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Ange and Rosa's are pretty great too. Ange throws herself off a building and falls on the opponent. Rosa calls in Maria to throw her a second gun and unloads both of them on the opponent.
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Oct 29, 2017 03:18
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I kinda hope Natsuhi is playable, and her only move is pushing her opponent off a cliff.
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Oct 29, 2017 03:23
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There's a parry/counterparry system which is red and blue arguing.
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Oct 29, 2017 03:47
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Holy crap, when I checked this thread out at the start of this month (possibly even on the fourth of october  ) I did not expect to be in for this ride. Sadly I only managed to catch up this late but I still wanna use this chance to say thank you to ProfessorProf for showing off this series, and to everyone in the thread as I have to admit, reading everyone's theories and thoughts really added something more to this tale than if I had just read it on my own, even if I felt a bit bad reading the more personal things people shared as someone who had up until now been an outsider to all this in a sense.I've gotta say though, at this point I am trying to figure out how to get some of my friends into this series, after all I'd love to see their reactions. Also it is probably gonna be fun being on the witch's side. I do remember the first game having a more horror-y (for lack of a better term) feel so with halloween and all I can try getting them hooked through that.
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Oct 30, 2017 04:34
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Greader posted:I've gotta say though, at this point I am trying to figure out how to get some of my friends into this series, after all I'd love to see their reactions. Also it is probably gonna be fun being on the witch's side. I do remember the first game having a more horror-y (for lack of a better term) feel so with halloween and all I can try getting them hooked through that. Just make them get to the first twilight of episode 2 in time for Halloween.
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Oct 30, 2017 05:35
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 BGM: The Executioner It was clear that this person had enough of a reputation to make them tremble. Erika lifted me up, flew into the air, and landed on top of the arbor. Then, she let go of me and, still wielding her scythe, made an elegant curtsy to the crowd of goats surrounding us.   "...Let's have the blockheads who can only think of the Rudolf's family culprit theory step down! If anyone thinks they can counter my argument, please feel free! Of course, I won't be holding back either!!"The goats all howled at once. It seemed to be a cry of shock, of fear, or possibly of wonder. The goats surrounded the arbor... chattering, but not moving any closer. None of them had the courage to stand against this detective, this Witch of Truth called Furudo Erika...  "...Good grief. All those thousands, and this is the best you can do? None of you has the courage to fight Furudo Erika in a battle of words? Too bad. Let's put an end to this. Then again, I, Furudo Erika, don't have enough spare time to counter all you blockheads one by one. I'll let her clean up the rest. You're up!!"When Erika cried out, red cracks opened in the dark night's sky. It looked like the spiderweb-shaped fissures that appear when a glass window has been struck hard. No, it actually was a spiderweb, colored blood-red.  BGM: Resurrected Replayer A laugh rang out through the spiderweb-covered world. A witch's laugh. It sounded somehow familiar to Ange... And there, standing on the spiderweb and gazing down on the goats who must have looked like bugs caught in, was the witch.  It was the witch who had hidden inside of Eva. The witch of the future, who would one day call herself the Endless Witch after the cat box closed over this world.  "Who forgets EVA Beatrice and calls themselves the murderer of Rokkenjima?! How impertinent! On this island, who lives and who dies is totally up to me!! All the wealth and gold is mine!! Everything about October 4th and 5th in 1986 is mine to do with as I please! It all belongs to me, EVA Beatrice!!"EVA swung her One-winged staff at the crowd of foolish goats beneath her, proclaiming their deaths. The spiderwebs which formed a ceiling that covered the heavens plummeted... and more spiderwebs seeped out of the ground at the goats' feet. Then, the webs from above and below met, and thousands upon thousands of goats were caught in their grasp. Then, as EVA swung her staff, it swirled. Around and around, like egg yolk being mixed in a bowl. Eventually, it was all packed to a massive, blood-red goo. The moans of goats drifted out from inside. That entire crowd had been compressed into a meatball a few meters across.  "So, you morons doubt that I'm the culprit?!!" "Reaching the Eva culprit theory and giving up there is good enough for the likes of you." "Why don't you just get crushed and disappeeeeeear?!?!" BGM: None No other word could do that sound justice. After sucking in all of those goats, the spider web ball vanished into thin air with a squelch. After that, there wasn't even a trace left. The dark rose garden lay there without any sound but that of the falling rain... EVA drifted down from the sky.  BGM: About Face  "A, Aunt Eva..."I knew I should be grateful. And yet, it really wasn't easy for me to believe that Aunt Eva was my ally. EVA realized that too.  "Don't worry. I'm not doing this because I want to be thanked. But I'll always be on your side. See you later."She giggled, spun around, and vanished... Now that she had already left, I started to regret not saying even a thank you... So, I figured I should at least thank the other person who had saved me.  "...Thanks... for saving me... Who... are you...?"I already knew her name. What I was really asking... was why she had saved me. "I'm Furudo Erika, the detective. And I'm also a witch." "...A witch...?" "The Witch of Truth. The one who searches for the Single Truth. And... you're the same, aren't you?" "..." I've been so desperate to know what happened... that I took a step off the roof of that skyscraper, drifted through several witch games and Fragment worlds, and abandoned myself to this long journey with no rewards. All I want... is to know what happened that day. All I want... is the Single Truth of that day. "Looking for something like that is what makes someone a Witch of Truth. So, you're just the same as me. That's why I came to save you." "...I... want to know. Just what happened on that day? No one will tell me! No one knows...! But I know something happened that day! I'd give up anything to learn what that was...! That's the one thing I need to know no matter what, even if it kills me...! So tell me! You know, don't you?! You know what happened on this island, right?!" "...Does a Witch of Truth, expect to be given the truth? If I told you that so-and-so was the truth, would you really just accept whatever I said...?" "No, I wouldn't..." "What did Battler-san show you today?" It may have been heart-warming and a lot of fun, but... It definitely... wasn't the truth.  "Didn't Battler-san show you that and say it was the truth?" "No way. That couldn't... be the truth!" "Sometimes, other people will try to mislead us by claiming they know the truth. But a real Witch of Truth must continue to pursue the Single Truth without being led astray. That's why you can't accept the fake truth that Battler-san's trying to force on you. You care about finding the one real truth more than anything." "...Yeah..."Onii-chan... is trying to confuse me. I've felt that this whole time. Even though he knows everything about what happened that day, he won't tell me anything at all. How is he any different from Aunt Eva, who mocked me and refused to tell me anything, even until the very moment of her death? Why won't Onii-chan tell me? "...Why...?" "..." "Why... won't he tell me?!"The dam inside my heart burst.  I cried out at the rainy night sky. Hot tears poured from my eyes, but they were covered by the cold rain that beat against me, so no one other than me would know that they were tears. No one would know my pain and sadness. I'm... always the only one alone... all alone... "Someone, tell me!!! Tell me what happened that day!!!" "...No one can tell you. After all, you can only find the truth if you do it yourself." "Where is the truth?! How can I find it?! Everyone's hiding it! They won't tell me! I'll find it myself...! So please, just tell me where the truth is hidden...!" BGM: L&D Circulation As that voice rang out, the world bent and swirled. After blinking several times, I realized that the world had become a sea of stars. No, that's not quite right. There are stars up there in the sky, but those lights below me aren't stars. They're lights from building windows, street lights, car lights. I was floating in the dark sky... over a city lined with skyscrapers.   "You..."Various bad memories are jumping out at me from the back of my mind. That's right. I was chained in place in that strange theater thing... and forced to watch a repulsive Fragment where Mom and Dad committed murder...  "...I never said that what you saw was the truth." "B, but you used the red to..."  "...Just how far are you willing to go to mock me...?" "...I apologize. But I did want to test you." "Test me how?" "I wanted to see if you were ready to accept the truth, no matter what it may be." "..." "...The truth can betray you sometimes. In fact, there are times when it shows itself as the thing you desire least. That Fragment I showed you was probably the worst one you could possibly imagine. However, if you lack the strength and the courage to withstand even something like that, then you aren't fit to reach the truth." "..."I have no comeback. Finding the truth is my goal. I just want to know what happened on that island on that day. I don't think of myself as wanting to hear only the facts that are pleasing to me. Have I really been prepared to face the bloody, unbearable truth that's probably waiting there for me...? ...If I find the truth, it'll mean having to look straight at my family's tragic final moments and accepting them as they are. And if I do accept that, it means abandoning my faint hope for that convenient miracle... the idea that one of them might have survived somehow... and might return even though 12 years have passed. Even though I know a miracle like that would be completely ridiculous, if I'm honest with myself, I have to admit that the faint hope it brought me has given me comfort these past 12 years.  Those two wishes contradict each other. By learning the truth, I'll be forced to accept that no one's coming home... "...The truth is always cruel. At times, it can even cut down your hopes. Most of the time, humans don't realize the costs of learning the truth. I simply wanted to see if you had the necessary resolve."I must choose between my two contradicting wishes. Will I find the truth... and abandon my optimistic hopes for my family's return? Or will I give up on the truth... and keep waiting for the family that will never really return for all eternity? Will I freeze up and let myself be fooled by the childish illusion my brother made for me? "...Tell me, Ange. Are you truly determined to learn the truth...?" "...I am." "And your resolve will not falter?" "It won't."After hearing my immediate reply, Bernkastel stared at me. Are those expressionless eyes of hers... measuring my resolve? Now that my brother is covering up the truth even after becoming Game Master... The only thing I can rely on in my search for the truth is the path that Bernkastel can show me...  "...Deep in your eyes... I see the glint of one who seeks the truth." "Will you tell me?! Will you show me the way that leads to the truth...?!" "Yes. I'll guide you. Did you forget, Ange? I am your guardian, am I not...?"How long has it been since I last heard Bernkastel use that word? Yes. Not since that time at the very beginning, when I met her in this future world and became a witch, with her as my guardian. That's when I become the Beatrice of 1998, the one who could defeat the Beatrice of 1986...   "...A Witch of Truth." "That's right. You're like Erika. A Witch of Truth, who will seek the Single Truth, undeceived by any illusions." "The Witch of Truth, ANGE Beatrice... has the power to reach the Single Truth, right...?" "Yes. However, up until now, you have been unable to use this power. Do you know why?" "...I do now. Even though I searched for the truth, I unconsciously resisted learning the truth." "Exactly. Finding the truth was your goal, but at the same time, you were unconsciously afraid that learning the truth would mean losing that miracle of your family coming back. So, you didn't have what it took to stretch your hand out to the Single Truth." "...You're completely right... I have to admit... that I was naive..."I must admit it. My entire family is dead. Now that I've acknowledged it, I must expose why they died, and who was behind it. "...Thanks. The Fragment you showed me in that dark theater... was there to open my eyes." "Many, many games have gone by, waiting for you to become a true Witch of Truth. But I think there was a purpose for all of it. After all, now, in this final game, you have become a Witch of Truth." "...Tell me. What happened on that island that day? I won't ask you to tell me directly. So guide me. What can I do to reach the truth...?!" "It's a bit too chilly here. Let's move." "To where?" "To a place better for drinking tea." BGM: In the Sun It was an applause in honor of a good fight. An applause in honor of Bernkastel.  "Yes, Lady Bernkastel's game was another splendid one!" "We're going to reveal her game board to all of you, so have a go at it. It's pretty awesome!" "...But you solved it in the end all the same." "A game that no one can solve isn't a game. The main point is whether it was fun or not." "It was fun! I guarantee it." "Same here. At first, I thought there was no way anyone could solve it, but the way you can use one confirmed purple statement after another to narrow down the suspects made for a nice puzzle." "Come, everyone! Gather, gather!" "Just what sort of game is Lady Bernkastel's mystery?!" ""That's for you to find out for yourselves!!"" Crowds gathered around each, looking down with interest.  "Hohoh, it's like a logic puzzle." "Quite an orthodox one, don't you think?" "So this is what a witch's game is like." "Hmm. Looking at it like this, it's just a game. But for the pieces, it's a massive series of crimes." "Pu ku ku. Indeed it is." "It would not do to waste such a rare gift from Lady BERNKASTEL. Let us take this opportunity to enjoy OURSELVES." "Still, this is a tough one... It almost makes you wonder if it was even made to be solvable, doesn't it...?" "You can't get anywhere unless you start by believing it was made to be solvable. A battle of wits doesn't begin until you trust the questioner and believe that it can be solved." "And we'll guarantee that it is. Come on, have a go at it...!"With Battler's encouragement, discussions over Bernkastel's mystery game began at each table. The mix of humans and fantasy creatures in heated discussion was truly a sight to behold. Beato and Bernkastel sat in a chair far off from the discussions.  "Any kind of calming black tea for me. With milk, if you don't mind." "As you wish. Is there anything you need, Lady Bernkastel?" "...Please add some dried plums to some black tea. That's the trick to making terrible tea drinkable." "*cackle*! Come now, don't sulk. We're honestly complimenting your game for being such a fun one."Since she had emerged victorious in the game Bernkastel had put all her heart into, the look on Beato's face made her last line almost sound like an apology. "...I'm not sulking. My face just looks this way." "When I managed to spot Bern's own kind of warmth in that expression, I felt like I'd climbed to the pitch-black top of a snowy mountain to find a beautiful star." "...Well, sorry for having an eternally frosty face." "How difficult it is to compliment Lady Bernkastel. No matter what you say, she always takes it in a bad way." "That's okay. She's the kind who'll think about it for hours later on." "Hohoh, the type who lies in bed thinking about it and hugging her pillow." "Yep, that's Bern for you."Beato and Lambdadelta giggled together. Bernkastel shrugged and looked away...  "You think so? Thank you." "Even though you could've made it unsolvable, you really did make it to be solved. That's not something you can do unless you plan on enjoying a fair game." "...I like games where I win no matter what. Games that I might lose are just a pain." "Later, I'd like to switch sides and try another one. I'll make a puzzle, and we'll see if you can solve it. A game for you to win against me." "..." "Of course, I'll use all the know-how I've picked up in my fights with Beato to make it super-hard. I'm not giving up my winning streak that easily...!" "...Both you and Beato. You have such an interesting way of thinking." "How's that?" "...A game is just a means to decide who wins and who loses, right? When you create one, your own victory should be your highest priority. So, why would you go to all the trouble of making a game you might lose...?" "What fun is there in a game that you always win? That's not even a game." "..." "Victory and defeat. It's fun because you're taking part in a fair competition, balanced between those two outcomes. A game isn't a fight. It's communication. It's the means you have to enjoy. And if you manage to win, well, that's just an added bonus." "...Finally. Finally, I clearly understand the difference between how all of you think and how I think." "What difference?"  "The world you live in must be pretty savage." "...And what about you? Wasn't it the same for you, until you understood Beato's game? An eternal game is eternal torture. Have you already completely forgotten about that pain you suffered...?" "...There were days I did think that. But now, it's all been resolved. I won't complain about stuff that's in the past. I'm impartial, you might say." "That... is the critical difference between you and me, I think. Your eternal torture was something you could laugh off and forget. Mine wasn't nearly so trivial. That's all there is to it." "...I don't know your history. It sounds like you had it rough." "Hmph. To think I'm getting sympathy from a mere former piece. I must be losing my touch."Bernkastel, sipping the black tea that Genji had brought her, gazed up at the ceiling with a faraway look. Battler may not have known her history, but even he was able to understand a bit of how she felt.  "...Are you being tortured, by someone right now?" "Are you kidding? I'm as free as can be. I'm not bound by anyone's shackles." "Then that's a good thing, isn't it? At least things are better for you now." "...True. It's much better now than it once was. Though I am on this long, endless journey to escape from boredom." "Then, at the very least, meeting up here should have been a good thing for you." "Indeed. Even the taste of defeat has driven boredom away from me for a time."No, no. Battler was shaking his head and laughing.  "So...?" "If your days are filled with nothing except running away from boredom, feel free to drop by our place every now and then. We'd love to welcome a friend. And we'll be able to set up everything needed to help a friend escape from boredom." "You think you can prepare a welcome interesting enough to help me, the great Bernkastel, escape boredom for even a night...?" "I do. That's what it means to be a friend." "..." "We won tonight's game. So, the next time you come, we'll switch sides. This time, we'll entertain you with one of our games. Of course, we don't intend to let you win easily. We'll challenge you to a devilishly twisted logic game! It won't be something you can solve in a night. It'll be good enough to make you stay for months, wracking your brains over it." "...You would entertain me, the great Bernkastel, as a friend...?" "Yeah, we would." "...Hmph... After talking with you, even this dried plum tea is starting to taste sickly sweet. What a pain." "I heard from Beato. Sounds like this dried plum tea stuff is one of your favorites. Next time, we'll toss some high-class dried plums covered in gold leaf into your tea, so make sure you come again." "...If you really plan to do that, try finding some better tea to start with. I'll never feel like coming again if you keep serving tea like this." "Ah, come on. Guess you drink high-grade black tea all the time. In fact, next time, why don't you invite us to somewhere we can drink some of this high-quality tea?" "...Me... invite you? *giggle*...ahahahahaha." "It's only fair, right? We've treated you. Now it's your turn." "Yes, it would be only fair." "So, let's have the game be fair too. Let's switch sides and start a new game. I'm looking forward to it. We won this time, but who knows about the next...?!" "...That's some confidence you have there. And yet, I'm afraid you're mistaken on one point." "What's that?" "My game isn't over yet. I wonder who will win in the end."After taking one more sip of her black tea, Bernkastel set her cup on the table, wearing a thin smile. "...The tea here's far too sweet. It was a mistake to have any. Thank you, Genji. Take this away, please." "As you wish..."Bernkastel asked for her tea to be taken away after taking only two sips. Battler smiled, realizing that this was just Bern's way of being shy.  If you really think this final game will be nothing but a happy epilogue... Then I'll have to invite you all to a proper game for bringing this tale to a close. Battler. You forget things too easily. Don't you remember in whose hands lie the key to this final game...?
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Oct 30, 2017 13:31
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ProfessorProf posted:
Yeah....considering what bern had gone through as a human im not surprised shes not like "bygones are bygones". Does that excuse whats shes about to do? No, not even close. Now they are entering stage 2 of berns game. This time battler will have ange to contend with since the entire point of bernkastals game was to cause ange to unlock the final "truth" that battler didn't want her to do. He gave her the key and hoped to let her live in her fantasy (like he did i guess) and live on by showing her how much fun they are all having within the cat box. Now she will unlock the cat box and see her 'truth' and cause the party inside to vanish. Now battler will have to fight against bernkastal to try and convince ange to not open the cat box.
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Oct 30, 2017 13:59
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lookw posted:Now they are entering stage 2 of berns game. This time battler will have ange to contend with since the entire point of bernkastals game was to cause ange to unlock the final "truth" that battler didn't want her to do. He gave her the key and hoped to let her live in her fantasy (like he did i guess) and live on by showing her how much fun they are all having within the cat box. Now she will unlock the cat box and see her 'truth' and cause the party inside to vanish. Now battler will have to fight against bernkastal to try and convince ange to not open the cat box. Of course, this is all predicated that the book left in the chapel is in fact the hidden "truth," and not Ange's worst fears about the same. Because that is a possibility, especially if this story is an allegory of Ange's belief and search for truth- literally anything could be in that book, but it wouldn't make it the truth, because it's all lost- the scene of the crime is so completely destroyed that no reconstruction will help, and the last witness- or perpetrator- died keeping that catbox closed, so there is no way for Ange to KNOW the truth anymore and I think she knows that... it's why she was driven to suicide, after all, and why she clutches so needily at the scraps of knowledge dropped by a known abuser who tells her to reject happiness in favor of knowledge and possible vindication. And here, alas, is where we get into another knotty moral judgement... because if that's what Ange believes will give her closure and strength to go on living, who is anyone to stop her? What right do we, as complete strangers, have to tell her that she cannot seek to fill the holes in her mind with the truth? We may disagree that that will bring her closure- which I absolutely do, seeking the truth is all well and good, but it should be done with as much physical evidence and lack of emotional hangups as possible in order to obtain the closest thing to the truth, and in this instance there is literally none of the former and all too loving much of the latter- but we can't stop her. And our Berne has put her in the perfect headspace to do that, firmly rejecting Battler's party as misleading and inept (which to be fair it is)... but possibly rejecting any chance of happiness or peace. In the past, this might have been my chance to rail on about what an awful monster I think Berne is, but after reading this update, another possibility reveals itself: that Berne, for all her standoffish bluster, might actually think that she's helping Ange by doing this. And I do not know which possibility is more terrible and sad. 
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Oct 30, 2017 17:21
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It's probably come up before, but isn't a Witch of Truth Bernkastel's fundamental enemy? Bern's power rests in things that can happen in other Fragments, the Witch of Truth limits the things that must remain consistent across all fragments. Why expect beneficence?
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Oct 30, 2017 17:38
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Remember, Bernkastel searched over 2 million fragments to find Lion... and then took pleasure in destroying the miracle she found.
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Oct 30, 2017 17:47
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Kytrarewn posted:It's probably come up before, but isn't a Witch of Truth Bernkastel's fundamental enemy? Bern's fundamental enemies are endless witches is like Beato. Truth doesn't fit into the Endless/Miracles/Certainty RPS triangle.
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Oct 30, 2017 18:03
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resurgam40 posted:Of course, this is all predicated that the book left in the chapel is in fact the hidden "truth," and not Ange's worst fears about the same. Because that is a possibility, especially if this story is an allegory of Ange's belief and search for truth- literally anything could be in that book, but it wouldn't make it the truth, because it's all lost- the scene of the crime is so completely destroyed that no reconstruction will help, and the last witness- or perpetrator- died keeping that catbox closed, so there is no way for Ange to KNOW the truth anymore and I think she knows that... it's why she was driven to suicide, after all, and why she clutches so needily at the scraps of knowledge dropped by a known abuser who tells her to reject happiness in favor of knowledge and possible vindication. And here, alas, is where we get into another knotty moral judgement... because if that's what Ange believes will give her closure and strength to go on living, who is anyone to stop her? What right do we, as complete strangers, have to tell her that she cannot seek to fill the holes in her mind with the truth? We may disagree that that will bring her closure- which I absolutely do, seeking the truth is all well and good, but it should be done with as much physical evidence and lack of emotional hangups as possible in order to obtain the closest thing to the truth, and in this instance there is literally none of the former and all too loving much of the latter- but we can't stop her. Are we so sure that Bern is wrong here? Endlessly hanging on to the vain hope that Battler might return sure didn't work out for Yasu.
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Oct 30, 2017 19:19
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ZiegeDame posted:Are we so sure that Bern is wrong here? Endlessly hanging on to the vain hope that Battler might return sure didn't work out for Yasu. Bern's throwing the baby out with the bathwater though. "False hope is bad, therefore any hope at all is bad" is poor logic, especially for a so-called Witch of Miracles.
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Oct 30, 2017 23:32
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resurgam40 posted:
This from what I seen her act and her piece and her history could never been seen in red if "Help Ange to be Happy or Satisfied." Berne is not one to forgive ever.
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Oct 30, 2017 23:34
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dotchan posted:Bern's throwing the baby out with the bathwater though. "False hope is bad, therefore any hope at all is bad" is poor logic, especially for a so-called Witch of Miracles. This is probably a good point to remind people that Bern has constantly referred to herself as "the Witch of Miracles that knows miracles don't exist". This is entirely in-character for her.
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Oct 30, 2017 23:40
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ZiegeDame posted:Are we so sure that Bern is wrong here? Endlessly hanging on to the vain hope that Battler might return sure didn't work out for Yasu. ... And that would be the other controversial bit about Berne's strategy: the entire point of Yasu's story is that their fantasies and dreams could not save them, merely filled their head with dreams that wouldn't come true, and stretched Yasu-all parts of them- so thin between duty and desire that they collapsed under the weight. So the idea of divesting Ange of at least not focusing on an impossible dream ans her raison d'etre is a good one. It's just that the one effort employed to this end was well-intentioned but insufficient as an argument, and the one about to be employed...I don't have a good feeling about. In order for Ange to get a good counsel, she needs guidance from somebody who shares a similar pain. And Battler has felt too little pain in his life (until very recently) and Bernekastel has felt so much pain that it has destroyed her completely. Ange's ideal guide isn't either of these. It would have to be someone familiar with pain and loneliness, but on a human level, someone dealt an unfair hand that they never quite leaned to process... someone who's had an equivalent amount of suffering to Ange, perhaps a decade or so... someone who can share the feeling of being so fearfully, utterly trapped.... but who could that be, I wonder? Hmmm... Hmmmmmm... *snaps fingers* Gohda. Obviously.
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Oct 31, 2017 00:09
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resurgam40 posted:It would have to be someone familiar with pain and loneliness, but on a human level, someone dealt an unfair hand that they never quite leaned to process... someone who's had an equivalent amount of suffering to Ange, perhaps a decade or so... someone who can share the feeling of being so fearfully, utterly trapped.... but who could that be, I wonder? Hmmm... Hmmmmmm... Kinzo circa 1940
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Oct 31, 2017 01:46
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dotchan posted:Bern's throwing the baby No, that was Natsuhi
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Oct 31, 2017 03:09
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Bern brings to mind "freedom's just another word for nothing left to lose."
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Oct 31, 2017 03:33
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I don't have much to say other than Ange is just going to get led on to a terrible fate on a string by Bern, and it hurts to see it happen in slow-motion.
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Oct 31, 2017 04:31
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It might be worth it if she gets a kicking outfit
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Oct 31, 2017 08:06
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I'm still not convinced that "actually being able to mourn her loss" is such a terrible fate for Ange. It's OK to put false hope to rest. Even if by some miracle there was another survivor(there probably isn't(, Ange isn't going to find them if she doesn't look. And if she never lets go of the hope that can't come true, she's bound to miss out on plenty of good things that are actually real. Bern comes across so sinister here because yeah, the truth is probably going to make Ange very, very sad. But it's OK to be sad sometimes, it's part of being human. And if you end the story right there as Bern will probably try to do, she'll look evil and the ending will look grim and miserable. But eventually, once Ange has cried herself out, she can take her giant mountain of cash and move somewhere where nobody has ever heard of Rokkenjima or Ushiromiya. She can even hire Amakusa as a real bodyguard/closet thing she has to a friend. And then she can start over, and hope for things that actually have a chance of happening.
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Oct 31, 2017 19:08
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 I've never regained consciousness to a smell before. Slowly, I opened my eyes. Wait, when did I lose consciousness in the first place? I don't remember going to sleep or falling unconscious. That's right. Bernkastel invited me to come to a place better for drinking tea... That's when my memory gets hazy. And, since the smell of black tea is what woke me up...  "Auaurora's study. I hate to admit it, but her taste in tea really is excellent."I was sitting on what appeared to be a sofa in a dimly lit study. Bernkastel sat across from me. And, right before my eyes, was a beautiful cup filled with hot, steaming tea. "...Isn't... this place..."I remembered. I've been here before. Wasn't it...  "How pleasant it is to see you again, child of man."...Yes, that voice. Just hearing it brings back memories. "Long time no see, my master." BGM: A Single Moment "...It won't be continuing much longer. This is the end, the true final game."This was the study of Featherine Augustus Aurora. The majestic Witch of Theatergoing, Drama, and Spectating. Once in the past, I was summoned by her and ordered to be her Reader, or miko.  "Don't tell me you want me to Read again..." "I wasn't the one who called you here. My miko brought the two of us together." "For what reason...?" "Isn't it obvious? To show you the path that leads to the truth." "You'll show me the way, Featherine?" "...I am the Witch of Theatergoing. Though I dislike interfering with the actors on the stage." "So, between Battler's boring play and my exciting one that manipulates the branches of fate, which would you rather watch? I know you can't stand even a minute of boredom." "Pft, heheheheheheheh."As Featherine rocked her rocking chair, she looked up at the ceiling and chuckled. She clearly holds some key to the truth I seek.  I don't remember saying anything out loud, but Featherine answered my question as though I had. Come to think of it, that's right. Featherine can read the thoughts of a mere child of man like me as easily as she can hear me speak. Well, I guess that'll help us get to the point quicker... "Onii-chan gave me this key. Still, he just said something about how I'd know how to use it when the time was right. He didn't say a word about what it was used for. Do you two know? What is this key for? Onii-chan said it was something very precious." "Explain, my miko." "No way. You explain." "...You demand that your master explain?" "You've got to participate on the stage every now and then. Otherwise you'll just go senile all the faster." "My, my... And yet, the memory of my long-overdue appearance on the stage when Ange was Reader should have been enough to last me a few more centuries." "Tell me. What is this key?" "A physical manifestation of the decision you are to make. This tale, this game... will end by asking you to make a certain decision. What you hold there is the act of your decision embodied in the form of a key." "The physical manifestation... of my decision..." "Exactly. At the end, Battler was probably planning to put you in front of two doors, both of which can be opened by the key. Then, he would ask you to choose which door to open. He must have told you that much, right?" "...He didn't tell me anything at all. He just kept saying things like 'you'll know when the time comes'. No one will tell me anything. Not Onii-chan, not anyone..." "Battler probably wants to respect a decision that you make by your own free will." "But Ange. You should've at least started to figure it out by now, right?" "...Figure what out?" Those words... made my heart jump in my chest. It was what I had been thinking. Onii-chan is clearly trying to trick me with a vague tale, almost like a daydream, that'll take me even farther away from the truth. At the 1986 family conference... Everyone had a wonderful time as they faded away. Everyone is smiling down on you from heaven, so you don't need to feel alone, even in 1998. So give it your all and live on by yourself. I've clearly felt Onii-chan's intention to end it like that. And every time I asked him about it, he'd dodge the issue and say something about how the decision would be mine in the end. "That's right. It may appear that Battler is giving you a fair choice, but he's actually scheming to get you to choose one of the two answers. You've already seen the farce of a tale that he's using to do that, right?"...That bizarre Halloween party. Everyone so strange and friendly that it was almost sickening. I've already seen more than enough of that tale, so sickly sweet it makes me want to vomit, where Ushiromiya Kinzo showered me with affection, where his children swore to support each other, where everyone was filled with happiness and hope. "...He's trying to trick me with those chummy scenes... so he can keep me away from the truth. He's such a... coward..." "Certainly, he might be called a coward from your perspective. But remember. If you are a player in this game and Battler is the Game Master, what does that mean?" "In the past, Battler was a player and Beato was the Game Master. And they each fought for their own respective truths. So, what is it this time?" BGM: None Could it be... that I've misunderstood everything from the very beginning? Onii-chan said he'd tell me what happened that day, so I was under the impression that I'd learn everything if I followed him. How would that be any different than, say, Onii-chan accepting everything Beato said about the crimes being the work of a witch? What... a stupid mistake I've been making... "...This game... has always been a fight between me and Onii-chan...?" "I'm surprised you participated in the game without realizing that." "..." "Battler really is sly. He just started up the final game without letting you realize that simple fact. Well, it was the same back in Beato's games. Battler was drawn into her game before he knew what was happening. Before he even knew how to fight. That's why I taught him how." "And now, it's exactly the same. You were forced to start this game before you understood anything about it, and I've come to tell you the truth. To tell you who you're fighting against, and for what." "..." BGM: Ridicule And finally, I realized what I needed to accomplish in this game. I've always been passive. I was sure that Onii-chan would tell me everything, so I naively thought I just had to believe whatever he said... "No. That was wrong."This is a battle... between me, the one who wants to reach the truth, and Onii-chan, who wants to trick me and chase me out into a 1998 where I'm all alone... All this time, I've kept on saying that Onii-chan was foolish and naive, and now I see that I was more naive than anyone else... And yet, Bernkastel didn't sneer at me. On the contrary, she looked at me with that cold gaze, as if to say 'so you've finally taken the first step'. "...Now do you understand? Your own purpose... and the purpose of that key."I gripped the key that Onii-chan had hung around my neck... and for a while, I shook with an emotion that even I couldn't understand. Now that I know Onii-chan tricked me, it would be easy to hate him. But hating him would be missing the point. After all, this is a game between me and him. Onii-chan has done nothing but make the optimal moves to win against me. If games aren't just a playful way to communicate, if they're the process that decides who wins and who loses... Then there can be no fair games. The best strategy is always to trick your enemy into defeat without telling them the rules, before they even know what's going on... ...In that sense, Onii-chan hasn't done anything wrong. He's... using that sickly sweet illusion to trick me... and force me out into a lonely future... They'll be the only ones having a good time in the cat box, and I'll be the only one chased out.  "Please, don't hate Battler. After all, one-sidedly tricking the opponent is what Game Masters do." "...I know. Onii-chan took the best option from his position. That's all there is to it. So, I need to make the best possible moves from my position."My goal is now clear. October 4th and 5th, 1986. What happened on Rokkenjima that day. I need to tear off the veil covering the truth. Nothing more, nothing less. "...Onii-chan gave me this key... probably because he wants me to put it into the keyhole of his choosing. That's why he keeps showing me this sentimental illusion. But I won't be fooled anymore. I'll open the door I want to open." "Certainly, this is more my kind of tale than one with an Ange who does whatever Battler says." "So, this time I'll let you take over the rest. Tell Ange. Tell her where the keyhole that leads to the truth is." "Tell me. Where is the keyhole?!" "...Very well. First off, have a seat. I'll bring it over right now."When Featherine rose from her rocking chair, my vision seemed to twist and bend. What? Some kind of interference? Why now, when Featherine's about to show me something important... Why is my head getting... suddenly... I dug my fingernails into my knees, clenching my teeth to keep from losing consciousness. However, the world just kept twisting more and more... Except for the feel of the sofa beneath me, I couldn't sense anything at all...  BGM: Scar Sound "...Huh?" "It looks like she's here." What's going on? This isn't the world of witches... but the world of humans...? I was sitting on the sofa... and Amakusa was behind me. ...There's no need to feel confused. Featherine and Hachijo Toya are the same being. To her, the difference between the two worlds is a trivial thing. To put it in the words of that lover of theatergoing, it's like having a slightly different background behind the stage. So, there was no reason for me to feel hesitant. "...Should I call you Hachijo this time?" "How complicated names are. Even though both of us are still here, just like before, you have to wonder what to call me." "...True. Calling you Featherine would be a bit rude to you now. For an actor, the name of the role they act is only temporary." "Precisely, child of man." "Featherine??"Amakusa's eyes went wide as he wondered what I was suddenly talking about. I ignored him and continued. "...So, what are you going to show me?"As I spoke, my eyes were caught by that heavy-looking object she held under her arm. At a glance, it looked like an encyclopedia with a fancy binding...  BGM: Lie-alaiaa As Featherine spoke, she set the heavy object on the table. My first thought... was of a grimoire. The heavy book had a mysterious, mystical feel to it, like something Maria onee-chan might carry around. And the most remarkable feature of it... was the large, sturdy lock that held it shut. Why would someone go so far to keep people from reading a book...? "Why don't you take it and observe the back?" "...The back...?"I flipped the heavy book over on my lap. And, as soon as I saw it, I gave a small gasp.  Without a doubt, those words were written there with the letters of the alphabet. "What is this...? Aunt Eva's... diary...?" "Could this be... that rumored..." "Do you know something about this...?!" "Just a rumor. They say that President Eva had a secret diary, and that she always kept it locked up. They say she took it with her everywhere she went. At least, that's what I heard from some of the other bodyguards." "...A secret... diary... And why is that here...?" "It was in the hospital room where Ushiromiya Eva passed away." So, it remained in that room for some time after her death before it was found. Then, by coincidence, it was probably found by someone who worked for the hospital, or else a patient or their family. Of course, by that time, there was a huge movement dedicated to the Rokkenjima mystery. A locked diary found in the hospital room where Ushiromiya Eva spent her last moments... would be absolutely priceless. The discoverer probably handed it over in secret to one of the 'Witch Hunters', who would be able to accurately determine its worth. Luckily, the Witch Hunters who got their hands on this book were all noble and upright people. Not content to boorishly destroy the lock and reveal the truth, they simply satisfied themselves with the fact that the truth of that day slumbered just on the other side of this mysterious lock. Thanks to that, Eva's diary has remained undamaged to this very day... "It is already known that Natsuhi, wife of Krauss, the oldest son of Kinzo, sealed all of her complaints and repressed feelings by writing them down in a diary, which she treated like a sort of charm." "...So, Aunt Eva did the same thing?" "It's possible, at least. Unlocking the hinges of this diary would be a pain, even if you had a key. It's sealed up tight like a corset."Amakusa was right. This wasn't a diary made to be casually opened and reminisced over. It's probably safe to assume that this diary was used to forget things by writing them down and sealing them away, just like Ushiromiya Natsuhi's. And on top of that, Eva brought it with her into her hospital room, then hid it behind the bed without telling anyone about it...  "By reading its contents, you will probably learn everything. However, we don't know where the key that unlocks it is."I jumped. Then, I looked down at my chest. That's where my brother hung that key... "Huh? I, it's gone! Th, the key's gone...!" "...What's wrong, Lady? What key?" "It's been hanging from my neck the whole time, hasn't it?!" "...I never noticed it. You had a key hanging from your neck...?"I understood almost immediately. In the world of humans, I haven't found the key. The 'me' with the key... is on the game board in the world of witches. "Make me the 'me' with the key! I'm going to unlock this diary."Featherine lifted a finger, spun it around, and the world twisted again.  BGM: None But at the same time, the diary on my lap popped out of existence. "Where'd the diary go?!" "It should exist somewhere on the game board. Since it is one of the keyholes you are to be given, it must exist somewhere." "Did Onii-chan hide it somewhere...?" "...Since Battler is trying to make this a game between you and him, it probably isn't completely hidden." "What do you mean...?" "Even if Battler thinks of it as a king that mustn't be taken, there would be no game unless it existed somewhere on this board." "In other words, it's somewhere in the Ushiromiya mansion...?" "Or, you may already have been given an opportunity to witness it. Like how a swindler has already hidden a trap in microscopic letters on the first page of a contract you sign." "...If Battler follows the rules of mystery as the Game Master, 'clues must be shown', so the choice that leads to Battler's defeat must have been shown. Ange. Try and remember. You should have seen Eva's diary already in Battler's world."In that instant, from the back of my mind... drifted the very first scene of this final game.  BGM: End of the World A book lying on the altar, a book with a lock on it... As soon as I showed interest in that book, Battler suddenly got serious and told me not to touch it... "That... was Aunt Eva's diary..." "That's right. Ushiromiya Eva's diary. The Book of the Single Truth, with the truth of that day written inside it." "...The Book... of the Single Truth... And is the truth really written inside it? After all, there's a chance that it's just something Aunt Eva-" 
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Nov 1, 2017 13:30
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Present in the old PC version, but apparently missing in this version for some reason, is a screen at the end of this update saying "End of part 1". We now have one half of one episode to go! Incidentally, I promise I'll only shill this once, but I won't be getting a lot of work done on the LP this weekend on account of I'll be running a 26-hour gaming stream for Extra Life. Please consider making a donation, all proceeds going to a local children's hospital.
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Nov 1, 2017 13:47
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Man, considering how this episode had actual interactions I am getting the feeling we are gonna choose at the end what to do with the book, and to be honest I have no idea yet which is the "correct" answer if such a thing really exists. Though I am not buying that Battler was trying to trick Ange out of some malicious reason, or even really try to trick her. They use the example of Beatrice's game and we know well at this point that the intent there was not to decieve but rather to make Battler realise something. I guess in the end the big question is which option would be best for Ange herself, and hopefully before we have to decide we get a bit more information on which choice it might be.
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Nov 1, 2017 15:24
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Greader posted:Man, considering how this episode had actual interactions I am getting the feeling we are gonna choose at the end what to do with the book, and to be honest I have no idea yet which is the "correct" answer if such a thing really exists. Though I am not buying that Battler was trying to trick Ange out of some malicious reason, or even really try to trick her. They use the example of Beatrice's game and we know well at this point that the intent there was not to decieve but rather to make Battler realise something. Let's be honest, at least 40% of the point of Beato's games was flirting. It's safe to say Bern is wrong about Battler's intent, but incompetent is as incompetent does. There should be another lock somewhere that Battler wants Ange to open, and hopefully it's something more than juts sealing Eva's truth away forever. I mean come on, Battler, you've gotta have something better than "your whole family is having an awesome magical party forever, and you aren't invited."
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Nov 1, 2017 16:52
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This isn't Battler. It's ENDLESS SORCERER BATTLER, so he's clearly not incompetent anymore.
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Nov 1, 2017 16:54
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Tired Moritz posted:This isn't Battler. It's ENDLESS SORCERER BATTLER, so he's clearly not incompetent anymore. Episode 6 would suggest otherwise.
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Nov 1, 2017 17:02
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Huh, so the choice at the end is just going to be between Bern's view and Battler's. Bern's view would have Ange rip open the cat box to expose its guts, to find the Single Truth. Battler's view would then presumably be the opposite, that finding the Single Truth is unnecessary, and that all that is needed is to keep the good memories of those who have passed in your heart. Assuming we're picking for Ange, and not my own self-satisfaction, I'm not sure which one is the correct one. Depending on the truth hidden in the book, that could be worse than not knowing it, even if it gives Ange that closure that she so desperately needs. Closure is kind of important, though.
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Nov 1, 2017 17:07
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ZiegeDame posted:Episode 6 would suggest otherwise. You mean the episode where Battler got everything he wanted and completely owned Bern and Eirka? 
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Nov 1, 2017 21:42
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Dr Pepper posted:You mean the episode where Battler got everything he wanted and completely owned Bern and Eirka? All that proves is Yasu is better at this poo poo than Battler. Battler greatest strength is that he knows he's incompetent, and isn't afraid to ask others for help to cover for his shortcomings. This may make him the wisest man in all of
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Nov 1, 2017 21:58
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ZiegeDame posted:All that proves is Yasu is better at this poo poo than Battler. It's pretty easy to solve a riddle custom made for you alone to solve. Battler deliberately locked himself up, he set up the entire logic error as a crazy gamble to try and revive Beatrice's memories.
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Nov 2, 2017 04:02
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Cyouni posted:Huh, so the choice at the end is just going to be between Bern's view and Battler's. Maybe Ange will pick her own option, and choose both, or neither? I think that'd be a satisfying ending, deciding to hell with this, I have a life to go live.
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Nov 2, 2017 04:15
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RedMagus posted:Maybe Ange will pick her own option, and choose both, or neither? I think that'd be a satisfying ending, deciding to hell with this, I have a life to go live. Theoretically I think that'd fall under Battler's view that the truth isn't needed to move forward.
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Nov 2, 2017 04:25
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Is people seriously arguing that Battler's view isn't the right view
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Nov 2, 2017 04:50
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I'm not even sure what exactly Battler's view is yet. So far, learning the truth about what happened isn't incompatible with believing your family is happy and watching over you from  Like, no version of "they all dead" changes Ange's ability to use her resurrection magic (aka imagination) to have her family support her. It's like, say you have a crush on someone, and you're trying to decide if you should ask them out. Bern's position is you should ask them out even though there's a chance (possibly a good chance) that you'll be rejected. Battler's position seems to be that you never ask them out, so you can spend the rest of your life pretending that they would have said yes. Only one of those positions has any chance of actually getting you a date, or even of letting you move on and find someone else.
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Nov 2, 2017 05:25
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Im not sure a date is the same as obsessing over a massacre that happens 10 years ago
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Nov 2, 2017 10:24
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I'm not sure what Battler's position really is, but I do know that you should never take a witch at their word. Even if Bern isn't lying it doesn't mean she's telling the whole truth.
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Nov 2, 2017 12:14
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I really wonder if Battler would've been better off trying to deliver his message more directly to Ange. I get that he's trying to give her enough hints that she could come to the conclusion on her own, similiar to the game he was in before all this, but I also think Ange is the kinda person who would rather just be directly told than having to jump through hoops. Doesn't help that Bern seems to get that and just tells her what she things/what she wants Ange to believe straight up (After some theatrics of "Look, what if your family were the evil ones?").
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Nov 2, 2017 15:33
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HiKaizer posted:I'm not sure what Battler's position really is, but I do know that you should never take a witch at their word. Even if Bern isn't lying it doesn't mean she's telling the whole truth. one of Bern's whole shtick is to disprove miracles, she's so jaded and burned by bad experiences that she will, she found Lion solely to destroy them. Ange is letting her desperation overcome the fact she knows Bern should never be trusted. to go with ZD's example, Bern wouldn't tell Ange to ask the crush out, she'd tell them to punch them because they'd never say yes anyways.
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Nov 2, 2017 16:21
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