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Warthur posted:By way of counterpoint I think it is likely that Beast has a somewhat higher proportion of forum-aware customers than, say, Vampire, Werewolf, or Mage do in either WoD or CoD flavours. Hey so this is like five pages back but it's almost like going POD and not going through any distributors fucks up your ability to get into brick and mortar because retailers can't get it wholesale unless they get in on the Kickstarter Crazy as gently caress that working outside the normal retail chain means you don't have presence in retail stores, who knew E that said I understand why they went that route but also it feels like shaking your head about a lack of presence in brick and mortar is kinda goofy
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Oct 26, 2017 05:42
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Hey, here's some good news. James Jacobs posted this over at ENWorld.quote:As the developer of the Book of the Damned, I can indeed confirm Folca was an error of judgement.
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Oct 26, 2017 06:15
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Rand Brittain posted:Yes, those are both personal attacks, and it would be very easy to reframe them so that they aren't without altering the content of the sentence! So I'm surprised that people don't. Suck my dick you gently caress man. I like big white boy butts.
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Oct 26, 2017 06:17
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Dave Brookshaw posted:This dumb! GimpInBlack posted:As one of the other Dummies in question, your review, while tough to read, never felt like an attack to me. And yeah, everything Dave said is accurate--I was one of those experienced writers with a lot of other poo poo on my plate at the time, and I regret that I didn't see where the game was heading before it was too late. It's not the game I thought I was working on, and I'm sorry that reading it caused you pain. These are interesting perspectives and I'm really glad you posted them, thanks. As someone who Beastposted a lot on RPGnet this p. much confirms some of the things I thought contributed. Levi Kornelsen posted:Eminently true. Criticism is not "giving cover" for those things and the posts here haven't been imprecise. You can use "Ah, but if your post isn't perfect you are giving cover for bad things" to apply to literally anything. There is room for mediocre posters to attempt mediocre critiques without having to take responsibility for death threats. Dave Brookshaw posted:No one seems to be reevaluating Promethean's "unhappy creature made of junk that slowly learns to be a human" or demon's "robot masquerading human emotions" in the light of this. It's just sticking it to the target that's already endangered its writers' lives a few times. I think this is probably because the accusation against McFarland is not that he had to spend time learning to become human or pretend that he couldn't experience emotions like other people, but because he was accused of abuse and Beast is about "creatures that abuse." You could re-interpret Promethean and Demon in light of that, but to be fair, you'd need to be better at reading media to be able to do that, and your average person might have trouble seeing it. The problem with beast is obvious enough to drag in neophytes. Mormon Star Wars fucked around with this message at 06:23 on Oct 26, 2017 |
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Oct 26, 2017 06:19
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Dave Brookshaw posted:Most things haven't had other participants doxxed or sent death threats already, before the allegations about Matt came to light. Beast has. You goddamn simp neither of those books is about how abuse is cool and good and anyone who fights back against abusers is a bad guy you loving rear end in a top hat At what point in this, after presumably reading the discussion up to a given point, did you think man you know what's a good look, saying that actually you're all just using the current situation to poo poo on a thing you already hate, not "wow gently caress the things people we're already saying take on a new light given new evidence" Get lobotomized E Jesus Christ I'm catching up and trying not to reply to the thread in real time but seriously what the gently caress, why do you feel the need to take a bullet for the book that people were already rightfully disgusted by and then put another one in your own foot by saying that this is all new poo poo following the accusation Is it because you're a goddamn moron? Probably! (USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST) (USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST)
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Oct 26, 2017 06:20
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I always wondered why rpg.net came off like a bunch of passive-aggressive vipers wearing stepford smiles. The fact that this was all in service of protecting the feelings of people in the industry just makes it all the more tragicomic.Rand Brittain posted:Yes, those are both personal attacks, and it would be very easy to reframe them so that they aren't without altering the content of the sentence! So I'm surprised that people don't. This isn't the Ex3 thread, so can you dial back the sycophancy a bit? I get not wanting to have words on record that might insult or hurt the feelings of people you want to work with, but it's possible to just hold your tongue and not chime in. Frankly, over the past few pages, you've just come off as a snide rear end in a top hat.
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Oct 26, 2017 07:02
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Any forum that makes a rule out of no personal attacks of any kind becomes a fuckin poison pit of assholes where the people who are liked by moderation and/or are good at the pass agg bullshit game can get away with anything and anyone who goes 'whst no that's stupid" gets punished gently caress big purple
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Oct 26, 2017 07:19
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The wheels are turning. Matt's been permabanned at rpg.net now.
Dave Brookshaw fucked around with this message at 07:34 on Oct 26, 2017 |
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Oct 26, 2017 07:23
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BENGHAZI 2 posted:Any forum that makes a rule out of no personal attacks of any kind becomes a fuckin poison pit of assholes where the people who are liked by moderation and/or are good at the pass agg bullshit game can get away with anything and anyone who goes 'whst no that's stupid" gets punished no, gently caress you buddy!!!
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Oct 26, 2017 08:22
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Ettin posted:Finally, my time to shine. How do I pitch my idea to Onyx Path and how do they feel about Anime? "Okay guys, get this, a Beast family, but they cause suffering by filling their speech with puns."
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Oct 26, 2017 08:34
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Goa Tse-tung posted:no, gently caress you buddy!!! I'm speaking from experience is the hell of it The Penny Arcade forums (shut up, I know) used to be a really hostile place. The admin instituted a rule saying no insults other than "silly goose". That's the only name you're allowed to call someone. It was an attempt to bring down the hostility level a few notches It worked! People simmered down a lot because they couldn't just go full throttle rear end in a top hat anymore And then people figured out how to get around it and it became arguably worse than before because some people will just play I'm not touching you until you hit them and then you get punished It sucks and is dumb and anyone who thinks it's fine or good should be punched
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Oct 26, 2017 08:44
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i agree with benghazi 2 and that's probably the most 2017 thing i've said so far
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Oct 26, 2017 11:01
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Yeah Benghazi 2 is spot-on. I moderate for another dead-gay forum and the ban on "flaming other users" doesn't suppress the behavior.
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Oct 26, 2017 11:03
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Dave Brookshaw posted:This dumb! Another of the aforementioned dummies. Yeah. I had a really tiny section. During the development, a lot of the less experienced people were talking and talking, and it got overwhelming. So, after a little while, I just clammed up, then wrote what was handed to me on the outline and took the check. Although I can say I really loved developing the Hunter supplement for Beast characters. That was kind of cathartic.
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Oct 26, 2017 11:30
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Capitalism truly makes Beasts of us all
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Oct 26, 2017 11:49
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MachineIV posted:Another of the aforementioned dummies. The Hunter supplement was barely better in that it sometimes managed to get away with saying "Beasts are terrible, awful, no-good, very bad things". But it also decided that the most Beast-hostile new compact should be a scattered group of disabled lab-experiment-escapee children, which.... wouldn't be bad as a hunter pitch (putting aside the mechanics of dream hunting being rigid and very dull when your niche role isn't in use), but I dread the idea of a Beast Storyteller deciding to use them as antagonists in a game. Nuns with Guns fucked around with this message at 12:40 on Oct 26, 2017 |
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Oct 26, 2017 12:34
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Nuns with Guns posted:The Hunter supplement was barely better in that it sometimes managed to get away with saying "Beasts are terrible, awful, no-good, very bad things". But it also decided that the most Beast-hostile new compact should be a scattered group of disabled lab-experiment-escapee children, which.... wouldn't be bad as a hunter pitch (putting aside the mechanics of dream hunting being rigid and very dull when your niche role isn't in use), but I dread the idea of a Beast Storyteller deciding to use them as antagonists in a game. Isn't that one based on Nightmare on Elm Street 3: The Dream Warriors?
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Oct 26, 2017 12:43
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MonsieurChoc posted:Isn't that one based on Nightmare on Elm Street 3: The Dream Warriors? whoa, somebody made an rpg about the best nightmare on elm street movie?
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Oct 26, 2017 12:45
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Serf posted:whoa, somebody made an rpg about the best nightmare on elm street movie? IIRC, one of the new Hunter groups introduced in Hunter: Tooth and Nail is a barely veiled version of the Dream Warriors. Also obligatory song link: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=noLPhZvcBpw
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Oct 26, 2017 12:49
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MonsieurChoc posted:Isn't that one based on Nightmare on Elm Street 3: The Dream Warriors? Well they call themselves "dream warriors" in their compact entry 
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Oct 26, 2017 12:51
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MonsieurChoc posted:Isn't that one based on Nightmare on Elm Street 3: The Dream Warriors? Yep.
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Oct 26, 2017 12:56
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I just don't like giving Beasts an in-game reason to be lovely to physically-disabled children. And yes I've thought this since before the new information about Matthew McFarland came out.
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Oct 26, 2017 13:01
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Nuns with Guns posted:I just don't like giving Beasts an in-game reason to be lovely to physically-disabled children. And yes I've thought this since before the new information about Matthew McFarland came out. It's a Hunter supplement, right? So the intended use is for players to be the physically-disabled children. And yes, a storyteller could include them in their Beast campaign, but that's a choice they've made on top of the existing awful choice to run Beast, so I don't think the hunter supplement is to blame.
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Oct 26, 2017 15:58
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There were still some real stinkers in there, like the Hunter group that shielded and protected Beasts so they could hunt Heroes and usher in the end of the world.
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Oct 26, 2017 16:03
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Flavivirus posted:It's a Hunter supplement, right? So the intended use is for players to be the physically-disabled children. And yes, a storyteller could include them in their Beast campaign, but that's a choice they've made on top of the existing awful choice to run Beast, so I don't think the hunter supplement is to blame. It's a hunter supplement that was funded thanks to the Beast kickstarter and iirc went out as a reward to Beast backers which kind of implies it's meant to be a resource for spats.
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Oct 26, 2017 16:27
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THIS IS NOT LEGAL ADVICE and I have no relations/connections to either party - but if anyone is in contact with the accuser you should probably recommend that they hire a lawyer (if they haven't already). This is likely just the start of the rollercoaster for everyone involved.
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Oct 26, 2017 17:30
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I sincerely doubt the law is getting involved - these cases are hard enough to prosecute when they're not nearly two decades old.
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Oct 26, 2017 17:47
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Levi Kornelsen posted:Eminently true.
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Oct 26, 2017 17:51
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Xarbala posted:I always wondered why rpg.net came off like a bunch of passive-aggressive vipers wearing stepford smiles. The fact that this was all in service of protecting the feelings of people in the industry just makes it all the more tragicomic. you know what other forum was big on getting industry people to post and protecting their feelings?  really makes u think
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Oct 26, 2017 19:11
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FordCQC posted:you know what other forum was big on getting industry people to post and protecting their feelings? CliffyB and other devs cheered when the place went tits up
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Oct 26, 2017 19:34
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That Old Tree posted:On the other hand, now, I don't feel all that guilty about it anymore, because John made something of a habit of sexual harassment. So hey about those permabans RPG.net are handing out to industry professionals who can't behave...
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Oct 26, 2017 20:57
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This is turning into attacking rpg.net mods for not acting quite as quick as people want(as in 48 hours rather than 24 or 12 or 0). Let's ignore frog God's bullshit and paizo trying to hide problems and all the other lovely companies because perfect is the enemy of good etc. The last couple of pages just read like a flashback to rpgsite and pundit et al circle jerking on how the rpg.net mods are all evil and need destroying. PST fucked around with this message at 23:44 on Oct 26, 2017 |
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Oct 26, 2017 23:41
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PST posted:This is turning into attacking rpg.net mods for not acting quite as quick as people want(as in 48 hours rather than 24 or 12 or 0). Let's ignore frog God's bullshit and paizo trying to hide problems and all the other lovely companies because perfect is the enemy of good etc. They handled it pretty quickly in comparison to a lot of other places, at least. I mean, look how long it took to get rid of Shmorky even though people knew he was a diaperfur for... I want to say at least since the mid 2000's?
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Oct 26, 2017 23:58
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Yeah but current RPG.net mods have actually personally inconvenienced some of the people in this thread so of course they’re the real monsters.
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Oct 26, 2017 23:58
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PST posted:This is turning into attacking rpg.net mods for not acting quite as quick as people want(as in 48 hours rather than 24 or 12 or 0). Let's ignore frog God's bullshit and paizo trying to hide problems and all the other lovely companies because perfect is the enemy of good etc. Believe it or not there's a big wide space of water between the criticism you've had here and the roasting and hooting you'd get in Pundit's horrible Gamergate echo chamber.
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Oct 27, 2017 00:00
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Bedlamdan posted:They handled it pretty quickly in comparison to a lot of other places, at least. I mean, look how long it took to get rid of Shmorky even though people knew he was a diaperfur for... I want to say at least since the mid 2000's? Yeah it's not like their initial response was to not ban him or anything and issue a statement to th effect oh wait Also shmorky got banned when it came out that he was also massively abusive and a pedophile, him being a furry who also poo poo in diapers didn't move the needle because this is the internet
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Oct 27, 2017 00:43
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Griping about RPGnet moderation would've died out in like a page if a half dozen current or former mods and admins didn't crawl into this thread to justify themselves in between whatever backroom dithering they were having on whether or not their child-rapist friend should be banned.
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Oct 27, 2017 01:13
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I don't think RPG.net were particularly tardy with their decision and I don't think that a delay of a day is too important an issue here, but I do think that RPG.net's size and online presence means that it can be viewed and criticized as an important component of the industry as a whole - and in that regard the occasional criticism of its practices shouldn't be out of place. But, so, hey, there's tons of abusers in this hobby. That's terrible. (gently caress you John Mørke.)
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Oct 27, 2017 01:35
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Nuns with Guns posted:Griping about RPGnet moderation would've died out in like a page if a half dozen current or former mods and admins didn't crawl into this thread to justify themselves in between whatever backroom dithering they were having on whether or not their child-rapist friend should be banned. I liked the guy who was like actually their idiot rule against personal attacks is good
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Oct 27, 2017 03:30
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BENGHAZI 2 posted:Yeah it's not like their initial response was to not ban him or anything and issue a statement to th effect oh wait Naw dude, I'm pretty sure or at least suspected those tendencies in Shmorky for a while. Not to mention that people have gotten banned for way less than being a goddamned diaperfur over here. Even if I did accept that only his most recent actions were a factor in his banning, it's not like Shmorky is the only example here. It took forever to get rid of Loosechanj even though Loosechanj.jpg was known and shared for years, not to mention guys like the Ducktales fanficcer mod who admitted to sniffing women's hair in the subway, and had to step down voluntarily. That's not even going into the fuckups of completely different websites, like the current trainwreck that is NeoGAF. I'm not going to say rpg.net is perfect but I can at least accept that their behavior was passable, at least when compared to people's seemingly boundless capacity to gently caress up.
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Oct 27, 2017 03:37
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