ref sheets exist? It occurred to me due to discussion in the general chat that the only ones I can think of are GreyHawk and City State of the Invincible Overlord and those are both 30 years old.
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# ? Oct 1, 2017 22:23 |
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Holmes Archive has put one together for Basic D&D but it's no where as intensive as the Judges Guild one. Although, the sheets seemed to be more of a beta version of what would be the Dungeon Master guides, so people nowadays just compile their own lists of pages from the guides that they find useful at the table. Perhaps a new 'Retro-Clone Reference Sheet' could find it's place in the market, or something. Edit: New Big Dragon Games did make the d30 DM and d30 Sandbox Companions, which fit much the same place as the Ready Ref Sheets, but make use of the d30. (Or a d3 followed by a d10 if you don't have the sillier of the silly dice that we all know and love) LashLightning fucked around with this message at 23:07 on Oct 1, 2017 |
# ? Oct 1, 2017 23:04 |
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alg posted:To even know this stuff goes on I usually have to read it here Same.
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# ? Oct 1, 2017 23:51 |
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Although now that I read that one it is pretty good. Lol.quote:Even if someone is technically beaten in an argument, they feel so demeaned and diminished by the process that, if they are weak, they can't let it go and look for any opportunity for revenge. Paolo sounds like a stand-in figure for a bunch of the grognards.txt forum stalkers that would wander the internet to annoy people and then come back here to either crow or cry about their days "work".
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# ? Oct 2, 2017 00:04 |
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DalaranJ posted:What modern ready ref sheets exist? It occurred to me due to discussion in the general chat that the only ones I can think of are GreyHawk and City State of the Invincible Overlord and those are both 30 years old. This is definitely but it's a good print out http://www.jedmc.com/s/Wilderness_Hexplore_revised.pdf
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# ? Oct 2, 2017 00:33 |
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DalaranJ posted:On another interesting note, this list also led me to "Searchers of the Unknown" which is the realized version of my theorized no ability score heartbreaker. Searchers of the Unknown is pretty great. I F&F'd it. There's also this compilation of various hacks of SOTU, but a bunch of them kind of bolt-on enough additional junk to kind of wander off the base concept. DalaranJ posted:What modern ready ref sheets exist? It occurred to me due to discussion in the general chat that the only ones I can think of are GreyHawk and City State of the Invincible Overlord and those are both 30 years old. Ready Ref Sheets are DMG tables. Ready Ref Sheets were even sometimes referred to as the first DMG by people looking back on it. I second LashLightning that the d30 Sandbox Companions are really close to the concept, but something like the generation tables in the back of a Sine Nomine game or the generation tables in 3e's DMG fall under the same idea. I did also buy a bunch of other Judges Guild products like the Village books and Temple books for their additional generation tables. Since they're technically statless, they can still be used until today. gradenko_2000 fucked around with this message at 00:44 on Oct 2, 2017 |
# ? Oct 2, 2017 00:39 |
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I'm vaguely annoyed that all this Zak S talk made me want to find this blog post he did a few years ago about a Lich and my basic googling can't find it because it just returns blog posts about Zak S and elf game drama. Found it finally, it just took a lot longer than I thought it should: Lich We are born into structures of law and tradition which were invented by men who were dead long before we were born. All our lives, we struggle against their vast, ubiquitous and posthumous powers. A Strange Aeon fucked around with this message at 03:51 on Oct 2, 2017 |
# ? Oct 2, 2017 03:40 |
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gradenko_2000 posted:3e's DMG fall under the same idea. drat, I completely forgot this was a thing before 3.5 and no longer have access to that book. Were these tables any use? Is there a PDF version of this book yet?
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# ? Oct 2, 2017 19:00 |
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# ? Jun 5, 2024 05:16 |
So I've been invited to a 2E PbE game. The party is a F/M, Bard, and C/R. It's been 17 years or so since I messed with 2E...is there any glaring flaw with making an Illusionist/Thief to join this group?
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# ? Oct 3, 2017 07:41 |