Fall Season 2017: Only discuss animes within my "watching range"

The Something Awful Forums > The Finer Arts > VEGETA > Fall Season 2017: Only discuss animes within my "watching range"

«‹›84 »

Eela6: May 25, 2007; Shredded Hen

kater posted:

Land of Lustrous Tier List:

Benitoite
Ulrichite
Bort
Uraninite
Diamond
Emerald
Sapphire
Usoro
Tungsten
Amethyst

I may have only seen 3 episodes but Phos is the best

What is wrong with you??

# ? Oct 26, 2017 05:50

Adbot: ADBOT LOVES YOU

# ? May 27, 2024 19:54

Space Flower: Sep 10, 2014; by Games Forum

Endorph posted:

well he aint my female but the sister is heavy

yeah i love imosae

# ? Oct 26, 2017 06:41

Kytrarewn: Jul 15, 2011; Solving mysteries in
Bb, F and D.

The Colonel posted:

it's fine. colosseum was weaker than the original but also the original is pretty much impossible to top and they were covering an arc in a single ep that the original expanded into a two-parter that was one of the most memorable arcs in the entire show, the stuff it's been going over that the original didn't hasn't felt as well-directed, but i can't exactly blame them for not being able to hire on a dead director and i've enjoyed it anyway

I had this same problem with FMA:Brotherhood, so I sympathize with them.

Start watching, get to the Tucker arc (which really bothered me in the original) and they just sort of roll over it in a single episode and it leaves me completely flat to the point that I couldn't continue watching (or got distracted and never thought about turning it back on or something).

As someone who hasn't seen the original Kino's(yet), I really enjoyed the Colosseum episode, but I'll be interested to see what I think of it in the original when I get around to watching that, too.

# ? Oct 26, 2017 09:50

kater: Nov 16, 2010

Still shocked how good Guru Guru is. Curious what else I've missed out on now.

# ? Oct 26, 2017 11:10

dogsicle: Oct 23, 2012

i spit on a list with no Antarcticite or Cairngorm

# ? Oct 26, 2017 11:44

Kytrarewn: Jul 15, 2011; Solving mysteries in
Bb, F and D.

kater posted:

Still shocked how good Guru Guru is. Curious what else I've missed out on now.

That's the problem with judging shows based on forum chatter. There's not much to discuss in Guru Guru- just good, dumb humor. But it's still one of the most satisfying shows of my week.

# ? Oct 26, 2017 11:52

Kashuno: Oct 9, 2012; Where the hell is my SWORD?; Grimey Drawer

Well, hopefully episode 4 of Juni Taisen changes things up or I am probably going to drop it. The first episode it was a shocking ending, the second episode was spent with tension wondering if it is going to go the same way as ep1, and now with ep3 it has gotten predictable real fast

# ? Oct 26, 2017 12:13

Nate RFB: Jan 17, 2005; Clapping Larry

Kytrarewn posted:

I had this same problem with FMA:Brotherhood, so I sympathize with them.

Start watching, get to the Tucker arc (which really bothered me in the original) and they just sort of roll over it in a single episode and it leaves me completely flat to the point that I couldn't continue watching (or got distracted and never thought about turning it back on or something).

This is why I always, always recommend the FMA manga over Brotherhood. It is a far superior story overall to the original, but the manner in which it rushes through those first 20 or so episodes to get through the first few arcs was beyond the pale.

# ? Oct 26, 2017 12:48

There Bias Two: Jan 13, 2009; I'm not a good person

Nate RFB posted:

This is why I always, always recommend the FMA manga over Brotherhood. It is a far superior story overall to the original, but the manner in which it rushes through those first 20 or so episodes to get through the first few arcs was beyond the pale.

I hated the main villain and much preferred the 2003 version.

# ? Oct 26, 2017 12:53

Nate RFB: Jan 17, 2005; Clapping Larry

Dante is super lame and everything about most of the character arcs revolving around the villains is halfbaked and not well thought out at all.

# ? Oct 26, 2017 13:03

Fangz: Jul 5, 2007; Oh I see! This must be the Bad Opinion Zone!

There's aspects of the 2003 anime I preferred to Brotherhood. I liked their treatment of Lust, I liked that the bad guy's final comeuppance isn't 'being beaten in a fight', I liked Pride vs Mustang.

# ? Oct 26, 2017 13:23

Nate RFB: Jan 17, 2005; Clapping Larry

Yeah but if you're going to go with fights with huge emotional gravitas re: Mustang, nothing comes close to Mustang vs. Envy in FMA manga/Brotherhood.

I also think manga Pride is orders of magnitude cooler in both character and concept than the sad sack that is 2003 Wrath.

E: Hell if we're going to do 2003 Pride vs. manga/Brotherhood Wrath, the latter's role in the endgame is an insane series of :stare:

Nate RFB fucked around with this message at 13:30 on Oct 26, 2017

# ? Oct 26, 2017 13:26

Lemon-Lime: Aug 6, 2009

Urahara keeps getting better with each episode, this week's was great.

I hope we get some answers soon. :ohdear:

# ? Oct 26, 2017 13:35

Fangz: Jul 5, 2007; Oh I see! This must be the Bad Opinion Zone!

Nate RFB posted:

Yeah but if you're going to go with fights with huge emotional gravitas re: Mustang, nothing comes close to Mustang vs. Envy in FMA manga/Brotherhood.

I also think manga Pride is orders of magnitude cooler in both character and concept than the sad sack that is 2003 Wrath.

E: Hell if we're going to do 2003 Pride vs. manga/Brotherhood Wrath, the latter's role in the endgame is an insane series of &

Sure, sure, I don't dispute that Brotherhood brought the cool fights. I just liked the 2003 anime's angle - that ultimately the bad guys are objectively stronger than the good guys, but they are in the end defeated by their failure to understand humanity. Pride failing to understand the love of his 'son', Dante failing to understand Gluttony's love for Lust, etc etc. This I thought was in the end more effectively and subtly done than how Father was finally defeated, and having the Voice of God dictate the theme of the series to him.

# ? Oct 26, 2017 13:37

Rangpur: Dec 31, 2008

The whole FMA/FMA: Brotherhood split makes it kind of a pain to recommend, because any part of the original manga that the 2003 version covered turned out better simply by virtue of not rushing everything to get to the new stuff. I also prefer certain thematic touches re: the homonculi, but I'm willing to concede that doesn't necessarily trump Brotherhood having a tighter, more coherent back half.

I guess you could watch the original anime up until Alphonse gets kidnapped by Greed, then switch to Brotherhood? There's probably stuff that doesn't quite gel with the transition from one to the other but nothing that majorly alters the plot, I think. Or you could just read the manga, though I think it would be a pity to completely skip a genuinely good adaptation, even if you do have to assemble it like Frankenstein's Monster to get the best version.

# ? Oct 26, 2017 13:48

Nate RFB: Jan 17, 2005; Clapping Larry

Fangz posted:

Sure, sure, I don't dispute that Brotherhood brought the cool fights. I just liked the 2003 anime's angle - that ultimately the bad guys are objectively stronger than the good guys, but they are in the end defeated by their failure to understand humanity. Pride failing to understand the love of his 'son', Dante failing to understand Gluttony's love for Lust, etc etc. This I thought was in the end more effectively and subtly done than how Father was finally defeated, and having the Voice of God dictate the theme of the series to him.

To me it basically comes down to me not thinking the characterization and arcs of the 2003 Homunculi to be all that well constructed or thought out. Their origins and motivations compared to their manga counterparts feels forced and convoluted, with some being interesting like Lust but most just kind of being :confused:

and alienating. In a sense it felt like Bones was reaching for narrative heights that they did not have the actual talent to achieve. Arakawa's take is arguably more simplistic, but there is so much more heart & soul to that cast of villains and I never came to doubt or roll my eyes at their arcs in a similar fashion.

# ? Oct 26, 2017 13:50

Postal Parcel: Aug 2, 2013

Endorph posted:

i not only like touga, my favorite utena character is saionji

Wakaba sockpuppet account spotted.
Honestly, my favorite was Juri. She tried so hard yet still couldn't make it to the stars

Rangpur posted:

The whole FMA/FMA: Brotherhood split makes it kind of a pain to recommend, because any part of the original manga that the 2003 version covered turned out better simply by virtue of not rushing everything to get to the new stuff. I also prefer certain thematic touches re: the homonculi, but I'm willing to concede that doesn't necessarily trump Brotherhood having a tighter, more coherent back half.

I guess you could watch the original anime up until Alphonse gets kidnapped by Greed, then switch to Brotherhood? There's probably stuff that doesn't quite gel with the transition from one to the other but nothing that majorly alters the plot, I think. Or you could just read the manga, though I think it would be a pity to completely skip a genuinely good adaptation, even if you do have to assemble it like Frankenstein's Monster to get the best version.

I don't think it's that hard, honestly
FMA has an arguably more melancholy take on the series, and the ending is certainly more of a downer. Contrast this to Brotherhood which has a much more hopeful message(and arguably tighter endgame). Pick which one you want to feel, or watch both and enjoy the differences. It's a long series though so there's no reason to destroy yourself in a one night binge.
(You being the general you)

# ? Oct 26, 2017 15:42

Kytrarewn: Jul 15, 2011; Solving mysteries in
Bb, F and D.

It's interesting to compare against, for example, Negima!? and Mahou Sensei Negima. While not a drama like FMA and Kino, they covered largely different storylines in very different ways down to having seemingly different and mutually exclusive mechanics for the magic systems. Shaft (presumably Xebec wasn't involved in the conversation at that point) did a brilliant job of not making the story feel either rushed or excessively-familiar, even for someone who watched both series back to back. And despite ignoring a couple of seemingly-major plot beats from the early series (largely revolving around Asuna) you still got a feel for the characters, their personalities and their respective places in the world.

I keep meaning to get around to reading the manga to see how both plotlines actually intertwine, but have not as yet.

# ? Oct 26, 2017 16:08

RME: Feb 20, 2012

Nate RFB posted:

Dante is super lame and everything about most of the character arcs revolving around the villains is halfbaked and not well thought out at all.

the last part of the 2003 anime with Dante is definitely where i felt the series takes a downturn

# ? Oct 26, 2017 16:18

gimme the GOD DAMN candy: Jul 1, 2007

Kytrarewn posted:

It's interesting to compare against, for example, Negima!? and Mahou Sensei Negima. While not a drama like FMA and Kino, they covered largely different storylines in very different ways down to having seemingly different and mutually exclusive mechanics for the magic systems. Shaft (presumably Xebec wasn't involved in the conversation at that point) did a brilliant job of not making the story feel either rushed or excessively-familiar, even for someone who watched both series back to back. And despite ignoring a couple of seemingly-major plot beats from the early series (largely revolving around Asuna) you still got a feel for the characters, their personalities and their respective places in the world.

I keep meaning to get around to reading the manga to see how both plotlines actually intertwine, but have not as yet.

negima!? was a weird silly comedy, while every other negima adaptation focused 100% on the naked girls. and to be fair, that is probably where most of the series' popularity comes from even if the flashy magic fights are more popular around here.

# ? Oct 26, 2017 16:49

Spiritus Nox: Sep 2, 2011

Do people around here like Negima? I've heard mixed things. Read a bit of the manga back in Junior High and liked it well enough, but I was a dumb kid at the time and tastes change.

# ? Oct 26, 2017 16:52

Nate RFB: Jan 17, 2005; Clapping Larry

Spiritus Nox posted:

Do people around here like Negima? I've heard mixed things. Read a bit of the manga back in Junior High and liked it well enough, but I was a dumb kid at the time and tastes change.

It's a mixed bag. I think Akamatsu has a genuine knack for fantasy action (and the path he took to be able to do that in the first place is kind of interesting) with absolutely great artwork and usually some really solid/memorable characters. On the other hand the harem hinjinx/comedy gets pretty laborious and more often than not is just kind of lame even if you're into that sort of stuff. At its heights the original Negima was one of the best shounen action series that I felt I was reading at the time, and during its lows it obviously was not.

# ? Oct 26, 2017 16:59

Endorph: Jul 22, 2009

negima ends with a lesbian marriage

# ? Oct 26, 2017 17:58

Nipponophile: Apr 8, 2009

Spiritus Nox posted:

Do people around here like Negima? I've heard mixed things. Read a bit of the manga back in Junior High and liked it well enough, but I was a dumb kid at the time and tastes change.

It combined the worst aspects of harem comedies with the worst aspects of shounen battlers. Of course it's going to have a fan base.

# ? Oct 26, 2017 19:11

Ranzear: Jul 25, 2013

Space Flower posted:

yeah i love imosae

Unrelated: This but unironically, because I rather enjoy how it depicts a meandering creative process and the hints of what he's gonna start actually writing based on the opening. I see it becoming some kind of bizarro Nozaki-kun.

But yeah, the skeeze factor will ruin that for a lot of people.

# ? Oct 26, 2017 19:56

dogsicle: Oct 23, 2012

erotic_egg_eating.gif

# ? Oct 26, 2017 20:04

HellCopter: Feb 9, 2012; College Slice

Spiritus Nox posted:

Do people around here like Negima? I've heard mixed things. Read a bit of the manga back in Junior High and liked it well enough, but I was a dumb kid at the time and tastes change.

I think it's great. The beginning is bog standard Love Hina stuff, but once it picks up it almost never stops. Even if that time is dozens of chapters in...
The action is super well-drawn and easy to follow. Whenever I re-read it there's always stuff I'm looking forward to seeing again.

# ? Oct 26, 2017 20:12

Eela6: May 25, 2007; Shredded Hen

Is blend-s good?

# ? Oct 26, 2017 20:16

AnoHito: May 8, 2014

Yes

# ? Oct 26, 2017 20:16

Silver2195: Apr 4, 2012

Spiritus Nox posted:

Do people around here like Negima? I've heard mixed things. Read a bit of the manga back in Junior High and liked it well enough, but I was a dumb kid at the time and tastes change.

I'm deeply ambivalent toward it. Quoting my own post from the UQ Holder thread (minus some of the more spoilery or excessively detailed stuff):

Silver2195 posted:

I've just read through the first 4 Omnibus volumes of Negima (up to the semifinals of the tournament). My thoughts on it are kind of complicated.

The bad:
* The element of teenage girls sexually harassing a prepubescent boy is uncomfortable as hell. I realize that the girls who push it the farthest, like Makie, are meant to be seen as immature and thoughtless rather than cool, but it's still treated as a joke.
* I guess I can take a somewhat more forgiving view of the girls who are in love with Negi but aren't so pushy about it, like Nodoka, but the age gap is still big enough to keep it in somewhat uncomfortable territory. That the girls who are most seriously in love with him are specifically impressed by his emotional maturity does help, I guess.
* I don't particularly object to fanservice per se, but here it's just so pervasive it becomes tedious, even for a while after the transition to battle manga. (This has surprisingly little inherent connection to the above points, since the fanservice almost always involves the girls, not Negi.) I think part of the reason it's so annoying is that it feels like Akamatsu doesn't just want readers to get aroused, he wants them to find it funny too, and it just isn't funny.
* The way the loser in half the fights may or may not have been holding back gets silly after a while.

The good:
* Akamatsu manages a large cast remarkably well. Some of the girls get very little focus, but Akamatsu still remembers they exist and lets them stick around in the background, and most of them have individualized personalities.
* There's interesting fights involving even characters with pretty simple power sets. Part of the trick of it is establishing the emotional stakes well, part of it is making the situations more complex than straightforward one-on-one fights (even during the tournament), and part of it is drawing action clearly.
* The villains are generally established as not really being that bad before they're beaten, which is much better than the common shonen trope (like many bad shonen tropes, Reborn is an obvious example, but Dragon Ball also did it) of establishing villains are irredeemable and then redeeming them anyway.

Thoughts on specific characters:
* Negi himself has a pretty unusual personality for the protagonist of a series like this; he's very book-smart, his harem-lead obliviousness is clearly mostly willful (and he has a good reason for it), and he doubts himself a lot (and not just when he loses a fight). He undergoes some interesting character development early on; he starts out with an immature tendency to seek magical quick fixes for his and other people's emotional/interpersonal problems, but he gradually gets over it. He's brave as opposed to merely lacking fear, but still actually brave as opposed to an Usopp-type character who only finds his courage when it's almost too late. It's kind of disappointing that he was replaced by someone as generic as Touta, although Touta has gotten more interesting lately.
* Asuna was one of the less interesting major characters for a while; she was dumb and tsundere and that was pretty much it. Her fight against Setsuna gives her some unexpected depth, though; arguably this shows that Akamatsu's decision to actually randomize the tournament bracket was good for storytelling, although a less skilled shonen writer might still have written a fight like that with no emotional stakes at all.
* Konoka isn't very fleshed out at this point; she's a nice person and that's about it. Yue is far more complex and interesting but clearly intended to be a much more minor character. [Retrospective note: Yue actually ends up getting more focus than Konoka]
* Evangeline is a good example of what I meant about establishing a villain as somewhat sympathetic before they're defeated; the first thing we're told about her is Takamichi's suggestion that Negi talk to her if he really needs help. We actually see her at her worst during the tournament rather than the blackout, since during the blackout Evangeline didn't come across as particularly sadistic. She's clearly changed a lot by the time of UQ Holder, but I can still definitely buy her as the same character.

Thoughts on specific arcs:
* The introductory arc was the weakest, since it was so focused on fanservice, unfunny slapstick comedy, and so forth. It nevertheless did a good job of establishing a lot of characters. I do think that, while Akamatsu intended to transition to a battle manga from the beginning, he wasn't quite sure which characters would be important; Ayaka was probably supposed to be more important than she ended up being and Setsuna less so, for example. If so, the change in direction was a wise one.
* The Evangeline arc features the first major fights of the series, and they're OK but nothing special.
* The Kyoto arc had better fights and introduced some characters from outside Negi's class. I think this is the real transition to a battle manga.
* The Wilhelm arc is somewhat weaker. Seeing everyone work together to deal with the villains' tricks was nice, although seeing how reliant the villains were on surprise, hijacking Asuna's power, etc. makes them oddly unthreatening in retrospect.
* Some interesting stuff happened at the festival (the scenes with Yue, for example), but a lot of the festival storyline felt like a return to the first arc and made me impatient for the tournament. I think Akamatsu was stalling a little to plan out the tournament and Chao storylines.
* The tournament is probably the strongest arc so far. Akamatsu's famous decision to actually randomize the bracket paid off pretty well, leading to some tense fights and character development, although it probably also contributed to the overreliance on "maybe he/she was holding back."

Edit: I forgot to mention that while Akamatsu is generally good at panel composition, he is terrible at speech-bubble placement. You have to guess who's speaking from context sometimes.

Silver2195 fucked around with this message at 20:36 on Oct 26, 2017

# ? Oct 26, 2017 20:32

Lemon-Lime: Aug 6, 2009

Eela6 posted:

Is blend-s good?

Yeah, it's funny. I like it.

# ? Oct 26, 2017 20:39

Space Flower: Sep 10, 2014; by Games Forum

Nipponophile posted:

It combined the worst aspects of harem comedies with the worst aspects of shounen battlers. Of course it's going to have a fan base.

Nipplephile here is mad Akamatsu never draws the nipple

# ? Oct 26, 2017 20:57

Julias: Jun 24, 2012; Strum in a harmonizing quartet
I want to cause a revolution

What can I do? My savage
nature is beyond wild

Eela6 posted:

Is blend-s good?

It's alright, it's a functional SOL workplace comedy with some good jokes here and there.

# ? Oct 26, 2017 21:07

Spiritus Nox: Sep 2, 2011

Julias posted:

It's alright, it's a functional SOL workplace comedy with some good jokes here and there.

Is there any context to Hifumi showing up in that eyecatch I've seen on twitter, or does the show just abruptly go "LOOK! DOGAKOBO!!""

# ? Oct 26, 2017 23:08

dogsicle: Oct 23, 2012

Spiritus Nox posted:

Is there any context to Hifumi showing up in that eyecatch I've seen on twitter, or does the show just abruptly go "LOOK! DOGAKOBO!!""

they're all manga time kirara shows. the other girl is from kinmoza

# ? Oct 26, 2017 23:09

Space Flower: Sep 10, 2014; by Games Forum

the manager is talking about being moe for dark-haired nadeshiko girls in that scene, such as shinobu and hifumin

# ? Oct 26, 2017 23:33

Spiritus Nox: Sep 2, 2011

Space Flower posted:

the manager is talking about being moe for dark-haired nadeshiko girls in that scene, such as shinobu and hifumin

ahhhh

# ? Oct 26, 2017 23:37

Waffleman_: Jan 20, 2011; I don't wanna I don't wanna I don't wanna I don't wanna!!!

https://twitter.com/Crunchyroll/status/923713063152263168

Dear God.

# ? Oct 27, 2017 01:53

an actual dog: Nov 18, 2014

yes good

# ? Oct 27, 2017 01:56

Adbot: ADBOT LOVES YOU

# ? May 27, 2024 19:54

AnoHito: May 8, 2014

Waffleman_ posted:

https://twitter.com/Crunchyroll/status/923713063152263168

Dear God.

# ? Oct 27, 2017 01:57

The Something Awful Forums > The Finer Arts > VEGETA > Fall Season 2017: Only discuss animes within my "watching range"

«‹›84 »