|
JFairfax posted:reverence for the military is a key element of fascist societies. Does that make North Korea and Soviet Russia a fascist state under this rule?
|
#
?
Oct 23, 2017 17:14
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 28, 2024 17:51 |
|
|
fallenturtle posted:Well, they DID plow a car into a crowd.... on the other hand it seems apparent that when the violence reaches that level the cops can't turn their backs, so even if the law isn't on the side of the antifas, there seems to be a ceiling of how violent folks can get until white people start going to jail. The media will never be an effective weapon against fascists because it's primarily populated by people who are utterly indifferent to it at best, often sympathetic to it, and occasionally active proponents of it. Rich and influential people are, on the whole, allies of fascism because they see themselves, correctly or not, as being part of the ruling class under fascism, not as part of the ruled. The media is not a weapon against fascists, direct action and political organization are.
|
|
#
?
Oct 23, 2017 17:15
|
|
|
Intrinsic Field Marshal posted:Does that make North Korea and Soviet Russia a fascist state under this rule? North Korea no because of the lack of private corporations. Russia, yeah you probably could, because russia sure as hell aint communist any more
|
|
#
?
Oct 23, 2017 17:15
|
|
|
America isn't a totalitarian regime just yet, but all of the infrastructure is in place, and the Police are probably the most militarised in the world. but you can be fascist without being totalitarian
|
|
#
?
Oct 23, 2017 17:16
|
|
|
forkboy84 posted:Punching Nazis is morally just. Ethically right. And also cool as hell and really funny too. I don't think violence is ever ethically right except in self-defense. However morally its correct in order to drive them off the streets. They shouldn't be given the right to march in the streets before things resort to violence. People have the right to conduct their business without having the Neo-Nazis marching through the streets intimidating them.
|
|
#
?
Oct 23, 2017 17:16
|
|
|
Intrinsic Field Marshal posted:I knew that. I thought it was funny to point out. AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA. Either: 1. You thought your arguments would be better supported if you could call your opponent an anti-Semite. 2. You actually thought anti-Semitism was funny. Neither of these are good looks for you, IFM.
|
|
#
?
Oct 23, 2017 17:24
|
|
|
Avenging_Mikon posted:AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA. I thought it was funny that he was talking about Nazis while having an anti-Semitic avatar yes. It was a funny juxtaposition.
|
|
#
?
Oct 23, 2017 17:29
|
|
|
Intrinsic Field Marshal posted:Maybe the FBI should label the Neo-Nazis under Richard Spencer as a domestic terrorist group and let the security services deal with it. Bookmark that, try again in 3 years.
|
|
#
?
Oct 23, 2017 17:30
|
|
|
how old are you IFM ?
|
|
#
?
Oct 23, 2017 17:30
|
|
|
JFairfax posted:how old are you IFM ? old enough to buy alcohol
|
|
#
?
Oct 23, 2017 17:31
|
|
|
Intrinsic Field Marshal posted:I don't think violence is ever ethically right except in self-defense. There is no difference between morality and ethics, it's a false divide invented by businessmen to justify blatantly evil behavior. Intrinsic Field Marshal posted:Maybe the FBI should label the Neo-Nazis under Richard Spencer as a domestic terrorist group and let the security services deal with it. They're way more likely to declare Antifa and/or Black Lives Matter and or black people in general to be terrorists. I'm not sure how anyone who watched left wing and right wing protests and the different police responses to them in the past few years could come away with any other conclusion.
|
|
#
?
Oct 23, 2017 17:31
|
|
|
Intrinsic Field Marshal posted:old enough to buy alcohol in france, england or the usa?
|
|
#
?
Oct 23, 2017 17:33
|
|
|
Intrinsic Field Marshal posted:old enough to buy alcohol Are you a very old looking 12 year old?
|
|
#
?
Oct 23, 2017 17:34
|
|
|
Goon Danton posted:There is no difference between morality and ethics, it's a false divide invented by businessmen to justify blatantly evil behavior. What's the supposed divide because I was also under the impression they were synonyms?
|
|
#
?
Oct 23, 2017 17:35
|
|
|
OwlFancier posted:What's the supposed divide because I was also under the impression they were synonyms? morals are what you carry in your heart. ethics are how you should behave professionally. a defense lawyer who is defending an obviously guilty criminal who has done a horrible crime may not be acting morally but would be acting ethically
|
|
#
?
Oct 23, 2017 17:37
|
|
|
forkboy84 posted:Are you a very old looking 12 year old? I had a rough childhood.
|
|
#
?
Oct 23, 2017 17:38
|
|
|
boner confessor posted:morals are what you carry in your heart. ethics are how you should behave professionally. a defense lawyer who is defending an obviously guilty criminal who has done a horrible crime may not be acting morally but would be acting ethically That seems spurious. Either upholding the legal system is more important than securing a prosecution or it isn't, or you're lying to yourself for money. OwlFancier fucked around with this message at 17:41 on Oct 23, 2017 |
|
#
?
Oct 23, 2017 17:39
|
|
|
OwlFancier posted:That seems spurious. agreed
|
|
#
?
Oct 23, 2017 17:41
|
|
|
OwlFancier posted:That seems spurious. If a policeman arrests a criminal for a heinous crime like child murder and beats them up in a jail cell he may be morally right in doing so but ethically wrong.
|
|
#
?
Oct 23, 2017 17:41
|
|
|
OwlFancier posted:What's the supposed divide because I was also under the impression they were synonyms? In reality, they are synonyms. Or more precisely, ethics is the study of morality. In business, however, "ethics" refers to their company's or profession's specific "code of ethics," so someone can justify greed, cruelty, and graft as "doing nothing unethical" as long as they don't violate anything in the code. And shockingly, these codes tend to have holes big enough to drive a truck through when it comes to preying on the disadvantaged.
|
|
#
?
Oct 23, 2017 17:42
|
|
|
Intrinsic Field Marshal posted:If a policeman arrests a criminal for a heinous crime like child murder and beats them up in a jail cell he may be morally right in doing so but ethically wrong. Also spurious. Either the legal process is more important than the specific outcome or it isn't, in which case it's either morally right or wrong not to beat the twat up.
|
|
#
?
Oct 23, 2017 17:43
|
|
|
OwlFancier posted:The media will never be an effective weapon against fascists because it's primarily populated by people who are utterly indifferent to it at best, often sympathetic to it, and occasionally active proponents of it. Rich and influential people are, on the whole, allies of fascism because they see themselves, correctly or not, as being part of the ruling class under fascism, not as part of the ruled. I might have agreed with that 20 years ago, but now a days its not impossible for the gen pop to influence the news media landscape. When small media makes enough noise the MSM starts to pick it up. While the shareholders and gatekeepers may be conservative, I think the journalists are more sympathetic to the left. That Vice documentary with Cantrell (sic) made some waves. There is the uphill battle of trying to convince them that the Nazis pose an existential threat to the US and the punching doesn't help if the media is the weapon until the audience is convinced its justified... so I'm not sure both tactics can be used concurrently. Perhaps we need a KKK/Superman approach... A faux-reality TV show about white supremacists and Nazis in America could be effective if it got enough viewers. Intrinsic Field Marshal posted:I don't think violence is ever ethically right except in self-defense. Maybe its just me, but I don't see how morals, at least from my person humanistic viewpoint, can be different than ethics because what I think is moral is based on what I think is ethical. fallenturtle fucked around with this message at 17:47 on Oct 23, 2017 |
|
#
?
Oct 23, 2017 17:44
|
|
|
fallenturtle posted:Well, they DID plow a car into a crowd.... on the other hand it seems apparent that when the violence reaches that level the cops can't turn their backs, so even if the law isn't on the side of the antifas, there seems to be a ceiling of how violent folks can get until white people start going to jail. It’s been cut down to a bedrock of real, violent nazis, though. Before Charlottesville, the ranks were swelled by 4chan cowards and Milo fans. Those people are scum and should be taken seriously, but you’ll notice it’s mostly open white supremacists coming out now who tend to be violent and get arrested. Spencer is still out doing his thing, but half the nazis call him a cuck or whatever and say he’s doing it wrong, whereas in the winter and spring they were willing to support his tv interviews and mainstreaming of him as a public talking head. There’s no unity or forward motion in their movement now, just sporadic rallies with swastikas and shootings. It’s not over by a longshot but things have shifted in a way that has then turning on each other a lot more now.
|
|
#
?
Oct 23, 2017 17:47
|
|
|
The mass media is rooted in wealth, it will protect the interest of wealth, and fascism is not particularly a threat to the wealthy, far less so than leftists who are fascism's primary opponents, so the majority of the media will always look to take out leftists before fascists. This is not going to change.
|
|
#
?
Oct 23, 2017 17:49
|
|
|
business hammocks posted:It’s been cut down to a bedrock of real, violent nazis, though. Before Charlottesville, the ranks were swelled by 4chan cowards and Milo fans. Those people are scum and should be taken seriously, but you’ll notice it’s mostly open white supremacists coming out now who tend to be violent and get arrested. Spencer is still out doing his thing, but half the nazis call him a cuck or whatever and say he’s doing it wrong, whereas in the winter and spring they were willing to support his tv interviews and mainstreaming of him as a public talking head. There’s no unity or forward motion in their movement now, just sporadic rallies with swastikas and shootings. It’s not over by a longshot but things have shifted in a way that has then turning on each other a lot more now. The moment actual violence comes along most of these people will melt away as theres a difference between shitposting online about how much you wanna beat the poo poo out of Antifa and actually doing it. 4chan talks a good game but cant commit in the real world except for stuff like HWNDU but that was non-violent and had no real risk other than exposing their identities online. Also /pol/'s neo-nazis are a whole separate thing on 4chan separate from the comics and cartoons board or the videogames board. People always treat 4chan like its this homogeneous monolith but its really lots of boards operating on their own with some boards having alot of crossover with other boards while some not at all.
|
|
#
?
Oct 23, 2017 17:55
|
|
|
Intrinsic Field Marshal posted:The moment actual violence comes along most of these people will melt away as theres a difference between shitposting online about how much you wanna beat the poo poo out of Antifa and actually doing it. this already happened, it's called punching nazis https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gnXBeQwmmrc
|
|
#
?
Oct 23, 2017 17:57
|
|
|
OwlFancier posted:The mass media is rooted in wealth, it will protect the interest of wealth, and fascism is not particularly a threat to the wealthy, far less so than leftists who are fascism's primary opponents, so the majority of the media will always look to take out leftists before fascists. This is not going to change. This is why the rise in alternative media threatens the status quo of the legacy media. Sometimes I feel if the legacy media is trying to pitch the left and right wings of the alternative media against each other so they can smear them as being extremist radicals.
|
|
#
?
Oct 23, 2017 17:57
|
|
|
Intrinsic Field Marshal posted:The moment actual violence comes along most of these people will melt away as theres a difference between shitposting online about how much you wanna beat the poo poo out of Antifa and actually doing it. 4chan talks a good game but cant commit in the real world except for stuff like HWNDU but that was non-violent and had no real risk other than exposing their identities online. Also /pol/'s neo-nazis are a whole separate thing on 4chan separate from the comics and cartoons board or the videogames board. People always treat 4chan like its this homogeneous monolith but its really lots of boards operating on their own with some boards having alot of crossover with other boards while some not at all. The violence has always been there. When Nazis march, they do hate crimes on the side. This is literally why antifa exists, to confront the violent ones and make them "pick on someone their own size."
|
|
#
?
Oct 23, 2017 18:01
|
|
|
Intrinsic Field Marshal posted:This is why the rise in alternative media threatens the status quo of the legacy media. Sometimes I feel if the legacy media is trying to pitch the left and right wings of the alternative media against each other so they can smear them as being extremist radicals. Alternative media doesn't threaten the interests that the legacy media serves, rich twats can own websites and pay people enough to make them class enemies as well as they can with the old media, it just requires a change in strategy.
|
|
#
?
Oct 23, 2017 18:04
|
|
|
Intrinsic Field Marshal posted:This is why the rise in alternative media threatens the status quo of the legacy media. Sometimes I feel if the legacy media is trying to pitch the left and right wings of the alternative media against each other so they can smear them as being extremist radicals. This is a difficult argument to make given that there was an astroturfed campaign of literal actual Fake News during the run up to the election last year. Alternative media can become regular media with no brakes extremely easily. And as for trying to smear alternative media as being radical extremists, they don't need to do anything to do that, they just say that's how it is. "Well both sides are just so extreme" has been the rallying cry of the party of order since they came into existence.
|
|
#
?
Oct 23, 2017 18:10
|
|
|
Watching you retards enter your second form and unleashing an epic exchange of tepid owns upon the gbs guy really is some exhilaratingly hilarious poo poo. But, mayhaps, could you post the lulz instead? thank you.
|
|
#
?
Oct 23, 2017 18:15
|
|
|
Dongicus posted:you retards Go away.
|
|
#
?
Oct 23, 2017 18:19
|
|
|
Maybe you want PYF instead?
|
|
#
?
Oct 23, 2017 18:21
|
|
|
JFairfax posted:you stupid loving idiot has it ever occurred to you that not everyone buys their own av, I mean look at mine, you think I loving chose this? Well? Yes.
|
|
#
?
Oct 23, 2017 18:24
|
|
|
Goon Danton posted:Go away. You're a retard if you keep butting your head up against the person who is EXTREMELY obviously taking the piss out of you. OwlFancier posted:Maybe you want PYF instead? I'm disinterested in pages long slap fights with really bad posters so no thank you. If that's not the case I'll happily check it out. (USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST)
|
|
#
?
Oct 23, 2017 18:28
|
|
|
Dongicus posted:Faaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaart
|
|
#
?
Oct 23, 2017 18:29
|
|
|
Dongicus posted:You're a retard if you keep butting your head up against the person who is EXTREMELY obviously taking the piss out of you. I'm not taking the piss. I really don't know these things. Please don't call me a retard, I am high functioning autistic person.
|
|
#
?
Oct 23, 2017 18:31
|
|
|
Hm. the epic fart quote edit. i am owned, i have been owned by the warrios of Logic with their swords made of Reason. watch as i melt away into the toilet like a big gay turd i am Intrinsic Field Marshal posted:I'm not taking the piss. I really don't know these things. Please don't call me a retard, I am high functioning autistic person. I called you a gbs guy, not a retard. though it is easy to confuse that one bwahahahha
|
|
#
?
Oct 23, 2017 18:33
|
|
|
I thought this was the YouTube intellectual mock thread, not the "Are Nazis actually bad and is it ever okay to oppose them?" thread.
|
|
#
?
Oct 23, 2017 19:08
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 28, 2024 17:51 |
|
|
Rugoberta Munchu posted:I thought this was the YouTube intellectual mock thread, not the "Are Nazis actually bad and is it ever okay to oppose them?" thread. It's literally easier to defend Richard Spencer than it is to defend Sargon.
|
|
#
?
Oct 23, 2017 19:12
|
|