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Dec 6, 2017 00:24
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MizPiz posted:The latter is true, but the only real reason is because he's bitch made. he also made Mao work with Chiang cause he was scared of the Japanese. The leader of world communism explicitly supporting parliamentarianism abroad cause he’s scared of war seems kind of bitch made to me Had Lenin not died or had Trotsky been able to seize power I doubt they would have taken the same course that Stalin did
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Dec 6, 2017 00:34
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now i'm actually watching jason unruhe huh https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=luvDh54zP4A i mean he's basically right. he's not exactly going out on a long limb but his reasoning is interesting, which i haven't heard from anyone else i also like the maoist dolls BrutalistMcDonalds fucked around with this message at 01:12 on Dec 6, 2017 |
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Dec 6, 2017 01:06
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A Typical Goon posted:he also made Mao work with Chiang cause he was scared of the Japanese. The united front against the Japanese was sensible, though.
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Dec 6, 2017 03:51
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Pener Kropoopkin posted:The united front against the Japanese was sensible, though. And it probably bought the communists time when they were initially on the ropes
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Dec 6, 2017 05:42
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GalacticAcid posted:Worth noting that Kotkin does read and admire Marxist historians, as made clear in his review of "Interesting Times". A Typical Goon posted:Kotkin never came off as anti-communist while I was reading the first edition until the very end in the summery chapter, and even then he came across as more anti-collectivization than anti-communist. He’s very objective and not at all judgemental during the first book. I’d guess he’s a socialist based on his descriptions of the Mensheviks and Left SRs but he really keeps his personal politics out of biography. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ot4OPfWZubM&t=3865s
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Dec 6, 2017 06:36
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Plutonis posted:Budionny and Voroshilov were complete retards on the Civil War and were complete retards on WW2 Don't forget Grigori "PPSh just makes soldiers waste bullets and the T-34 will never replace cavalry" Kulik
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Dec 6, 2017 06:43
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https://twitter.com/nucleartakes/status/938199755670376453
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Dec 6, 2017 07:25
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man i'm deep in this unruhe hole uhh hrm i didn't know that south korean troops shot defectors, which he claimed. well, i looked it up and he's right. they shot (and killed) one trying to cross into north korea in 2013.
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Dec 6, 2017 07:46
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South Korea has been more or less a de jure and/or de facto military dictatorship for a large portion of its history, it was just the US-aligned anti-communist one so it is The Good One
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Dec 6, 2017 08:09
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A Typical Goon posted:he also made Mao work with Chiang cause he was scared of the Japanese. are you an expert in things that have never happened?
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Dec 6, 2017 09:23
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https://twitter.com/turing_police/status/938145170247237632
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Dec 6, 2017 13:26
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But on the other hand, who cares what Victims of Communism has to say about it? If you dunk on Dems from the left you get MAGA CHUDs cheering you on so whatever.
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Dec 6, 2017 15:08
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yeah i don't take bad faith bullshit from victims of communism seriously. the left needs to be able to criticize itself. and mugabe is baaaaarely "the left". also that article is fine if you actually read it
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Dec 6, 2017 15:16
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if there’s one thing I don’t get about Tankies it’s the claim to care about social justice while simultaneously supporting some of the worst dictators the world has to offer Iraq war broke a lot of people’s brains
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Dec 6, 2017 15:27
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anti imperialism is a land of contrasts
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Dec 6, 2017 15:29
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A Typical Goon posted:if there’s one thing I don’t get about Tankies it’s the claim to care about social justice while simultaneously supporting some of the worst dictators the world has to offer invading foreign countries and getting millions killed isn't very socially just
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Dec 6, 2017 15:32
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Pener Kropoopkin posted:invading foreign countries and getting millions killed isn't very socially just depends which flag you use
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Dec 6, 2017 15:34
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Pener Kropoopkin posted:invading foreign countries and getting millions killed isn't very socially just ‘not being as damaging as America’ is such a low bar to clear that it’s embarrassing that anyone that actually identifies as a leftist uses it as a legitimate argument
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Dec 6, 2017 15:40
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A Typical Goon posted:‘not being as damaging as America’ is such a low bar to clear that it’s embarrassing that anyone that actually identifies as a leftist uses it as a legitimate argument I don't think you really get the nature of the problem.
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Dec 6, 2017 15:46
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I don't fake sympathy with my enemies because I'm not a cuck
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Dec 6, 2017 15:49
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I kind of don't like the framing of 'self-crit' because the 'self' here is signifying an previous investment of something that has to be counter acted, which is both not necessarily true, and also not setting yourself up to examine it properly and with honesty. Rather, articles like Sunkara than as an argument against investing in something emotionally/politically/intellectually from people who aren't already, and everyone else can just react to that, as it were. The act of self-definition should be entirely rooted in the present moment, not anchored to a past, sunken cost (which then has to be unanchored, as it were).
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Dec 6, 2017 16:18
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Or perhaps more radically: There's no point trying to grasp for an ineffable phantasm of 'pure' ideology, and then begin the task of negotiating with reality, through making trade-offs and such. That's the exact opposite direction to be taking. Rather, the present context should inform those guiding principles -- the exact timing or nature of the transcendent moment can take care of itself. So all political thought as an act of discovery, revolution as revelation.
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Dec 6, 2017 16:33
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alright zizek
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Dec 6, 2017 16:40
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A Typical Goon posted:if there’s one thing I don’t get about Tankies it’s the claim to care about social justice while simultaneously supporting some of the worst dictators the world has to offer have you considered the fact that supporting anti imperialism means you don’t cheer on US invasions of other countries? It doesn’t mean you unequivocally support the target regime. That’s just a dumb argument
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Dec 6, 2017 17:51
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IMO the only sensible position is that unless you're going to install a communist state, then regime changes should never be considered an option - and even then it's an iffy proposition since reactionary forces may be more powerful than expected and make the action ultimately not worth it in lives and sheer human misery.
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Dec 6, 2017 18:00
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I don't think anyone posting in here is cheering on US interventions
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Dec 6, 2017 18:23
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Karl Barks posted:I don't think anyone posting in here is cheering on US interventions i just don't like the neocon tactic where we start talking about the immorality of this or that regime as a reason to invade it, destroy it and loot its resources. north korea for example has 9 trillion dollars of untapped natural resources zimbabwe has gold, platinum etc so it just sounds sanctimonious that while the US babbles on about "democracy, liberty" in the back they are divvying up and counting the money they will make thats why saying that those regimes are anti-imperialist is factually correct even if they are "no angels"
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Dec 6, 2017 19:51
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You can be a victim or target of US/western imperialism while still being imperialist yourself, look at Iran. Is North Korea not doing imperialism because of ideology or lack of means?
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Dec 6, 2017 20:41
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Every country is imperialist and sides with a global hegemon, in order to advance its own interests I'm "anti-imperialist" in the sense that I oppose imperialism. The potential victims of American imperialism aren't necessarily members of some phantom valiant anti-imperialist regime simply because they don't want to be invaded. People in Kurdistan, Kuwait, and Iran certainly viewed Saddam Hussein as an imperialist before we invaded Iraq What's bizarre to me is that people who oppose U.S. imperialism and simply choose not to back a side get accused of supporting imperialism
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Dec 6, 2017 21:36
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I am an Anti-Imperialist. Down with North Korean Imperialism. Down with Iranian Imperialism. Down with Cuban Imperialism. Down with Syrian Imperialism. Down with Venezuelan Imperialism. Did I miss anything?
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Dec 7, 2017 01:29
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Odobenidae posted:I am an Anti-Imperialist. Down with North Korean Imperialism. Down with Iranian Imperialism. Down with Cuban Imperialism. Down with Syrian Imperialism. Down with Venezuelan Imperialism. Did I miss anything? you forgot Houthi imperialism
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Dec 7, 2017 01:44
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Odobenidae posted:I am an Anti-Imperialist. Down with North Korean Imperialism. Down with Iranian Imperialism. Down with Cuban Imperialism. Down with Syrian Imperialism. Down with Venezuelan Imperialism. Did I miss anything? chinese? the one that actually is going to happen/is happening
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Dec 7, 2017 01:45
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Odobenidae posted:I am an Anti-Imperialist. Down with North Korean Imperialism. Down with Iranian Imperialism. Down with Cuban Imperialism. Down with Syrian Imperialism. Down with Venezuelan Imperialism. Did I miss anything? imperialism in the marxist sense of trying to extract resources from other countries with war or otherwise
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Dec 7, 2017 02:56
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Top City Homo posted:imperialism in the marxist sense of trying to extract resources from other countries with war or otherwise but according to some posters in this thread Russia conducting a war in Syria for access to a Mediterranean port isn’t imperialism because only America can be imperialist
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Dec 7, 2017 07:14
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America is the only empire
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Dec 7, 2017 07:22
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The Syrian Civil War Of Russian Aggression (2011 - present)
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Dec 7, 2017 08:32
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Odobenidae posted:The Syrian Civil War Of Russian Aggression (2011 - present) yeah you got me. A fascist state taking advantage of a civil war to enhance their geopolitical position? Impossible!
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Dec 7, 2017 08:42
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Hmm, I wonder who was ultimately responsible for destabilizing the region, creating groups like Al Qaeda and ISIS in the first place...?
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Dec 7, 2017 09:27
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I don't think they're using the civil war to try to seize or gain a mediterranean port or whatever scenario that's being put forth because they've had one there since the 70s. The Russian forces were also literally invited into the conflict by the Syrian government after they requested their help.
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Dec 7, 2017 09:34
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