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blugu64 posted:Yes assembling pre-manufactured parts is easier then refining everything from scratch The Hermosillo Plant in Mexico that assembled my Ford ZX2 apparently produces 300,000 cars a year, give or take, and that's just a single average sized assembly plant. When the Tesla plant was NUMMI, it made a similar number of cars. It would be great for them if they could get that plant running to the level that it was 20 years ago when it was owned by GM and Toyota. Then, in order to compete on a world scale, they only have to build like twenty more factories the same size.
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Nov 2, 2017 06:34
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Also lol at the idea that cars in 1920 didn't have to be safe or functional or deal with bureaucracy, and that this somehow made Ford's job easier. Obviously the cars were less complicated; they also obviously had to work and to deal with the regulations of their time. The factory also assembled those 800 cars per day with First World War era machinery that predated electronics. Everything was done by hand or with elaborate mechanical systems. And Tesla, despite their best efforts, is still running into plenty of problems building their cars up to a consistent quality standard.
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Nov 2, 2017 06:40
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blugu64 posted:Yes assembling pre-manufactured parts is easier then refining everything from scratch Car makers today dont really just assemble a bunch of pre-made parts tho - there is a fuckload of processing onsite. Sure some speciailty parts are from third parties but you still have a lot of raw materials go in that need to be processed. Maybe there's no blast furnace onsite anymore but in all honestly processing the iron and coking coal or aluminium is actually fairly simple compared to what the car maker does with it next. Plus car makers do cast their own blocks and other components still from raw ingots - Tesla dont have ICE to cast so they are more of the lines of get a fuckload of coils and smash them into shapes to weld - that secondry processing is way more complex than the blast furnace part. Plus you really cant compare a 1920's car process to today at all - a car plant was basically a foundry as that's what cars basically all they required. Cars today you just cant tip molten iron into a sand cast or into a open huge fuckoff forge and bolt the results together... and much of the time too the bits that didnt come out of 100 ton press were third party supplied. quote:Plus you say that as if there aren't already a dozen+ factories already capable of out producing teslas goal already, and that's just in the US/setting aside the elonflation of that 300k number. Most of them are actually owned or controlled / have exlusive agreements by other car makers. quote:The factory also assembled those 800 cars per day with First World War era machinery that predated electronics. With an enormous amount of human staff that cant be done these days (I seriously doubt Tesla would pay for 10 times the humans to employ) , on a much simpler to operate prodution line, in what was basically a foundry with an area to bolt together what came out of the foundry, to a product that... well... didnt exactly work all that well and needed a godawful amount of maintenace and adjustments as soon as it left the production line. You realyl cant compare the two eras at all. CAT INTERCEPTOR fucked around with this message at 06:48 on Nov 2, 2017 |
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Nov 2, 2017 06:41
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ilkhan posted:I don't have a specific ETA, but the estimator is showing first production: 12/17-2/18 Std bat: "early 2018" AWD: 8/2018/10/2018
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Nov 2, 2017 06:52
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xa0PAg7FfMk Speaking of old Ford assembly lines.... this might be of interest.
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Nov 2, 2017 11:53
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Meanwhile in the Tesla factory https://imgur.com/gallery/BSiLz
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Nov 2, 2017 12:17
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CAT INTERCEPTOR posted:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xa0PAg7FfMk Holy loving poo poo that headbolt/intakebolt/everythingbolt drill press. I got the shivers imagining the poor bastard(s) that had to change the tools on that.  If there was ever a video that deserved Powerhouse for its soundtrack, this is it. Edit: Holy gently caress that slick-back truck pulling the lunch wagons at 13:55. I WANT IT. MrYenko fucked around with this message at 13:52 on Nov 2, 2017 |
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Nov 2, 2017 13:47
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Anubis posted:For the record, my 3's original Oct-Jan expected date has been pushed to Dec-Feb Yup, same. Which really sucks, because I wanted the tax credit in 2017.
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Nov 2, 2017 14:22
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Not looking good for Tesla.
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Nov 2, 2017 15:18
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The Bolt had its highest selling month in October again. https://insideevs.com/monthly-plug-in-sales-scorecard/
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Nov 2, 2017 15:40
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ClassH posted:The Bolt had its highest selling month in October again. Wow, what happened to the model S and X sales in September?
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Nov 2, 2017 15:53
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Anta posted:Wow, what happened to the model S and X sales in September? Might be due to CA tax credit being put on hold for a couple months. Or maybe it's model 3 cannibalizing s/x sales.
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Nov 2, 2017 15:55
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Anta posted:Wow, what happened to the model S and X sales in September? Do you mean October? Tesla generally prioritizes international sales in the first month of a quarter, so US sales will look anemic. (Take a look at the 1Q numbers for a good example of this.) Expect an increase in sales numbers in November and an even bigger one in December.
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Nov 2, 2017 16:16
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Gamesguy posted:Might be due to CA tax credit being put on hold for a couple months. The Osborne Effect
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Nov 2, 2017 16:30
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Anta posted:Wow, what happened to the model S and X sales in September?
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Nov 2, 2017 17:40
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Agronox posted:Do you mean October? Nah, I mean September, It's more than double the average monthly sales. Agronox posted:Tesla generally prioritizes international sales in the first month of a quarter, so US sales will look anemic. (Take a look at the 1Q numbers for a good example of this.) ilkhan posted:End of quarter push. One of these or both make sense. You can actually see a three-month pattern in the 2016 numbers. March, June, September, and December have way higher sales than the other months, and the month immediately after has very low sales. Anta fucked around with this message at 18:45 on Nov 2, 2017 |
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Nov 2, 2017 18:43
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Tesla doesn't really do incentives, but they play around with MSRP and models when they want to push sales numbers.
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Nov 2, 2017 20:05
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ilkhan posted:BEVs are all lease for the foreseeable future. Too much depreciation and too much quick improvement to purchase. Not always, at least for me. My Leaf ended up costing around $5k (with $5k worth of hail damage to the metal, all plastics/glass repaired for free) and it's got an 8 year/100k mi battery capacity warranty. Sure, the Leaf will be a loving joke compared to the EVs from 2024 or whatever, but even a battery-degraded Leaf will get me around town and the TCO is superb Plus you can probably crack the pack at the end and part out the cells for a few grand
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Nov 2, 2017 20:59
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Could be bad timing for Tesla if they don't get more model 3s out the door. http://thehill.com/policy/energy-environment/358446-gop-tax-bill-ends-electric-vehicle-tax-credit-overhauls-other
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Nov 2, 2017 23:22
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While I think they will pull through, it isn't entirely unrealistic that Tesla becomes a sort of EV Duesenberg. The biggest name for a while, then poof gone, decades later enthusiasts can talk about how ahead of its time it was.
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Nov 2, 2017 23:41
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Ol' Musky is now laying the seeds for when he eventually claims that he totally had level-4 autopilot working, for real, but he just can't show you because the government won't let him.
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Nov 3, 2017 02:36
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Ola posted:While I think they will pull through, it isn't entirely unrealistic that Tesla becomes a sort of EV Duesenberg. The biggest name for a while, then poof gone, decades later enthusiasts can talk about how ahead of its time it was. The poof gone was called the great depression.
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Nov 3, 2017 03:49
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Ola posted:While I think they will pull through, it isn't entirely unrealistic that Tesla becomes a sort of EV Duesenberg. The biggest name for a while, then poof gone, decades later enthusiasts can talk about how ahead of its time it was.
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Nov 3, 2017 04:19
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 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S92YHx4Vqe0
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Nov 3, 2017 21:24
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Sagebrush posted:Ol' Musky is now laying the seeds for when he eventually claims that he totally had level-4 autopilot working, for real, but he just can't show you because the government won't let him. Except they've already released video of a Model S and a Model X driving themselves. Tesla just can't make that available to consumers until the government sets up rules allowing people to fully release control of a vehicle to a computer. The issue there is that that would surely involve their hardware having to measure up to some government standards for reliability, and there's no guarantee that what they're putting in their cars now will meet said standard (it's kind of hard to design something to comply with rules that haven't been written yet). I've heard that the computer is designed to be easily upgraded, but things could get ugly if their sensors are declared inadequate.
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Nov 4, 2017 14:52
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Cockmaster posted:Except they've already released video of a Model S and a Model X driving themselves. It can easily drive itself from A to B today, if you just set requireDriverKeepHandsOnWheel = false. It makes for a good video, if you give it 6 or 7 attempts in a well mapped environment, but it doesn't make a fully fledged L4 autonomous car.
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Nov 4, 2017 15:08
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Doug DeMuro got his hands on a Model 3 to review: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=te6VqldjTT8 More details in his written article.
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Nov 6, 2017 19:35
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A surprisingly good overview of the car, a lot of the misgivings I had about the giant ipad stapled to the dash don't seem as bad now. I especially like how the two physical scroll wheels are context sensitive, unfortunately switching context still requires eyes off the road. I'm still in the  camp of touchscreens don't belong in cars but that's looking like more of a personal preference now.What would be neat is the ability to reconfigure the buttons yourself, for instance if I always want the left wheel to scroll for volume and the left/right to be track select, but the right wheel scrolls for climate control temp and left/right press would be fan speed. Between that and the stalks that'd be 90% of the daily interaction with my car right there, if I need to screw with anything else I can wait for a light or just set it before I leave.
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Nov 6, 2017 19:55
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Hah, I'd forgotten that it has no key at all and requires a smartphone app to unlock. I mean, sure, literally everyone buying a model 3 will have a smartphone, but that's still some  UX
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Nov 6, 2017 20:49
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The Tesla story in a nutshell.
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Nov 6, 2017 21:47
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Sagebrush posted:Hah, I'd forgotten that it has no key at all and requires a smartphone app to unlock.
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Nov 6, 2017 21:52
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El Grillo posted:It has a key card doesn't it? Yes, it has a RFID keycard.. There is a reader on the driver side B pillar to unlock the car, and a reader just behind the cup holders in the center console to "start" the car with.
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Nov 6, 2017 22:46
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Which is handy if you ever drive outside of cellphone range and get out of the car, shutting the door behind you.
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Nov 6, 2017 23:56
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It's bt based, not cell signal based.
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Nov 7, 2017 03:12
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In 10 years: "Help guys, my car won't start" "Have you tried restarting your phone?"
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Nov 7, 2017 05:22
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Powershift posted:In 10 years: Hope you don't drop it/have a lithium battery balloon up (like my last two).
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Nov 7, 2017 16:37
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I'm not endorsing phone-as-main-key as a good thing, but I'll chime in to say that I've been unable to find my car keys more often than I've lost my phone or run out of charge on my phone.
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Nov 7, 2017 17:12
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It's actually RFID card as main key, phone as optional key. I would keep my RFID card in my phone wallet, so I could lose both at the same time for that ultra modern panic experience.
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Nov 7, 2017 18:12
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Someone got locked out of their tesla out in the desert though, did it change between the x and the 3?
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Nov 7, 2017 18:39
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hifi posted:Someone got locked out of their tesla out in the desert though, did it change between the x and the 3? The S and X use a different system for phone-keyless start. Using it requires connectivity to the Tesla "mothership". The phone app tells the mothership to start the car, the mothership then sends a command to the car via its own cellular connection telling it to start. There is no direct communication between phone and car. It is not meant to be a primary method of using the car. In the desert case, the driver left their fob at home, and then drove out to an area where the car and his phone both had no service. Thus when he went to go start the car again, he couldn't. The 3 is different from what I have been able to ascertain.. You "pair" your phone to the car, and the car recognizes your phone via Bluetooth Low Energy, not requiring any internet connectivity. I would imagine/hope the phone and car do some sort of cryptographic exchange to authenticate...
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Nov 8, 2017 06:23
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