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OwlFancier posted:You don't need to assign a scientist to a ship to fly it around. Did they actually say this is the case? If so then I guess you will just have to pay a few more minerals for your suicidal scouts.
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Nov 2, 2017 21:45
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Nuclearmonkee posted:Did they actually say this is the case? If so then I guess you will just have to pay a few more minerals for your suicidal scouts. Well no they might require a scientist on board but you can by default build them and fly them around without a scientist in them, the reason I used corvettes was simply because they were cheap and you start with three of them.
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Nov 2, 2017 21:46
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Fellblade posted:While they said there is currently no plan for how to solve the problem, an obvious answer would be to de-couple the mega-engineering tech from the DLC (leaving the existing megastructures as DLC only) and have it only apply to gates or something. OwlFancier posted:You don't need to assign a scientist to a ship to fly it around.
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Nov 2, 2017 21:47
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Not really a big fan of "only science ships can enter unexplored systems" but I also don't care too much about it.
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Nov 2, 2017 21:50
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OwlFancier posted:Well no they might require a scientist on board but you can by default build them and fly them around without a scientist in them, the reason I used corvettes was simply because they were cheap and you start with three of them. OK, I was assuming that "unexplored" means "not surveyed" because otherwise it's just changing what type of ship you scout with and who cares.
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Nov 2, 2017 21:52
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GunnerJ posted:OK, I was assuming that "unexplored" means "not surveyed" because otherwise it's just changing what type of ship you scout with and who cares. Being able to find all nearby primitives and colonizable planets with my starter 3 corvettes is extremely good and can matter Quite A Lot depending on what flavor of genocidal maniac you are playing.
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Nov 2, 2017 21:53
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The science ship thing is just an early game thing. Once your sensors reveal the next system (level 2) you'll auto scout the next node and can corvette scout.
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Nov 2, 2017 21:54
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Nuclearmonkee posted:Being able to find all nearby primitives and colonizable planets with my starter 3 corvettes is extremely good and can matter Quite A Lot depending on what flavor of genocidal maniac you are playing. Yeah but if you don't have to survey then this change is just a speed bump to doing that because you have to build some new ships instead of using your starters.
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Nov 2, 2017 21:54
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I actually kinda hate feeling forced to explore the entire drat galaxy with my 3 starting ships. I'll usually have the entire galaxy mapped by the time I've got my first colony. I'd much rather slowly explore with science ships.
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Nov 2, 2017 21:59
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Nuclearmonkee posted:Being able to find all nearby primitives and colonizable planets with my starter 3 corvettes is extremely good and can matter Quite A Lot depending on what flavor of genocidal maniac you are playing. No more ignoring your three free nearby habitable worlds just because they won't expand your borders! I like the idea of having a solid well populated core and kind of having a less populated sprawling frontier over time. Before the game explicitly encouraged settling planets as far away as you could manage for the sake of claiming territory. Man, it really is going to be a whole new game. GunnerJ posted:Yeah but if you don't have to survey then this change is just a speed bump to doing that because you have to build some new ships instead of using your starters. Exploration is risking a scientist until you get sensor level 2. That's a big change and I'm happy with it as corvette exploration was micro hell but I felt like I was shooting myself in the foot if I didn't do it to some extent. Now there's a real reason not to do it right off the bat.
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Nov 2, 2017 22:00
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How does planet cap / system cap interact with the new system ownership system? It looks like it's still there at 1/3 at the start. Also I wonder if sectors need to be contiguous anymore or you just assign them owned system.
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Nov 2, 2017 22:07
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So are we at least going to get some "terrain effects" that buff you instead of all being just debuffs? Cause if they're all just "X doesn't work properly in this system" then that's getting modded out too.
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Nov 2, 2017 22:12
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"I do not accept this game design change! I do not accept this game design change!" I shout as I slowly mod myself into a corn cob.
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Nov 2, 2017 22:15
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canepazzo posted:How does planet cap / system cap interact with the new system ownership system? It looks like it's still there at 1/3 at the start. Also I wonder if sectors need to be contiguous anymore or you just assign them owned system. Tier 0 stations can claim systems but offer no defenses and cost no upkeep and don't count towards your cap
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Nov 2, 2017 22:15
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Shadowlyger posted:So are we at least going to get some "terrain effects" that buff you instead of all being just debuffs? Cause if they're all just "X doesn't work properly in this system" then that's getting modded out too. They're not debuffs they're mechanics changes. Nebulas hiding poo poo isn't always bad - they make for excellent rally points. Pulsars turning off shields isn't always bad either - throw a plasma fortress at a pulsar chokepoint and you're laughing at all those shield and anti-shield using scrubs.
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Nov 2, 2017 22:19
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Zore posted:Tier 0 stations can claim systems but offer no defenses and cost no upkeep and don't count towards your cap Yeah but what does the planet/system cap do then? Since colonies were used to claim systems - not anymore.
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Nov 2, 2017 22:20
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canepazzo posted:Yeah but what does the planet/system cap do then? Since colonies were used to claim systems - not anymore. How many developed stations you can have. You'll need a developed station to colonize in the system or have defenses.
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Nov 2, 2017 22:22
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canepazzo posted:Yeah but what does the planet/system cap do then? Since colonies were used to claim systems - not anymore. Presumably it's just a cap on core Colonies now; judging from the dev stream earlier it wasn't effected by plunking down outposts, so that seems most likely.
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Nov 2, 2017 22:22
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DatonKallandor posted:They're not debuffs they're mechanics changes. Nebulas hiding poo poo isn't always bad - they make for excellent rally points. Pulsars turning off shields isn't always bad either - throw a plasma fortress at a pulsar chokepoint and you're laughing at all those shield and anti-shield using scrubs. They're debuffs, call em what they are.
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Nov 2, 2017 22:22
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canepazzo posted:Yeah but what does the planet/system cap do then? Since colonies were used to claim systems - not anymore. The way it's been explained so far, colonies and system caps work exactly the same but the planet no longer claims the system. Presumably, taking a system as a result of war will give you the planets as well as the outpost located there. Zore posted:How many developed stations you can have. You'll need a developed station to colonize in the system or have defenses. I thought fortress cap was separate from system cap, did I miss something?
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Nov 2, 2017 22:22
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Zore posted:How many developed stations you can have. You'll need a developed station to colonize in the system or have defenses. There's a starbase limit for advanced starbases and apparently still a system limit for systems with planets in them. Presumably it's just that- a limit to how many systems with planets you can have before you have to put them in sectors. I don't see why that would be different. I do wonder how new starbases will interact with sectors though.
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Nov 2, 2017 22:28
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Shadowlyger posted:They're debuffs, call em what they are. Since they aren't, that's not possible. Sorry. (Seriously, the pulsar for example is a giant buff to armor and anti-armor weapons. Someone using those will surely feel the heat of this "debuff" as his enemies are literally melting in his plasma-fire.)
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Nov 2, 2017 22:35
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Shadowlyger posted:They're debuffs, call em what they are. Not... really. They're home field advantage. Do you think that cover in company of heroes is a debuff because it makes shooting into it less accurate? If you know a system blocks shields you build a full armour defence fort in that system and it works better than generalist designs.
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Nov 2, 2017 22:39
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So re: only science ships can enter unscouted systems, do they need to fully survey the system before they can go farther? If not, then the three corvettes scouting the entire galaxy just turns into building a science ship to shift+right click > move every star in the galaxy with. Sure, it's a bit more punishing to lose it because of the higher mineral cost and leader influence, but not so punishing as to outweigh the benefits of having scouted the entire galaxy by year 20. Maybe make it so that you have to "discover" via survey hyperlanes leading out of systems like in Aurora/Starfire/whatever?
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Nov 2, 2017 22:41
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Wiz posted:Most people's games don't end before 2400, and people having impossible to beat crises dropped on them in 2350 was a huge issue when 1.8 came out. A slider was outside the scope of a hotfix, but will be added in the future. What is your definition of "end"
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Nov 2, 2017 22:48
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Libluini posted:Since they aren't, that's not possible. Sorry. All that does is force you to micro your way around the pulsar or go refit your entire fleet with plasma weapons of your own to kill it, and now you have control of the plasma-equipped pulsar fortress while you go refit your fleet again with weapons that don't suck against shields. In other words, all it introduces is a shitload more micro.
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Nov 2, 2017 22:49
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Shadowlyger posted:All that does is force you to micro your way around the pulsar or go refit your entire fleet with plasma weapons of your own to kill it, and now you have control of the plasma-equipped pulsar fortress while you go refit your fleet again with weapons that don't suck against shields. Are we just using "micro" to mean "thing I don't like" at this point?
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Nov 2, 2017 22:51
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That's all it's ever meant in this thread, honestly.
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Nov 2, 2017 22:52
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I opted to go for the genetic engineering path in my current playthrough, and I'm finding it kind of underwhelming. I'm wondering if it's kind of meh, or if I'm just playing wrong. The special traits you get at the end are nice, but don't feel as game-changing as, say, turning everyone in robots or being able to access the Shroud. Being able to specialize my people so I could have a bunch of nerve-stapled miners would be nice, but it seems like that would require an ungodly amount of micromanaging to put them on the correct tiles and shift them between planets, and at the end of the day it's easier to just use robots, since I can determine exactly where they go.
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Nov 2, 2017 22:53
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life micro is the worst
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Nov 2, 2017 22:53
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1) You can't micro around the pulsar fortress because it's the only way into your enemy's core worlds.... almost.... almost like that's intentionally the point of the overhauls  2) Forcing your enemy to spend a bunch of resources and time refitting their entire fleet to kill one thing is kinda what the fortress is there for. Like, it's a deterrent that your enemy has to work hard and spend resources to overcome while you're loving their poo poo up elsewhere. E: "God, why even have forts in EU4, all they do is make you micro a bunch of artillery into the province or try and micro your army around it."
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Nov 2, 2017 22:54
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Crazycryodude posted:1) You can't micro around the pulsar fortress because it's the only way into your enemy's core worlds.... almost.... almost like that's intentionally the point of the overhauls And the point I'm making is that this is stupid. There shouldn't be choke points in loving space.
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Nov 2, 2017 23:00
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Well, war in the game sucks without them and like 95% of the community and obviously the dev team agree with me on that so 
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Nov 2, 2017 23:01
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Shadowlyger posted:And the point I'm making is that this is stupid. There shouldn't be choke points in loving space. There also shouldn’t be FTL but
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Nov 2, 2017 23:02
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Shadowlyger posted:And the point I'm making is that this is stupid. There shouldn't be choke points in loving space. You are completely correct from a technical standpoint. However, Stellaris is not a hardcore spacesim, it is an empire building game that happens to be a space opera, and it takes place on an incredibly small timescale if we're talking realistic interstellar warfare and features FTL travel, and most importantly, is a video game, so you're completely wrong from every standpoint that actually matters. Psycho Landlord fucked around with this message at 23:09 on Nov 2, 2017 |
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Nov 2, 2017 23:02
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For the sake of realism I've modded Stellaris to remove FTL travel options from the game.
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Nov 2, 2017 23:03
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Yeah at the end of the day I'm playing sentient mushroom space wizards flying at FTL speeds around a "galaxy" that has all of 800 stars. This isn't exactly diamond-hard sci-fi, it's space opera and it's supposed to be fun above all. If you must, just make up some technobabble about physics only allowing for hyperlanes and boom, when you don't want to fly at sublight speeds for 20k years now chokepoints make sense.
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Nov 2, 2017 23:04
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It's correct there should not be choke points in space, obviously there aren't! But in order to violate physics to travel faster than light the science of hyperlanes was discovered based on the gravity wells of solar systems. Of course you're free to travel anywhere you want without using a hyper lane, but it would take beyond the timeframe of the game to do so. Sure, go sub-light to avoid a hyperlane choke point but it will take you 400 years. There, now it makes sense within the scope of the game world.
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Nov 2, 2017 23:05
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Shadowlyger posted:And the point I'm making is that this is stupid. There shouldn't be choke points in loving space. My god you're right, we must act to excise all elements of the game that are an affront to realism at once! *throws entire game in the trash*
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Nov 2, 2017 23:05
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Shadowlyger posted:And the point I'm making is that this is stupid. There shouldn't be choke points in loving space.
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Nov 2, 2017 23:08
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