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HIJK posted:It's definitely a strange thing to argue about but I'm not stopping anyone if they really want to go at it. thanks for your input!
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Dec 18, 2017 17:14
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Skyscraper posted:thanks for your input! You are welcome friendo
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Dec 18, 2017 17:16
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WelpNeurosis posted:there is a huge degree of difference between chapters of torture porn where the author is clearly getting off on it, at one end of the spectrum, and a single line reference to something like that happening, at the other. the difference being as to what can be in a book without it becoming unreadable. no one's disputing that rape of any kind is a bad phenomenon, which seems to be what your post is getting at. All opinions aside, Behemoth is factually in the category of "chapters of torture porn", whether the author is getting off on it is not mentioned in the text. Take that into advisement as you decide whether to read it. Starfish is a dope book, it's like The Deep but hard SF and actually about being underwater.
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Dec 18, 2017 18:33
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Quality derail lads, 9/10.
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Dec 18, 2017 18:43
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Chill my dudes! I read Annihilation by Jason Vandermeer this week just gone. It was quite a short book and I got through it over a couple of nights. I found the story very unsettling, it gave me a sense of dread that I haven't got from a book in a long time, especially towards the back end of the story when the biologist revisits the tower / encounter with the creeper Ive heard that they're making a TV programme based on it, which sounds like it could be really good if they get it right. I'm going to do the 2nd one in the trilogy next I think!
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Dec 18, 2017 20:52
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most sex scenes are terribly written and embarrassing to read. when theyre written by genre writers they become unbearable. namaste
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Dec 18, 2017 22:25
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General Ledger posted:Chill my dudes! They're making a movie, actually, starring Natalie Portman and directed by the same guy as Ex Machina, and it looks pretty good even though I'm unsure about how well the book will translate to a visual medium.
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Dec 18, 2017 22:59
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hopterque posted:They're making a movie, actually, starring Natalie Portman and directed by the same guy as Ex Machina, and it looks pretty good even though I'm unsure about how well the book will translate to a visual medium. here's the trailer. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=89OP78l9oF0
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Dec 18, 2017 23:06
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hopterque posted:They're making a movie, actually, starring Natalie Portman and directed by the same guy as Ex Machina, and it looks pretty good even though I'm unsure about how well the book will translate to a visual medium. A new trailer just came out a few days ago for it. So far it's looking promising. *^^^^ beat me to it*
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Dec 18, 2017 23:07
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I'm extremely down for Natalie Portman's women scientist expeditionary monster hunter corp. I just need to decide now if I want to read the book first or watch the movie.
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Dec 19, 2017 01:47
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Not to derail anything that's going on cause it looks like there are some mighty deep discussions about the merits of rape, but I just finished a reread of Clive Barker's The Hellbound Heart and really enjoyed it, even more so then the first time around. That got me looking into Barker's other work, and Weaveworld and The Great and Secret Show both sounded pretty interesting. Anyone here read them and feel confident in recommending them? (I realize Barker is probably way old hat. I've never read anything more than The Hellbound Heart and, while I enjoyed it the first time, I didn't enjoy it enough to look into his other work.)
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Dec 19, 2017 02:28
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I've never managed to finish Weaveworld. Not that it's bad, but I always end up eyeing another book I've been dying to read and the cycle continues. I'd honestly recommend the Books of Blood over his other long-form works. Some real good poo poo in there.
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Dec 19, 2017 11:47
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USMC_Karl posted:Not to derail anything that's going on cause it looks like there are some mighty deep discussions about the merits of rape, but I just finished a reread of Clive Barker's The Hellbound Heart and really enjoyed it, even more so then the first time around. That got me looking into Barker's other work, and Weaveworld and The Great and Secret Show both sounded pretty interesting. Anyone here read them and feel confident in recommending them? I can recommend both of them. They're my favorite after his short stories. I think TGASS is the stronger of the two, but they're both solid. Drunken Baker, you should finish Weaveworld because it has an absolutely bonkers ending. As a side note, I cannot recommend the sequel to TGASS, Everville. Got some neat ideas but it never really seems to expand on the really cool mysteries and stuff. Apparently it's an attempt at a trilogy but I don't actually forsee the last book getting written. It feels pretty uneeded since the first book is suitably stand alone.
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Dec 19, 2017 15:54
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The Great & Secret Show is a pro-read, especially as Barker's first full-length foray into "not quite horror".
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Dec 19, 2017 16:16
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General Battuta posted:Welp Eliminative materialists seem convinced weird torture rape fantasies are universal for reasons that are opaque to me. Metzinger and Bakker do that poo poo too Anyway this is why panpsychism is the only viable position in the matter, peace out
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Dec 19, 2017 18:05
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Look, if you liked Hellbound Heart you can probably swallow anything Barker threw up. I'd say Weaveworld because it's at least coherent.
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Dec 19, 2017 21:52
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I can DEFINITELY say don't read Scarlet Gospels though. Christ, I sound like a broken record sometimes, but it can't be stated enough just how crap that book is. Most people tend to think it was ghost written and it ends with Pinhead fighting THE Satan in a Dragon Ball Z flying lazer fight in THE Hell. Maybe I LIKE repeating myself because I get a pleasant, tingling sensation in my gut whenever I describe that. It's like a laugh that will never actually happen.
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Dec 20, 2017 12:47
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Careful, you're making me want to read it now.
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Dec 20, 2017 16:18
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Rough Lobster posted:Careful, you're making me want to read it now. It really is worth reading just to see how badly it misses the point in a series that's easy to do right. It's the Suicide Squad of horror novels
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Dec 20, 2017 16:47
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Here is my hot take: Clive Barker has always been a lovely writer.
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Dec 20, 2017 16:52
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Ornamented Death posted:Here is my hot take: Clive Barker has always been a lovely writer.
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Dec 20, 2017 18:23
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I liked most of the Books of Blood.
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Dec 20, 2017 21:16
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anilEhilated posted:I liked most of the Books of Blood. The Books of Blood are good, Imajica is good, The Great and Secret Show is good, The Thief of Always is good, Galilee is good, Clive Barker is good. It's basically impossible to get a sense of horror in the 90s without reading him pretty extensively.
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Dec 20, 2017 21:34
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What do you think about The Damnation Game?
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Dec 20, 2017 21:43
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Just to clarify, I think the Books of Blood are important when considering the history of the horror genre, because they told types of stories that, for the most part, had never been told before. Barker was one of the first successful horror writers (if not the first) to fully incorporate sex and sexuality into his stories. What he did with Books of Blood was a watershed moment and the genre is unquestionably better for them. However, the stories themselves just aren't that good. In the long run, and in a very, very general sense, I suspect Barker will be remembered much the same as Lovecraft: both have made important contributions to the genre that are worthy of praise, but the people inspired by them are simply better writers. a foolish pianist posted:It's basically impossible to get a sense of horror in the 90s without reading him pretty extensively. This is just laughable, though. Barker wasn't even writing horror in the 90s, so no, you don't need to read him extensively to understand horror in the 90s. Ornamented Death fucked around with this message at 21:50 on Dec 20, 2017 |
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Dec 20, 2017 21:46
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Ornamented Death posted:Just to clarify, I think the Books of Blood are important when considering the history of the horror genre, because they told types of stories that, for the most part, had never been told before. Barker was one of the first successful horror writers (if not the first) to fully incorporate sex and sexuality into his stories. What he did with Books of Blood was a watershed moment and the genre is unquestionably better for them. This seems a funny thing to say given works like Carmilla. Sexuality in horror goes back a long, long way. Maybe Barker was the first to be so graphic, but I wouldn’t put money on it.
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Dec 20, 2017 21:52
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Darth Walrus posted:This seems a funny thing to say given works like Carmilla. Sexuality in horror goes back a long, long way. Maybe Barker was the first to be so graphic, but I wouldn’t put money on it. I guess I phrased that wrong. Sex and horror have always walked hand in hand, but the sex part of the equation was always hidden away in the shadows, generally only alluded to, never front and center. Barker shined a spotlight on it. Carmilla, to use your example, while not necessarily subtle about the sexuality of the title character, was still very coy with the whole thing. By comparison, In the Hills, the Cities opens with two dudes stopping in a field for a quick gently caress session.
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Dec 20, 2017 22:06
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Ornamented Death posted:I guess I phrased that wrong. Sex and horror have always walked hand in hand, but the sex part of the equation was always hidden away in the shadows, generally only alluded to, never front and center. Barker shined a spotlight on it. Carmilla, to use your example, while not necessarily subtle about the sexuality of the title character, was still very coy with the whole thing. By comparison, In the Hills, the Cities opens with two dudes stopping in a field for a quick gently caress session. I think you’re still a little way off. Cinema had been doing that sort of thing for decades before Barker, especially Italian giallo. For original English-language stuff, there’s Don’t Look Now as one of the classic examples from the Seventies.
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Dec 21, 2017 00:37
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General Ledger posted:What do you think about The Damnation Game? I was wholly unimpressed by it. Thought it was incredibly weak compared to the aforementioned novels and the Books of Blood.
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Dec 21, 2017 00:51
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Clive Barker is kinda bad at starting things and becoming distracted by other projects. Like half of his novels were planned to have sequels that never came out, or in the case of the Great And Secret Show, he wrote 2 books but never got around to writing the third.
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Dec 21, 2017 01:12
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Is Cabal good? The movie is my heartsong and I bought a copy at a used bookstore a while back but haven't gotten around to it. I'm guessing since it hasn't been mentioned the answer is "not so much."
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Dec 21, 2017 03:20
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Dr. Video Games 0081 posted:Is Cabal good? The movie is my heartsong and I bought a copy at a used bookstore a while back but haven't gotten around to it. I'm guessing since it hasn't been mentioned the answer is "not so much." I read it because like you Nightbreed was extremely my poo poo and my opinion is that it ehhhhh kinda sucks. I loved all the varied characters in the film and most of them aren't described in the book at all.
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Dec 21, 2017 03:28
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There goes the neighborhood!
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Dec 21, 2017 04:02
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Darth Walrus posted:I think you’re still a little way off. Cinema had been doing that sort of thing for decades before Barker, especially Italian giallo. For original English-language stuff, there’s Don’t Look Now as one of the classic examples from the Seventies. It was about showing other authors that they could have mainstream success with certain kinds of stories, not being the first guy to tell those sorts of stories. As I said, my original post was worded poorly, but this is what i was getting at. Beyond that, almost nothing you have named has had what I would call mainstream success except maybe Don't Look Now, and that still took decades and is a film when I've been talking about publishing. Barker broke out of the horror ghetto, something incredibly rare on its own, and the fact he did it with a) his first published book and b) the sorts of stories he tells is notable.
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Dec 21, 2017 04:14
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Drunken Baker posted:I can DEFINITELY say don't read Scarlet Gospels though. I made this mistake. I'd never read any Barker except for The Hellbound Heart about a decade ago, and I picked up The Scarlet Gospels in a bookstore - as in literally, picked it up - and was blown away by the first two chapters and bought it on the strength of that opening. The rest of the book was complete bollocks.
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Dec 22, 2017 22:57
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Is there a thread to discuss Jeff Vandermeer's Annihilation?
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Dec 23, 2017 02:30
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Professor Shark posted:Is there a thread to discuss Jeff Vandermeer's Annihilation? You're in the thread where we discuss that book.
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Dec 23, 2017 03:36
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The Imago Sequence was really great, loved it pretty much from beginning to end. Stories in particular I liked were Proboscis, The Imago Sequence, Hallucigenia, and Procession of the Black Sloth. Good stuff!
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Dec 23, 2017 07:02
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Bilirubin posted:The Imago Sequence was really great, loved it pretty much from beginning to end. Stories in particular I liked were Proboscis, The Imago Sequence, Hallucigenia, and Procession of the Black Sloth. Good stuff! occultation and other stories is fairly equal in quality (maybe a bit lower but not much between them). beautiful thing that awaits us all is a step down but still has a couple of good ones. swift to chase i'm still only 20% through. it seems so far like it might hit on some of the other genre elements that we've seen a bit of in earlier stories but hadn't been in the forefront - fantasy and sci-fi. the croning is compulsory reading if you enjoyed any of the Children of Old Leech stories. his novellae Xs for Eyes and The Light is the Darkness have had poor reception. I enjoyed them. Xs for Eyes melds Barron's horror with '30s pulp and it's kind of interesting style wise. The Light is another one of Barron's ultra-tough manly characters confronting cosmic forces.
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Dec 24, 2017 02:20
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Hungry posted:I made this mistake. I'd never read any Barker except for The Hellbound Heart about a decade ago, and I picked up The Scarlet Gospels in a bookstore - as in literally, picked it up - and was blown away by the first two chapters and bought it on the strength of that opening. God! I forgot about that opening. If I could be arsed I'd re-read it to see how the prose and style line up, because it might just lend credence to the "two authors" rumour(fact).
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Dec 27, 2017 13:26
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