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So I had a weird situation with my boiler just now. I was out for a while, so the heat dipped in the house to 60. I turned it on before I started home, and the boiler ran contentiously for about 90 minutes. I get home and notice the pressure gauge says 2.5 PSI. (Just note that the previous gauge was broken so I had it replaced by the gas company, for free, since I have that Worry Free contract). I also notice the water was a little high, since I had put water in it that evening, so I connect my hose to skimmer and I turn it on to tap off the top. Suddenly, boiling hot high pressure steam starts shooting out of the hose, like I've never seen before for. I've drained it numerous times while running, but I've never see that. So I turned off the boiler, and reopened the valve and let it all blow off. I have a couple problems: 1) shouldn't the pressure cut off kick in well before that? 2) the tech that came out last year to replace the gauge used one that goes from 0-30, which seems like way too much, the boiler max is 15 and since it operates at normally max .5 PSI shouldn't the gauge be maybe 0-10? The pressure cut out has kicked in before, a couple weeks ago, when it ran for almost 2-3 full hours to heat from 50 to 69, but I don't remember the gauge reading, The pressure cut out looks to be set at 2, maybe that's too high? Everything was super hot in the house well before hand, so if it cut out at 1 PSI it'd still be plenty of heating power and duty cycling time. I'm going to call them to come out and look at it. The first available appt is 1/19. I can call a local company, but it won't be free. Not sure if I should do something or just not worry about it. I went ahead and booked the 1/19 appt, just to have it. Here's some pics: 1) here's Bertha, my lady love:  2) close up of her sweet knobs.  3) gauges for days: 
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Jan 2, 2018 02:57
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Any recommendations for air filters? I need twin 16x30x1 and apparently the big box stores don't carry that size on the shelf, so I'm just going to set up a subscription on amazon, trying to decide what I want. I want to get as much dust out of the air as I can without sacrificing too much air flow. Also, I have pets, but I figure that just means changing it more often.
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Jan 3, 2018 17:29
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We use the Flanders Pre-pleat filters at work and they're pretty good. They certainly catch a lot of crap.
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Jan 3, 2018 18:21
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I just bought a house with single zone oil hot water baseboard radiators, but which also has central air installed (date unknown, but its R22, so it’ll be phased out soon, but I have no reason that believe it’s leaking.) with all the ductwork run. I’d like to convert entirely to propane forced air heat and remove the baseboard heaters prior to renovating the floors and walls. One of the HVAC guys that I had give me a quote says that with my existing central air system it would be possible to just add a coil to the existing unit, but that it would probably be hard to source one. He also provided me with a quote to update everything for $9,000; propane furnace with new AC and heat pump (which I currently don’t have). This house is a project starter home that we will be in for 2 to 5 years, so I’m thinking I won’t get a return on an entire new HVAC system just in efficiency savings alone. Does anyone think it would be worth it to pursue the retrofit option instead of the new system? I’d also have to buy a water heater, now that I think about it, which will bump the cost.
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Jan 3, 2018 18:43
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I wouldn't add a heat exchanger to the existing forced air a/c, the blower fan isn't designed for that additional restriction. Where are you located?
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Jan 4, 2018 05:16
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SE Pennsylvania.
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Jan 4, 2018 17:05
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Does Johnstone Supply do retail sales to the pubic? I need some ductboard and the big box stores don't sell it....but they sell the start collars for it.
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Jan 11, 2018 03:30
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Typically no, second question they ask is usually what contractor you are working for. Wouldn't hurt to call and ask though. I can't imagine why they would say no for ductboard.
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Jan 11, 2018 06:02
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The only thing they refuse to sell me (and in one case wouldn't even give a price for), was actual hvac equipment itself. I've purchased tools, capacitors, a drain pan and float switch, with no issues as a cash sale at both Johnstone and Baker Bros.
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Jan 11, 2018 20:08
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I've been doing some thinking, and since the boiler is a little old, and i'd like to get on top of replacing it before it dies, maybe I could actually replace it with an actual furnace and regular ducting. Since i have the ductless upstairs, I don't need go through the hassle of ducting in a closet or something. Wondering what the average cost of installing a furnace, heating five rooms (kitchen, living room, bathroom, two bedrooms) in the downstairs of a cape. It's an open basement, just the old piping for the radiators, but with that out, ducting could go in pretty easy. I'm curious, though, how they place the vents and the cold air return. Does each room need a return? Is it best to place the vents on the outer walls? I've ran ducting before, so I'm not afraid of that, but I don't know how to lay the system out. I figure I can have the furnace installed, and leave it available to install a central A/C later, to save some cost. What is a good ballpark, maybe 10k for the furnace/ducting, and then 5k for the A/C? I figure it's hard to ask, but I'd like to know if I should save prepare for the 10-20k range or signficantly higher.
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Jan 26, 2018 21:13
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I would just have them install the furnace and the A/C part at the same time, if you can swing it. It will save a lot of work down the road of having to cut the duct back out to fit the coils in place. It's much easier to do it all at once, and could actually save you some money. Since you're talking about the basement, I assume you're going to have floor vents put in? The cost really depends on how much work they have to do, with removing the old pipes, radiators, etc, and cutting holes for vents, duct support, etc. As for vent placement, I know code for new construction is to have some form of return in each room. Most places deal with this by just having a little jumper duct that goes over the doorways, and then having a central return, usually with a filterback grille. Though if you're doing this under the floor, it may be easier just to run return ducting to each room, all combining into a singular return. Then having a filter in the unit. Supply placement varies, but you generally want to have them in the center of a room, facing an exterior wall. The ideal form is for the air to sort of make a loop around the room. Starting from the supply, on the interior wall, going to the exterior wall, then back to the return. There's a good bit of measuring and math you have to do for sizing the ducts properly, generally involving the square footage of the room, what kind of heat load it will have, etc. This is probably the most important part, making sure you size everything correctly for even distribution. You'll also want to install dampers where the supply lines break off the main trunk. I have to consult some of my old notes to figure that out though, I don't really do much duct stuff. But you can find programs online to help. Also buy a ductulator off eBay or somewhere, that'll will also be necessary.
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Jan 26, 2018 21:47
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Thanks for this, I'd prefer to wait, the boiler at the moment is fine, but I want to get it replaced before it fails so I can take my time and do it right. I was thinking in three years have it done. I figure I can pull out the radiators and piping myself, I don't mind doing that, and then I could open/close the walls myself to get it all ready for them to install the top/bottom vents. My house is not large at all.  Kitchen: 10x13 Bedroom 9x10 Living Room 11x17 Master Bedroom 11x12 The entire downstairs is something like only 800sqft. The upstairs is taken care of with ductless splits. I don't need a really powerful system. I'm also planning on having blow-in insulation since the house isn't insulated very well. It's all plaster, which is fun, but I can deal with replacing one stud width per room. Only the bedrooms have doors downstairs, the kitchen, central hall and living room don't have doors, just openings. Figure I could put one cold air return in the hallway, one in each bedroom, and a jumper between the bathroom and hallway door. The registers would be on the interior walls facing towards the exterior and then with the returns on the opposite? It wasn't clear from your notes.
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Jan 26, 2018 22:24
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Ok, well if your house is basically just a rectangle it shouldn't be too hard to run ducting at all. Just run a central trunk down the middle, with drops in each room. And your idea for the return will work. Just one in the hallway, with jumpers on the rooms with the doors. You don't need to put a return jumper in the bathroom though. As for register placement, you want to have the supply facing an exterior wall, and have the return nearby. Typically you just put the return over the door though, so that will be fine. You basically want the air to make a big loop around the room. Like so: Blue = Supply Red = Return  But since the hallway appears to be so small, you may be better off just having the two bedroom returns joining into the main return line.
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Jan 26, 2018 22:43
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Thanks! The boiler is the green box, in the basement, and I can put the A/C unit likely right outside (I'd have to deal with setback, I think it has to be five feet from the properly line, I think it's only 7ft to the neighbors fence, but I can deal with that).  There's a stair case to the basement, I revised a little to make that more clear so the trunk would have deal with that, probably split it before it. The basement has the pipe for the boilers now, so with that clear there'd be plenty of headspace to run it, and since it's go right up into the walls it'd be really easy. The best method is to have two vents in each riser if possible, top and bottom for heat/cool, right? I don't have a problem doing that since I can open the walls and repair whatever, I'd rather put the time into that and have better heating/cooling. I can do that myself no problem. EDIT: also how do you force the air to loop the room? Direction of the registers? EDIT2: any idea of cost? atleast a range, 10-20k? 20-30k?
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Jan 26, 2018 23:47
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Yeah, if you wanted to terminate the trunk before the stairs, and run drops near the end, that would work. Just make sure you don't connect them at the very end, or else you'll run into pressure issues/ As far as the two vent thing goes, I don't have a great answer for that. I'm mostly used to dealing with cooling, so the vents are near the top of the wall. As far as the direction of the air goes, the grills have louvers on them to help direct the air. So, if you're mounting a wall register, you'd want to have it so the louvers are pointing to the exterior wall. Cost is variable, depending on the brand of equipment, and whatnot, but I'd budget for at least $15K. If you're doing the hard stuff yourself, such as tearing out the old stuff, walls, etc, that will certainly cut down on costs.
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Jan 27, 2018 00:07
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I have a 1.5 year old HVAC system including a single-stage gas furnace. About half the time when the heat comes on it's blowing room temp. I've been checking vent temps the past couple of days and there's no apparent rhyme or reason as to whether it blows hot or not. Sometimes it comes on blowing 68F after not running for a while, which would seem to rule out an overheating issue. Sometimes it runs at room temp for a while, shuts itself off, and comes back hot while the thermostat is set at the same temp the whole time. Just changed the filters 2 days ago. I've never paid much attention to it because it maintains temps well enough (within 2 degrees of thermostat), even when it was <10F outside a few weeks ago. I haven't had a chance to climb up there and see if there are any error codes when this happens, but does this make sense to anyone?
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Feb 2, 2018 14:42
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Could check the fan settings on the stat. I have mine to circulate, but I think a lot of people leave the fan on "auto" which might lead to it just wanting to move air sometimes. There should be a few settings like "on", "off", "auto", "circulate," etc. If you can find the manual for the stat, you might find some tidbits in there about it.
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Feb 2, 2018 15:33
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Yeah, it's this one, which only has auto & on. It's on auto, which should mean the blower only runs when the furnace is running. When I had flame sensor issues with my old funace I think I remember that the blower wouldn't run either, so I'm confused whether it could be expected behavior for: -thermostat calls for heat -blower runs -no heat from furnace If it's been wired differently than my old one, maybe it's possible that a furnace lockout (due to hitting the cycle limit mentioned in the thermostat manual, flame sensor or pressure switch issues, etc) would still allow the blower to run? I'm just running on Google knowledge so I have no idea. I assume checking for error codes when I get home needs to be my next step. Edit: checking error code was my next step. Was getting locked out due to retries - cleaned the flame sensor and made sure the wire was secure and things seem ok now! The Bunk fucked around with this message at 05:37 on Feb 3, 2018 |
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Feb 2, 2018 17:16
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I have a home with the HVAC system and rigid metal ductwork in the crawlspace, and we've been dealing with radon infiltration. We have a radon system but the radon level in the home is higher on days that the furnace or A/C runs for long periods of time. I found that two of the panned returns had large gaps in them that I've since sealed with sprayfoam and mastic. Now, the system does not have a filter at the blower. Instead there is a 12x24x1 filter at each of the return grills. In my untrained thinking this should mean there is substantial negative pressure on the return side all the way from the grills to the air handler. Would taking out the filters at the grills and having a single filter at the air handler decrease the amount of crawlspace air sucked in via any leaks in the return I haven't found yet? Second question: The HVAC system is about 3 years old. Because of the filter arrangement the air handler was sucking some unfiltered air from the crawlspace via the gaps I've since sealed. Is my heat exchanger coil likely covered in crud?
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Feb 3, 2018 01:02
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I have this heater in my shop: https://www.menards.com/main/heatin...61692447430.htm I’d like to hook it up to a thermostat like the Honeywell I have in my house, which I can control from my phone. Problem is, the unit has its own built in controller. Would it be reasonably viable to bypass the built in stat and use a standalone unit instead? Would I likely be able to use the 2-stage design of the unit for better efficiency? Follow up: if that worked out, could I feasibly control a second matching unit in parallel with the first? The idea would be two have one at opposite corners of the shop, creating a circular flow along the perimeter.
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Feb 3, 2018 23:49
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Bad Munki posted:I’d like to hook it up to a thermostat like the Honeywell I have in my house, which I can control from my phone. Problem is, the unit has its own built in controller. Would it be reasonably viable to bypass the built in stat and use a standalone unit instead? Would I likely be able to use the 2-stage design of the unit for better efficiency? When I converted a freezer in to a kegerator I just set the built in thermostat to the coldest position. When the external thermostat gives it power the internal thermostat immediately kicks it on. Seems like the same idea could work just fine in the opposite direction, set the built in thermostat to some cutoff temp above where you'll ever want to actually set it to. That also would provide a safety factor if your automation system fails which you'd lose if you bypassed it.
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Feb 4, 2018 00:21
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Also insurance purposes. Modifying heaters like that removes the ul rating, and thus insurance coverage in case of a fire. Two stages won't help much if you aren't being billed by peak load. Eheat is eheat, no real efficiency help other than better insulation.
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Feb 4, 2018 00:33
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All good points. I wasn't sure if just setting the unit to a high temp and then controlling power via the stat would work with this unit, I don't know if it remembers what it was set to before if power fully drops, haven't checked that functionality. Probably does, though. Also, I'd have to be switching 50 or 60 amps on 240v anyhow, I think I've seen some stats that do that directly but it seems like a lot. Hadn't considered the UL rating implications. And, derp, the resistance heat "efficiency" thing makes perfect sense. I think the idea with that is just that it can use one coil to maintain temp, which would have it cycling less, but I guess would also mean the fan would have to be running more? Or maybe it's just straight up marketing wank and there's no other reason behind it. Once I finish insulating the shop, we'll see how well it works as-is. Worst case scenario, I'll end up craigslisting the unit and replacing it with a unit (or two) that are made to be controlled by an external stat. Or I'll just leave it alone. Sure wish I had natural gas out here.
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Feb 4, 2018 15:51
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how many actual different manufacturers of HVAC units are there? I'm talking gas/electric furnaces/ac combos for residential use. I know Carrier and Trane are the flagships of two companies and many of the down market brands/models are just re-labels/downgrades of those products but is it really just the two of them? I found a Canadian manufacturer (Napoleon) but it looks like it is effectively not available in the US (or at least not in my area). My furnace is starting to crap out and it is ~25 years old at this point so I'm looking to get a new one and figured a new AC unit at the same time is a good idea but I haven't really been able to find good buyers guides that actually provide any good differences between the brands.
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Feb 4, 2018 16:23
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Molybdenum posted:how many actual different manufacturers of HVAC units are there? I'm talking gas/electric furnaces/ac combos for residential use. There are about 5 or 6 manufacturers of HVAC equipment in the US sold under different brand names. UTI is the megacorp that makes Carrier, Bryant, Payne, Tempstar, and some more. Other groups are York/Luxaire/Coleman; Goodman/Amana/Janitrol; Rheem/Ruud; Lennox/Armstrong; Trane/American Standard; Frigidaire/Gibson/Mammoth, etc. It's been 15 years since I did any residential installs so I've lost track of a lot of it.
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Feb 4, 2018 17:33
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There's really only a handful of brands, all with a dozen different rebrands of varying Quality. Off the top of my head: International Comfort Products: -ICP -Carrier -Payne -Bryant -Tempstar Johnson Controls -Johnson controls -York -Coleman -Luxaire Ingersoll Rand -Trane -American Standard -Ameristar Rheem/Ruud Lennox -Armstrong. Goodman -Amana -Daikan ExplodingSims fucked around with this message at 00:02 on Feb 5, 2018 |
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Feb 4, 2018 23:53
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hopefully this is the right thread, if not please point me to it. The upstairs of my house is much hotter than downstairs in the summer. I see that some of the smart thermostats have sensors you can place in other rooms so it can get a more accurate average temp reading. I currently have 15 year old or so honeywell model and I was looking at getting something like this https://www.amazon.com/EcoBee3-Smar...keywords=ecobee Just about every smart thermostat says that it requires a "C-wire" I looked behind my current thermostat and it doesnt appear to have one.  What are my options and does what im looking at buying even match my needs or is there a way cheaper option?
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Feb 7, 2018 02:43
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Fauxtool posted:hopefully this is the right thread, if not please point me to it. You've got 2 wires going to your Y terminal. You probably don't need 2 there and can probably free up the black wire there to be your C. Go down and look at your furnace. Which terminals do the wires go in there?
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Feb 7, 2018 02:55
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pull that backplate off the wall and see if there is an unused wire in the cable they put between your existing thermostat and your hvac unit. if you've got a spare blue or gray at both ends, you can use it as the C wire.
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Feb 7, 2018 02:57
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There is a blue wire not connected to anything behind the backplate. The "black" one that is connected in the same slot as the yellow wire is brown but may have been black before. So that free blue wire is ok to use as a "c?" or the black one in the yellow slot?
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Feb 7, 2018 03:10
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Use the blue one, but you have to land the other end of it at your furnace/fancoil/whatever. The black and yellow in the Y slot may be for something else. I can't tell via the INTERNET. If you have trouble identifying where it needs to go, post an image and we will try to walk you through it.
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Feb 7, 2018 03:52
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Turn off the power to your furnace first. Verify the blue isnt hooked to anything already and land it on the C terminal. Hook the other end of blue to the C terminal on your new stat, turn power back on. If you have questions, post a pic of the control board where the thermostat wires are connected inside your furnace. IMO the nest stats are better than the ecobee, but pick whichever you want.
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Feb 7, 2018 15:02
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Is a quote for $7100 to install a Trane XR13 2-ton A/C ok? This is in Seattle where stuff can be pricey. The company is well rated but I have no idea if that's a good price.
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Feb 10, 2018 04:29
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Charles posted:Is a quote for $7100 to install a Trane XR13 2-ton A/C ok? This is in Seattle where stuff can be pricey. The company is well rated but I have no idea if that's a good price. I had a very similar model from American Standard (They're the same company) installed in October along with a furnace for around $8k Canadian so that really seems like quite a bit... but I'm in Southern Ontario and you're in Seattle so who knows. Did you get 3+ quotes? It's only February so you have a lot of time still.
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Feb 10, 2018 06:22
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EngineerJoe posted:I had a very similar model from American Standard (They're the same company) installed in October along with a furnace for around $8k Canadian so that really seems like quite a bit... but I'm in Southern Ontario and you're in Seattle so who knows. No I think I'll get another quote then.
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Feb 10, 2018 07:00
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Charles posted:No I think I'll get another quote then. Is this just for a/c or are they replacing the furnace as well?
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Feb 12, 2018 16:50
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My furnace is dead, and it seems the 24V transformer is not working (zero output voltage and open circuit across 24V terminals). It's part of a fan center as this is an older model furnace. The part is 47-19807-02. On the relay side, I have yellow, black and red wires. I had put tape on the wires they connect to to label them, but a couple fell off and now I'm not sure how to reconnect it properly. It looks like Yellow is supposed to be hot into the relay, connected to Red when un-energized and switched to Black when energized. What supply and load wires do I connect these to for everything to work without shorting or burning down my house? n/m figured it out! mr.belowaverage fucked around with this message at 20:00 on Feb 24, 2018 |
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Feb 24, 2018 18:27
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Is it possible to tell at a glance if this old-rear end thermostat could be replaced with a Nest Thermostat E? I've looked online for some compatibility info but I'm still not sure. My house has an oil burner with baseboard heating. fwiw I did come across a YouTube review that claimed a C-wire wasn't necessary for the Nest E, which is often cited as an issue when I look up stuff about old thermostats.
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Feb 25, 2018 19:44
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It depends. if that is a 24v stat, yeah you will probably be fine. if it's an older milivolt stat, it won't work. if you have a voltmeter and know how to use it, on the back there should be a pair of wires coming in, turn the stat off and take a voltage reading across them.
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Feb 25, 2018 20:13
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MRC48B posted:It depends. if that is a 24v stat, yeah you will probably be fine. Don't have a voltmeter handy but thanks! An electrician will be here in the next couple of weeks for a bathroom, so I'm just trying to figure out what I'm working with here beforehand. Trying to figure out options with/without extra electrical work. Not sure if I'm looking at the right thing but this taco box says "24 VAC ONLY" on the side of it:   Also saw this thing on my burner, figure it may include pertinent information:  Something else about 120v here: 
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Feb 25, 2018 21:02
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