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nine16thsdago posted:I have a trane XL16c at home, which I think I understand is a 2-stage heat pump with 2-stage natural gas aux heat ("dual fuel"). The honeywell (american standard branded, came with the unit) thermostat looks like it's wired as a "multistage two-step scroll heat pump with two-stage variable speed gas furnace" (according to the thermostat manual). Wiring is: R,O,Y,G,B,W1,X2,Y2 (there's also a pair of sensor leads...) If you have a wire on O then that's gonna be the same as the O/B terminal. You'll just have to change to change the power setting in the Tstat. O and B are pretty much the same, except for how the power the reversing valve. O = energized in cooling B = energized in heat (Which is only really a thing on Rheem units) When you set up the stat it should give those options, and you'll want it to be on energized in cooling. So it sounds like you'll just need to wire it up as a heat pump with aux. heat.
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Dec 15, 2017 20:30
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Just a followup to my previous post, there was a small leak in the gas control valve so we shut it off until it's replaced.
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Dec 15, 2017 22:37
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ExplodingSims posted:If you have a wire on O then that's gonna be the same as the O/B terminal. You'll just have to change to change the power setting in the Tstat. thank you! I have read somewhere that trane/AS use "B" as "common," and in the trane installers manual (edit: i.e., the one for my model number), that seems to be indicated in the wiring diagram. so moving the wires on my current thermostat to the ecobee, i'll map the following: code:edit: wolrah posted:https://nest.com/support/article/Should-my-B-wire-go-in-Nest-s-O-B-connector-Or-is-it-a-common-wire-that-belongs-in-the-C-connector thanks! VVVVVVVVV nine16thsdago fucked around with this message at 18:10 on Dec 16, 2017 |
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Dec 16, 2017 04:31
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nine16thsdago posted:thank you! I have read somewhere that trane/AS use "B" as "common," and in the trane installers manual (edit: i.e., the one for my model number), that seems to be indicated in the wiring diagram. so moving the wires on my current thermostat to the ecobee, i'll map the following: https://nest.com/support/article/Should-my-B-wire-go-in-Nest-s-O-B-connector-Or-is-it-a-common-wire-that-belongs-in-the-C-connector
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Dec 16, 2017 05:52
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I would like to reinsulate my original round rigid metal ductwork in my crawlspace. The original fiberglass insulation is coming apart in many places, and pulling it off would give me the opportunity to seal many of the old joints with mastic. I bought a roll of foil-backed fiberglass insulation at Home Depot and it was the worst stuff I've ever touched in my life. Simply moving it caused it to shower you with sharp tiny glass fibers, and the foil backing material was both (1) not attached at all to the fiberglass and (2) so thin that it was almost impossible to touch it without tearing. Reading reviews of the stuff on Home Depot's website seems to confirm that it's total garbage. There are some ducts that were reinsulated much later that have decent insulation: a tough backing and high quality fiberglass that isn't spraying 1 cm fibers everywhere. Where do I get this stuff? Can I buy it in sleeves to pull over my existing ductwork? Can I get cellulose insulation for round rigid ducts?
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Dec 16, 2017 18:07
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This is the stuff we use at work: https://www.johnstonesupply.com/storefront/product-view.ep?pID=R94-707 Not sure if you can get outside of Johnstone though. They might let you buy it depending on how professional you look that day though  Although be prepared to do one of the work kinds of AC jobs there is. Working with this poo poo is never pleasant, no matter which brand you use.
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Dec 16, 2017 20:36
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I have two separate heat pumps in my house. One of the heat pumps (Trane) is controlled by a Trane 7-Day programmable thermostat like this one. The other heat pump (a very Old York unit) is controlled by a much simpler digital non-programmable thermostat like this one. I would like to upgrade the non-programmable unit so that I can set the same schedule on both thermostats so that the house gets heated more evenly. What do I need to look for (wires, specifications on the air handler, specifications on the heat pump, etc.) to make sure that I can replace the non-programmable thermostat with a programmable unit similar to the one I have?
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Dec 21, 2017 15:36
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here's the non-branded version of your trane thermostat https://www.amazon.com/Honeywell-YRTH8500D1008-7-Day-Programmable-Thermostat/dp/B000VLG1ZQ/ It's battery powered, so you won't need a C wire-- it should just work fine. here's the manual/video https://yourhome.honeywell.com/en/products/thermostat/7-day-programmable-thermostat-rth8500d
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Dec 21, 2017 16:11
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Jose Cuervo posted:I have two separate heat pumps in my house. One of the heat pumps (Trane) is controlled by a Trane 7-Day programmable thermostat like this one. The other heat pump (a very Old York unit) is controlled by a much simpler digital non-programmable thermostat like this one. All you need is just a regular programmable stat. Not much else to it. Just be sure to verify the wires. And if you don't have a C wire it's not a big deal but if you have a spare while you can hook up for it you should pretty much always hook up C if you can. The stat linked above is a pretty alright though can, be a bit confusing for setup. Personally I think te next model up is the best: https://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B012...Pj6L&ref=plSrch Very easy setup, nice display, and it has the option to add Wireless indoor and outdoor sensors. Which is very nice, if you care about things like humidity levels and what not
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Dec 21, 2017 16:36
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Qwijib0 posted:here's the non-branded version of your trane thermostat ExplodingSims posted:All you need is just a regular programmable stat. Not much else to it. Thanks for the replies, links to thermostats, and the install advice!
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Dec 21, 2017 22:35
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Cross-posted from the Fix it Fast stickied thread: I've got a forced hot air furnace, a Trane XR95. It's pretty new (3 years old, so installed about a year before I bought the house.) There's no zones at all, 1 single thermostat in the "main floor" hallway (raised ranch, so main floor is basically the first floor, and half of the ground floor is finished, two room, the other half is unfinished basement.) We have three rooms that don't see a lot of use. The spare bedroom and office upstairs, and the craft room downstairs. Does it make sense to close the registers in those rooms when we're not in there? I know it's hard to tell without detailed info on the unit (CFM, BTUs, etc...) but, generally, aren't furnaces sized appropriately so their return air amount will equal the amount the output? And with the registers being closed, some hot air still gets pushed through the ducts until it hits the closed register, potentially wasting it, and then maybe creating backpressure on the furnace and affecting how well it heats the rest of the house? The office in particular gets VERY warm, since it's relatively small and has only 1 outside wall (vs the master bedroom and spare bedroom that are corner rooms.) So it almost feels like a waste of heat in that room. The craft room downstairs also gets pretty warm if the register is open because it's small, and being half below grade is well insulated.( I think?) But if I close the register to the craft room, it gets VERY cold. Like...50's. Probably because of the wall it shares with the unfinished basement behind it (I think it has R-19 insulation, but it's only a 2x4 frame, so it might be stuffed in too much and is compressed.) We keep the thermostat at 68 most of the time when we're home, but the craft room is probably upper 70's, and office mid 70's. The craft room is mostly below the living room, so I'm also wondering if keeping it heated helps maintain the living room at a better temp?
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Dec 28, 2017 21:57
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I have a Heat pump and central air in my house that was built in the 40s (2k square feet & 2 story) and my electric bills in the winter are insane. Last month was $320 and this month it will be more and it's due to the furnace being run nonstop even showing it is running in aux mode sometimes. Now I also have baseboard heaters all throughout the house that I never use. The thermostat is located on the first floor and is set around 67-69 degrees. Would it be more efficient to lower that even more and turn on the baseboard heaters in the rooms we are currently in?
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Dec 30, 2017 20:53
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fyallm posted:I have a Heat pump and central air in my house that was built in the 40s (2k square feet & 2 story) and my electric bills in the winter are insane. Last month was $320 and this month it will be more and it's due to the furnace being run nonstop even showing it is running in aux mode sometimes. Now I also have baseboard heaters all throughout the house that I never use. The thermostat is located on the first floor and is set around 67-69 degrees. Would it be more efficient to lower that even more and turn on the baseboard heaters in the rooms we are currently in? baseboard heat is going to be as (in)efficient as your Aux strips so in order to use them to your advantage you could drop your central heat when it's cold enough for aux to come on and only heat the room you're in.
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Dec 30, 2017 23:12
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If your AUX heat is running all the time, your heat pump isn't pumping very well. Recommend you get someone to check it out.
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Dec 30, 2017 23:20
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Hummm ok thanks guys, it doesn't run in Aux all the time, but during these single digit months it kicks in more often
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Dec 30, 2017 23:25
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fyallm posted:I have a Heat pump and central air in my house that was built in the 40s (2k square feet & 2 story) and my electric bills in the winter are insane. Last month was $320 and this month it will be more and it's due to the furnace being run nonstop even showing it is running in aux mode sometimes. Now I also have baseboard heaters all throughout the house that I never use. The thermostat is located on the first floor and is set around 67-69 degrees. Would it be more efficient to lower that even more and turn on the baseboard heaters in the rooms we are currently in? How cold does it get where you are? Sounds like you have the wrong heating system (or more likely lacking a fossil second stage that is more appropriate to your climate).
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Dec 31, 2017 00:00
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Has the bill always been high in the winter? Possible equipment issues aside, if your house was built 70-odd years ago and hasn't been updated I'm sure the insulation is pretty lacking. There's a couple different things it could be related to the equipment, but if you're leaking air like crazy that doesn't help either.
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Dec 31, 2017 00:42
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It goes down to single digits maybe lower.. Not sure what fossil second stage means... I am sure insulation behind these plaster walls doesnt exist.
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Dec 31, 2017 04:27
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Fossil second stage means getting a gas-fired furnace, and getting your unit wired so it uses the heat pump first, then fires the burners when it gets really cold. Better insulation would be the most effective way of reducing your heating bills, but if your walls are plaster it probably isn't too practical.
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Dec 31, 2017 05:00
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They can inject spray foam into the stud bays without tearing the wall apart. You may be able to get assistance from a DoE program for home weatherization http://www.waptac.org/Grantee-Contacts.aspx
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Dec 31, 2017 15:31
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Is this a good place to ask for help on an emergency HVAC question? Setup: it's cold as poo poo outside. My heater shut down in the middle of the night and it's getting to the low 50s in here. All HVAC repair shops in the area are backed up for days. I've got a ton of family visiting and the house is freezing. The unit in question is electric with a geo ground loop. - No breakers were tripped. the thermostat is still getting power and trying to control the furnace. - I checked the voltage coming off the breakers that power the unit. Not quite 120 on each pole, but like 116-118, and that's what I get coming into the house. - I set the fan to "on" at the thermostat, according to the manual it should kick the fan on and just let it run, but it doesn't, I get no response. - I tried flipping the breakers off for a bit, then back on, just to see if a reset would do anything. After turning power back on, after 5-10 minutes, it'll try to come on, but won't actually get anywhere. I hear maybe the ground loop pump come on? It runs for a bit, gets a bit louder maybe, and then shuts down. Still no action from the blower during all of this. Wondering if it's the blower motor or the starter cap, but I don't know how to specifically check the two to figure that out for sure. Anyhow, it;s getting hard to typp, figners froedzen, semd hwlp fst
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Dec 31, 2017 18:03
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Bad Munki posted:Is this a good place to ask for help on an emergency HVAC question? Go to where the blower is. Set blower to "on" with the tstat. Spin blower carefully by hand. If blower spins, replace start cap. If motor doesn't spin, you've got other problems. Give make/models of your blower, and describe any noises you hear and lights you see.
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Dec 31, 2017 18:05
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Ok. So there's a few things to check here. I'm assuming you have a multimeter with an ohm setting? So let's start from the begining. In the air handler, find the terminal strip with the tstat wires connected to it. With everything running, verify you're calling for what you need. Go from G to C, or ground if there is no C. If you don't have 24V, you have a bad tstat. Next check the fan relay. (Assuming it has one.) Take the wires off the coil and check for resistance. If I'd OL then you have a bad relay. Next step would be the fan. If it has a cap, try giving it a spin, or just replacing the cap. If doesn't have a cap and I'd an ECM then you're out of luck.
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Dec 31, 2017 19:28
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I did set the fan to on and tried to get it started, got nothing. Spun freely. If I leave it on, I can hear a faint hum, like a (small) stalled motor, but it could also just be the ground loop pump buried in the back there. I also put the system on emergency heat at the stat, nothing from that either. Anyhow, disaster hopefully averted, after calling two dozen places, I actually got someone to come out, he's working on it now. I was getting pretty disheartened, wasn't looking like anyone could come out until middle of the week, it's SUUUUUPER backed up around here with the cold snap (Des Moines, IA, it suddenly dropped to like -15 last night so every HVAC in the area got to experience a little stress testing.) e: Tech says the fan's shot. Had me stick my nose in the blower compartment and yeah, there's a faint smell of burnt electronics, and the connector to the fan had some nice little bit of charring on it, so something fried itself. Apparently this fan has a whole on board computer, though, so it's gonna be $$$ most likely, if he can even find the part today. Bad Munki fucked around with this message at 19:37 on Dec 31, 2017 |
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Dec 31, 2017 19:31
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Yup. ECM. Those are pretty expensive when they fail. The good news is is that a aftermarket rescue Motors are pretty much the same now. Worst case scenario he should also be able to install a single speed motor if need be to at least get you up and running
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Dec 31, 2017 20:14
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Ha, that’s exactly what he’s doing right now. It’ll get us running until a replacement can be sourced. In the mean time, my old school wood fireplace that I scoffed at and threatened to replace with a gas insert is working fine and dandy.
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Dec 31, 2017 20:20
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Sometimes it's nice to have the simple things that just work. That's the thing about some of these super advanced units, the work great when they're working, but when something fails it's much more expensive now.
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Dec 31, 2017 23:15
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ExplodingSims posted:Yup. ECM. Those are pretty expensive when they fail. The good news is is that a aftermarket rescue Motors are pretty much the same now. I would like to know more about these "ECM" units. Brushless DC or something?
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Jan 1, 2018 16:52
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For whatever reason, swapping it out for the basic "just go" motor means we don't get our geo loop in the picture, and we're just on aux/emergency heat from the electric coils just downstream from the blower, so like 25% our normal heating capacity. Fortunately, a couple space heaters and the gas fireplace in the living room (with a nice big fan blowing air over it to really keep things moving) is doing quite well and the house stayed at a pretty reasonable temp last night through -20 degrees, which is easily the coldest we should see this year. I was pretty worried last night, but now I'm sure we'll be able to limp along until Wednesday or Thursday when we can get this part replaced. Only danger now is if the LP tank runs out, I forgot to fill it before winter, so I went into this with just over a hundred pounds left. But this is the first we've really used it this winter, so even if I run that fireplace full bore, it should last a couple few days. All that being said, everything the guy said jived perfectly with what you all were saying, so that makes me more comfortable trusting his expertise and taking what he said at face value. Because literally every drat heater in the greater Des Moines area crapped out with the cold, all the repair services were booked solid for days on end, so I was pretty far down the list when this guy called me back, wasn't sure what I was going to be getting.
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Jan 1, 2018 17:10
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babyeatingpsychopath posted:I would like to know more about these "ECM" units. Brushless DC or something? Sure thing! So, your standard motor you have on an air handler is what's called a PSC motor, Permanent Split Capacitor. These are your standard fractional horsepower motors that usually have 3 speed settings on them, which is accomplished by wiring them in a certain place in the motor windings. As the name implies, it also needs a capacitor to run properly. An ECM, Electronically Commutated Motor, is a DC motor, that has an inverter either built into it, or as a separate module from the motor. These are generally much more quiet, and also allow for a pretty much infinite amount of speed setting, which is ideal for things like dehumidification and ventilation. They're also generally more low maintenance, as the ability to spin up instead of starting at full speed is easier on the motor.  The downside is, when they break, they tend to be pretty expensive to replace. Although usually it's the module that craps out, no the motor, so that can be replaced separately. I think Rescue also makes a generic ECM replacement now too, which is cheaper than OEM. I don't really deal with these too often though, since the commercial side of things all the big motors are VFD controlled if they need something like this.
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Jan 1, 2018 18:53
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The other downside is that it will fail at the least opportune time. I've considered keeping a spare...got lucky that when mine failed the weather was fair, and I had the luxury of waiting on Prime two-to-infinity day shipping.
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Jan 1, 2018 19:30
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fyallm posted:I have a Heat pump and central air in my house that was built in the 40s (2k square feet & 2 story) and my electric bills in the winter are insane. Last month was $320 and this month it will be more and it's due to the furnace being run nonstop even showing it is running in aux mode sometimes. Now I also have baseboard heaters all throughout the house that I never use. The thermostat is located on the first floor and is set around 67-69 degrees. Would it be more efficient to lower that even more and turn on the baseboard heaters in the rooms we are currently in? My last electric bill was $490 and it's gonna be even more with the cold weather this month. We keep the thermostat at 63 overnight and while we're both at work, then 66 when we're at home. Basement has a gas furnace so we keep that at 68 and spend most of our time there. I definitely need to get the entire attic reinsulated, but the HVAC system was brand new this past summer. It's not using AUX all the time, but a lot of the time. House is about 4,100 sq ft, with the upstairs a bit larger and with higher ceilings than the basement. I did get that gas control valve in the furnace replaced btw, smells a lot less like gas now.
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Jan 1, 2018 19:52
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Just for fun, here’s what the inside of mine looked like:  And a connector plug on it was also all melty and sad.
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Jan 1, 2018 20:38
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The best part was the lovely potting on the electronics package would loosen up with vibration and let in moisture. Replacement packages include literature telling you to install a drip loop on the wiring harness.
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Jan 1, 2018 20:53
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So I posted a little bit ago about my undersized return air duct. The issue that had brought a repairman out in the first place was my furnace is short cycling and reporting “open high limit”. When the repairman came out, I bumped the thermostat to 80 so it would run and, after opening a vent in the side of the return drop, the furnace was running constantly - until the next day, when the cycling picked up. Fast forward to today, when a combination of near-zero temps and poorish circulation caused me to bump the thermostat from its normal 70 to 72. Since I did this, the furnace had been running ... well, properly. On until temperature and then off, no short cycles. Could the thermostat be causing the problem somehow? How would it cause the furnace to throw back an overheating related error? Or is this just the weirdest coincidence ever?
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Jan 1, 2018 21:58
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davebo posted:My last electric bill was $490 and it's gonna be even more with the cold weather this month. We keep the thermostat at 63 overnight and while we're both at work, then 66 when we're at home. Basement has a gas furnace so we keep that at 68 and spend most of our time there. I definitely need to get the entire attic reinsulated, but the HVAC system was brand new this past summer. It's not using AUX all the time, but a lot of the time. House is about 4,100 sq ft, with the upstairs a bit larger and with higher ceilings than the basement. I did get that gas control valve in the furnace replaced btw, smells a lot less like gas now. Sucks high energy buddy... I need to have insulation added to my attic and maybe the foam if they can do it.. But currently still paying off roof and water proofing in the basement.. Being house poor is not fun.
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Jan 1, 2018 22:42
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I posted earlier that I have an ecobee thermostat installed on a system with natural gas for heating through a furnace (American Standard Freedom-95 Comfort R) and an electrical AC system (Furnace in the basement, AC unit outside). Anyways, looking at the options, it gives me something where I can select the minimum fan run time per hour in Auto mode (min/hr). Why would I want this? What does having the fan running actually do, as far as heating is concerned? Right now it's set for 0 as a minimum.
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Jan 2, 2018 01:11
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nwiniwn posted:I posted earlier that I have an ecobee thermostat installed on a system with natural gas for heating through a furnace (American Standard Freedom-95 Comfort R) and an electrical AC system (Furnace in the basement, AC unit outside). It lets you equalize the temperatures of your house a bit more. So if you've got a room that has sucky insulation, running the fan for at least 20 minutes an hour might help the temperature of that room match the rest of the house. Apparently you don't actually want to use that when you're using the AC. It'll dry out the AC coil, making your house more humid.
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Jan 2, 2018 01:21
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devicenull posted:It lets you equalize the temperatures of your house a bit more. So if you've got a room that has sucky insulation, running the fan for at least 20 minutes an hour might help the temperature of that room match the rest of the house. Good to know-the insulation definitely sucks here, so maybe I'll try boosting it up to 20/hr and see if I notice any change. Right now, my main problem is the thermostat is in the dining room (lower level), and my bedroom (upper level) is always about 4-5 degrees warmer than the thermostat. I bought some ecobee sensors yesterday and just installed them to try and fix that (the idea that when it knows I'm in the bedroom, it will use that to gauge what my system should be doing instead of the thermostat downstairs which will be colder).
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Jan 2, 2018 01:25
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fyallm posted:Sucks high energy buddy... I need to have insulation added to my attic and maybe the foam if they can do it.. But currently still paying off roof and water proofing in the basement.. Being house poor is not fun. Since I posted that I climbed up in the attic (no stair access and I've got a 6' ladder and 10' ceilings) just to check the ducts and tape up any corners leaking air. Found a little bit but nothing significant. The parts of the attic that do have insulation it's just so old and torn up, I hope it'll help a lot having that redone so I'll call some places soon. If the accessible attic area was roughly 1,900 square feet does anyone have a ballpark guesstimate of what that would cost having professionals using that blown insulation? I'm assuming there'd be no good way to get rolls up there. I'm also assuming I'd need to have all the old crap removed instead of just blowing new stuff on top of it, or would it matter much?
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Jan 2, 2018 02:53
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