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RyokoTK
Feb 12, 2012

I am cool.
I can confirm the Xbox 1 S controller is very good.

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SCheeseman
Apr 23, 2003

I used one of those with a hacked up cable on my PC for a good 5 years or so. It's still one of my favourite controllers.

EDIT: Oh you're talking about the OTHER Xbox 1 S controller.

Ularg
Mar 2, 2010

Just tell me I'm exotic.

DXH posted:

Yeah all of my friends who have PS4s or use DS4s for most of their gaming complain endlessly about the quality of those controllers. In regards to the 360 controllers, your mileage may vary, as I still use the one I bought 8 years ago as part of a kit with the USB dongle for PC and it still works fine even if the left stick drifts a little and the dpad does wonky things (which was frustrating in Dark Souls). I bought another one a year and a half ago and it crapped out with deadzones after 4 months.

I hear great things about the new Xbox One S controller (the one that uses Bluetooth) and it's supposedly the new standard for PC controllers so try picking one up on Cyber Monday if you can, a friend of mine just got his and he says it's a world of difference in twitchy games like Rocket League.

Thanks. if it wasn't for actually having and playing a ton of games on my PS4 I would have swapped back to Xbox controllers years ago. Like I said I JUST spent what was basically my black friday/cyber monday budget on a brand new DS4 that turned out to be borked too.

fishmech
Jul 16, 2006

by VideoGames
Salad Prong

DXH posted:

Yeah all of my friends who have PS4s or use DS4s for most of their gaming complain endlessly about the quality of those controllers. In regards to the 360 controllers, your mileage may vary, as I still use the one I bought 8 years ago as part of a kit with the USB dongle for PC and it still works fine even if the left stick drifts a little and the dpad does wonky things (which was frustrating in Dark Souls). I bought another one a year and a half ago and it crapped out with deadzones after 4 months.

I hear great things about the new Xbox One S controller (the one that uses Bluetooth) and it's supposedly the new standard for PC controllers so try picking one up on Cyber Monday if you can, a friend of mine just got his and he says it's a world of difference in twitchy games like Rocket League.

Yeah, the Xbox One controller is the 360 controller but fixes the bad d-pad and some reliability issues. Then the ones made since about 2015 add a normal headset jack and support for Bluetooth pairing.

Most importantly, you never need weird third party software to make them work, since they're the official Microsoft Windows standard controller, succeeding the 360 ones.

Guillermus
Dec 28, 2009



Xbox One controllers have somehow weird Ximput issues with some emulators and some old games. Other than that, they're the best you can get for PC gaming. I like the DS4 but xbone controllers are still my favourite.

MariusLecter
Sep 5, 2009

NI MUERTE NI MIEDO

Gobblecoque posted:

The bundle inspired me to replay the Turok series yet again. I did Dinosaur Hunter on hard and for the most part was a very fun challenge but the fact that enemies don't drop anything ever means ammo gets crazy scarce at times, especially later on. You almost never get a chance to use energy weapons because their ammo comes almost exclusively from drops. It's probably a pipe dream but I think an "ultraviolence" type difficulty setting where you have normal ammo drops but greater quantities of enemies would probably be real fun.

Turok and Turok II but as Black Mesa like remakes?

Lemon-Lime
Aug 6, 2009
The only problem I've had with my XB1S controller is that sometimes it randomly starts disconnecting every minute or so, and then the problem goes away after five minutes. This seems to occur when it's on low (but not empty) batteries but since you can't check the battery level at all, I have no way of confirming this.

Otherwise it's got phenomenal build quality and is really comfortable to use.

e; you can also fully remap it via the Xbox Accessories app, which is really nice.

Lemon-Lime fucked around with this message at 22:18 on Nov 25, 2017

Rocket Pan
Nov 3, 2011

Anything can be sent, as long as it's less than 1200 bytes

Lemon-Lime posted:

The only problem I've had with my XB1S controller is that sometimes it randomly starts disconnecting every minute or so, and then the problem goes away after five minutes. This seems to occur when it's on low (but not empty) batteries but since you can't check the battery level at all, I have no way of confirming this.

Otherwise it's got phenomenal build quality and is really comfortable to use.

e; you can also fully remap it via the Xbox Accessories app, which is really nice.

Funny you mention the Xbox Accessories app, because that is also where you can check the battery level. But yes, if the battery is low enough it can keep shutting itself off. That's fairly normal, and can actually be affected by types of batteries used as well, where lower quality batteries will have a more erratic voltage at a lower charge. You can see this in some smartphones where they don't shutoff when charging, but their power draw is higher than what they can charge, and can start doing weird things like suddenly lose the modem altogether until rebooted.
Worth noting that you can also connect it through USB and just use it that way if you don't like worrying about batteries. Unlike the 360 controllers it can also be used entirely through USB as well, not needing the wireless receiver.

Guillermus
Dec 28, 2009



I always use my gamepads wired on PC and on my ps4 (DS4 V2 that act wired), but on my 360 I use eneloops that last like forever.

Lemon-Lime
Aug 6, 2009

Rocket Pan posted:

because that is also where you can check the battery level.

Nope! Battery level won't show if it's not plugged in, and if it's plugged in the battery level only shows as "plugged in."

(I assume the battery level would show if I were using the wireless adaptor instead of Bluetooth, but that would negate the point of the XB1S controller.)

Casimir Radon
Aug 2, 2008


I bought Crysis from Gog in the Thanksgiving sale. I have it on Steam from years ago, never finished it. What really gets me is the horribly compressed intro they stuck on it. You're trying to show what a technical marvel your game is so the first thing people see is some poo poo that looks like it came off the original XBOX?

Instruction Manuel
May 15, 2007

Yes, it is what it looks like!

Casimir Radon posted:

I bought Crysis from Gog in the Thanksgiving sale. I have it on Steam from years ago, never finished it. What really gets me is the horribly compressed intro they stuck on it. You're trying to show what a technical marvel your game is so the first thing people see is some poo poo that looks like it came off the original XBOX?

Shoot, some of today's games still have shoddily compressed video next to their AAA graphics.

Cream-of-Plenty
Apr 21, 2010

"The world is a hellish place, and bad writing is destroying the quality of our suffering."
All of this controller talk is weird because I've owned and used three DS4 controllers on two laptops and a desktop (via DS4Windows) for the past several years and haven't had any issues with any of them. :iiam: I've actually been more unsatisfied with 360 controllers (like their mushy-rear end D-Pads and comparatively annoying triggers).

Rocket Pan
Nov 3, 2011

Anything can be sent, as long as it's less than 1200 bytes

Lemon-Lime posted:

Nope! Battery level won't show if it's not plugged in, and if it's plugged in the battery level only shows as "plugged in."

(I assume the battery level would show if I were using the wireless adaptor instead of Bluetooth, but that would negate the point of the XB1S controller.)

Bluetooth was the critical aspect here. Yes, it needs the wireless adapter. It can't work over wired either because it's obviously not using the battery then.

ETPC
Jul 10, 2008

Wheel with it.
Hey, does anyone know if the steam versions of Doom 3/ROE or Quake 4 got any further bug fixes then the final retail releases? Should I buy them if I already own retail copies?

The Kins
Oct 2, 2004

ETPC posted:

Hey, does anyone know if the steam versions of Doom 3/ROE or Quake 4 got any further bug fixes then the final retail releases? Should I buy them if I already own retail copies?
I don't have them installed on-hand at this exact moment, but I'm pretty sure they're just the final retail patches with a Steam DRM wrapper thrown on. No need to double-dip.

Rocket Pan
Nov 3, 2011

Anything can be sent, as long as it's less than 1200 bytes
Actually odd note about Quake4 on Steam, it was patched to add native widescreen options in the menus. Unless I'm going mad, I sure I remember that being added as a patch one day, and it was never in a retail build (it supported it but not as menu options).
As an anecdote, both Doom3/ROE and Quake4 also support cloud saves. It caught me by surprise as my Doom3 save collection was huge, so when they added it my PC at the time spent a good half hour uploading saves.

A3th3r
Jul 27, 2013

success is a dream & achievements are the cream

ETPC posted:

Hey, does anyone know if the steam versions of Doom 3/ROE or Quake 4 got any further bug fixes then the final retail releases? Should I buy them if I already own retail copies?

I guess the retail & the steam versions of Quake 4 are basically the same thing, so, no

The Kins
Oct 2, 2004
If you remember Final Doomer, the mod by the DRLA folks that added alternate player classes inspired by the TNT and Plutonia episodes, a "Plus" version is out now that adds three more classes based on Ancient Aliens, Back to Saturn X and the Japanese Community Project.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ej9jWaRsfAY

c0burn
Sep 2, 2003

The KKKing
https://twitter.com/DickWhitehouse/status/934978069130911746

site
Apr 6, 2007

Trans pride, Worldwide
Bitch
I know this is a longshot but my desktop is dead so I've been trying to do some gaming on my hella old Macbook and I was wondering if anyone's ever run across a ZDL type doom launcher for os x

A3th3r
Jul 27, 2013

success is a dream & achievements are the cream
to contribute some original content to this thread, I can confirm that UT2004 is an excellent fairly old FPS that definitely makes me nostalgic to play. It is available for PC's on STEAM. I think that at this point the original Call of Duty 4 would probably be thought of as a classic as well, & is well worth purchasing on STEAM. Don't know if Metro 2033 counts as an "early FPS" or not but it is excellent

chocolateTHUNDER
Jul 19, 2008

GIVE ME ALL YOUR FREE AGENTS

ALL OF THEM
Something I never realized until watching a random youtube video a few days ago, was that Digital Extremes did most of the work on UT2k3 apparently. Epic was busy with the Unreal Engine, and Unreal 2. Did Epic take back the reigns from DE for UT2k4? Or was DE still the main studio on that as well?

Rupert Buttermilk
Apr 15, 2007

🚣RowboatMan: ❄️Freezing time🕰️ is an old P.I. 🥧trick...

I never played UT2K3, but I've heard, time and time again, about how horrible it was. What was the big problem? How could there be such a dip in quality from UT99 - UT2K4?

I played the poo poo out of 99, but I'd choose 2K4 over it any day. Whatever was lost I didn't miss, and I absolutely love everything that was added. :colbert:

Ularg
Mar 2, 2010

Just tell me I'm exotic.
I have a ton of fond memories of UT2k4 but going back to it isn't as special as before. I just don't like the weapons as much.

Mordja
Apr 26, 2014

Hell Gem

Ularg posted:

I have a ton of fond memories of UT2k4 but going back to it isn't as special as before. I just don't like the weapons as much.

You can fix that by installing the Ballistic Weapons mod, some of the most satisfying guns put into a game.

dis astranagant
Dec 14, 2006

Rupert Buttermilk posted:

I never played UT2K3, but I've heard, time and time again, about how horrible it was. What was the big problem? How could there be such a dip in quality from UT99 - UT2K4?

I played the poo poo out of 99, but I'd choose 2K4 over it any day. Whatever was lost I didn't miss, and I absolutely love everything that was added. :colbert:

I wouldn't really say UT2k3 is horrible but the good parts are mostly indistinguishable from 2k4.

chocolateTHUNDER
Jul 19, 2008

GIVE ME ALL YOUR FREE AGENTS

ALL OF THEM

Rupert Buttermilk posted:

I never played UT2K3, but I've heard, time and time again, about how horrible it was. What was the big problem? How could there be such a dip in quality from UT99 - UT2K4?

I played the poo poo out of 99, but I'd choose 2K4 over it any day. Whatever was lost I didn't miss, and I absolutely love everything that was added. :colbert:

Ut2k3 was a good game at it's core, but launched with a serious lack of maps, and didn't have Assault mode which was hugely popular in UT99 online play. Also, the system requirements were seriously beefy back in the day; like "I need to build a new PC to play this game" stuff.

Ut2k3 got a few official map-packs like UT99 did that took care of the maps problem, and by the time UT2k4 came out the system requirements weren't as big of a deal.

Glagha
Oct 13, 2008

AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA
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AaaAaaAAAaaaaaAA

Yeah I was under the impression it was because UT2k3 was just fine but had issues and 2k4 came out very soon after and was just better and why would you play 2k3

chocolateTHUNDER
Jul 19, 2008

GIVE ME ALL YOUR FREE AGENTS

ALL OF THEM

Glagha posted:

Yeah I was under the impression it was because UT2k3 was just fine but had issues and 2k4 came out very soon after and was just better and why would you play 2k3

Yeah, pretty much. IIRC 2k4 came out barely 12 months after 2k3 and contained so much more content.

E: Also I remember Onslaught mode being hailed as the second coming of christ with people on multiple forums everywhere talking about how good it was.

Sir Lemming
Jan 27, 2009

It's a piece of JUNK!
UT2K3 did a lot of stupid things like getting rid of the sniper rifle entirely for the sake of the much-less-cool Lightning Gun, focusing too much on outdoor maps (before there were any vehicles), not having enough maps in general, and getting rid of Assault mode. UT2K4 took everything good from 2K3 -- literally -- and just added a lot that was missing.

UT2K3 is Windows 8, UT2K4 is Windows 10.

Diabetes Forecast
Aug 13, 2008

Droopy Only

chocolateTHUNDER posted:

Something I never realized until watching a random youtube video a few days ago, was that Digital Extremes did most of the work on UT2k3 apparently. Epic was busy with the Unreal Engine, and Unreal 2. Did Epic take back the reigns from DE for UT2k4? Or was DE still the main studio on that as well?

It's actually very different than that. Epic were working on a game design called 'Unreal Warfare' internally that was about objective based combat and (if I remember right) was going to be geared around team combat with AI. They ended up not liking the direction of the project, but had so many assets from it and new stuff like working vehicles, that they hodgepodged it together with 2k3's content to make UT2k4. Onslaught and Assault was the big gamemodes that UW was meant to be a combined vision of, so when UT3 came out they built the intended combined system gamemode, Warfare (which frankly nobody liked because it often would pull you away from doing the fun capture point fun) The rest of the project's ideas became Gears of War.

There's videos about it on youtube SOMEWHERE, and you can see one of the maps from the UW project was put into 2k4 almost totally unmodified.

E: here's some footage of it from 2002
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gfGNClgwk8M

Diabetes Forecast fucked around with this message at 19:16 on Nov 28, 2017

Social Animal
Nov 1, 2005

I remember the only thing I liked in UT2k3 was the rag doll physics so I still played mostly UT. When UT2k4 came out with the same engine but with assault mode it blew me away.

Invasion mode was fun too but I think that came as a patch later on. Man I sunk so many hours in my senior year of high school with UT2k4.

Speaking of which why was UT3 considered bad? I only got to play it after it died out and I remember just playing the campaign a bit.

Sir Lemming
Jan 27, 2009

It's a piece of JUNK!

Social Animal posted:

Speaking of which why was UT3 considered bad? I only got to play it after it died out and I remember just playing the campaign a bit.

I'm the official thread authority on why UT3 was (kind of) bad, so here goes: mostly for aesthetic reasons. Which sounds shallow, but it does make a difference in how fun a game is. UT3's maps and models were so over-detailed in that grimy-shiny Gears Of War style that it was literally impossible to adequately display team colors on the characters, so they just put a colored glow around them instead. Which is just one example of the problem. It was actually pretty fun, but it was just aggressively ugly to the point of being legitimately distracting.

Shadow Hog
Feb 23, 2014

Avatar by Jon Davies
Bit of a segue, but it was recently noted in HG101's Discord that games don't really do colored projectiles as much as they loved to in the late '90s/early 2000s - starting right around the same "real is brown" fad that led to Unreal Tournament 3 looking as drab as it did.

I suppose I hadn't really missed it that much, but it's still kind of a shame. Not gonna have too many firefights lit up like a dance floor like you would with, say, Forsaken here.

JLaw
Feb 10, 2008

- harmless -

Sir Lemming posted:

I'm the official thread authority on why UT3 was (kind of) bad, so here goes: mostly for aesthetic reasons. Which sounds shallow, but it does make a difference in how fun a game is. UT3's maps and models were so over-detailed in that grimy-shiny Gears Of War style that it was literally impossible to adequately display team colors on the characters, so they just put a colored glow around them instead. Which is just one example of the problem. It was actually pretty fun, but it was just aggressively ugly to the point of being legitimately distracting.

Yeah. IIRC the initial release was also stingy on configurable options. Later releases had better menus that allowed dialling back the graphical effects among other things.

Also the gamefeel got chunkier/weightier, more like Quake 3, which put off some longtime UTers. Plus the loss of some game modes as mentioned above.

I had some fun games with it long after release, where we were using the final "UT3 Black" release that had the additional menu options and various bundled-up content.

ZogrimAteMyHamster
Dec 8, 2015

I don't know why but I keep using this thing when I want to test any sort of weapon/monster mod for Doom. It's a terrible idea and shouldn't be done because the placement of monsters and weapons in these maps is invariably - and predictably - utter poo poo.

Speaking of maps, I recently converted an ancient long-time pet project of mine from ZDoom-Hexen format to UDMF because holy poo poo I'm using too many 3D effects & other poo poo and it hosed up a bunch of linedef triggers/actions/properties meaning I have to sift through nearly 60 goddamn maps and fix it all manually.

haveblue
Aug 15, 2005



Toilet Rascal
Readability is a really important part of game art design. A good studio will spend a lot of effort on making sure that things have unique silhouettes, are instantly identifiable against a range of backgrounds, and can't have these things compromised by customization options.

fishmech
Jul 16, 2006

by VideoGames
Salad Prong

ZogrimAteMyHamster posted:

I don't know why but I keep using this thing when I want to test any sort of weapon/monster mod for Doom. It's a terrible idea and shouldn't be done because the placement of monsters and weapons in these maps is invariably - and predictably - utter poo poo.

Speaking of maps, I recently converted an ancient long-time pet project of mine from ZDoom-Hexen format to UDMF because holy poo poo I'm using too many 3D effects & other poo poo and it hosed up a bunch of linedef triggers/actions/properties meaning I have to sift through nearly 60 goddamn maps and fix it all manually.

You should be using Oblige instead of Slige for now. The placement of everything is much better.

Oblige is of course formally done for now as far as updates, but something else should be along shortly. The main author just wasn't interested in continuing development anymore, so someone will probably fork the project:
http://oblige.sourceforge.net/

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ZogrimAteMyHamster
Dec 8, 2015

haveblue posted:

Readability is a really important part of game art design. A good studio will spend a lot of effort on making sure that things have unique silhouettes, are instantly identifiable against a range of backgrounds, and can't have these things compromised by customization options.





Unless it's id Software circa 1994 :v:

fishmech posted:

You should be using Oblige instead of Slige for now. The placement of everything is much better.

Oblige is of course formally done for now as far as updates, but something else should be along shortly. The main author just wasn't interested in continuing development anymore, so someone will probably fork the project:
http://oblige.sourceforge.net/

I know, and I genuinely love Oblige to bits (it's given me some of the best Survival co-op experiences over Skulltag/Zandronum), but there's a strange power Slige has over me when it comes to 'five-minute-fuckabout' testing because of just how lovely the maps are.

ZogrimAteMyHamster fucked around with this message at 23:32 on Nov 28, 2017

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