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Burt posted:I can send you the replay for this if you want? It happens, but it's not very likely though. I've also first blooded a cruiser with multiple citadels from 20+km away but only that one time. It's pure RNG Jesus that will happen very occasionally, when you play often enough. Unrelated note. Did they change up the Halloween game from last year? It seems superficially the same, but I'm having a lot more successful runs than last years and I just succeeded twice in a row.
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Oct 22, 2017 22:47
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They tweaked it, yeah. More skill points for the captains and such.
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Oct 22, 2017 23:29
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Sorry CrazedKid, should have div'd up with me :P https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jwYVwFHF8u8 James Garfield posted:There are six times as many battleships in the queue I'm currently in as every other ship class combined. Obviously it is completely balanced, in fact battleships are probably the worst class because a torpedo hit me once. We have been over this tired trope before. What kind of ships are most likely to influence wins and losses especially if those manning them are potatoes vs skilled players? CVs, and DDs. What kind of ship do you want if its late and you need a comeback? DDs and CAs. Battleship players who don't get any warning that they are even under torpedo attack with weapons that have predictor icons to tell you where to shoot is ok because BBs should turn every once in a while. But a cruiser with an early warning perk should be allowed to sail in straight lines for 10 seconds or more and if they get punished for it, hat is absolutely not ok and BBs should be nerfed. Because you know, logic.
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Oct 23, 2017 00:03
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MikeC posted:Battleship players who don't get any warning that they are even under torpedo attack with weapons that have predictor icons to tell you where to shoot is ok because BBs should turn every once in a while. But a cruiser with an early warning perk should be allowed to sail in straight lines for 10 seconds or more and if they get punished for it, hat is absolutely not ok and BBs should be nerfed. Because you know, logic. 
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Oct 23, 2017 00:17
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Ahahahaha there's nobody online to start clan battles. Blame Flagelum I guess?
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Oct 23, 2017 01:14
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MikeC posted:Sorry CrazedKid, should have div'd up with me :P You didn't answer, why do you think there are consistently more BBs in queue than all other classes combined?
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Oct 23, 2017 03:11
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James Garfield posted:You didn't answer, why do you think there are consistently more BBs in queue than all other classes combined? To be fair, BBs have consistently been the most popular class by far since the second the game launched.
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Oct 23, 2017 03:20
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3 Wins 4 Losses and we advanced to Gale group 1. It is extremely easy to advance in CW, it seems. DUNKN has obtained the German research facility, we're going for the US bonus next. We've got 2 spots open! Twenties, Centra_Spike, Reaping_101, or CAG618, if you are goons please say so, otherwise I'm gonna assume you're pubbies and deny the app. We are looking for goons who want to Clan War, please have a good clan wars T10! And by good T10, I mean: DD: Z-52, Gearing CA: Hindenburg, Movska, Des Moines, Henri IV BB: Montana CV: :wargaming: If you're wondering why I'm not including the Khabarovsk or Conqueror, its because they're good randoms boats, but not quite as good in the super CA city that is CW. Do not consider a Zao or a Shima as a T10. I'm going to have an aneurysm soon if I see more goons bring Shimas.
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Oct 23, 2017 04:19
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So after my hard drive had a head crash I upgraded to a solid state drive (finally). I'm noticing that the typical pattern is that the worse the engine of a game is, the bigger the difference in HD load times. WoWS is one such game  What I didn't expect was there to be a difference in load time for box collection. It's literally 5x faster to grab a box; which makes me think that whatever process they are using for that, it's clientside. Edit Re: Clanwars Should I drop my plan of xping to the Conquerer then? The only reason I was going for that ship was to help in CW. If that's the case I'll put more effort into my Z-52 and Hindenburg... though I'm wondering how much I'll actually get to use a Hindi if I've already got a DM and Moskva. Was also looking at Pan Asian DDs, depending on how they end up on live. Mauzeraut fucked around with this message at 04:55 on Oct 23, 2017 |
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Oct 23, 2017 04:48
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James Garfield posted:You didn't answer, why do you think there are consistently more BBs in queue than all other classes combined? We have been over this a hundred times. People, especially casuals, play this game to fire big guns with big ships with big names. Not no name boat #22 that fires a 5 inch pop gun. I endure playing T10 matches in a T8 ship once every day because its the loving BISMARCK.
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Oct 23, 2017 04:59
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Mauzeraut posted:Edit Re: Clanwars The Conq is better than the Kurfurst at least and probably better than the Yamato for CW. But the Hindenburg is probably the best non-RADAR CA, with its high DPM and everything else. But if you have a DM/Movska already, its probably not necessary to add another CA if you'd rather get your Conqueror. As it stands, we've actually been having a small amount of success forgoing DDs all-together, though if we run some I'm pretty sure I'm going to require them to be either Z-52s or Gearings now. Khabas can be a competitive choice, but unfortunately they suck on one of the maps very hard and if we get that map I don't want to have a dead-weight option.
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Oct 23, 2017 05:01
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MikeC posted:We have been over this a hundred times. People, especially casuals, play this game to fire big guns with big ships with big names. Not no name boat #22 that fires a 5 inch pop gun. Carriers are extremely unpopular despite being actual war winning ships
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Oct 23, 2017 05:33
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James Garfield posted:Carriers are extremely unpopular despite being actual war winning ships Actually, I don't think that'd be the case. If CVs were better implemented, I bet you'd see them become a bit more popular. Its just that... people play this game for boat violence, so they are expecting action, and CVs are not a very action-y oriented class. That turns the main demographic off, that would actually love to play the Enterprise, or the Kaga, or the Graf, or the Ark Royal, etc.
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Oct 23, 2017 05:50
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James Garfield posted:Carriers are extremely unpopular despite being actual war winning ships WoWS carries the inherent fantasy elemental of the "what if" which is exactly why BBs are so popular. Yamato/Musashi and the 4 Iowa class BBs never saw each other in open combat. They were irrelevant by the time the US entered the war. But they were designed and built in a time before CVs were a known quantity and were expected to fight each other in a decisive naval action. CVs literally robbed an entire generation of battleships the chance to test themselves in combat. The chance to see iconic ships shoot at each other, in the manner they were designed and built for, even in a totally unrealistic arcade setting, is literally the wet dream of naval enthusiasts. It also explains why there are so many snipers that sail broadside on in the backline. That is how it should be done in their minds.
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Oct 23, 2017 06:08
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Hazdoc posted:Actually, I don't think that'd be the case. If CVs were better implemented, I bet you'd see them become a bit more popular. Its just that... people play this game for boat violence, so they are expecting action, and CVs are not a very action-y oriented class. That turns the main demographic off, that would actually love to play the Enterprise, or the Kaga, or the Graf, or the Ark Royal, etc. CVs being unpopular suggests that players aren't only picking ships for being known in real life though (and there are about as many kurfursts/roons/hindenburgs as their real equivalents, even though Wargaming designed those ships0. I mean of course CVs would be more popular if they were better implemented, or if they just had an interface that wasn't intentionally bad. As far as I remember there were plenty of CVs in navyfield. But that was the point really, it's a bit ridiculous to claim that the only reason battleships invariably outnumber every other ship class combined in queue is that people wanted to play big ships and that people can't even tell which ship is easiest to play. e: also most players don't limit themselves to one ship class! It's not that two thirds of players are dedicated battleship players, it's that people play their battleships more often than their other ships. James Garfield fucked around with this message at 06:23 on Oct 23, 2017 |
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Oct 23, 2017 06:08
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James Garfield posted:people play their battleships more often than their other ships. I think that's because they don't die as easily as the rest. They pardon a lot of mistakes, especialy as most are very hard if not impossible to citadel. In comparison CA die in 3 torpedoes or a handful of BB citadels, DD die in 2 torpedoes or a handfull of penetration, this is a more tense gameplay.
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Oct 23, 2017 06:41
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Just because a ship has the lowest skill floor before it becomes an enjoyable ship class to play doesn't mean it is not balanced within ship classes. How on earth can you be that dense? In many cases in gaming, its usually the opposite where a hard to play class/faction usually is the powerful class/faction because developer and balance testers inherently can't unlock the full potential a pro player could. A ship class may require a more competent player to utilize but that doesn't affect its overall power or place in the game. Numerous commentators like including Goons in the thread and CCs like Flamu, not just me, have flatly stated that CVs and DDs are the prime drivers of win rates. One team with bad players in these classes make it exponentially harder to win than having a terrible BB driver. If anything while Battleships have a much lower skill floor vis a vis Cruisers and Destroyers, they also have a much lower skill ceiling where inherent dispersion, slow rate of fire, and lack of maneuverability means that is becomes increasingly harder for each percentile of player to differentiate themselves from the previous percentile. Across the board if you look at the average for damage done for say an Iowa by the top 5% that pilot that ship vs the average damage done for the entire population of Iowa pilots, the difference is 60% more done by the elite super unicums vs average joe. A super unicum player in a Yamato can only squeeze out an extra 50% more damage. Contrast that to say the average Super Unicum in a Roon clears more 80% more damage than average joe and a split in a Hindenberg is 75% additional damage. These are not atypical numbers. Going back to the point at hand. Give me a logical reason why its ok to punish battleship players who drive in straight lines but it is not ok to punish cruiser players who drive in straight lines? Other than there are a lot of battleships in queue.
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Oct 23, 2017 06:43
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MikeC posted:Going back to the point at hand. Give me a logical reason why its ok to punish battleship players who drive in straight lines but it is not ok to punish cruiser players who drive in straight lines? Other than there are a lot of battleships in queue. If your battleships get hit by destroyer torpedoes even remotely as often as your cruisers take 15000 damage hits from battleships, you're either playing tier 3 or being extremely passive in cruisers. Mid tier cruisers especially get "punished" for doing the exact thing they need to do to win the game: you still want to do it, because it quantifiably makes your team win more, but doing it makes you eat unrepairable 15000 damage BB salvos (in 30000 health ships) fairly often and there's no way to avoid that without winning less often. Like world of tanks artillery, it's not hard to avoid but the thing you do to avoid it is objectively bad gameplay. Battleships don't have to deal with any of that. I use battleships aggressively and rarely take much damage from destroyer torpedoes. The skill floor is higher because they don't get punished anywhere near as badly (and when they do, battleships tend to get punished by surviving and losing the game rather than immediately dying like a cruiser or destroyer).
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Oct 23, 2017 07:50
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MikeC is a BADleships apologist
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Oct 23, 2017 08:04
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James Garfield posted:You didn't answer, why do you think there are consistently more BBs in queue than all other classes combined? Because bbs are the most fun. Destroyers are neat when I get to torp run, otherwise it’s smoke and fire a bajillion shells for poo poo damage each. Cruisers meh because it’s just fire a bajillion shells for poo poo damage each. BBs are baller because I shoot a few shells and either dominate a fucker or bounce, each volley feels like it has meaning and true power behind it, and sometimes my secondaries start up and I feel like an endgame boss.
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Oct 23, 2017 08:06
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really it's just weird to me that there are people who don't think making battleships stronger would also make them more popular, I wouldn't have expected that to be controversial.
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Oct 23, 2017 08:30
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I love all ship classes equally.
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Oct 23, 2017 12:57
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Actually its possible for MikeC to be right and wrong at the same time. I think he is mostly correct about why BBs are so popular, but added to the historical argument is the simple fact that a retard BB driver (50% or more of them) can survive 15 mins or more in a game and no matter what has actually happened, probably think they have contributed. Whereas if you are a retard in a high-tier cruiser you are 100% guaranteed to die in the first 5 mins of any match. Personally, every time I would take a team mate in a cruiser who dies after 2mins but who has helped a DD secure 1 cap and maybe badly damaged or killed 1 enemy DD rather than a coward/retard BB who has full health after 15 mins and ends the game with 50k dmg and no kills. As for farming BBs with DDs, that is hyperbole. In another match in which I div'd with a fellow goon this weekend, I ate an 18k AP volley from a Missouri at 11km whilst at full speed and maneovering in my Udaloi. That is literally the worst case scenario but BBs are just as scary to a gunboat DD now as any cruiser.
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Oct 23, 2017 13:27
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I wish this game had more battleships and less cruisers. 200k damage games in my Hindenburg are fun.
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Oct 23, 2017 13:29
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Not to carry on this BB discussion but this deserves a lot more love, skip to about half way in, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ovAvZeTGXNk
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Oct 23, 2017 14:15
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Cippalippus posted:I wish this game had more battleships and less cruisers. 200k damage games in my Hindenburg are fun. You're in luck, because fresh on the tails of Mutsu, Kii, and Musashi, comes Ashitaka, the down tuned tier 7 Amagi 
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Oct 23, 2017 17:13
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NTRabbit posted:Ashitaka, the down tuned tier 7 Amagi https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_kKXvDaJIzQ
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Oct 23, 2017 17:56
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quote:ST, fire extinguishing time gently caress yeah 
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Oct 23, 2017 18:49
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Oh here come the BB tears...
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Oct 23, 2017 18:59
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Oh poo poo yes. I'll even take that on my Spee, because the Spee gets Repair Party. Our every move is the new tradition.
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Oct 23, 2017 19:38
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Playing destroyers is absolutely miserable now.
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Oct 23, 2017 20:19
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pokchu posted:Playing destroyers is absolutely miserable now. Brit BBs rocking that sweet rear end HE. Turn to avoid the shells of other BBs, take full pens because the shells hit you at an angle. Nothing pisses me off more than Missous though. Yeah let's just give a BB radar that has longer reach than the max range of a DD's torpedoes, eat poo poo DD players.
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Oct 23, 2017 20:34
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NerdyMcNerdNerd posted:Brit BBs rocking that sweet rear end HE. That and CVs, which is just pouring salt into the wound. Great, it's super fun having both your and your torpedoes being permanently spotted by a class of ships which add absolutely no value to the game.
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Oct 23, 2017 21:39
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pokchu posted:That and CVs, which is just pouring salt into the wound. Great, it's super fun having both your and your torpedoes being permanently spotted by a class of ships which add absolutely no value to the game. It honestly feels like CVs should just have some kind of innate accuracy when going against DDs because they are just too easy to annihilate with torpedo planes. A single torpedo and you are D-O-N-E. Bombs feel like they hit the right amount of damage and skill required, because even a single bomb has a high chance for fire and that poo poo hurts in a DD. I'm glad CVs are infrequent on NA because they're unfun to deal with in every ship class. Even other CVs.
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Oct 23, 2017 21:45
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James Garfield posted:If your battleships get hit by destroyer torpedoes even remotely as often as your cruisers take 15000 damage hits from battleships, you're either playing tier 3 or being extremely passive in cruisers. Quite honestly, I think a lot of cruiser players are bad. Like really really bad but just have some sort of weird superiority complex and just blame all their failings on BBs being overpowered or something when 99% of the time they eat that 20k citadel volley its because they were exceedingly stupid and decided showing broadside was the correct choice of play or they got greedy and kept firing instead of dropping into concealment when they are under the gun sights of multiple battleships. When people in here talk about cruisers taking damage "fairly often" the way you just did, it doubly convinces me its just bad cruiser players whining that they cannot use their insane DPS without any restriction whatsoever or should be allowed to be stupid and not get punished just because they are in a cruiser. Let me just say this again. If you are consistently taking massive chunks of damage in your cruiser from battleships, you are the reason why you are failing. Re-examine your gameplay. Stories like that Moskava getting 50k deleted from 20km is 99.99999999999% of the time the player being stupid to the extreme and letting it happen to them. wdarkk posted:gently caress yeah I didn't think this is possible. Wargaming addressing a very real issue and coming up with a non-extreme and subtle buff that doesn't outright destroy mechanics or upset the balance in wild swings.
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Oct 23, 2017 23:51
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LOL if you think if you need to show broadside to eat 20k damage in a cruiser. Oh and cruisers and battleships of same tier have roughly same naked DPM. While one out those two has much better penetration.
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Oct 24, 2017 00:59
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MikeC posted:Quite honestly, I think a lot of cruiser players are bad. Like really really bad but just have some sort of weird superiority complex and just blame all their failings on BBs being overpowered or something when 99% of the time they eat that 20k citadel volley its because they were exceedingly stupid and decided showing broadside was the correct choice of play or they got greedy and kept firing instead of dropping into concealment when they are under the gun sights of multiple battleships. When people in here talk about cruisers taking damage "fairly often" the way you just did, it doubly convinces me its just bad cruiser players whining that they cannot use their insane DPS without any restriction whatsoever or should be allowed to be stupid and not get punished just because they are in a cruiser. 16 inch shells are really loving good at penetrating all the things, especially CA hulls. 18 inchers can overmatch even BB armor. Hence, BBs are dumb as gently caress and the people who drive them reflect this.
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Oct 24, 2017 01:14
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 You are both bad and need to stop making excuses for cruisers. 3.2 million potential. Killed not by the Yamato, or the Montana, or the Conqueror. Dodged all of that poo poo easy. No, killed by the loving minotaur and machinegun spam.
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Oct 24, 2017 02:07
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Looks like by next week's sale I'll have unlocked the Kagero and the Akizuki. That means 'ole Yamamoto will finally have a home.
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Oct 24, 2017 02:08
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MikeC posted:
Thanks for your opinions dude I'll be sure to file them along with YOUR WAIFU IN THE TRASH
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Oct 24, 2017 02:18
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