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Are the non-adventure sourcebooks workable, like the different peoples? I’m trying to google for people’s experiences but not having luck. (Thanks!)
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Oct 24, 2017 10:56
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There's not much in the way of mechanics that are objectionable. Like, the base stats for goblins or orcs aren't particularly objectionable, it's just background (the history/background of orcs) or specific character creation results (large genitals, loveslave to a hag, reputation as a great lover) that are maybe not suitable for a kid. I think most releases would need a sanitation pass before they're suitable for a 10-year old, but it shouldn't be too difficult or onerous (maybe time-consuming to come up with alternatives, though).
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Oct 24, 2017 11:25
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Serf posted:If they don't want to make a go of it there, then they're back to square 1. They can still rescue the priests (or at least get some form of closure on that front), but they'll have to find another way to get out of town. Sure, thanks. I just have to work out how. I figured, since they killed the guardians on this side, and then just refused to enter the portal before 48 hours later, the priests and their kidnappers have vacated the spot on the other side - presumably to leave for Tarterus. Of course, maybe I could get them to Tarterus, somehow 
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Oct 24, 2017 12:03
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Subjunctive posted:The 5e thread has been casting the usual, totally reasonable aspersions on that game, and SotDL keeps coming up as an alternative. Which is cool! rumble in the bunghole posted:The adventures are a lot trickier to fix but mostly you just ignore insanity and the fear effect some monsters have, skip level 0 and avoid using the more Dark Fantasy stuff like Forbidden Magic or a bunch of the monsters. The rest is just gm style. Rumble posted some good advice, and while I would definitely remove Insanity and Corruption and the Forbidden Magic traditions, I wouldn't ignore the fear effects in combat. They're important to the combat math, as PCs can easily amass quite a few boons to their attack, and those banes are important for balancing that out a bit. Right now I've reflavored Frightening as Intimidating and Horrifying as Mighty. Instead of becoming frightened, PCs become shaken. Alternatively, ignore what I just said since you're talking about a 10-year-old. Combat balance isn't that important in that case and skewing it in their favor is perfectly cool. Subjunctive posted:Are the non-adventure sourcebooks workable, like the different peoples? I’m trying to google for people’s experiences but not having luck. The DLC2 is noticeably better off with regards to the ancestries that are available and how they would play to people who aren't a fan of grimdark bullshit. As a general note, low rolls on character creation tables give worse results, especially with Backgrounds. 9 and below offer the more troubling results, and you may want to fudge the numbers on that to give them a good result or at least one that isn't disturbing. I would say that most of the setting books won't be useful to you, since the world isn't really suited for children. Some of the ancestry books, notably humans, halflings and dwarves are all pretty good on expanded options for those ancestries that don't dip into the objectionable. And the system books like Forbidden Rules and DLC1/2 are usually fine since they mostly just add new mechanics. You could look at the Freeport Companion if you're interested in pirate/sailings stuff with a noticeably lighter tone than the main setting. Tias posted:Sure, thanks. I just have to work out how. I figured, since they killed the guardians on this side, and then just refused to enter the portal before 48 hours later, the priests and their kidnappers have vacated the spot on the other side - presumably to leave for Tarterus. You could do so much with Tarterus, that would be awesome. There is also the possibility that as they explore around they find more portals that the kidnappers have been using. That way you could set them up with more destinations in case they don't like their current situation or want to try something different.
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Oct 24, 2017 12:57
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Subjunctive posted:Are the non-adventure sourcebooks workable, like the different peoples? I’m trying to google for people’s experiences but not having luck. All of them have some grimdark stuff, but most or all of it is very easily cropped out. The only ancestry I can think of that can't really be adapted is the Cambion from Exquisite Agony, whose abilities are built off of having and gaining Corruption. The Gnomes from Children of the Earth shouldn't require any conversion at all, they're pretty PG/PG-13 right out of the box. Did you have any questions about specific Ancestries/sourcebooks?
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Oct 24, 2017 15:02
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Technically double posting to ask about something that came up in the 5e thread. This game ties ability scores to Ancestry, which is both a big step backwards in game design and pretty problematic from an "Orcs are inherently stronger and less intelligent" perspective. But the starting stats are also definitely part of the game balance between all the Ancestries. Has anyone decoupled Ancestries from starting stats in favor of an array or point buy method? How did you balance things like the Clockwork having weaker stats in exchange for stronger Ancestry abilities?
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Oct 25, 2017 12:13
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Jimmeeee posted:Technically double posting to ask about something that came up in the 5e thread. This game ties ability scores to Ancestry, which is both a big step backwards in game design and pretty problematic from an "Orcs are inherently stronger and less intelligent" perspective. But the starting stats are also definitely part of the game balance between all the Ancestries. Has anyone decoupled Ancestries from starting stats in favor of an array or point buy method? How did you balance things like the Clockwork having weaker stats in exchange for stronger Ancestry abilities? I have come up with two solutions for this issue. For the stock setting, I allow players to take the human stats, 10 in everything with a +1 to any stat they want, instead of their ancestry's normal scores. Honestly this is the most equitable solution. I think that Schwalb really likes to emphasize how dark and ugly his world is, which includes things like dumber orcs and whatnot. This is one of the few places where mechanics are wedded to fluff in a way that I think hurts the game overall. In the setting that I've been working on for my upcoming game/possible hack, I've been working on my own ancestries. I specifically made sure that no ancestry starts with less than 10 Intellect, which was a primary goal of mine. These ancestries are still very much a WIP, and I'm strongly considering just going with my rule of "10 in all stats, +1 to one that you want" for all of them, even if that is more generic.
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Oct 25, 2017 12:24
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Serf posted:I have come up with two solutions for this issue. For the stock setting, I allow players to take the human stats, 10 in everything with a +1 to any stat they want, instead of their ancestry's normal scores. Honestly this is the most equitable solution. I think that Schwalb really likes to emphasize how dark and ugly his world is, which includes things like dumber orcs and whatnot. This is one of the few places where mechanics are wedded to fluff in a way that I think hurts the game overall. That makes sense, I should look into that. That does seem like it would leave Humans weaker than the rest though, since RAW they trade any other unique abilities for having higher and more customizable base stats than the others. Would giving them another starting profession help balance them out?
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Oct 25, 2017 12:38
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That's one thing I miss from Fantasy Craft, balanced/points-based ancestry/species design. I wonder, with the amount of ancestries we've got currently, if it would be possible to reverse-engineer something like that? Eh, probably more effort than it's worth...
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Oct 25, 2017 12:39
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Jimmeeee posted:Technically double posting to ask about something that came up in the 5e thread. This game ties ability scores to Ancestry, which is both a big step backwards in game design and pretty problematic from an "Orcs are inherently stronger and less intelligent" perspective. But the starting stats are also definitely part of the game balance between all the Ancestries. Has anyone decoupled Ancestries from starting stats in favor of an array or point buy method? How did you balance things like the Clockwork having weaker stats in exchange for stronger Ancestry abilities? Just reskin the ancestries.
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Oct 25, 2017 12:45
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Jimmeeee posted:That makes sense, I should look into that. That does seem like it would leave Humans weaker than the rest though, since RAW they trade any other unique abilities for having higher and more customizable base stats than the others. Would giving them another starting profession help balance them out? Another profession or language would be a good way to do that, but overall there are few ways to balance it out since there are far fewer numerical bits that you can tweak in SotDL compared to other games. I know that clockworks are overly gimped because Defense 13 is valued way higher than it should be. It is somewhat useful at level 0-3(ish), but since Defense doesn't stack, once your Agility is over 13 or you get mail armor or better it stops being relevant. That's reasonable but the very low base stats are too much of a trade off for it.
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Oct 25, 2017 12:46
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Serf posted:Another profession or language would be a good way to do that, but overall there are few ways to balance it out since there are far fewer numerical bits that you can tweak in SotDL compared to other games. I know that clockworks are overly gimped because Defense 13 is valued way higher than it should be. It is somewhat useful at level 0-3(ish), but since Defense doesn't stack, once your Agility is over 13 or you get mail armor or better it stops being relevant. That's reasonable but the very low base stats are too much of a trade off for it. The new Yerath from DLC 2 start with a base of 12 Defense and gain 1 more at level 4, maybe something similar could be done for Clockwork to bring them in line. Or maybe, since the Yerath are probably similarly gimped, both Ancestries' Defense could be set to 12 or 13 + Agility modifier so it has a chance of staying relevant when you hit your expert path.
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Oct 25, 2017 12:59
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In regards to ancestries determining stats I haven't found anything extremely objectionable, but I also only look at the stat blocks and tell my players to really focus on who their characters are as people rather than defining them by their attributes. I probably toss out a lot during character gen because I've never liked the idea of fabricating a character through tables. To that end, and your mileage may vary, I look at things like lower INT to start with as a reflection that maybe this character isn't formally educated or isn't "intelligent" according to the standards of the dominant culture. Orcs might have 9 INT, but it doesn't mean they're all drooling and illiterate, it probably just means they can't quote the classics like human scholars would. I guess it depends on whether you want to play SotDL as written and stick to the setting outlined in the book (which I think has a lot of cool poo poo), or take the mechanics and divorce them from the setting. If you really want to separate ancestries and attributes, you could try giving all level 0 characters six points, and a 9 in all four attributes. Raising an attribute costs one point, and you can only put a maximum of 2 points in an attribute at character gen unless otherwise stated in your ancestry (humans then retain their advantage of getting an extra attribute boost by being able to put three points in one attribute). Each ancestry then retains any of its unique racial talents. I am not a game designer, and this system probably has some serious oversights considering I just made it up on the spot. There is also the option of giving everyone human stats, I just didn't want to add to the chorus with a "me too."
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Oct 25, 2017 13:27
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Jimmeeee posted:The new Yerath from DLC 2 start with a base of 12 Defense and gain 1 more at level 4, maybe something similar could be done for Clockwork to bring them in line. Or maybe, since the Yerath are probably similarly gimped, both Ancestries' Defense could be set to 12 or 13 + Agility modifier so it has a chance of staying relevant when you hit your expert path. The yerath are significantly less gimped than the clockworks. They have a pretty normal stat spread and the application of their caste can bring them solidly up to a very good starting set of attributes. Add in their extra arms, limited flight and musk abilities and you're way better off than a clockwork, who have the key thing as mainly a way to be screwed over. My solution for the Defense issue is just to discard it entirely. Defense is equal to your Agility like normal, armor works the same way it does for anyone else.
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Oct 25, 2017 13:42
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Jimmeeee posted:Pretty problematic from an "Orcs are inherently stronger and less intelligent" perspective. Orcs are literally a race magic-engineered into being big dumb brutes to serve as slave soldiers. If this is a problem for your personal setting then just reskin the Ancestries as was suggested earlier - let a player mechanically play a human while saying they're an orc or whatever. But for the setting as is? It's not racism if it's true. In fact, it's intentionally treated as a horrible crime on the part of the Empire and a tragedy for the Jotuns.
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Oct 25, 2017 18:23
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Orcs are the result of moral degeneracy on the part of the Empire. They are a past sin made flesh and are a metaphor for imperialism. They also lead to its downfall. There's no reason to be offended on a racial basis - aristocracies produce an underclass, in this case literally.
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Oct 25, 2017 21:24
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I just go ahead and baseline bump up all Intellect scores to 10 because the alternative is a little too  for my taste. I know the setting isn't nice or happy, but the setting is the weakest aspect of the game.If a person wants to play a less-intelligent character, well, you can cut that Intellect down to a 9 and enjoy your free point in another stat. Speaking of which, I've been thinking more about how to handle stats in the game now, and I have another idea: an array of 10, 10, 10, and 9 that you can place however you like. You can then take a point from one to add it somewhere else. For humans, since as Jimmeeee mentioned this leaves them a little in a lurch, I propose giving them an additional +1 to any stat they want, plus an additional language/profession.
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Oct 25, 2017 22:01
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In fairness, the flavor seems to suggest that intellect 7 is the point at which a character starts being considered truly stupid. 9 and 8 are more basic laymen intelligence. I tend to roleplay orcs in my campaign as basically a darker shade of Klingons - not unintelligent per se but of extremely narrow focus and with little patience for extended consideration or introspection. The fact that humans especially stereotype them as dumb thugs - and underestimate them accordingly - is actually a theme I've taken advantage of in my stories. One of the recurring antagonists in my story is an envoy of Drudge who was the former slave of an upper crust family and thus more eloquent and focused on vicious manipulation over outright bloodshed. It resulted in a duel of influence between her and the PCs over the Crusader State of Westhold.
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Oct 25, 2017 23:39
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Is this game cool
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Oct 26, 2017 00:37
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Phi230 posted:Is this game cool Hell yes.
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Oct 26, 2017 00:42
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Phi230 posted:Is this game cool 
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Oct 26, 2017 00:48
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I wanna play
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Oct 26, 2017 00:58
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It is very good.
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Oct 26, 2017 01:01
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Play a smarty orc. Be the exception that proves the rule. (Not racist)
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Oct 26, 2017 01:23
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Jimmeeee posted:All of them have some grimdark stuff, but most or all of it is very easily cropped out. The only ancestry I can think of that can't really be adapted is the Cambion from Exquisite Agony, whose abilities are built off of having and gaining Corruption. Nothing specific yet, I haven’t had a chance to dive in. Thanks!
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Oct 26, 2017 04:12
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I want to run a one shot to convince some people that games besides D&D exist. Any recommendations on what to run?
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Oct 26, 2017 05:07
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Gumball Gumption posted:I want to run a one shot to convince some people that games besides D&D exist. Any recommendations on what to run? If you got it in a bundle somewhere, though, Dark Deeds In Lost Hope is a pretty decent looking starter adventure. It's not particularly gross, it's more investigation than combat, and you can mostly dial up or down the combat that is there based on how the PCs are looking without totally wrecking the feel of the adventure.
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Oct 26, 2017 06:26
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Gumball Gumption posted:I want to run a one shot to convince some people that games besides D&D exist. Any recommendations on what to run? Like bewilderment said, Dark Deeds in Last Hope is the go-to adventure for introducing player to the game. It is the biggest and most well-detailed adventure put out so far and it has a good balance of investigation, combat and NPC interaction. I would also throw out a recommendation for The Witching Wood, as that was the first adventure I ran online and it went really well. It's a bit more of a dungeon delve with forest exploration spread out over several days and a time limit for the PCs to find the titular witch and deal with her. A Year Without Rain is also good if you want a traditional dungeon crawl after some investigation. It is high-lethality though, and the boss is a bit overtuned and can easily take out PCs in short order. Finally Dead By Dawn is good as well, since it takes place in one area, has an interesting minigame of rolls with random events and actions the PCs can take, and is mostly a series of combat encounters and interaction with a few NPCs. If you want to skip level 0 and do level 1, then Blood Will Run is a good choice, mostly mystery and investigation with a little dungeon delve at the end and a decent boss monster for the PCs to tangle with.
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Oct 26, 2017 14:03
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Yo Serf, I've been thinking, and I've decided to let Tarterus come to them. The powers that be are going to take out the group for what they did to their portal/guards, and sic a group of hobgoblin assassins on them. Torturing, tracking or bloodhounding the survivors or corpses will lead to a new portal, to a waystation on Tarterus itself. Fighting off the moon-beast slavers will lead to finding the lost priestly delegation, and horrible insanity trying to deal with the cursed moon and returning in one piece. Your feedback has been much appreciated, is there anything you'd add or remove? FunkMonkey posted:Play a smarty orc. Be the exception that proves the rule. (Not racist) Both the orcs in my group are rather bright with a Kunta Kintish streak a mile wide. Good thing they're stuck in Dis 
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Oct 26, 2017 14:13
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Those all look like good choices, thanks for the help! Here's hoping I can convince my group that other games do in fact exist.
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Oct 26, 2017 14:37
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Tias posted:Yo Serf, I've been thinking, and I've decided to let Tarterus come to them. The powers that be are going to take out the group for what they did to their portal/guards, and sic a group of hobgoblin assassins on them. Torturing, tracking or bloodhounding the survivors or corpses will lead to a new portal, to a waystation on Tarterus itself. Fighting off the moon-beast slavers will lead to finding the lost priestly delegation, and horrible insanity trying to deal with the cursed moon and returning in one piece. I like the idea of making the problem more of a proactive thing. Confronting players and sending threats after them is a good move when you want to get them rolling down the path. My suggestion for something to add would be harvesters. They are often responsible to the abductions that take place on Urth, and since they can often blend in with normal society they make good intelligent villains who can hound the players after they return from Tarterus. If you don't want them to be the centerpiece of the adventure, maybe set up some hints that harvesters are working with the slavers. Then you can spring harvesters on them later if you want and go ahead and set up some foreshadowing now. Also, as a general note to the thread, especially people who are buying the Halloween bundle currently on DTRPG: the supplement Horrific Parasites (about harvesters) contains some rough stuff beyond the normal Shadow of the Demon Lord fare. I wasn't really happy that it came up without some sort of warning so proceed with caution. Gumball Gumption posted:Those all look like good choices, thanks for the help! Here's hoping I can convince my group that other games do in fact exist. I've found that SotDL is a somewhat easier sell than something like Dungeon World or what have you because it still uses the d20. I've known players who are like "no d20? No dice" (pun not intended)
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Oct 26, 2017 14:41
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How's the math, by the way? Normally d20 games (read, D&D) give me a bad first impression because math tends to be spotty (see: D&D 4e before the MM fix). Is this one of those games with +1 modifiers all over the place?
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Oct 26, 2017 17:45
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Azran posted:How's the math, by the way? Normally d20 games (read, D&D) give me a bad first impression because math tends to be spotty (see: D&D 4e before the MM fix). Is this one of those games with +1 modifiers all over the place? Not really, no. The game has an Attribute baseline of 10, which means a +0 to rolls using that Attribute. So if you have a Strength of 11 and you're swording a bandit, you get a +1 to the roll. If you're attempting to cast a spell from an incantation with Intellect 9, you do so with a -1. These numbers translate directly, so your modifier to a roll is always your score -10. There are very few stacking modifiers. No +2 swords or armor of +1 Defense. Armor gives you a static Defense value and only the light armors stack with your Agility. The target number for all challenge rolls is 10, and attack rolls are variable depending on what defense you're attacking. Boons and banes are where things get interesting. They are d6s that represent modifiers to your rolls that either help or hurt you. Boons and banes cancel each other out, and no matter how many you add to your roll, you only take the highest. So getting more of them has a lessened effect the higher you go, but martials who get guaranteed boons can trade those boons through banes to do special attacks. It is a system that really helps even out the math and swinginess, unlike advantage/disadvantage from 5E.
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Oct 26, 2017 17:52
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Azran posted:How's the math, by the way? Normally d20 games (read, D&D) give me a bad first impression because math tends to be spotty (see: D&D 4e before the MM fix). Is this one of those games with +1 modifiers all over the place? No, the math is actually very flat. Skill checks are almost always a DC10 unless you're explicitly rolling against an opponent. The modifiers are often less important than the implementation of the boons and banes, which do most of the heavy lifting to boost your rolls.
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Oct 26, 2017 17:52
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Wow, I am loving this 31% off sale right now. Also I noticed there's another new version of the core book. I wonder if the paths of power stuff is back in?
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Oct 27, 2017 19:32
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dwarf74 posted:Wow, I am loving this 31% off sale right now. From what I can tell, the better Fighter from Paths of Battle is now the standard Fighter. I could be wrong, but they look identical.
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Oct 27, 2017 19:36
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dwarf74 posted:Wow, I am loving this 31% off sale right now. The latest new version was basically fixing the bookmarks, they went missing when they did the big update.
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Oct 27, 2017 19:37
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Serf posted:From what I can tell, the better Fighter from Paths of Battle is now the standard Fighter. I could be wrong, but they look identical. Good. I had remembered he'd rolled it back after complaints, last I'd heard anything about it.
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Oct 27, 2017 20:15
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So, which of the Expert adventures are good? I've done Blood Will Flow and One Perfect Moment for the Novice adventures, which were fun. Also I think the Rogue is broken because the party's one has made like 90% of all the kills, especially on the undead we have fought due to the player's ludicrous luck at rolling nat 20s.
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Oct 30, 2017 16:04
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SunAndSpring posted:So, which of the Expert adventures are good? I've done Blood Will Flow and One Perfect Moment for the Novice adventures, which were fun. Luck is luck, so there's not much you can do about a player who just keeps rolling high. Let them enjoy their good fortune I guess. As for Expert adventures, the only one I have personally run is "Feast of the Father", which is a very fun little Shadow Over Innsmouth-style investigation/combat adventure. Lots of bodily function grossout horror though, so be forewarned. I've also looked at "Beware the Tides of Karshoon" which is a neat dungeon crawl, but I can't vouch for it as strongly. _____________________________________________________________________________ The penultimate Freeport Kickstarter release dropped yesterday, "Beyond the World's Edge". This a 34-page supplement that details some of the lands beyond Rul, with an emphasis on coastal or island settings. Highlights are
Overall I think it's a pretty good book, but be warned that if you're a player, there's really nothing in here for you aside from ideas for backstories and whatnot. This is all setting info and monster statblocks. Oh yeah, did I mention the crashed spaceship full of robots, aliens and laser guns? _____________________________________________________________________________ Also, on  November 9th at 8:00 PM Eastern time, I'll be running a level 5 adventure of my own design. Right now I'm calling it Paradise Island, based on information from "Beyond the World's Edge". If you're free and want to give the game a shot, drop by the Discord to get in on this one. If you have any questions, feel free to drop me a line here or in the chat.
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Oct 31, 2017 03:02
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