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 Route C:Sure enough, the red girls show up during the YoRHa stage play, taunt A2 with the truth about YoRHa, and murder her friends/allies. The play also revealed that all the YoRHa prototypes were implanted with (and are aware of) false memories that influence their personalities. I don't remember offhand if false memories were brought up at any point in the game. The brief description given for A2's false memories appears to be a reference to Kainé. This particular bit of information would have been worthless to newcomers to the franchise, but it would have been a nice reference to include alongside all the other NieR 1 callbacks that stack up late in the game. Is there any good reason for this information to not be included in the game? Fake Edit: Anemone is watching over unit No21, who is infected with the logic virus. Anemone has promised to kill her before she becomes fully corrupted. YoRHa Stage Play, Ver. 1.1 posted:No21 removes her eye mask.
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Oct 29, 2017 13:44
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Know Such Peace posted:(Spoiler-B-Gone) Nope. Who knows. Maybe they felt that including that bit as part of a setpiece that they did not have the budget for to make playable (???) wouldn't be effective enough. I sure would've loved seeing that in-game, though! I think the story works without it, but it'd be a welcome addition for A2 in particular. I agree that this particular instance is where the game feels too sparse. Eh. 
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Oct 29, 2017 14:01
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Know Such Peace posted:
I'm pretty sure this was a feature exclusive to the "Next generation special forces" proto-YoRHa and actual YoRHa have no implanted memories since not once is it ever brought up in the game.
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Oct 29, 2017 14:12
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If anyone else shares my obsession with hearing people's first impressions with late-game Automata, Joseph Anderson recently started Twitch streaming and uploaded his entire blind run on his secondary YouTube channel. Anderson makes in-depth (often 2+ hour) game design analysis videos that often include suggestions for fixing weak moments in gameplay. He is currently planning on releasing a critique of Automata around the end of November. It was interesting to hear his thoughts throughout the entire experience. Since he is brand new to streaming, there were very few sub/donation interruptions, and he is not yet in that weird 'Twitch entertainer' mode that every streamer eventually settles into.
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Oct 29, 2017 15:05
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Know Such Peace posted:
It makes me wonder about something though. We meet Devola, Popola and Emil in Nier: Automata, except it turns out they're actually copies, not the real characters from Nier 1. This tidbit from the play (and the fact that they certainly look the part) arguably puts A2 and 2B in the Nier Copy Club for Kainé. This leaves 9S out of the club and Nier without a copy, except that 9S totally looks like Act 1 Brother Nier. Is 9S supposed to be Copy Club Nier?
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Oct 30, 2017 01:18
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i am tim! posted:It makes me wonder about something though. We meet Devola, Popola and Emil in Nier: Automata, except it turns out they're actually copies, not the real characters from Nier 1. This tidbit from the play (and the fact that they certainly look the part) arguably puts A2 and 2B in the Nier Copy Club for Kainé. This leaves 9S out of the club and Nier without a copy, except that 9S totally looks like Act 1 Brother Nier. Is 9S supposed to be Copy Club Nier? The evidence suggests Automata continues from Ending D so Nier does not exist.
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Oct 30, 2017 01:29
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Nier is alluded to in various weapon histories.
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Oct 30, 2017 01:40
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ZiegeDame posted:The evidence suggests Automata continues from Ending D so Nier does not exist. There's also the Ending E short story from Grimoire Nier that continues off of Ending D, where Nier is recreated in the Forest of Myth based on what the Divine Tree remembered when he first showed up during Act 1. Speaking of which, if the recreated Nier only had the memories from that point in time, he would barely know Kainé at all, which is not dissimilar to the situation with 2B losing the 9S she knows only to get a new 9S that barely knows her.
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Oct 30, 2017 01:45
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Route C stuff (still): The red girls are a super-obvious reference to One/One and Manah/Seere. A2 is a reference to both Kainé and Zero, with berserk mode referencing Zero's intoner mode. It might be more of a stretch, but 9S's character arc reminds me of Caim. They both go from cheerful dudes who crush on their siblings to vengeful mass murderers.
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Oct 30, 2017 11:56
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Know Such Peace posted:Route C stuff (still): * pauses mid-sentence, raises head to look at a giant signal projected onto the clouds, arrives by crashing through window and non-killingly tackling bad guys * WELL ACTUALLY Yeah, the 9S - Caim comparison feels REALLY off... I mean, Caim STARTS OUT as a killing machine who just loves murderin'. That's almost his entire character. He loves murder so much he weirds out the genocidal dragon. Also, his sister crushes on him and not the other way around; it's so one-sided, in fact, that his sister promptly kills herself when it's revealed.  Nines, on the other hand, exists to suffer at the hands of the plot, and his end goal is suicide. He gets dunked on so hard the audience literally rises up and demands a happy end. It's quite a stretch, yeah. Oh, and let's not forget the super-obvious connection to the Watchers! Red eyes, the mask tattoos, little girls with deep man voice... That's the most interesting thing about them, if you ask me. Are the machines actually the watchers, or are they eventually going to turn into them? Is the arrogance of the machines (represented by N2) a sign of infection by the watchers? Is the logic virus the watchers in digital form? Might be...
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Oct 30, 2017 12:33
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poo poo. You're right. I combined Furiae's secret with Caim's attitude after he loses Angelus.
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Oct 30, 2017 12:56
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If anyone has a connection with Caim, I’d say it’s Kainé, since she entered a pact-like connection to a Shade after swearing vengeance against them for killing her grandmother, puts her in a similar place with regards to Caim and dragons. Granted, it also works to connect Angelus and Kainé for similar reasons, slotting Tyrann in as notCaim in this case.
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Oct 30, 2017 14:35
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ZiegeDame posted:The evidence suggests Automata continues from Ending D so Nier does not exist. Emil mentions Nier, not by name but Nier is definitely the "he" Emil refers to during the giant Emil heads boss Honestly though looking for direct connections between characters is kinda moot because so many of the references are aesthetic alone. I'd argue the point of some of the references is that characters don human symbols they don't understand the meaning of. The machines-watchers connection especially is something I highly suspect is intentionally following this logic and is the one case where the machines actually are just reading old world data and replicating the kind of symbology they find.
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Oct 30, 2017 17:34
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9S is way closer to Brother Nier, in that he spends the first half of the game optimistic and the second full of murderous rage.
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Oct 30, 2017 18:51
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Torquemadras posted:* pauses mid-sentence, raises head to look at a giant signal projected onto the clouds, arrives by crashing through window and non-killingly tackling bad guys * WELL ACTUALLY Caim's backstory was that he used to be a happy, cheerful guy until his parents got eaten by Legna, and I think there's also some stuff that suggests the attraction might have been two-way?
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Oct 30, 2017 19:03
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Nines needs to stop muddying up the gene pool with his dunkability. He deserves being dunked into oblivion. And I don’t care that there’s no such thing as an android gene pool. 
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Oct 30, 2017 19:52
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...! posted:Nines needs to stop muddying up the gene pool with his dunkability. He deserves being dunked into oblivion. And I don’t care that there’s no such thing as an android gene pool. There is a model number/type pool.
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Oct 30, 2017 19:58
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Really the greatest mystery of the setting is why they keep rebuilding model 9 when his sole consistent character trait is loving up and getting dunked.
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Oct 30, 2017 20:04
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Nina posted:Really the greatest mystery of the setting is why they keep rebuilding model 9 when his sole consistent character trait is loving up and getting dunked. He's the best at hacking. Like, actually the best android hacker in the world full stop. That's kinda useful when you're fighting an eternal war against an AI.
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Oct 30, 2017 20:11
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9S losing his arm and obtaining a parasitic replacement for it is pretty similar to Zero.
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Oct 30, 2017 23:42
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Even ignoring the Hackerman aspect of it, 9S - despite being a Scanner model who is "not designed for combat" - proceeds to carve a bloody path through machines, Yorha, and (somehow) piloted flight units, as soon as any sense of inhibitions or self-restraint are removed. Plus the 9S model is so advanced that they have to specifically assign a E-Type model to him at all times because it's inevitable that he'll discover the truth behind Yorha. He really only gets dunked when 2B is around because he does a lot of stupid reckless stuff for her sake, like uploading her data first before a self-destruct, or crash-landing a flight unit from space into a machine she's fighting, or trying to 1v1 the strongest Yorha model that's ever existed because she killed 2B. In that regard, 9S can be considered to be even more advanced; he's self-dunking, which makes 2B's job effortless and furthers overall unit productivity.
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Nov 1, 2017 09:02
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I love the concept really but more for being a part of the buddhist symbolism the game is full of. Thematically speaking 9S is stuck in a cycle of endless rebirth and execution for sins committed in a past life as the original number 9.
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Nov 1, 2017 15:54
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Haha, there's a seventeen year old kid who can't get ending E because the parental restrictions won't allow him to connect to PSN.
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Nov 5, 2017 01:35
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I was putting off an update that turned out to keep me from going online the day I got C and D. I've been meaning to go back but I wound up watching the ending on Youtube anyway.
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Nov 5, 2017 02:03
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Nina posted:I love the concept really but more for being a part of the buddhist symbolism the game is full of. Thematically speaking 9S is stuck in a cycle of endless rebirth and execution for sins committed in a past life as the original number 9. Yeah my buddy who beat the game before me went on and on about how existentialist the game is but once I beat it, it became pretty obvious that there's way more Buddhist DNA in the themes and plot.
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Nov 9, 2017 04:36
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 http://www.amiami.com/top/detail/detail?gcode=FIGURE-034775&page=top http://www.amiami.com/top/detail/detail?gcode=FIGURE-034774&page=top
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Nov 9, 2017 21:17
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https://mobile.twitter.com/yokotaro/status/928987106977787904
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Nov 12, 2017 03:08
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I started replaying and while I still have the same criticisms for it I'm actually enjoying myself a bit more without the nagging feeling of having to beat the game fast so my gushing friends won't spoil me
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Nov 12, 2017 13:03
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Don't make friends and you'll never have problems like that.
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Nov 12, 2017 13:13
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I just had a dumb revelation today, something that in retrospect should have been obvious. (Route C spoilers) Number 21 from the stage play has the same personality as 21O. So when she argues for saving Lily because they're like a family, that's foreshadowing the 21O boss fight where she reveals her desire for family
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Nov 12, 2017 22:53
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Yep! Every number designation is the same ”person”
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Nov 13, 2017 10:25
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Nina posted:Yep! Every number designation is the same ”person” I'd say it'd would be more accurate to describe it as every number having the same "baseline". After all, we see an example to the contrary in the game itself. Attacker 2 and model 2, type E are both running off the same number. Same basic personality, and at factory zero, they'd basically be the same person. But experience changes people, so 2B's a stoic soldier all-too-aware of her own sins, while A2 is a psychotic murderhobo. Same start, but by the time we meet them, they're very different people.
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Nov 13, 2017 11:00
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Sadly playing the game again now I’m noticing time has only accentuated how much I don’t like 2B and 9S. I keep thinking I want to just play the game entirely as people who aren’t them
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Nov 13, 2017 11:09
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Nier: Automata 2 - Jackass and Pascal's Excellent Adventure It's an item shop game like Recettear where you sell illicit substances and the body parts of your dead friends to passing Androids.
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Nov 13, 2017 17:38
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Just finished Route C and while I have lots of questions, one thing is nagging me the most What's the significance of machines that poorly emulate human behavior (the story about machines failing at farming over and over) without learning? Why do they want to do "human things," and why do they begin to learn and just...stop?
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Nov 15, 2017 01:08
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Grey Fox posted:Just finished Route C and while I have lots of questions, one thing is nagging me the most What's the significance of machines that poorly emulate human behavior (the story about machines failing at farming over and over) without learning? Why do they want to do "human things," and why do they begin to learn and just...stop? Route C/D EndingTheir core programming is kill all androids and humans. If they really tried they could accomplish this with ease. With the aliens dead, should they actually do this, and there are no more androids to kill, they won't be able to get new orders, and will be unable to fulfill their core function/reason for existing. So they dedicated a lot of research into how to fail, so they could continue working towards their prime objective without ever achieving it. As 9S said, failure itself was the point.
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Nov 15, 2017 01:14
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That's... not what he asked.
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Nov 15, 2017 01:55
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Well If the question is specifically why the interest in humans, it's because they're stuck on this planet full of information about humans, and also the humans in Nier were really, really good at failure. They don't start to learn how to farm and then stop. They learn how to farm, they learn how to be really bad at farming, and mission accomplished.
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Nov 15, 2017 02:06
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https://twitter.com/yokotaro/status/930617710056058880
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Nov 15, 2017 03:13
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Just wanted to point out the cuteness of the forum saying this thread was "Killed by a kitten."
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Nov 15, 2017 03:37
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