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i don't actually know what hero you guys are talking about 
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Oct 23, 2017 16:58
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Kerrrrrrr posted:i don't actually know what hero you guys are talking about Our lord and savior, zeratul, long may he reign.
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Oct 23, 2017 16:59
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Zeratul (don't ever play him he's terrible I don't care about pro level play)
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Oct 23, 2017 16:59
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I've died several times because Zeratul VPs me in with with the enemy then runs away while their backup arrives. it's got such amazing troll potential, even more so than playing Tassidar and force-walling people against the enemy keeps.
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Oct 23, 2017 17:02
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The best Zeratuls I've played with have traded 1 for 1 at irrelevant times on the other side of the map. The medium ones engage 1v3, do nothing, then use VP to escape. The bad ones ignore his quite decent ability to clear waves and just dive 1v5 over and over while raging. Zeratuls have absolutely been the worst ragers I've played with because they can't do anything and they don't realize their hero sucks.
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Oct 23, 2017 17:07
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There was a brief period when Zeratul's AA damage amps all stacked multiplicatively and you could delete anyone by popping Shadow Assault + Blood Frenzy or whatever that level 16 attack speed boost is called. You could burst down Muradin in 3-4 seconds. And even then Shadow Assault was bad.
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Oct 23, 2017 17:09
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Also - Sylvanas. When is she actually the right pick? her pick rate seems like she's overpicked but her win rate is decent. I never want her on my team because all I want in a team is for people to win the 4 man while I desperately soak. I've had great luck with her in QM but all specialists are OP in QM.
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Oct 23, 2017 17:10
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No Wave posted:Also - Sylvanas. When is she actually the right pick? her pick rate seems like she's overpicked but her win rate is decent. I never want her on my team because all I want in a team is for people to win the 4 man while I desperately soak. She is really good when you can abuse her trait with the map objective. So Shrines, Mines, Battlefield, Braxis. Especially Battlefield because she can also burn down the Immortals quickly.
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Oct 23, 2017 17:13
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No Wave posted:Zeratul (don't ever play him he's terrible I don't care about pro level play) People who just want to sneak up on people and murder them can faceroll people with valeera so they do that instead.
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Oct 23, 2017 17:22
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Zeratul is the only stealth I'm happy to have in my team.
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Oct 23, 2017 17:30
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I would take Nova over Zeratul every time. I like having Nova because they're decent in the four man and nobody knows to soak/wave clear anyways, and Novas generally have a lot of experience with the character and understand its limitations. I've actually been carried pretty hard by Novas quite a few times (my winrate with a Nova on my team that isn't me is 58%, just to illustrate where I'm coming from even if the sample size is too small). However if you're playing at ranks where people know how to play I'm sure things change. EDIT: I'd take Samuro too definitely. You have to be a special kind of bad to get zero value out of him even if your contribution to the game ends up being a bladestorm every 100 seconds. No Wave fucked around with this message at 17:49 on Oct 23, 2017 |
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Oct 23, 2017 17:41
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Samuro seems like a liability in most games I've seen because he's solely reliant on autoattacks to do work which means you can easily counterpick him with something that blinds, but also his clones give stacks for any quests requiring someone to hit heroes so the other team can farm his primary gimmick for an early game power spike.
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Oct 23, 2017 17:53
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Kai Tave posted:Samuro seems like a liability in most games I've seen because he's solely reliant on autoattacks to do work which means you can easily counterpick him with something that blinds, but also his clones give stacks for any quests requiring someone to hit heroes so the other team can farm his primary gimmick for an early game power spike. They really have a few too many heroes in the game with "hit x hero" quests for him to be a go-to pick, but as a niche character he can be very effective under the right conditions.
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Oct 23, 2017 17:58
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No Wave posted:Also - Sylvanas. When is she actually the right pick? her pick rate seems like she's overpicked but her win rate is decent. I never want her on my team because all I want in a team is for people to win the 4 man while I desperately soak. Sylvanas can contribute when there's a map objective that benefits a lot from her trait or there's nobody to punish her for jumping around them and shooting tons and tons of q's that are reloading from Windrunner.
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Oct 23, 2017 17:59
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Dietrich posted:They really have a few too many heroes in the game with "hit x hero" quests for him to be a go-to pick, but as a niche character he can be very effective under the right conditions. Grubby was playing some Sam and going illusion build and it got pretty hateful
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Oct 23, 2017 18:08
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JIZZ DENOUEMENT posted:Grubby was playing some Sam and going illusion build and it got pretty hateful Yeah, he's definitely a character who has some insane possible skill ceilings for really good players to climb to, but overall as a character focused primarily on autoattacks in a world where there are so many ways to counterpick AA heroes (blinds, blocks, whatever that talent is that reduces AA speed if someone attacks you, etc) it makes him kind of rough to fit into a draft and him feeding quest stacks is like an extra twist of the knife. He seems like he can clear camps insanely fast but, well, so can Sonya who seems like a better all-round pick if you need a melee beatstick that can solo mercs.
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Oct 23, 2017 18:19
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JIZZ DENOUEMENT posted:Grubby was playing some Sam and going illusion build and it got pretty hateful
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Oct 23, 2017 18:26
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Sonya can't clear camps that fast. She can do it efficiently but Samuro's got way better dips and can leave if he's stumbled upon. Don't get me wrong Sonya is insane and my first pick these days (people don't go Malth down here to counter her) but Samuro is the merc god.
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Oct 23, 2017 18:30
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Man, puckish scamp is such a great talent. It basically turns junkrat into murky. You can force the other team to tear their hair out by hitting any still standing towers then just ulting when they get to you. You do even more damage to the tower, and within ten seconds you're in another lane doing it again. Really at that point in the game you should be teamfighting, so I'm not endorsing this strategy. It is fun though.
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Oct 23, 2017 18:31
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IM seems like what you really want. He's too squishy to get off Bladestorm consistently and like...if you're good with the illusions, you won't die, ever.
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Oct 23, 2017 18:32
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PantsBandit posted:Man, puckish scamp is such a great talent. It basically turns junkrat into murky. You can force the other team to tear their hair out by hitting any still standing towers then just ulting when they get to you. You do even more damage to the tower, and within ten seconds you're in another lane doing it again.
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Oct 23, 2017 18:34
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No Wave posted:The best Zeratuls I've played with have traded 1 for 1 at irrelevant times on the other side of the map. The medium ones engage 1v3, do nothing, then use VP to escape. The bad ones ignore his quite decent ability to clear waves and just dive 1v5 over and over while raging. Zeratuls have absolutely been the worst ragers I've played with because they can't do anything and they don't realize their hero sucks. If Zeratul is trading himself he’s doing it hilariously wrong. Take that “blink has two charges” talent and you’ve got Genji levels of Oh poo poo escape. (My best Void Prison moment has to be popping it on the enemy team during their Li Li ult, but keeping Li Li out of the radius to waste her cooldown by the time the rest of the team reappeared)
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Oct 23, 2017 18:36
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Dire Human posted:If Zeratul is trading himself he’s doing it hilariously wrong. Take that “blink has two charges” talent and you’ve got Genji levels of Oh poo poo escape.
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Oct 23, 2017 18:41
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No Wave posted:Orbital BFG is more efficient at this and you still get to play the game... Orbital BFG is a bad talent though, whereas Puckish Scamp is The Best 
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Oct 23, 2017 18:43
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No Wave posted:I get really confused when players caught outside of the VP don't just walk in (unless there's a Jaina/Diablo/any combo on the enemy team). It triggers your “stay out of bad thing!!!” instincts and people avoid it for a second or two out of habit.
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Oct 23, 2017 18:44
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Or when the whole team walks into the VP and the enemy Kel'Thuzad uses that as a chance to launch them into orbit as soon as it expires.
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Oct 23, 2017 19:50
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Versus AI seems way more fun these days than in the past. Really looking forward to continued updates. So I have the HotS Complete app, which has builds available on it (shows win rates and popularity.) I assume these are from hotslogs, since the app also lets you sync to your hotlogs stats. My question is, are these builds optimal, assuming they are from hotlogs or some other similar database? Is there a known source of builds that is clearly worse than the others or are they all generally the same? Also, trying to get Valeera to lvl 5 and holy poo poo do I not know what I am doing. I guess I will get more comfortable over time, but drat did I feel overwhelmed. Edit: Mostly talking about big team fights. I felt like I was having an APM issue or something, with regards to finding good targets and actually doing the right attacks on them quickly. ToastyPotato fucked around with this message at 20:41 on Oct 23, 2017 |
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Oct 23, 2017 20:38
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ToastyPotato posted:Versus AI seems way more fun these days than in the past. Really looking forward to continued updates. She's energy limited rather than cooldown limited, unlike all other characters in HOTS. Don't spam her skills on cooldown. Apply 3 combo points, then wait for enough energy to use the finisher. Also consider which of her 3 stealth openers is the correct one given the target you are attacking. Garrote is usually the best choice if they have escape skills, but cheap shot might be better if they do a lot of AA damage or they're already being targeted by your team. If they're really low on health Ambush will do the most damage the fastest. Dietrich fucked around with this message at 20:48 on Oct 23, 2017 |
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Oct 23, 2017 20:44
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Lots of streamers have builds but lots of their builds tend to be extremely bad and outdated especially for heroes that aren't super meta right now. (Kerrigan still has Q build as the recommended build in most guides which is absurd now, any HL Kerrigan build that doesn't have Fury at 4 is automatically garbage). It's not realistic for a single person to keep 70 heroes up to date. No source is perfect but HotsLogs is the best start + your own experience eventually imo.
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Oct 23, 2017 20:45
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Also you tend to be able to get away with Talents in vs AI that you couldn't against a real player.
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Oct 23, 2017 21:07
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http://stormspy.net/heroes popped up a while back as an alternative to Hotslogs, but I don't know if it really catching on. ...and Valeera was the hero I always dreaded to show up when I used Auto-Select. I got a lot better at her when I stopped trying to 100-0 people (unless they are squishy and out of position). Also never bother with her against Veteran or Elite bots, they will respond to you the millisecond you leave stealth, it's absurd. I think this is a decent build to get to know Valeera better: 1. trait/energy regen 4. trait/combo points 7. Q/ambush 10. Smoke Bomb 13. Q/ambush 16. E/eviscerate 20. trait/D cooldown Mierenneuker fucked around with this message at 21:15 on Oct 23, 2017 |
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Oct 23, 2017 21:13
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Eraflure posted:Zeratul is the only stealth I'm happy to have in my team. Tyrande is the best stealth character  No Wave posted:Orbital BFG is more efficient at this and you still get to play the game... But from level 1-19 you have to play Sgt. Hammer...
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Oct 23, 2017 21:26
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I think Hammer is unfairly maligned. Her Z is sick and she's a decent AA hero with a nice bonus if left alone ever.
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Oct 23, 2017 21:42
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Hammer is good for grinding AI games in 4 mins
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Oct 23, 2017 21:46
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BrianBoitano posted:Tyrande is the best stealth character Was thinking of heroes with a passive stealth, but yeah, Tyrande strong. No Wave posted:I think Hammer is unfairly maligned. Her Z is sick and she's a decent AA hero with a nice bonus if left alone ever. Bad Hammer players should never press E in most of their games. Hammer is a worse baddie magnet than Nova because she's 1) a specialist 2) seemingly very easy to play 3) not very easy at all because sieging/teamfighting properly as Hammer takes a lot of practice
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Oct 23, 2017 21:55
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How do you usually deal with a sieged up hammer outside your walls? Happens a lot in qm where I just feel like "welp i'm stuck now". I assume the team should just rotate down and gank her in a normal circumstance?
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Oct 23, 2017 21:57
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If you can't answer her you need to ask for a rotation She has a lot of hard counters like Chromie, Nazeebo, etc.
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Oct 23, 2017 22:21
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Same way you deal with Sylvanas: Wrap around the back Use long distance abilities from outside of vision (approaching from side lane or hiding behind your wall) Save CC for when she starts her escape (hammer Z or Sylv wave) Send a tank (lol QM) to bully her away and (Sylv) take her Q fire
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Oct 23, 2017 22:30
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In hero league you draft a chromie, stitches, or kel'thuzad to tear her a new exhaust. In QM you just shrug and go eh its QM. Gotta play the cards dealt to you. Either your team rotates down to help or they don't. Part of the reason why I think hammer/nova/zagara are so popular in QM is because the other team doesn't have the opportunity to draft a specific counter.
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Oct 23, 2017 22:35
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| # ? Jun 10, 2024 09:21 |
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Tell me about this Zagara counter
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Oct 23, 2017 22:38
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