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Mr. Bill posted:Also, courier no longer has to be upgraded. Just babysat sometimes.
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Nov 16, 2017 01:44
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lol at accusing someone of ad hominems in the Dota 2 thread
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Nov 16, 2017 04:07
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what happened to tcjimbo
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Nov 16, 2017 06:03
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He realized everyone in lljk hated him and left dota forever.
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Nov 16, 2017 06:17
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Last i heard, he hosed off to HOTS or some poo poo.
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Nov 16, 2017 06:53
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Brinner posted:what happened to tcjimbo he's real salty about dota and went 2 hots
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Nov 16, 2017 07:06
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IncendiaC posted:Not all that much in the grand scheme of things. Off the top of my head, the following have been simplified or removed: What about spawning runes all over the map instead of just the 1 rune you have to fight for? Or spell scaling that blurs the distinction between spell and physical damage. Or tenacity. Or giving offlaners and supports tons of gold which means they no longer have to make do with very little gold and xp (I actually enjoyed that aspect of the game a lot! It took effort to play position 5 and still carry the game for your team through good support). Honestly you could go on and on but it's like asking what made HoN inferior to Dota back in the day. They were extremely different games, with HoN picking up a lot of design cues from APEM and focusing on being a hero brawler that's more about action than strategy. Now excuse me while I get hit by Kunkka's ult 12 times in a row.
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Nov 16, 2017 08:37
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dota 2 literally got me a job thank you
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Nov 16, 2017 08:40
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Elman posted:What about spawning runes all over the map instead of just the 1 rune you have to fight for? Or spell scaling that blurs the distinction between spell and physical damage. Or tenacity. Or giving offlaners and supports tons of gold which means they no longer have to make do with very little gold and xp (I actually enjoyed that aspect of the game a lot! It took effort to play position 5 and still carry the game for your team through good support). Mana management is less punishing too between Shrine, Mangos (free ones lol), raindrops, medallion, soul ring, urn, aquilla. Item management is easier with backpack. Everyone is stronger at laning with several base HP increases (Base HP increase, Str gain increase, Str giving more HP). Comeback Gold + Exp punishing even minor mistakes in the ahead/stomping team. Easier to build items, lots more mid tier items and lower priced high tier items. Deso going from like 4.5k gold to 3.5k gold, Skadi going from like 7k gold to 5.4k, even Rapier lost a Demon Edge in its price. Then there's a bunch of QoL increases which no one really should complain about but does simplify things like tower range/aggro/spawnboxes/castranges/ward range.
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Nov 16, 2017 08:52
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Y'all say simplify interchangeably here with "actually considered" because a few of the things you mentioned here besides economy changes sound more like dota1 bugs imported as features in dota2 for the sake of keeping the original audience. I started playing 4 years ago and I assure you was not as consistent mechanically as it is nowadays. It seems a bit contradictory for the veterans in this thread to both desire the value of having good mechanics for a mid lane and hate the fact that consistent mechanics actually allow teams to recover from bad early games. Its hard to say reduction of damage types is a bad change in any way when the original concept was extremely poorly executed.
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Nov 16, 2017 09:01
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heres a really big change that destroyed the competitive viablity of a hero: dazzle not being allowed to buy 5 couriers and clear a 6 stack of ancients with them in 30 seconds at level 7
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Nov 16, 2017 09:41
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Brinner posted:what happened to tcjimbo He played pubg for a bit as well.
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Nov 16, 2017 10:46
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Elman posted:Or giving offlaners and supports tons of gold which means they no longer have to make do with very little gold and xp (I actually enjoyed that aspect of the game a lot! It took effort to play position 5 and still carry the game for your team through good support). this is the big one. everyone is rich through no effort of their own every game now, and they all have some wacky busted talent every 5 levels. it's like one of those custom games you play for like two rounds and uninstall
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Nov 16, 2017 16:46
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I've gone from like around 4k to 2k in like a year I have no idea how to play Dota anymore haha
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Nov 16, 2017 18:25
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clockwerk 25 talent that makes battery assault go fast is the best thing in the game
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Nov 16, 2017 22:15
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is it stunlock fast?
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Nov 16, 2017 23:38
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It pings fast enough that if you catch antimage in cogs (and he doesn’t have manta up) it’ll cancel his blink permanently. Pretty much any spell with a cast animation is hosed.
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Nov 16, 2017 23:46
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Cuntellectual posted:I think what hurts dota the most is how little valve cares, or seems to care, about it. They don't communicate at all. It's always struck me as odd how little visibility Dota seems to get despite being their only active title under development. It's not like I want Steam to be plastered with ads for Dota 24/7, but if they were looking to boost player numbers they could probably leverage their mega-hit platform a little better
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Nov 16, 2017 23:51
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Fuligin posted:their only active title under development  Valve has never spent a huge amount on advertising or coverage. They rely on Steam and reputation. it's been a sore point with some people for a while but I doubt running ads is gonna help. Anyone interested in mobas knows what dota is and what to expect. idk why we need huge player numbers
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Nov 17, 2017 01:16
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Brinner posted:idk why we need huge player numbers
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Nov 17, 2017 01:24
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Brinner posted:
Maybe I'm being an idiot right now but I'm not actually sure why you're thunking at me. There's the Dota card game I guess, but all the leaks and departures over the past few years suggest that most of Valve's not-Dota, not-Steam activities have come to a halt or been cancelled. Credit where credit is due, they've been dedicated to growing the pro scene and continuing to support the game, but their secretive, head-up-their-own-rear end, "it's-done-when-it's-done" posture towards community relations is and always has been poo poo.
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Nov 17, 2017 01:31
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Fuligin posted:Maybe I'm being an idiot right now but I'm not actually sure why you're thunking at me. There's the Dota card game I guess, but all the leaks and departures over the past few years suggest that most of Valve's not-Dota, not-Steam activities have come to a halt or been cancelled. they're making HL3, L4D3, and Artifact plus some other game.
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Nov 17, 2017 01:36
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Well? The crowd funded prize pool and viewers has grown every year despite a smaller player base. Dota has always been an inherently difficult game to get into and no amount of tutorials, advertisements are going to help. it requires a huge investment of time and is infinitely more complicated than other mobas around. Icefrog is doing his best to make changes to accommodate new players without losing the essence of what dota is. queef anxiety fucked around with this message at 01:50 on Nov 17, 2017 |
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Nov 17, 2017 01:38
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Fuligin posted:Maybe I'm being an idiot right now but I'm not actually sure why you're thunking at me. There's the Dota card game I guess, but all the leaks and departures over the past few years suggest that most of Valve's not-Dota, not-Steam activities have come to a halt or been cancelled. Valve have stated multiple SP games in the works as well as Artifact. Plus active updates and development of CS:GO, TF2 etc. Sure, i'm not a fan of where Valve has been heading either but saying its the only active game in development is pretty far fetched.
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Nov 17, 2017 01:43
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TF2 just got a major update too, somehow
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Nov 17, 2017 01:44
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Glory to Italia!
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Incoherence posted:You basically pay for the courier upgrade up-front: it's 200g this patch instead of a total of 220? last patch, but you pay for it at the start of the game instead of paying half at the start of the game and the other half at 3 minutes (most of which was probably passive gold).
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Nov 17, 2017 01:52
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Kild posted:they're making HL3, L4D3, and Artifact plus some other game.
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Nov 17, 2017 01:52
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Fuligin posted:Maybe I'm being an idiot right now but I'm not actually sure why you're thunking at me. There's the Dota card game I guess, but all the leaks and departures over the past few years suggest that most of Valve's not-Dota, not-Steam activities have come to a halt or been cancelled. Apparently a lot of valve employees drank the VR koolaid and spend their time on that...except they've never released a VR game aside from that tech demo 2 years ago. Valve also lost their main writers and the half life guy which is a pretty big hit, especially since the writing in their older games was fantastic. fake edit: plus there was an ex-valve artist who recently posted a bunch of concept art for what was supposed to be a new IP SP fantasy game, but it got scrapped. IIRC a lot of that stuff got rolled into dota lore and probably artifact.
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Nov 17, 2017 01:54
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jBrereton posted:Dota 3. https://dota2.gamepedia.com/media/dota2.gamepedia.com/8/89/Dlc_stanleyparable_announcer_welcome_16.mp3
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Nov 17, 2017 01:59
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Kild posted:they're making HL3, L4D3, and Artifact plus some other game. Brinner posted:Valve have stated multiple SP games in the works as well as Artifact. Plus active updates and development of CS:GO, TF2 etc. Sure, i'm not a fan of where Valve has been heading either but saying its the only active game in development is pretty far fetched. Ahh, so I was being kind of an idiot, which is what I get for posting without coffee. I'd completely forgotten about CS and TF2, although my understanding is that both have a fairly low tempo of updates. TF2 has been running on fumes and community content for years, no? I'm still super skeptical about any new IPs tho, much less a new Half-Life. Laidlaw's blog post doesn't seem like the kind of thing you write about a franchise still in active development.
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Nov 17, 2017 02:03
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Fuligin posted:Ahh, so I was being kind of an idiot, which is what I get for posting without coffee. I'd completely forgotten about CS and TF2, although my understanding is that both have a fairly low tempo of updates. TF2 has been running on fumes and community content for years, no? I'm still super skeptical about any new IPs tho, much less a new Half-Life. Laidlaw's blog post doesn't seem like the kind of thing you write about a franchise still in active development. Well its still speculation but they have stated they're working on 4 games and some videos they've released of tech demos and poo poo show L4D3 and HL3 folders.
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Nov 17, 2017 02:04
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Fuligin posted:Ahh, so I was being kind of an idiot, which is what I get for posting without coffee. I'd completely forgotten about CS and TF2, although my understanding is that both have a fairly low tempo of updates. TF2 has been running on fumes and community content for years, no? I'm still super skeptical about any new IPs tho, much less a new Half-Life. Laidlaw's blog post doesn't seem like the kind of thing you write about a franchise still in active development. TF2 just got a huge 4 day update and CS:GO gets regular updates for the pro and casual scene. I don't play a lot anymore so they could be garbage though. Still a high player base. HL has been dead in the water for years and I think most of the SP games mentioned are all VR.
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Nov 17, 2017 02:06
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jBrereton posted:Yeah it's probably among the more irritating changes in 7.07 because now a lot of support players are just straight up refusing to buy the full allotment of support poo poo at the start of the game unless one of their favourite heroes is a Mango Champ Du Jour.
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Nov 17, 2017 02:07
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Incoherence posted:I mean, if I can help it, I'd rather walk to lane with more than tangos and 2 branches or clarities, especially because rune fights are more common now. Nerfing supports in the early game was needed to be honest and the strip down of the side shop has balanced it out for cores too. It helps the offlane and punishes early roaming to mid as you're not getting brown boots stick sub 2 mins.
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Nov 17, 2017 02:14
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Brinner posted:Nerfing supports in the early game was needed to be honest and the strip down of the side shop has balanced it out for cores too. It helps the offlane and punishes early roaming to mid as you're not getting brown boots stick sub 2 mins. - PMS no longer exists - Creep XP is more evenly spread, and creeps provide about 50gpm more - You almost inevitably have to buy part of the support kit in pubs because yer pos 5 is a moron so you lose a healing item
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Nov 17, 2017 02:26
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jBrereton posted:It really does not help most offlaners that: It' almost like if you remove something from the game you need to make changes elsewhere to balance it out . hence the change to supps. offlane is the hard lane again and its good. pull camp favours your side and equilibrium is much easier to keep in your favour. hopefully they will never balance the game around 'my supp only bought cour' removing PMS was the best thing thats happened to dota in a long time.
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Nov 17, 2017 03:00
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The offlane is loving MISERABLE now if you get the guy that doesn't read patch notes or anything and you get the 5th pick jungle legion or whatever. Good luck doing anything against their Antimage/Pudge/Warlock trilane or whatever they come up with, that dewards you before creeps meet and then you're just completely shut out with nowhere else to go.
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Nov 17, 2017 03:18
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TOOT BOOT posted:The offlane is loving MISERABLE now if you get the guy that doesn't read patch notes or anything and you get the 5th pick jungle legion or whatever. Good luck doing anything against their Antimage/Pudge/Warlock trilane or whatever they come up with, that dewards you before creeps meet and then you're just completely shut out with nowhere else to go. That's why the more durable offlanes are becoming popular again. Centaur has the highest win rate in 7.07b right now with omni/abba not far behind. You can't get away with putting any hero with a PMS and some sort of zoning potential in the offlane and expect it to do well. If they are trilaning your safe lane then you know their offlane *should* be suffering just as much. e: if you're playing with 5th pick LC jungle or 5 pos that doesn't support then the enemy sure as hell don't know how to pull camps through and play a decent trilane queef anxiety fucked around with this message at 03:32 on Nov 17, 2017 |
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Nov 17, 2017 03:29
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Pick offlaners that can jungle or roam. Then walk around to different lanes, set up kills, and then to back to the tower to get xp once it’s pushed. Easy!
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Nov 17, 2017 03:30
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Brinner posted:That's why the more durable offlanes are becoming popular again. Centaur has the highest win rate in 7.07b right now with omni/abba not far behind. You can't get away with putting any hero with a PMS and some sort of zoning potential in the offlane and expect it to do well. If they are trilaning your safe lane then you know their offlane *should* be suffering just as much. It kind of sucks because it limits your offlane options to like 5 heroes in the current patch. Anything that doesn't withstand a tactical nuclear strike is way too greedy for the offlane now. I like a lot of the other changes but offlane/safelane dynamic sucks now. It's really annoying when enemy supports sit their asses down on your lane and still compete with you in levels because of the 2 free bounty runes and so on. And then after they've zoned you for 2 minutes, the enemy carry runs at you with phase boots and extra 2 levels, and then the lane is loving done
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Nov 18, 2017 00:05
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