TG As An Industry - Past, Present, Future - The Something Awful Forums

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Reene: Aug 26, 2005

Valatar phrased himself in the most obtuse way possible but it is absolutely true that there are abusers who use abuse accusations as a means to harm and defame their targets.

That said, it's generally pretty simple to spot when it's the product of a group of trolls and also vanishingly rare compared to all those times when something has actually happened. "Believe but verify" is the mantra in all but the most toxic of nominally SJ-positive spaces.

# ? Oct 28, 2017 17:39

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# ? Jun 3, 2024 02:20

Maxwell Lord: Dec 12, 2008; I am drowning.
There is no sign of land.
You are coming down with me, hand in unlovable hand.

And I hope you die.

I hope we both die.; Grimey Drawer

Subjunctive posted:

Does verification require a real person to appear in front of an RPGnet mod, or is it mere internet conversation?

I don't know what conversations took place among the mods. I think they should have banned him right away too but I understand why they weren't as quick to respond as they should have been.

# ? Oct 28, 2017 18:22

HerdingCats: Sep 12, 2017

I feel like it got understandably overlooked in the storm of posts happening at the time the accusation was made, but I recall seeing a post in the RPGnet thread from (former?) Mummy developer C. A. Suleiman, who said he had first-hand reason to believe the allegations. (Yep, I just went back and checked -- post #396.) Considering the potential career impact of speaking out against a colleague or former colleague like that, I am inclined to give it a great deal of credence. So the 'it's just a stranger on the internet making an accusation' argument, regardless of its validity or lack thereof, doesn't even really apply here. We literally have people who have worked with McFarland backing its credibility.

# ? Oct 28, 2017 18:59

Gerund: Sep 12, 2007; He push a man

Plutonis posted:

There's indeed people who would love to use abuse as a cudgel dude

https://twitter.com/Cernovich/status/921840239114461184

Way to quote only part of my post. No obfuscation there.

I don't see the same accusations that are being levied against, specifically, the man accused of raping a 16 year old by what appears to be the victim. I see a completely unrelated blue check dipshit listing a bunch of publications he dislikes and linking to his own website, a site that I am not clicking.

You would have tp be obtuse to see these as the same thing. I believe victims, full stop.

And honestly, why would you follow / not block that dipshit?

# ? Oct 28, 2017 19:06

Plutonis: Mar 25, 2011

I don't have a twitter account

# ? Oct 28, 2017 19:23

Andrast: Apr 21, 2010

Plutonis posted:

I don't have a twitter account

A wise choice.

# ? Oct 28, 2017 19:30

That Old Tree: Jun 24, 2012; nah

Gerund posted:

Way to quote only part of my post. No obfuscation there.

I don't see the same accusations that are being levied against, specifically, the man accused of raping a 16 year old by what appears to be the victim. I see a completely unrelated blue check dipshit listing a bunch of publications he dislikes and linking to his own website, a site that I am not clicking.

You would have tp be obtuse to see these as the same thing. I believe victims, full stop.

And honestly, why would you follow / not block that dipshit?

If you don't read Cernovich, how will you learn that Gorilla Mindset that teaches you women are trying to steal your precious semen, and STDs can be avoided with nothing but coconut oil and tea tree oil?

# ? Oct 28, 2017 19:33

Maxwell Lord: Dec 12, 2008; I am drowning.
There is no sign of land.
You are coming down with me, hand in unlovable hand.

And I hope you die.

I hope we both die.; Grimey Drawer

Also that hotel floors are a great place to take a dump

# ? Oct 28, 2017 20:11

PST: Jul 5, 2012; If only Milliband had eaten a vegan sausage roll instead of a bacon sandwich, we wouldn't be in this mess.

Jimbozig posted:

Yeah, the time to worry about whether a claim may be false is when the accused actually denies it. When the accused just steps down and goes silent or admits it, there is no need for that poo poo at all.

Bill Webb sort of, kind of, via a bullshit coverup apology admitted what he did, and there are still people trying to deny it and playing the 'but what did he really do' and the 'but he was drunk' and 'i'm sure he just flirted with someone' cards.

There's evidence of Mentzer being a creepy harassing dickhead, and having lovely views on abuse victims, and both (some) old school TSR people and a gently caress ton of gamergaters and alt-righters with confederate flags and 'don't step on me' rushed to his defence and turned it immediately into 'she was trying to sabotage his kickstarter) which was a steaming pile of poo poo, and she's already hated by gamergate so of course they piled in.

gently caress, even women who actually get through the whole process of court case and appeal and supreme court appeal (recent canada case i'm thinking of) still get accused of lying and harassed for it.

# ? Oct 28, 2017 20:38

Kurieg: Jul 19, 2012; RIP Lutri: 5/19/20-4/2/20

Maxwell Lord posted:

Also that hotel floors are a great place to take a dump

You can learn that by reading nChanging Breeds, a book written by Phil Brucato, literal crazyman.

# ? Oct 28, 2017 20:40

Halloween Jack: Sep 12, 2003; I WILL CUT OFF BOTH OF MY ARMS BEFORE I VOTE FOR ANYONE THAT IS MORE POPULAR THAN BERNIE!!!!!

Hypothetical question about how the OGL works: Does this mean you can use stuff from the SRD in a completely different system? Like, you can have an Owlbear (who is an Arcane Archer) cast Prismatic Spray on a Blink Dog (who is a Shadowdancer) wielding a Holy Avenger?

# ? Oct 29, 2017 03:50

Alien Rope Burn: Dec 5, 2004; _{I wanna be a saikyo HERO!}

Halloween Jack posted:

Hypothetical question about how the OGL works: Does this mean you can use stuff from the SRD in a completely different system? Like, you can have an Owlbear (who is an Arcane Archer) cast Prismatic Spray on a Blink Dog (who is a Shadowdancer) wielding a Holy Avenger?

I'm not sure what you mean? The OGL technically doesn't even mention the d20 system, if you're wondering. It can be applied to any game. The d20 system uses the OGL, but not vice versa. You could make your own game that's OGL, but not d20.

Technically I don't see why you couldn't have d20 OGL material adapted to another system using the OGL as your license, but the main issue with that is that you'd then have to theoretically apply the OGL to the game / supplement / whatever that you're making. Not sure that's been done. And if you're not making a d20 game, there aren't a lot of compelling reasons to do so, since you'd be opening up whatever rules content you have to the OGL, which isn't in your best interest unless you just want to provide the content freely (and frankly, that's probably better as a Creative Commons license, IMO). It'd generally just be easier to rename / rebrand whatever you want to borrow from D&D if it's distinctive enough to worry about legally. And applying the OGL would get complicated if you're working with any sort of system you don't own. Of course, you can mix up various d20 OGL games however you like using it.

(This is not legal advice, take my word with a grain of salt as just somebody who's actually bothered to read the varying legalese on the OGL license in the back of d20 books - different companies had different takes and you'd have to pay attention to that, too.)

# ? Oct 29, 2017 05:20

Halloween Jack: Sep 12, 2003; I WILL CUT OFF BOTH OF MY ARMS BEFORE I VOTE FOR ANYONE THAT IS MORE POPULAR THAN BERNIE!!!!!

Alien Rope Burn posted:

It'd generally just be easier to rename / rebrand whatever you want to borrow from D&D if it's distinctive enough to worry about legally.

But that doesn't work when your only reason for doing this is to make awful, awful puns about Owlbear Bryant, The Blink Yard Dog, Umber Hulk Hogan, and Mephit Man.

# ? Oct 29, 2017 05:26

BENGHAZI 2: Oct 13, 2007; by Cyrano4747

Plutonis posted:

There's indeed people who would love to use abuse as a cudgel dude

https://twitter.com/Cernovich/status/921840239114461184

mike cernovich is a loving moron and nobody believes him who isn't also a moron

man has made a living off telling other men how to be Alpha and In Control and yet used to make a living off alimony payments from his ex (and still does i think)

# ? Oct 30, 2017 05:01

Serf: May 5, 2011

surely the man who chugs gorilla cum and thinks breathing exercises will let him explore the cosmos is a trusted source

# ? Oct 30, 2017 10:59

DivineCoffeeBinge: Mar 3, 2011; Spider-Man's Amazing Construction Company

Kurieg posted:

You can learn that by reading nChanging Breeds, a book written by Phil Brucato, literal crazyman.

Phil Brucato may be a literal crazyman but he bought my short story for the Mage anniversary fiction collection book thingy so he's okay in my book.

# ? Oct 30, 2017 15:50

Plutonis: Mar 25, 2011

The point I was making wasn't that he was trustworthy, but that guys like him might start to slander people with abuse accusations!!!

# ? Oct 30, 2017 15:56

Gerund: Sep 12, 2007; He push a man

Plutonis posted:

The point I was making wasn't that he was trustworthy, but that guys like him might start to slander people with abuse accusations!!!

Again, you should believe victims AND not worry about what guys jacked up on gorilla semen are saying.

Its actually really god drat easy.

# ? Oct 30, 2017 16:08

Comrade Gorbash: Jul 12, 2011; My paper soldiers form a wall, five paces thick and twice as tall.

Gerund posted:

Again, you should believe victims AND not worry about what guys jacked up on gorilla semen are saying.

Its actually really god drat easy.

Yeah, there's a world of difference between an otherwise uninvolved third party making an allegation, and someone saying they themselves were victimized.

# ? Oct 30, 2017 16:36

That Old Tree: Jun 24, 2012; nah

Hey, who wants to go to a gaming convention in Texas!?

quote:

Ok, I am making this post so everyone knows who is "allowed" to come to the Con.

I have received about 3 emails asking me about Frank Mentzer and Bill Webb being on the list of attendees at the Con in 2018 (in this case both are Special Guests). They are bringing up info about "sexual harassment" claims as a reason to not have them at the Con....

So here is my stance on the subject:

Everyone is allowed to come to the Con

Our Con is a gaming Con. ie: when you arrive you are as follows:

Race: Gamer
Sexual orientation: Gamer
Political affiliation: Gamer
Religion: Gamer

get the drift....

I don't care if a member of ISIS or the most wanted person in a America comes to the Con, as long as they are there to game, and everything is about gaming.

I have asked people to leave the Con when I find them debating politics and/or religion at the gaming table. (so what do you think I'd do if I observed any sexual harassment ?)

Thus anything not gaming related can get you removed from the Con.

As long as everyone keeps everything about gaming, things are fine. If I hear of or observe anything non-gaming related, the person's time at the Con is ended until the next Con.

Not sure if that answers your question.... so here's more

If someone is in attendance at the Con that you don't like or don't approve of, my suggestion is don't play in their games. Don't talk to them. If people don't sign up for someone's games, then if they are a Special Guest, I can't afford to invite them back on my dime if they are not filling their games (that's an easy protest)...

We run a very small Con (max attendance set at 500) and I can't ask people not to attend based on information posted on the Web, or actions that occurred at another venue, or for that matter any conduct from their past.

Basically it's like telling me anyone having done anything in the past that I, or you or others don't like or don't agree with must not be allowed at the Con. That being the case, then no one at all would be invited since if I was privy to everyone's past, I am sure I can find some thing that someone in attendance doesn't agree with or like.

We have felons (even though they've served their time, they are still felons) and some people might not like that, we have thieves (if you've ever stolen anything, even as a youth, you are thief), heck any previous violation of the law (including speeding) makes you a criminal (for life I might add)... and who wants to game with criminals ...

My point is, everyone at the Con without fail has something in their past I could "judge" and decide they should not be allowed to attend (myself included). It's not my place to judge.

This is a gaming Con for gamers... if everyone arrives as a gamer and games, then what they have done outside our Con, doesn't really matter.

Anything not gaming related isn't tolerated, pretty simple.

If you don't want to come to NTRPGCon, I don't care, the Con is for Mike & I, be it us and 2 dozen Special Guests or 400+ additional attendees. I will always have the Con, but if people don't want to come, heck we'll move back to the LaQunita and have 50 people... works for me.

This is all I have to say about the subject, no other post or response from me will occur on the subject.

[REDACTED]
NTRPGCon.com

P.S. I reserve the right to make edits to this post to correct mistakes in spelling or grammar and/or to clarify statements that people can't comprehend. But nothing will be deleted from this post.

quote:

Even though I made the statement on my forms that I would not make any more posts about this, I will take the time to post here. (I don't even know if I have ever posted here, except maybe to promote the Con once or twice in the past, didn't even remember I had an account until I searched all my email history.).

In any case, I will first tell you who I am, always important to know who you are "flaming" in the forums.

I am [REDACTED], United States Marine Corp vet, prior Police Officer and current IT tech that runs a RPG Con as a Hobby. Father of one son, grand father to 2 boys and 1 girl. I don't vote, never have (except once in 1984 when in the USMC, and our captain passed a yellow card to everyone, advised everyone to mark Republican and pass them back to the front). I couldn't tell you who the VP of the country is, nor who any were in any past years, much less who was President when... I really don't care who runs the country, it's all been down hill since Washington (this is all my opinion of course, and start another hate post based on this if you like).... I don't watch the news, I don't take the paper, I don't even watch sports.... I don't have a social media presence on the web, in the sense that the only thing I have is a small Face Book site where I post pics of the Con, any "Con" Face Book page is hosted/ran by the guy who helps me run the Con ([REDACTED]). I don't use a smart phone thus I don't text, and even as an IT tech I don't get emails unless I am sitting at my desk working... I have a camera for taking pictures, a "car" phone that is in the car and turned on when I call people (not carried on me 24/7). I don't spend time reading crap on the internet, but someone pointed me to this post since it was a "reply" to a post I made on our forums. So I came to read it, and it's good to see people discussing things good or bad since everyone has opinions, better than going to fisticuffs.

The reason for the info/history on myself is so you know something about who I am and maybe some of how I think. Hoping that being a vet lets you know I am not only patriotic about the USA, but I also believe in defending our freedoms and rights. I personally don't think highly of those that disrespect our country or the flag and such, but I served to protect the right for them to be "assholes". Letting you know I was a Police Office is to show you that I served my community and protected the rights of others. Even doing IT work is a way to help others (on a less dangerous scale I might add). I am not a bad person, no mater how you'd like to paint my picture.

I carry a weapon at all times, sometimes more than one. In Texas we have that right, and it means I have been through the full investigation by the FBI on back ground checks etc. (4 times at least since it was done in the USMC, for the PD, for IT work I do for a DoD company, and again to carry a weapon). Should the need arise to protect someone, I'll be one of the first to put myself between the attacker and the victim. It's who I am.

Now to the topic at hand. The poster of this thread isn't someone I know personally, but I did get an email from them, and it was not just a "querries about steps to saftey". I will post the email here for you to read... it comes off very accusatory and as an "attack", along with accusing "Metzer" as harming someone physically. I don't know any of the "facts" that this email is based on, I don't even know if Frank Mentzer and Bill Webb were ever convicted of anything. I just get this email. I have gotten 2 other emails that I can find on the subject, but the other 2 emails were titled (paraphrased) "refund" and the body just said that they could not support a con that had Frank Mentzer and Bill Webb in attendance (not much info to go on there and if they want a refund, that's fine). But I am now veering off "topic" a bit so back to the email I received:

---------------------------------------------------------------------
From: [Real name not redacted by con organizer]
To: [REDACTED], [REDACTED]
Date: 2017/11/03 18:52
Subject: Metzer and Webb

So you have Metzer and Webb as your special guests at you con. So what
measures do you have in place to protect people attending and other guests
from sexual harassment from these two who have a repeated history of it.
And Metzer having injured a staff member at another con while drunk after
sexually harassing and assaulting someone.

Do you not think it sends the wrong message to have them as speakers after
these widely publicized incidents? Or is sexaual assault, sexual
harassment, and assault not things you care about?
---------------------------------------------------------------------

I don't take kindly to "attack" type emails, so getting such isn't a good way to start a conversation.

So since it was the 3rd email I have received referencing Frank Mentzer and Bill Webb, I opted to post a message in our forums so as not to have to start replying to every one looking to send additional emails on a topic I have no details on, nor have time to go read about (this has already been more time on a site reading a thread than I've spent in years on any site at all). The original poster of this thread and of the email above has also sent me numerous emails and I also took time to reply to as well.

Many have read the forum post, and I will presume many read it one way and many read it another. All things read are usually understood differently by different people, it's the way humans work.

Those that caught the line:
"I have asked people to leave the Con when I find them debating politics and/or religion at the gaming table. (so what do you think I'd do if I observed any sexual harassment ?)"

Should get the point, all the rest is frivolous ... I will not tolerate sexual harassment, nor will I tolerate any other type of infringement of someone's personal space, rights, freedoms or otherwise. read that how you will. (did anyone read that line... it's the point of this entire post here on this forum.... everything else above and below is frivolous, but you guys like drama)

Any other point I made was this... all of you, and I mean all of you have something in your past you may not be proud off (includes me) and whether you like it or not, it is part of you. So a felon is a felon even if he's served his time (and one poster said he has no problem with that... so if he served time for molesting a child is it still okay ?) Everyone here goes out into the world to work, shop, eat, play etc and every day you are among people that rape, kill, abuse etc.... you just don't know who, or maybe you do ? So for those that you do know of that are bad people, have you attacked Walmart for allowing them shop there and asked Walmart to ban them from their stores, have you contacted all the hotels to tell them bad people stay at their hotel and they need to keep them out ? No, of course you don't. If someone in your family was accused (or even convicted) of a crime, would you also "abandon" them, or would you still have them around in an attempt to show them you do care even though you don't approve ?

It's good you want to air out a problem. I have no clue about whether sexual harassment is a problem at gaming conventions, but it hasn't and won't be at our convention.

I don't have people fill out some past history form, nor do I do back ground checks on all that attend... I could, I have contacts and resources to do so. And I could have metal detectors, pat downs and the like as well. Sounds like a very safe Con at that point, but it sort of loses it's luster, like flying... I hate flying these days, I'd rather drive if it's 8-12 hours or less, not worth the "safety" at that point.

We have a good size group of current law enforcement attendees at our Con. Police, Border Patrol, DEA, ATF, county Sheriff plus former/retired Police, and a large group of concealed carry attendees.... all meaning we have a number of people in attendance that have had full FBI back ground checks and have spent years protecting people as a way of life.

Probably one of the more safe Cons out there.

But now I am off topic.

You can post all the hate you like, all the twisted interpretations of my post from our forums, or from this post if you like. It won't change anything for our Con.

We accept everyone that is a gamer at the Con, it's a Con for gamers about gaming. We'll even accept you as long as you don't bring the hate along. You'll be safer than most places.

This is all I have to say about the subject, no other post or response from me will occur on this forum about the subject.

[REDACTED]
NTRPGCon.com

P.S. I reserve the right to make edits to this post to correct mistakes in spelling or grammar and/or to clarify statements that people can't comprehend. But nothing will be deleted from this post by me, I have no control of moderators on this forum and no clue as to how they determine what should be edited by them and thus defer to them on that topic.

I feel safer already.

That Old Tree fucked around with this message at 23:17 on Nov 5, 2017

# ? Nov 5, 2017 19:35

senrath: Nov 4, 2009; Look Professor, a destruct switch!

quote:

"I have asked people to leave the Con when I find them debating politics and/or religion at the gaming table. (so what do you think I'd do if I observed any sexual harassment ?)"

I think you'd do absolutely nothing.

# ? Nov 5, 2017 19:39

Alien Rope Burn: Dec 5, 2004; _{I wanna be a saikyo HERO!}

'Sup, geek social fallacies?

# ? Nov 5, 2017 19:43

theironjef: Aug 11, 2009; The archmage of unexpected stinks.

Despite having "sexual orientation: gamer" in there, the worst part is still the bit where he says the con would be less fun if there wasn't a risk of people carrying dangerous poo poo around the halls.

# ? Nov 5, 2017 20:22

Golden Bee: Dec 24, 2009; I came here to chew bubblegum and quote 'They Live', and I'm... at an impasse.

Things I have: A gun on me at all times. A con.
Things I don't have: a smart phone, an understanding of who the vice president is.

# ? Nov 5, 2017 20:28

Evil Mastermind: Apr 28, 2008

Golden Bee posted:

Things I have: A gun on me at all times. A con.
Things I don't have: a smart phone, an understanding of who the vice president is.

Other things I don't have: a basic idea of other people's worries having value. The understanding that I shouldn't doxx people. A basic understanding of social dynamics.

# ? Nov 5, 2017 20:38

ravenkult: Feb 3, 2011

Evil Mastermind posted:

Other things I don't have: a basic idea of other people's worries having value. The understanding that I shouldn't doxx people. A basic understanding of social dynamics.

tl;dr
a brain

# ? Nov 5, 2017 20:58

Lord_Hambrose: Nov 21, 2008; *a foul hooting fills the air*

Golden Bee posted:

Things I have: A gun on me at all times. A con.
Things I don't have: a smart phone, an understanding of who the vice president is.

This is insane

# ? Nov 5, 2017 21:11

DalaranJ: Apr 15, 2008; Yosuke will now die for you.

senrath posted:

I think you'd do absolutely nothing.

Thank goodness that this one person is capable of watching hundreds of people at once because I can guarantee that they would do even less than nothing if allegations were merely reported to them instead of being directly observed. Likely they'd throw out the person making the allegations.

# ? Nov 5, 2017 21:36

Nuns with Guns: Jul 23, 2010; It's fine.
Don't worry about it.

That Old Tree posted:

It's good you want to air out a problem. I have no clue about whether sexual harassment is a problem at gaming conventions, but it hasn't and won't be at our convention.

Well this fills me with complete confidence in our Department of Defense.

# ? Nov 5, 2017 22:04

moths: Aug 25, 2004; I would also still appreciate some danger.

DalaranJ posted:

Likely they'd throw out the person making the allegations.

Almost certainly. Every dumb line in that screed is a setup for him to say "This convention's for GAMING not criminal complaining!" as he ejects victims.

# ? Nov 5, 2017 22:13

Living Image: Apr 24, 2010; HORSE'S ASS

Who wants to bet that if a Special Guest or whatever was accused of theft instead of sexual harassment they'd be banned immediately?

# ? Nov 5, 2017 22:18

Kurieg: Jul 19, 2012; RIP Lutri: 5/19/20-4/2/20

Corrode posted:

Who wants to bet that if a Special Guest or whatever was accused of theft instead of sexual harassment they'd be banned immediately?

"I'm sorry, it says here your gender is GAMER, not 'owner of things', therefore you can't be stolen from, get out."

# ? Nov 5, 2017 22:30

Comrade Gorbash: Jul 12, 2011; My paper soldiers form a wall, five paces thick and twice as tall.

How come all of these assholes feel they need 50,000 words to show how much a tool they are.

# ? Nov 5, 2017 23:19

RocknRollaAyatollah: Nov 26, 2008; Lipstick Apathy

I like how edgy assholes feel like they're being progressive and accommodating by telling people they don't give a gently caress about who someone is but heavily implies that if your identity crosses a line, you're gone.

This man is the nerd social fallacy made flesh too. "Frank and Bill are gamers. Unless I see it, it doesn't exist and they're free to play in OUR safe space, the GAMER space."

# ? Nov 6, 2017 01:08

JackMann: Aug 11, 2010; Secure. Contain. Protect.; Fallen Rib

We were talking about this in one of the Tradgames-adjacent chats, and it really does remind me of Breendoggle.

For those who don't know, Walter Breen was the husband of Marion Zimmer Bradley. He was also a pedophile (so was she, but he was known to be a pedophile). There was a huge argument in science fiction fandom over whether or not it was okay to keep him out of conventions where kids would be present. It would, y'know, be wrong to just exclude someone.

# ? Nov 6, 2017 01:20

alg: Mar 14, 2007; A wolf was no less a wolf because a whim of chance caused him to run with the watch-dogs.

why would you advertise carrying a gun at a loving rpg convention lmao

# ? Nov 6, 2017 01:24

Mors Rattus: Oct 25, 2007; FATAL & Friends
Walls of Text
#1 Builder
2014-2018

alg posted:

why would you advertise carrying a gun at a loving rpg convention lmao

Texas.

# ? Nov 6, 2017 01:25

ProfessorCirno: Feb 17, 2011; The strongest! The smartest!
The rightest!

This is absolutely the best time to advertise your con with "Also we got lots of guns!" in Texas.

# ? Nov 6, 2017 01:52

Plutonis: Mar 25, 2011

https://twitter.com/thehill/status/927323905848696833

# ? Nov 6, 2017 02:07

Adbot: ADBOT LOVES YOU

# ? Jun 3, 2024 02:20

Lunatic Sledge: Jun 8, 2013; choose your own horror isekai sci-fi Souls-like urban fantasy gamer simulator adventure

or don't?

My favorite parts of the whole thing, hands down are

quote:

As long as everyone keeps everything about gaming, things are fine. If I hear of or observe anything non-gaming related, the person's time at the Con is ended until the next Con.

this, for one. If you decide to grab some underage asses we'll kick you out, but feel free to stop on by next year it's cool no judgement we're all gamers here bro better luck next time and

quote:

Basically it's like telling me anyone having done anything in the past that I, or you or others don't like or don't agree with must not be allowed at the Con. That being the case, then no one at all would be invited since if I was privy to everyone's past, I am sure I can find some thing that someone in attendance doesn't agree with or like.

This isn't about polite disagreements god dammit it's about known sexual harassers. Dude's trying to paint it as a political issue when it's a safety issue. People are trying to keep the scumbags out not because well I don't like them or I disagree with their stance on things, people want the scumbags out because they're scumbags. A person's religion or sexuality or who they voted for is a whole different beast than whether or not they're a sexual predator. Whether some creepo should get free reign to victimize real humans isn't something you just throw your hands up and say "agree to disagree" on, that's ridiculous.

# ? Nov 6, 2017 02:23

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Traditional Games > TG As An Industry - Past, Present, Future

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