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That was a cool LP and I've learned more about obscure Mario mechanics than I ever expected to. Thanks!
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Nov 7, 2017 20:05
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Thanks for showing off that hack, it was a wild ride. Don't feel bad about your low opinion of the last level, though. Even if you'd been more awake, it was just bad. I appreciate you ending the video in time with the music instead of just cutting off that last note.
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Nov 7, 2017 20:08
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Rabbi Raccoon posted:So I don't claim to know anything about the inner workings of Super Mario World, but that last Koopa in the Ice gauntlet was walking after you knocked his wings off, right? Couldn't you have just walked instead of worrying about timing the jump? That was a 1F0 tile, which is solid to enemies (and has some odd physics) but Mario falls through. It's shown up in other levels as well, for example the second level in https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KpcRBGIesNQ uses it a lot, those little sparkles that enemies are standing on (12:55 for example). The mistake you made is one reason it's frowned upon unless you can clearly convey its ephemeral quality.
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Nov 7, 2017 20:12
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Bruceski posted:That was a 1F0 tile, which is solid to enemies (and has some odd physics) but Mario falls through. It's shown up in other levels as well, for example the second level in https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KpcRBGIesNQ uses it a lot, those little sparkles that enemies are standing on (12:55 for example). The mistake you made is one reason it's frowned upon unless you can clearly convey its ephemeral quality. Because the spot he was walking on lined up exactly with one of the background clouds, I didn't realise it *wasn't* a platform until they started talking about 1F0; I would have jumped right in there and died.
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Nov 7, 2017 20:16
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That ice sub level was utter trash. I'm amazed you guys didn't at least start dropping savestates at the entrance to the level, to save the ~30 seconds of retreading from the checkpoint. Thanks for the LP, guys! It was interesting and there were some really great levels. Pity about the ones that weren't great.
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Nov 7, 2017 20:17
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Good LP of a sometimes-good-too-often-bad contest. Thanks for putting in the sleepless nights!
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Nov 7, 2017 20:18
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FishOnAPiano posted:Because the spot he was walking on lined up exactly with one of the background clouds, I didn't realise it *wasn't* a platform until they started talking about 1F0; I would have jumped right in there and died. Agreed. I went back and forth on it, since they made the tile have a thicker line as well. It made the cloud stand out too much from the background.
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Nov 7, 2017 20:19
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I've started to learn Lunar Magic almost entirely inspired by this LP and it really is quite accessible and fun to use! If anyone has even a slight interest in romhacking after this I certainly recommend giving it a try because the tools are so easy to use even for someone who has no coding knowledge whatsoever like me! Make a level and see how it goes, and use the LP as a very good and thorough guide for what to do and what not to do!
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Nov 7, 2017 20:28
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So, I assume the video title was a toss-up between the one we got and 'I hate video games'? Jokes aside, thanks a lot for making it through all of this. For me it certainly provided some valuable insights into game design in general. Although I'm really curious now: What are your personal favourite SMW romhacks? I mean, you've been talking about bad hacks a lot, but there have to be some good ones... right?
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Nov 7, 2017 21:34
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Now it's time for MaGLX2!
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Nov 7, 2017 22:18
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Staff Invasion...really felt like an afterthought. I appreciated that the sub-levels were short, saved their own progress, and had a few cool ideas, but it's a bit of a slog and the ones that were bad were fairly jarring. The Kaizo-themed ice sub-level also felt very out of place, and its placement at the end of one of the worst-designed 'hub worlds' I've seen recently was...unfortunate. I mean, every time you go there, you have to enter a door, go through a powerup grinding filter, pass through a pipe, and then run in serial fashion through a series of pipes and unfortunately-placed platforms with each world getting an entire screen to yourself. That's not a hub, that's just several seconds of annoyance everytime you want to enter a world, multiplied by the number of times you die (which is likely to happen at least a couple of times in the sketchy ice world near the end of the line). It's a relatively minor complaint, I suppose, but that 'hub' was designed in an almost-intentionally bad way and I find it frustrating. Reducing the vertical traversal busywork of the platforms and stairs, laying the pipes out in an actual hub-and-spike fashion, placing them closer together, reducing the complexity and time-sink of the powerup grinder (or removing it entirely because WHO CARES), really ANY kind of design tweak once-over could have made that less irksome.
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Nov 7, 2017 23:31
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Inco posted:Then they didn't do a good enough job of informing the player of that. Players would read "You have two mushrooms to use for all of these levels" and a reasonable takeaway is that they would keep the mushroom they used until they lost it, and have a second. This leads to the player using the mushrooms up unwisely because the mechanics weren't properly explained, and either restarting the level entirely or doing the parts over and over until they get it right. i understood what it said, it seemed pretty clear? it's lovely but its not confusing. the real crime is that they use the same song for an hour
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Nov 7, 2017 23:35
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staff invasion would've been improved immensely by just splitting it into nine levels
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Nov 7, 2017 23:36
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FPzero posted:
Thanks for doing it, it was a fun watch. I don't play SMW romhacks myself but I'm playing through the original right now and I find myself doing a lot of the ~pro moves~ you did in this run so that part stuck with me.
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Nov 7, 2017 23:38
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corn in the bible posted:i understood what it said, it seemed pretty clear? When a thing says 2 mushrooms for all, I imagine that most people generally think that means 2 mushrooms for all. Not 2 mushrooms for the first one you do.
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Nov 8, 2017 01:11
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Wow, that snow section was really bad. Beach/Resort also seemed kinda iffy, but nowhere near the quasi-Kaiso difficulty of Snow/Ice. Overall, this level was okay, if a bit long. It would have been so much better if it didn't have issues with powerups and if the filter wasn't there (though Snow/Ice was straight up bad). Thanks for doing this LP! It's been really interesting to hear you guys talk about level design while playing through this contest. It's been a really fun watch.
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Nov 8, 2017 01:17
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More like "Staff Infection"  Something you didn't point out about the Ice subsection: it looks like you can't complete it unless you're small. So if you used a mushroom on it, well, gently caress you. That was quite a bit above quasi-Kaizo in my mind.
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Nov 8, 2017 01:24
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Prav posted:staff invasion would've been improved immensely by just splitting it into nine levels Or even a "Mega Man refight" hub setup (aka ONE drat SCREEN).
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Nov 8, 2017 02:58
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Prav posted:staff invasion would've been improved immensely by just splitting it into nine levels That would defeat the purpose of the "Void". But I agree, the Void is stupid.
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Nov 8, 2017 03:00
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Bellmaker posted:Or even a Mega Man style refight setup (aka ONE drat SCREEN). Not possible under vanilla. Pipes are given destinations per screen according to the commentary. It seems to me like mos tof the levels were inoffensive except for that ice level, just that it was the wrong time to be presented with them. Like they probably shouldn't have even attempted to the mushroom gimmick. None of them would even be that much easier with a fire flower.
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Nov 8, 2017 03:01
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Cheez posted:I feel as if that section with the "greyscale" water isn't intended, because I've never seen it like that and I'm aware that there's multiple versions of the rom because one doesn't play nice with certain emulators. I've never seen the glitchy lines, either. The way I remember it, it was orange-ish water like before, but each screen was "clearer" than the previous one. Im using the recommended emulator for the rom, so idk what would be causing it.
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Nov 8, 2017 03:43
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Prav posted:staff invasion would've been improved immensely by just splitting it into nine levels Dragonatrix posted:When a thing says 2 mushrooms for all, I imagine that most people generally think that means 2 mushrooms for all. Not 2 mushrooms for the first one you do. Heavy Sigh posted:Im using the recommended emulator for the rom, so idk what would be causing it.
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Nov 8, 2017 04:51
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Cheez posted:I may be wrong on this but I think the whole deal is that this is possible in vanilla? Doesn't really change how the execution feels, but maybe it's supposed to be really interesting on that level instead of on playing it. The sticking point is that the level takes away the mushrooms after each segment, which is in no way suggested by the wording. You don't get the mushrooms for "all" segments, you get the mushrooms for "up to 2" segments. The warning to use them wisely could very naturally be interpreted as "don't gently caress it up and lose them because you're not getting them back", not "we're going to take them away even if you're careful enough to keep them, so don't use them until you're 100% sure you need them."
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Nov 8, 2017 04:56
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Straight White Shark posted:The sticking point is that the level takes away the mushrooms after each segment, which is in no way suggested by the wording. You don't get the mushrooms for "all" segments, you get the mushrooms for "up to 2" segments.
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Nov 8, 2017 04:59
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I dunno man, when you eat a sandwich to stop being hungry today are you just as hungry tomorrow as if you never ate? No? Well that's a stupid analogy then.
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Nov 8, 2017 05:04
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Cheez posted:If someone told you that you only have two sandwiches to eat for all of the days you're locked in the basement, do you have two sandwiches every day or two sandwiches period? Are you being willfully dense?
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Nov 8, 2017 05:05
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Dabir posted:I dunno man, when you eat a sandwich to stop being hungry today are you just as hungry tomorrow as if you never ate? No? Well that's a stupid analogy then.
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Nov 8, 2017 05:08
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Let's not turn it into an argument again, please. The main takeaway is that judging by the number of people interpreting it in different ways, the text might have been a little better worded. Or hell, don't put such a thing in place to begin with. I'm not even sure how it was achieved in vanilla either. My guess is that it's using some object memory manipulations that are beyond my knowledge but somehow still doable in Lunar Magic.
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Nov 8, 2017 05:10
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Cheez posted:If someone told you that you only have two sandwiches to eat for all of the days you're locked in the basement, do you have two sandwiches every day or two sandwiches period? Jesus christ you're a dense motherfucker. Nobody (or at least hardly anybody) is talking about getting the mushrooms back ever; the level is quite clear on that point. The complaint is that the level forces you through a buzzsaw after each segment, so you even if you never get hit during a segment you don't get to keep the mushroom for all the levels. Someone who quite reasonably interprets the message as saying "you have 2 mushrooms and only 2 mushrooms to get through this entire gauntlet" is likely to screw themselves out of one or both mushrooms. I guess in your analogy this would be someone deciding to ration themselves part of a sandwich and save the rest of it for future days, only to have someone come in and take the half eaten sandwich away at dawn the next day. Because when they said "you only have two sandwiches to eat for all of the days" they really meant "you only have two days in which you get to eat sandwiches out of all of the days", even though that's a really tortured interpretation of the basic instruction "you only have two sandwiches to eat for all of the days."
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Nov 8, 2017 05:12
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Cheez posted:It works grammatically, which is the point but I guess it's just gently caress the English language. Everything needs to be overly wordy just for you because you're just going to assume things that aren't being said. Not my problem. If your choice of words doesn't convey what you need to convey to the people you need to convey it to, you need to choose different words. I don't see how this is controversial to you.
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Nov 8, 2017 05:13
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FPzero posted:Let's not turn it into an argument again, please. Please heed the words of the OP folks, or the punishment button is going to see some action tonight. Thanks.
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Nov 8, 2017 05:17
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Can't believe VLDC is over. It's been a fun LP. So uh, what do we still have alive left in the thread? VLDC's kind of the only thing I've been paying attention to in the thread.
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Nov 8, 2017 05:18
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Cheez posted:It works grammatically, which is the point but I guess it's just gently caress the English language. Everything needs to be overly wordy just for you because you're just going to assume things that aren't being said. Not my problem. Hi. Effective communication requires minimizing ambiguity for the audience you're communicating to. Numerous people ITT have said that their interpretation does not align with what the person who wrote the text at issue intended for the interpretation to be. Consequently, that person failed to communicate effectively. You don't need to be overly verbose. "There are two mushrooms. Use them wisely." Solved.
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Nov 8, 2017 05:19
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Mysticblade posted:Can't believe VLDC is over. It's been a fun LP. Rockman 4 Minus Infinity is still going, and uh...
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Nov 8, 2017 06:21
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Eight friggin' months of VLDC. FP, does that mean that you're going to finish up the Metroid Prime soon-to-not-be-a-trilogy? Or is that going to be a secret?
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Nov 8, 2017 07:27
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People who play games are not good at designing games.
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Nov 8, 2017 07:53
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magikid posted:People who play games are not good at designing games. Some are, enthusiasm and tunnel vision can just get the best of you. Heck, look at various difficulty hacks like Long War for that, they do some incredible modding and balancing, it just tends to be around a very specific playstyle that others may find obscure or unfun.
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Nov 8, 2017 08:33
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AweStriker posted:Rockman 4 Minus Infinity is still going, and uh... The FF6 randomizer run is still going!
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Nov 8, 2017 13:39
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Congrats on finishing VLDC9.  Thanks for doing this. It's been great following the videos and I've had lots of fun even though I'm not super interested in the Mario franchise otherwise. I admit I'm glad I had the ability to skip through some of the tedious levels, though.
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Nov 8, 2017 14:38
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Does this mean you're gonna finish up the Prime trilogy, FP?
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Nov 8, 2017 15:24
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