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So I realize that going ham as the ottomans is pretty low on the list of EU4 achievements, but I restarted that ironman run for a third loving time. Last time I ran myself into so much debt I was paying something like 25-30 ducats a month in interest alone. The start it gave me this time was extremely lucky. For whatever reason I actually had manpower left over after sieging down armenia/greece/byzantium. With a few thousand manpower to spend I was able to run right over the turkish cores just fine, diplomatically vassalized Dulkadir, and then right after I got my poo poo mildly together the Mamluks decided to go to war with Qara  So after the two most credible threats to me finished beating the everloving hell out of eachother I declared war on just about everything. That ended with the Mamluks and QQ losing a shitton of land to me. Dulkadir got fed for their contribution (tripled their size and only got an extra 1k infantry out of them, fuckers). Georgia got eaten after that. Serbia and Wallachia got vassalized because I like having my free siege armies more than I do half a drat ducat a month or whatever they'd offer me. QQ and the Mamluks ended up being treated to Round 2. I just annex'd Dulkadir, and now here I am. Almost the size of Ming in 37 years     
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Oct 5, 2017 16:07
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Atreiden posted:But that's like how the dlc works. I don't really see the problem with making Cossacks slightly better if it helps fix advisors. Though like I said before, I think the price for older dlc should go way down or possibly become free updates at some point. No, I mean the Cossasks estate, not the entire estate mechanic. Which you have to be orthodox + Eastern tech group to use and is the only estate to give mil advisors.
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Oct 5, 2017 17:05
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RabidWeasel posted:No, I mean the Cossasks estate, not the entire estate mechanic. Which you have to be orthodox + Eastern tech group to use and is the only estate to give mil advisors. oh I thought you meant the expansion. my bad. I had honestly forgotten that was a thing. Only played western nations since taking a years break do to a bug.
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Oct 5, 2017 17:16
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Finally doing a Muscovy run after getting the DLC. Do I even need expansion/exploration to colonize Siberia now? I'm thinking starting with religious for the extra Tolerance of the True faith and to help eat into sunni hordes, but after that, no idea.
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Oct 5, 2017 17:49
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Sephyr posted:Finally doing a Muscovy run after getting the DLC. Do I even need expansion/exploration to colonize Siberia now? I'm thinking starting with religious for the extra Tolerance of the True faith and to help eat into sunni hordes, but after that, no idea. You don't need it, but exploration will get you off to a quicker start because 1) you don't need to wait till you form Russia and 2) fewer ideas to buy to get the colonist. And it's not a bad idea to have multiple colonists anyway, there's a lot of russias out there.
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Oct 5, 2017 17:55
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Is there a tutorial on how to actually make money when playing as a mid-tier nation?
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Oct 5, 2017 18:34
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skasion posted:You don't need it, but exploration will get you off to a quicker start because 1) you don't need to wait till you form Russia and 2) fewer ideas to buy to get the colonist. And it's not a bad idea to have multiple colonists anyway, there's a lot of russias out there. Hmm. I was planning to go expansion because it has other bonuses that stay in play even after the bulk of colonization is done (extra merchant, diplo slot, trade power boost). It's not like I'll need colonization range boosts.
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Oct 5, 2017 18:36
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i got Relentless Push East or whatever without either. but the siberian frontier dip colonies don't get any bonii to growth
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Oct 5, 2017 18:36
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Technowolf posted:Is there a tutorial on how to actually make money when playing as a mid-tier nation? Beat up small and other mid-tier nations.
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Oct 5, 2017 18:37
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Sephyr posted:Finally doing a Muscovy run after getting the DLC. Do I even need expansion/exploration to colonize Siberia now? I'm thinking starting with religious for the extra Tolerance of the True faith and to help eat into sunni hordes, but after that, no idea. Under no circumstances should you pick expansion; Religious and Economic are vastly better picks, Admin is ok too but the mercenary bonuses are just wasted on you. Exploration would be ok-ish, but I'd much rather have something else instead, Siberian Frontiers gives you all the colonizing power you can really benefit from.
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Oct 5, 2017 18:50
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Yes, it's like a lava lamp.
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Okay, so I've been chugging along on my first EUIV game as Pomerania (definitely not ironman).  I don't really want to take over the world per se, but it was fun taking Gotland from Denmark during the Third Swedish War of Independence. I even got Sachsen recently too! But the Reformation is killing me. The reason I don't want to convert is because it would cause me to lose -100 prestige, which I think affects my stability boost costs (which is already super high, and it's currently at 0).  I'm also kind of clueless as to how to get more technologically advanced. Poland has a huge army that's denying me one of Prussia's cores (though I'm not sure I'll want to form them in this run--Pomeranian national ideas are much more trade focused which is what I want to play with.) Accepting the printing press is taking forever, and my king is pretty lovely too (something like 2-1-3 with greediness on top of it, -10% nat'l tax.)  What's the best way to catch up with everyone? Denmark, Sweden, and Bohemia are my rivals and I feel like if it weren't for my rather new alliance with Russia, Poland and Lithuania would've eaten me alive by now. I'm also allied with Austria, Magdeburg is a vassal, and Mecklenburg has been my best bud since the beginning (trying to diplo-annex them is proving impossible because of our economic disparity. Pomerania is full of woods and fish and not much else.) P.S. Fun things happening outside my ring of neighbors: - Genoese Crimea, and a bunch of land around it ("Genoese Pontic Steppe") - Spanish Lowlands, Spanish Sicily and southern Italy - Hungary split in two by Poland - Salzburg has like 3 territories lol
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Oct 5, 2017 19:17
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Sephyr posted:Finally doing a Muscovy run after getting the DLC. Do I even need expansion/exploration to colonize Siberia now? I'm thinking starting with religious for the extra Tolerance of the True faith and to help eat into sunni hordes, but after that, no idea. I would go religious or admin. Both have their strength, these days I prefer admin for the cheaper tech and 5 extra states. But religious is still really strong and if you go quantity too you get one of the best policies in the game, soldiers prayer book (+10% moral. +5% moral recovery). Been a while since I played Russia and I don't have third Rome, but if you conquer Scandinavia, then colonizing north America is also an option, so exploration might still be worth it.
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Oct 5, 2017 19:21
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Jedi Knight Luigi posted:Okay, so I've been chugging along on my first EUIV game as Pomerania (definitely not ironman). If the only thing that is keeping you from converting is the prestige/stability cost, I say who gives a gently caress, convert. Prestige is cheap and two of the Protestant bonuses you can choose improve prestige gain and lower stab costs, you'll make it back before you know it. Generally if you're inside the HRE but not angling to become emperor before the religious wars, I would say convert. Some of the Protestant bonuses are really good and most HRE nations are not big enough to get a frequent benefit from pope powers. But it's worth considering whether Austria would still like you if you did convert. What's your heir like? 2-1-3 is pretty dire, if the heir is any better at all I would say give the old man a push. If an institution is just taking way too long, you can always develop towards it, though that could take a while too with such a crap king. That is a pretty big Pol-Lit. I think your best bet for expansion is probably the other north German minors if you can manage it. Mecklenburg is never going to be poor enough to be diplovassalized unless you get massively bigger, so just kill them if you get a chance. Try and land grab in the Lübeck node as you can.
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Oct 5, 2017 19:32
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Marxalot posted:So I realize that going ham as the ottomans is pretty low on the list of EU4 achievements, but I restarted that ironman run for a third loving time. Last time I ran myself into so much debt I was paying something like 25-30 ducats a month in interest alone. The start it gave me this time was extremely lucky. For whatever reason I actually had manpower left over after sieging down armenia/greece/byzantium. With a few thousand manpower to spend I was able to run right over the turkish cores just fine, diplomatically vassalized Dulkadir, and then right after I got my poo poo mildly together the Mamluks decided to go to war with Qara Seems like a fairly normal if suboptimal Ottomans start to me. If you're sieging and it's safe just park the minimum amount of units needed to siege plus one.
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Oct 5, 2017 19:52
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Marxalot posted:Are +3 advisors supposed to be more of a late/end-game thing or what? Definitely a mid to late game thing. Personally, I think that money is way more important than MP in the early game, so even if I can afford better advisors, I usually stick with only +1. In the early game you don't have very much to spend MP on, so extra MP usually just turns into extra development, which is very inefficient. Obviously that's not completely true in specific situations, like having to seed an institution, annexing a lot of development, filling out an idea group, or just having a lovely monarch. One exception is a good DIP advisor, because more DIP lets you take more unjustified demands in wars, and you can always turn extra DIP into mercantilism. You can also get a +2 or +3 diplomat from the nobility at half price. Once I reach the Age of Absolutism I start going ham on advisors. A +3 MIL advisor is top priority, mainly for boosting your absolutism, but also for artillery barrages, which are incredibly useful.
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Oct 5, 2017 20:32
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I disagree, monarch points spent even through development gives you a much stronger foundation to start with than the few more loans takes out of it. The only advisor type I don't push hard for early is the mil one since those points tend to be pretty abundant; with estates you literally always have access to a half price admin dude, and almost always a half price dip dude, and normally within a few decades they're gonna default to being level 3's. So from that point on it's level 3's all the way.
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Oct 6, 2017 02:56
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The half-price level 2s are just as efficient on a MP-per-ducat basis as the full price level 1s, so they're an easy choice. Full price advisers and level 3s are less efficient (though by the time you're seeing half-price level 3s you're probably at the point where it's still worthwhile).
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Oct 6, 2017 03:06
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Yeah and likewise for going from 2 to 3. Not using those estate advisers just feels like you're throwing away hundreds of free MP
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Oct 6, 2017 05:22
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You all are playing Russia wrong, just saying. Here's how Muscowy works these days: - Beat the poo poo outta Novogrod - Beat the poo poo outta Denmark and steal Iceland (depending on how you're setup you might have to steal Faroes first) - First 2 ideas should be Admin / Exploration and you're 3rd is Offensive. - Use your Colonists for the new world, and do the Siberia thing using the frontiers ability. Canada -> East Coast -> Caribbean should be your order of establishing CNs. - Conquer your way to dominate the Baltic / Lübeck / North Sea trade nodes. Doable by 1550. The Baltic coast is your playground, make sure people know it. Russia with the DLC is so stupidly overpowered it's better than the Ottomans after the first 50 years.
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Oct 6, 2017 07:40
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Koramei posted:I disagree, monarch points spent even through development gives you a much stronger foundation to start with than the few more loans takes out of it. The only advisor type I don't push hard for early is the mil one since those points tend to be pretty abundant; with estates you literally always have access to a half price admin dude, and almost always a half price dip dude, and normally within a few decades they're gonna default to being level 3's. So from that point on it's level 3's all the way. More money lets you wage war more often and for longer, which lets you annex much more development than developing ever will give you.
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Oct 6, 2017 08:02
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Fister Roboto posted:More money lets you wage war more often and for longer, which lets you annex much more development than developing ever will give you. There are hard limits on how much land you can grab. AE and overextension are obvious, but also coring costs and stating are limits, especially if your argument is that your new clay should earn you dosh.
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Oct 6, 2017 08:41
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Man I wish they would take a look at Christianity and its related mechanics. Specifically Catholicism and to a lesser degree reformed. Right now I can't see any reason to ever stay Catholic, even as a large nation. it's just too easy to permanently piss off the pope. While the buffs you can buy are nice enough, they take to long to save up too, especially as a small or medium sized country and they are overall worse than what protestants get. Reformed is alright, but fairly boring and protestant is just so much more versatile. The Treaty of Tordesillas is also fairly ahistorically implemented, it was only ever a treaty between Spain and Portugal and is brutally punitive for a mid-late game colonizer. Coptic and orthodox got some nice changes fairly recently and are pretty good.
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Oct 6, 2017 08:50
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Best place to play Catholic is on the outskirts of Europe so you can more easily conquer and convert heathen land for more points. Staying small and/or being surrounded by fellow Catholics is terribly boring.
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Oct 6, 2017 08:54
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Poil posted:Best place to play Catholic is on the outskirts of Europe so you can more easily conquer and convert heathen land for more points. Staying small and/or being surrounded by fellow Catholics is terribly boring. Yea Poland-Lithuania, Portugal (maybe Spain if you don't plan to conquer Italy), Austria (same deal with Italy as Spain + HRE mechanics) and Hungary are really to only ones where it might make sense to stay Catholic.
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Oct 6, 2017 08:58
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Atreiden posted:Yea Poland-Lithuania, Portugal (maybe Spain if you don't plan to conquer Italy), Austria (same deal with Italy as Spain + HRE mechanics) and Hungary are really to only ones where it might make sense to stay Catholic. Spain should definitely stay Catholic, one of their national ideas is just a bonus to yearly papal influence (not sure if it converts somehow if you do) and you should be colonizing trade company regions, which have plenty of high-development provinces to convert and keep influence topped off.
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Oct 6, 2017 16:04
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Eldred posted:Spain should definitely stay Catholic, one of their national ideas is just a bonus to yearly papal influence (not sure if it converts somehow if you do) and you should be colonizing trade company regions, which have plenty of high-development provinces to convert and keep influence topped off. Nah, if you want to conquer Italy etc as Spain, go protestant. I did that in my current game and it made everything much easier. the +2 papal influence idea is not better than the combined buffs from Protestantism. I'm nearly finished with my game as Aragon -> Spain and will soon just for the fun of it restore the roman empire. I already did a run for the mare nostrum achievement as France (and man did I get punished for colonizing mid game in that run) and made the mistake of staying catholic. Treaty of Tordesillas and the lackluster buffs makes Catholicism really bad. Couple that with pissing of the pope for conquering his territory and wanting to colonize and it's just not worth it.
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Oct 6, 2017 22:53
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Dance Officer posted:There are hard limits on how much land you can grab. AE and overextension are obvious, but also coring costs and stating are limits, especially if your argument is that your new clay should earn you dosh. Each point of base tax in a non-state, wrong religion, wrong culture province with -3 intolerance is worth 0.09 ducats a year and costs 5 admin to core. Developing in a state province with the right religion and right culture without any modifiers to development cost gets you 1 ducat a year and costs 50 admin. Considering that the worst case scenario for conquering is only slightly less efficient than the best case scenario for developing, I'd go with conquering over developing most of the time.
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Oct 6, 2017 23:01
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Fister Roboto posted:Each point of base tax in a non-state, wrong religion, wrong culture province with -3 intolerance is worth 0.09 ducats a year and costs 5 admin to core. Developing in a state province with the right religion and right culture without any modifiers to development cost gets you 1 ducat a year and costs 50 admin. Considering that the worst case scenario for conquering is only slightly less efficient than the best case scenario for developing, I'd go with conquering over developing most of the time. Sure, right until you hit walls arising from overextension, AE, or truce timers you should just be conquering all the time. But those walls do exist and are effective (until the mid-game anyway) (and then there's edge cases, like Gold provinces, where you definitely what to develop a bit)
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Oct 6, 2017 23:04
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Also worth noting that more money can help you with one of those walls, by spending it on gifts to keep countries from becoming outraged.
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Oct 7, 2017 01:39
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QuarkJets posted:Sure, right until you hit walls arising from overextension, AE, or truce timers you should just be conquering all the time. But those walls do exist and are effective (until the mid-game anyway) What's the trick with gold provinces? Doesn't developing production increase chance of the mine going dead?
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Oct 7, 2017 06:14
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BeAuMaN posted:What's the trick with gold provinces? Doesn't developing production increase chance of the mine going dead? It increases the chance of the mine losing half of its development eventually, but you make mad ducats and even at 10-12 dev there is an extremely high chance that nothing bad will ever happen.
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Oct 7, 2017 06:42
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Jeez I should have been developing my gold mines.
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Oct 7, 2017 06:51
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Finished my Aragon game for consulate of the Sea, got the achievement around the early 18th hundreds, as I was allied for with Austria, who held Venice and didn't want to lose them. I restarted until I got a game where Castile and Austria both rivaled France and didn't rival me, so had them as allies. I then started by taking the mission to vassalize Navarra and forged claims on southern France and Provence, When France was in the middle of it's first war (with Burgundy) I declared war and was able to bring in Castille by promising them land (this was in 1451, so didn't have the favors). They didn't want any land, so I lost the alliance for not giving them any, but two months later I regained it. Took 3 provinces my self and released and diplo vassalized Toulouse. France was never a threat after that and lost their last province in 1528. By 1490 I started murdering a couple of heirs until I got a girl and by 1500 I formed a PU with Castile and formed Spain in 1520ish. After that I converted to protestant so I could take Rome for the yearly prestige and extra missionary without getting the catholic modifier for holding Rome. I won the thirty years war, but a fairly big England, that held northern France became emperor and was surprisingly good at it. They added northern France and most the British isles to the empire and released some protestant minors and made them electors (including Desmond in Ireland). I dicided to go for the Spain as Emperor achievement since I didn't get that the only other time I've played Spain. That took far longer than I had expected, in part because I got two great female rules in a row and both rulled for around 90 years combined. and then got unlucky with an election right before I got a male ruler, with the newly elected emperor ruling for 47 years. I had originally planed to try and get all the reforms passed, but by the time I got elected it was really to late. So instead I decided to go for being able to restore the roman empire and technically getting mare nostrum (already had the achievement and sort of wished their was some triggered modifier for it  )I got a giant Sweden and a small Hungary in personal unions and eventually used Hungary to take much of the Balkans before integrating them. The last 100 years or so of the game was spend fighting silly wars to get all the land needed, rather than focusing on Asia + most of Indonesia had been colonized by the locals and the Mamluks  So got two achievements and learned to take simplified screenshots with f10 here is a couple of final screenshots before I formed the roman empire, since it doesn't change the colors of colonial nations.   BeAuMaN posted:Jeez I should have been developing my gold mines. Yeah early-mid game they can be a major boost to your economy and stays good till endgame, though by then trade, production and taxes should have overtaken them. The inflation is generally negligible and the risk of the event that half their production is really low. I've only seen it happen ones or twice in my near 1500 hours of playing this game (  )
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Oct 7, 2017 12:06
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 Help, how do I tech. 
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Oct 7, 2017 12:44
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Ming actually expanded, Muscovy didn't form Russia (how did they colonize all that land without Siberian Frontier?), Kutai killed Brunei, what the gently caress?
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Oct 7, 2017 13:13
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TorakFade posted:Ming actually expanded, Muscovy didn't form Russia (how did they colonize all that land without Siberian Frontier?), Kutai killed Brunei, what the gently caress? I don't have third Rome (or MoH) so I rarely see Russia form. They are generally just beaten up by Ottomans, Poland-Lithuania and Ming, sometimes by Denmark and Sweden too. The whole Indonesia region was odd, most of what I hold there, I conquered from Mamluks, who was driven out there by the Ottomans. Mamluks also colonized Alaska England and Portugal allied Siak and Kutai, so I think that might have had something to do with it, but it's not the first time I see it.I think Muscovy often takes Expansion and colonize that way.
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Oct 7, 2017 13:43
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Ah, the joy of having you Fire 4/Shock 5/Siege 3 general die two days before your troop stack reaches an enemy stack and you can't replace him because you've already walked half the distance, leading to your stack being wiped. Also, twice in this run I've had troops at war with Ottomans and with access through the Commonwealth, only for the dirty Poles to decide they want to play with the other Great Powers, declare on me, pounce my main stack who now has nowhere to flee to because there are forts all around, and then get vaporized by cavalry on the plains. War really is hell. Is there some 3X game out there where you just grow and makes friends and never fight with the other civs? Like, Kumbaya the Game?
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Oct 8, 2017 04:26
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Sephyr posted:Ah, the joy of having you Fire 4/Shock 5/Siege 3 general die two days before your troop stack reaches an enemy stack and you can't replace him because you've already walked half the distance, leading to your stack being wiped. Yeah, try Civ V on Chieftain difficulty
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Oct 8, 2017 06:59
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Has anyone thought of achievements that will be easier to accomplish before this upcoming DLC? I was going to wait to play another game till it comes out, but I've got some free time and the itch to play.
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Oct 8, 2017 16:18
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AAAAA! Real Muenster posted:Has anyone thought of achievements that will be easier to accomplish before this upcoming DLC? I was going to wait to play another game till it comes out, but I've got some free time and the itch to play. The one to own 200 grain provinces as a horde. Next patch half the steppes are getting changed to livestock.
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