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Chuck_D
Aug 25, 2003
Cool. I would kill for a mix of this and the bomber squadron/aircraft/crew management that was originally envisaged for B-17 The Mighty Eighth. As a history geek, I'm not terribly keen on the more ahistorical bits of the game, but completely understand them from a game play and sales standpoint. Give me gritty realism as I'm trying to keep an entire bomb squadron (or bomb group for that matter) flying and I'm in heaven.

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HerpicleOmnicron5
May 31, 2013

How did this smug dummkopf ever make general?


Gewehr 43 posted:

Cool. I would kill for a mix of this and the bomber squadron/aircraft/crew management that was originally envisaged for B-17 The Mighty Eighth. As a history geek, I'm not terribly keen on the more ahistorical bits of the game, but completely understand them from a game play and sales standpoint. Give me gritty realism as I'm trying to keep an entire bomb squadron (or bomb group for that matter) flying and I'm in heaven.

Played Battle of Britain 2 as the Luftwaffe?

gradenko_2000
Oct 5, 2010

HELL SERPENT
Lipstick Apathy
They introduced a slow-mo button?!

I should get back into it.

nessin
Feb 7, 2010
I can get past most of the realism issues with Bomber Crew and for the most part the hectic nature doesn't bother me too much. What always kills me everytime I try to play it:

1) I want to be part of a bomber wing. Flying solo just feels so wrong.

2) High altitude and everything associated with it being locked away due to intel requirements for gear and skill requirements for navigation. I don't want to play several dozen missions just so I can give myself the feel of how flying the plane should be.

3) Sorta mixed on this one, but the pacing is just all over the place. Having missions be relatively short is great, but it sucks that the actual meat of the missions is over in 3 minutes or less for most missions. Unless everything is going wrong and you're about to die anyways, there isn't much tension in the game it's all just a few quick snap judgements. Once you have a few skills unlocked, notably manual navigation, you can mix up the game a bit and start balancing avoiding radar/danger areas versus your fuel supply. However even then, at least up to the point I've been able to reach, it's only rarely that a mission will throw roadblocks that are meaningful between you and destination, rather than at the destination itself. Just having a few extra fighters to deal with without the chaos of everything else over the bombing target is just pointless and tedious in most cases.

Taintrunner
Apr 10, 2017

by Jeffrey of YOSPOS
I jumped back into finishing the tutorials for Cold Waters, and man, I’m really coming around to liking that game a lot.

Vahakyla
May 3, 2013
Bomber Crew should have formation flight. Just fly in a bunch to Dresden and try to make it back with the formation.


Also common escorts most of the time.

Hekk
Oct 12, 2012

'smeper fi

TOAW IV release date is November 16th. Other than the obtuse stars remaining after each action shenanigans, I really enjoyed TOAW III. I might have to give this new version a go.

gradenko_2000
Oct 5, 2010

HELL SERPENT
Lipstick Apathy

Nostalgia4Ass posted:

TOAW IV release date is November 16th. Other than the obtuse stars remaining after each action shenanigans, I really enjoyed TOAW III. I might have to give this new version a go.

stop making me want this I do not have 50 bux

Chuck_D
Aug 25, 2003

HerpicleOmnicron5 posted:

Played Battle of Britain 2 as the Luftwaffe?

No, I didn't. I had it at one point many years ago, but it didn't grab me in my younger, more impatient years.

AARP LARPer
Feb 19, 2005

THE DARK SIDE OF SCIENCE BREEDS A WEAPON OF WAR

Buglord

Nostalgia4Ass posted:

TOAW IV release date is November 16th.

Great news. Getting this for sure.

Dimitris
Apr 11, 2017

by Fluffdaddy
Command LIVE #7 released: Black Gold Blitz!


skooma512
Feb 8, 2012

You couldn't grok my race car, but you dug the roadside blur.
Is Pike and Shot Campaigns any good? It’s on what’s become of Bundlestars now for 8 bucks.

Bloody Pom
Jun 5, 2011



Taintrunner posted:

I jumped back into finishing the tutorials for Cold Waters, and man, I’m really coming around to liking that game a lot.

I'm still too intimidated to start playing it, I've mostly been experiencing the game vicariously through Jive Turkey's streams.

I think worrying about torpedo evasion is the big thing scaring me off. The automatic controls they added are really nice but as soon as I have to drive the thing by hand everything goes to hell.

AceRimmer
Mar 18, 2009
Speaking of subs, is 688(I) Hunter/Killer worth the learning curve? It's been sitting in my Steam list for ages, ever since I got it in a bundle with Fleet Command.

HerpicleOmnicron5
May 31, 2013

How did this smug dummkopf ever make general?


May as well just play Dangerous Waters.

ZombieLenin
Sep 6, 2009

"Democracy for the insignificant minority, democracy for the rich--that is the democracy of capitalist society." VI Lenin


[/quote]

Bloody Pom posted:

I'm still too intimidated to start playing it, I've mostly been experiencing the game vicariously through Jive Turkey's streams.

I think worrying about torpedo evasion is the big thing scaring me off. The automatic controls they added are really nice but as soon as I have to drive the thing by hand everything goes to hell.

It’s really, really quite easy. It’s easier than the Red Storm Rising was way back when. I wasn’t joking earlier—for some reason American/NATO submarines, weapons, sensors, and counter measures are modeled to be easily 3x more capable than their Soviet counterparts.

It actually, for me, makes playing the 1984 campaign on realistic kind of stale and I’ve switched to the 1968 campaign, which is still kind of easy, but much more challenging.

I will start another 1984 campaign next on the game’s highest difficulty, which I haven’t tried yet.

TL;DR version—if you have any experience with grog games generally or naval sims, you really don’t need to be intimidated by the game.

Q_res
Oct 29, 2005

We're fucking built for this shit!
I'm definitely no super gamer, and I've been playing Cold Waters 84 campaign on the hardest difficulty setting. In terms of Torpedo Evasion, I genuinely don't sweat it except in shallow waters. The Land Strike and SEAL insertion missions are still nail biters, but for the most part there's not much challenge in the game.

leekster
Jun 20, 2013
What makes TOAW special and why should I be excited for a sequel? I've never heard of it before and I'm curious.

DogonCrook
Apr 24, 2016

I think my 20 years as hurricane chaser might be a little relevant ive been through more hurricanws than moat shiitty newscasters

ZombieLenin posted:

It’s really, really quite easy. It’s easier than the Red Storm Rising was way back when. I wasn’t joking earlier—for some reason American/NATO submarines, weapons, sensors, and counter measures are modeled to be easily 3x more capable than their Soviet counterparts.

It actually, for me, makes playing the 1984 campaign on realistic kind of stale and I’ve switched to the 1968 campaign, which is still kind of easy, but much more challenging.

I will start another 1984 campaign next on the game’s highest difficulty, which I haven’t tried yet.

TL;DR version—if you have any experience with grog games generally or naval sims, you really don’t need to be intimidated by the game.

Ironically the highest setting is the easiest. Youll see lol.

I think nuetral shipping will make a big difference because you have to loiter more to confirm targets. But even then you could just ping and shoot back at everything that shoots at you while you evade.

Bloody Pom
Jun 5, 2011



Don't know if it's confirmation bias or not, but I've heard that on the highest difficulty in CW enemy vessels will auto-detect incoming torpedoes within 1KYD, even if they're on passive and right in their baffles.

Q_res
Oct 29, 2005

We're fucking built for this shit!

DogonCrook posted:

Ironically the highest setting is the easiest. Youll see lol.

How so?

Also, I think it'd really help if the AI could be remotely effective at torpedo evasion. I had an encounter the other day with an Alfa. Took my time, identified it on sonar and launched a torpedo his way. By the time it got close enough for the game to actually render the 3D model for the Alfa, he was on the surface cavitating like crazy.

DogonCrook
Apr 24, 2016

I think my 20 years as hurricane chaser might be a little relevant ive been through more hurricanws than moat shiitty newscasters

Q_res posted:

How so?

Also, I think it'd really help if the AI could be remotely effective at torpedo evasion. I had an encounter the other day with an Alfa. Took my time, identified it on sonar and launched a torpedo his way. By the time it got close enough for the game to actually render the 3D model for the Alfa, he was on the surface cavitating like crazy.

They have a chance of getting lucky when they actively ping. On higher difficulties they try and be smart and only ping in bursts or not at all.

In the above they may be able to automatically know where you are at higher difficulty but it doesnt matter. You can actually make it all go quicker if you fire one off as soon as the scenario loads and redirect it to whichever idiot lights up and tries to hunt you exposing themselves. At the end of the day, at range you are completely invulnerable and the flipside is they have no hope of dodging one.

DogonCrook
Apr 24, 2016

I think my 20 years as hurricane chaser might be a little relevant ive been through more hurricanws than moat shiitty newscasters
I guess the issue is the hardware gap is so huge any sort of tactics are out the window the fastes easiest resolution is to just shoot everyone the second you detect them and dodge anything that comes your way. They either evade or try and counter you but you get a 100% resolution on them while all they have on you is torpedo position which is also now loud as hell and they have to boogie so they cant hear poo poo. The only option is for them to ping and that might as well be a homing beacon.

E: also if you are far off they dont always even detect the torpedo launches or the torpedeo itself till its active but that may have been fixed its been awhile.

DogonCrook fucked around with this message at 03:06 on Nov 8, 2017

gradenko_2000
Oct 5, 2010

HELL SERPENT
Lipstick Apathy

leekster posted:

What makes TOAW special and why should I be excited for a sequel? I've never heard of it before and I'm curious.

TOAW is "important" because it's a game engine that can be used to dynamically model any operational-level wargame scenario from the 20th century. It's also one of the few wargames to correctly model the temporal cost of battles and how that relates to the breakthrough-exploitation phases of modern combat.

The sequel is going to be good because it's looking to eliminate some of the most fiddly micromanagement aspects of the rules and interface.

V for Vegas
Sep 1, 2004

THUNDERDOME LOSER
Hoping TOAW is $30 in line with some of Matrix's more recent pricing but fear it's going to be more like $80.

skooma512
Feb 8, 2012

You couldn't grok my race car, but you dug the roadside blur.

AceRimmer posted:

Speaking of subs, is 688(I) Hunter/Killer worth the learning curve? It's been sitting in my Steam list for ages, ever since I got it in a bundle with Fleet Command.

It runs really good for a Windows 98 game.

As for the learning curve, I was able to play it decently when I was 8 years old. It's cool and good.

Taintrunner
Apr 10, 2017

by Jeffrey of YOSPOS
Tried the 60s campaign for Cold Waters on my first go and almost immediately got my rear end handed to me by a trio of submarines. Oops.

Stairmaster
Jun 8, 2012

Are there any surface combat scenarios in command where you use nukes? Bonus points if it has that regulus armed Iowa.

Popete
Oct 6, 2009

This will make sure you don't suggest to the KDz
That he should grow greens instead of crushing on MCs

Grimey Drawer

Taintrunner posted:

Tried the 60s campaign for Cold Waters on my first go and almost immediately got my rear end handed to me by a trio of submarines. Oops.

The later scenario is much easier, the Los Angeles is basically like playing with cheats.

Drone
Aug 22, 2003

Incredible machine
:smug:


skooma512 posted:

Is Pike and Shot Campaigns any good? It’s on what’s become of Bundlestars now for 8 bucks.

Would be interested in hearing about this too. I go back and forth on screenshots of whether or not I think it'd be decent.

AceRimmer
Mar 18, 2009

gradenko_2000 posted:

It's also one of the few wargames to correctly model the temporal cost of battles and how that relates to the breakthrough-exploitation phases of modern combat.

The sequel is going to be good because it's looking to eliminate some of the most fiddly micromanagement aspects of the rules and interface.
This seems like at least one pretty big change for the actual mechanics too.

Matrix forums posted:

Fairly soon we will explain it properly in detail, but the gist of it is that we are utilising the turn phases and time stamps to remove a classical exploit: normally, what you'd do in a turn-based game to encircle and eliminate a defending unit is to encircle it while it stands inactive, then attack it with your yet unmoved unit standing next to it. Prevented from retreat, the defender would be eliminated, and your attacking unit is still fresh as not having yet moved, ready to advance deep into enemy territory. Right?

Well, that's not exactly realistic, is it? What we have done is that if your encircling units took X time within a turn to get to a position to block retreat, then if they DO block retreat of the defending unit, then the combat will take at least X time as well. This simulates the fact that even if they are just passive participants in the combat they are participating (by virtue of blocking routes of retreat), and thus the combat that ensues cannot start before the blocking units arrive in their position to participate in the ensuing. :)

I hope that makes at least some sense. As I mentioned, once the guys are less busy, we will make a post explaining it better than I could.

Dimitris
Apr 11, 2017

by Fluffdaddy
Limited one-week sale on Fanatical (ex-Bundle Stars)!


Drone
Aug 22, 2003

Incredible machine
:smug:


Looks like there's a buuunch of grog stuff on sale at Fanatical: https://www.fanatical.com/en/latest-deals

Highlights are CMANO for 25, ATG for 10, Pike & Shot for 10 (though I don't know anything about the game I assume that's a great price).

gradenko_2000
Oct 5, 2010

HELL SERPENT
Lipstick Apathy

AceRimmer posted:

This seems like at least one pretty big change for the actual mechanics too.

That sounds a great (from a fidelity/realism) change.

Drone posted:

Looks like there's a buuunch of grog stuff on sale at Fanatical: https://www.fanatical.com/en/latest-deals

Highlights are CMANO for 25, ATG for 10, Pike & Shot for 10 (though I don't know anything about the game I assume that's a great price).

AGEOD games also there on cheap. Revolution Under Siege seems like a really appropriate game for 2017.

Bloody Pom
Jun 5, 2011



Stairmaster posted:

Are there any surface combat scenarios in command where you use nukes? Bonus points if it has that regulus armed Iowa.

Northern Inferno is incredibly nuke-happy, being a Cold War gone hot scenario. It even has nuclear torpedoes that are just as likely to blow you up as they are the target.

ZombieLenin
Sep 6, 2009

"Democracy for the insignificant minority, democracy for the rich--that is the democracy of capitalist society." VI Lenin


[/quote]

Popete posted:

The later scenario is much easier, the Los Angeles is basically like playing with cheats.

I think Narwhal is actually the easiest. Given how Soviet sensors are modeled, you are virtually undetectable unless on the surface, cavitating, or someone is right next to you pinging you with active sonar.

The draw back being you only have two torpedo wires—you only need 2—combined with a 25 knot top speed.

And since Seawolf is being added, if the Los Angeles class is cheat mode, Seawolf will be god mode. Seawolf has 8 loving torpedo tubes with wiress, a 33 knot top speed, advanced anti-cavitation screws, super sound absorption skin, and she’s probably 1.5x quieter than the Narwhal.

If they added the defunct Sealance (canceled at the end of the Soviet Union) missile this would be even better. You could take your Seawolf and her advanced sensor platform, stay hidden, and drop missile delivered anti-submarine torpedos from 40 miles away.

dtkozl
Dec 17, 2001

ultima ratio regum

skooma512 posted:

Is Pike and Shot Campaigns any good? It’s on what’s become of Bundlestars now for 8 bucks.

if you use it for multi it is great, the old string of scenarios single player is mediocre, and the new dynamic campaign is the most busted excuse for anything i've ever seen. buy it for the former, avoid for the latter.

xthetenth
Dec 30, 2012

Mario wasn't sure if this Jeb guy was a good influence on Yoshi.

How's the variety of lasers in CMANO, and are there anyways to add bigger lasers to ships/land? Some people are asking about 1+ MW lasers, and I'd love to know if it could be done.

Marshal Prolapse
Jun 23, 2012

by Jeffrey of YOSPOS

dtkozl posted:

if you use it for multi it is great, the old string of scenarios single player is mediocre, and the new dynamic campaign is the most busted excuse for anything i've ever seen. buy it for the former, avoid for the latter.

What if I just desperate want an Age of Rifles like game...also why the hell has no one remade that?

God it covered so many neat small conflicts that way Steel Panthers II did with proxy cold war battles.

Marshal Prolapse fucked around with this message at 18:54 on Nov 8, 2017

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Popete
Oct 6, 2009

This will make sure you don't suggest to the KDz
That he should grow greens instead of crushing on MCs

Grimey Drawer
I kinda hope the makers of Cold Waters do a WW2 Battle for the Atlantic game next.

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