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Some Numbers
Sep 28, 2006

"LET'S GET DOWN TO WORK!!"

C-Euro posted:

Tell me about Pauper Mill because I have a gimmick to maintain. The closest thing I know to that is UG Turbofog with Jace's Erasure.

There's also Curse of the Bloody Tome.

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Flip Yr Wig
Feb 21, 2007

Oh please do go on
Fun Shoe

PJOmega posted:

Are the snow lands just a style choice?

They enable Skred.

C-Euro
Mar 20, 2010

:science:
Soiled Meat

Some Numbers posted:

There's also Curse of the Bloody Tome.

So something like
Curse of the Bloody Tome
Jace's Erasure
Mind Sculpt
Tome Scour
Thought Scour
Winds of Rebuke
Jace's Phantasm (thanks IMA!)
Some other stuff I can't think of right now

Wizards please reprint Hedron Crab at common in the next Masters set.

E: Quick 10-minute draft:
4 Ash Barrens
4 Dismal Backwater
8 Island
2 Radiant Fountain
2 Swamp
3 Chainer's Edict
2 Crypt Incursion
4 Curse of the Bloody Tome
4 Dream Twist
4 Jace's Phantasm
4 Mind Sculpt
3 Sea Gate Oracle
4 Shriekhorn
4 Thought Scour
4 Tome Scour
4 Winds of Rebuke
//Sideboard
2 Bojuka Bog
1 Chainer's Edict
3 Dispel
2 Duress
2 Echoing Decay
3 Hydroblast
2 Rancid Earth

Dunno if this is an already-established archetype in Pauper. Seems like aggro strategies would still be a problem, especially since you're milling fewer cards per mill spell. But it does let me play Winds of Rebuke which I wish was good enough for Modern Mill, so it's not a complete loss.

C-Euro fucked around with this message at 23:43 on Feb 8, 2018

Some Numbers
Sep 28, 2006

"LET'S GET DOWN TO WORK!!"

Flip Yr Wig posted:

They enable Skred.

Not in a UB deck they don't.

Flip Yr Wig
Feb 21, 2007

Oh please do go on
Fun Shoe

Some Numbers posted:

Not in a UB deck they don't.

I suppose I ought to actually pay attention to surrounding posts before slamming that reply.

little munchkin
Aug 15, 2010

Mulloy posted:

So my EDH group wants to add pauper as a side option. As a result I have been looking for control decks - I know pauper isn't super control oriented, but looking at the popular decks like delver and such I wasn't seeing anything that looked like it would be fun longer term. I saw Dimir Alchemy and I pieced that together, but I was wondering if there were any B/U/x control decks in existence in pauper or if I just need to grow up and learn to like tempo.

here's the spicy grixis list i mentioned

4 Bleak Coven Vampires
4 Mulldrifter
2 Beetleback Chief
1 Trinket Mage

4 Galvanic Blast
2 Ghostly Flicker
2 Terminate

4 Chainer’s Edict
4 Thoughtcast
2 Firebolt

4 Metalspinner’s Puzzleknot
4 Prophetic Prism
1 Executioner’s Capsule
1 Nihil Spellbomb

4 Great Furnace
4 Seat of the Synod
4 Vault of Whispers
3 Swiftwater Cliffs
2 Mortuary Mire
1 Dimir Backwater
1 Izzet Boilerworks
1 Rakdos Carnarium

Sideboard
2 Electrickery
2 Pyroblast
1 Terminate
2 Wrecking Ball
1 Hydroblast
1 Reaping the Graves
4 Kuldotha Rebirth
1 Firebolt
1 Pyrite Spellbomb

little munchkin
Aug 15, 2010

C-Euro posted:

Dunno if this is an already-established archetype in Pauper. Seems like aggro strategies would still be a problem, especially since you're milling fewer cards per mill spell. But it does let me play Winds of Rebuke which I wish was good enough for Modern Mill, so it's not a complete loss.

there's an established mono blue mill deck. there's also a mono blue aggro deck that can turn into a mill deck post-board :argh:

not gonna put the effort into finding you decklists though

MisterOblivious
Mar 17, 2010

by sebmojo
Here's a Wall Mill deck I saw a few years ago.

C-Euro
Mar 20, 2010

:science:
Soiled Meat

little munchkin posted:

there's an established mono blue mill deck. there's also a mono blue aggro deck that can turn into a mill deck post-board :argh:

not gonna put the effort into finding you decklists though

Awww

MisterOblivious posted:

Here's a Wall Mill deck I saw a few years ago.

Thanks, I may have seen a list like this a long time ago too.

Mulloy
Jan 3, 2005

I am your best friend's wife's sword student's current roommate.

little munchkin posted:

here's the spicy grixis list i mentioned

Thanks! I'll keep these in mind and see how it goes.

Mezzanon
Sep 16, 2003

Pillbug
Just won a G3 against mono blue delver with acid trip. Finished the game with 4 cards left in library, drew 20 cards off assorted mulldrifter triggers.

Vital Signs
Oct 17, 2007

Mezzanon posted:

Just won a G3 against mono blue delver with acid trip. Finished the game with 4 cards left in library, drew 20 cards off assorted mulldrifter triggers.
Legend.

I've been spending my lunch breaks at the local LGS looking at box after box of commons. Where I moved from, nothing that is even a dollar survives being out in a common box. So finding 10 moments peace was pretty great. The owner is also nice enough to charge me a reduced rate for stacks. Bought around 200 cards of assorted pauper playables and paid $15 bucks.

Kabuki Shipoopi
Jun 22, 2007

If I fall, you don't get the head, right? If you lose the head, you're fucked!

God drat! That's pretty rad. That's the best thing about pauper. I can go to other stores in my area that don't do pauper leagues, and score some great cards for real cheap.

A buddy of mine bought 4 Ash Barrens for .40 a pop from a local store because the owner is just in it for modern and standard.

Edit:

So I was thinking about dipping into white for some of the goodgood lands and landfall effects, plus access to Armadillo Cloak. Any suggestions? I know going 3 color is risky, but there's so much mana fixing it almost doesn't matter. The deck is fun where it sits, but it's left wide open to control and I was hoping to make it a bit more competitive.
code:

4 Adventuring Gear 
4 Crop Rotation 
4 Evolving Wilds 
5 Forest 
2 Gruul Turf 
4 Harrow 
2 Hooting Mandrills 
4 Lightning Bolt 
4 Makindi Sliderunner 
5 Mountain 
4 Plated Geopede 
4 Rancor 
2 Temur Battle Rage 
4 Terramorphic Expanse 
4 Valakut Predator 
4 Zektar Shrine Expedition 

4 Apostle's Blessing 
2 Mogg War Marshal 
3 Molten Rain 
3 Pyroblast 
3 Smash to Smithereens

Am I asking for the moon on a stick here?

Kabuki Shipoopi fucked around with this message at 05:25 on Feb 11, 2018

always be closing
Jul 16, 2005
An old friend of mine texted me and said he'd been going to the LGS for pauper night and it was a ton of fun, so I looked on goldfish at the meta page and bought this:

code:
Creatures (8)
4	Augur of Bolas	
4	Gurmag Angler	
Spells (30)
3	Disfigure	
4	Preordain	
2	Tragic Slip	
1	Agony Warp	
3	Chainer's Edict	
4	Counterspell
2	Deprive	
2	Doom Blade	
1	Echoing Decay	
4	Forbidden Alchemy	
2	Probe	
1	Evincar's Justice	
1	Mystical Teachings	
Lands (22)
2	Bojuka Bog		
4	Dimir Aqueduct		
4	Dismal Backwater		
6	Island		
2	Radiant Fountain		
4	Swamp		
Sideboard (15)
1	Dispel	
2	Duress	
1	Hydroblast
2	Relic of Progenitus	
1	Devour Flesh	
1	Negate	
2	Shrivel	
2	Cartouche of Ambition	
3	Stormbound Geist	
75 Cards Total

anyone play something similar and have advice?

e- i should read the last few pages before posting.

suicidesteve
Jan 4, 2006

"Life is a maze. This is one of its dead ends.


Here's my list I haven't updated in like 2 years.

https://deckbox.org/sets/1340476

Flea Bargain
Dec 9, 2008

'Twas brillig


3-0d my local pauper weekly with Dinrova Tron. It is everything Magic should be about - slowly not losing until you turn the corner and now your opponent can't ever win they just don't know it yet. Beat UR delver twice, 2-1 2-0 and UB reanimator once 2-0.

Edit: I'd never picked the deck up before so going to time was a real concern. We didn't, but I felt the time pressure in two out of three matches.

Mezzanon
Sep 16, 2003

Pillbug
Played my first round of paper pauper league and won 2-1 vs 4-colour tron as u/w acid trip.

Game 2 involved all 4soreadimg seas and at least 6 reality acids.

G3 I beat a T4ulamogs crusher.

suicidesteve
Jan 4, 2006

"Life is a maze. This is one of its dead ends.


Mezzanon posted:

Played my first round of paper pauper league and won 2-1 vs 4-colour tron as u/w acid trip.

Game 2 involved all 4soreadimg seas and at least 6 reality acids.

G3 I beat a T4ulamogs crusher.

Reality Acid on Crusher, sac Reality Acid to annihilator is the only sweet thing I ever did with that stupid deck.

Mezzanon
Sep 16, 2003

Pillbug

suicidesteve posted:

Reality Acid on Crusher, sac Reality Acid to annihilator is the only sweet thing I ever did with that stupid deck.

I had T3 acid on a tron land, opponent untapped played a mountain and cast crusher, passed. I untapped and journey to nowhere’d the crusher and dream stalker’d the reality acid.

But I really like that that annihilator trigger line

Vital Signs
Oct 17, 2007
Mikeyr00r00's "paupular deck" series is amazing. It really gives a good look at a ton of different decks in the format, and I like his style of recording/playing.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lSvVF_hfN08

always be closing
Jul 16, 2005

always be closing posted:



code:
Creatures (8)
4	Augur of Bolas	
4	Gurmag Angler	
Spells (30)
3	Disfigure	
4	Preordain	
2	Tragic Slip	
1	Agony Warp	
3	Chainer's Edict	
4	Counterspell
2	Deprive	
2	Doom Blade	
1	Echoing Decay	
4	Forbidden Alchemy	
2	Probe	
1	Evincar's Justice	
1	Mystical Teachings	
Lands (22)
2	Bojuka Bog		
4	Dimir Aqueduct		
4	Dismal Backwater		
6	Island		
2	Radiant Fountain		
4	Swamp		
Sideboard (15)
1	Dispel	
2	Duress	
1	Hydroblast
2	Relic of Progenitus	
1	Devour Flesh	
1	Negate	
2	Shrivel	
2	Cartouche of Ambition	
3	Stormbound Geist	
75 Cards Total


I have never used them before, but how/when am I supposed to play these bounce lands? That has been some of the most confusing decisions in my first 3 matches with this deck. Do I just try and play basic>t2 1 Mana play, bounceland>t3 replace basic

Some Numbers
Sep 28, 2006

"LET'S GET DOWN TO WORK!!"
So, bouncelands aren't actually that complicated. You generally want to spend mana and then play the bounceland to return a basic, but you can also return a Dismal Backwater or Radiant Fountain which will gain you more life.

Another sweet play that this deck doesn't have access to is tapping a cycling land for mana, playing a bounceland, returning the cycling land and then cycling it. Works really well with Ash Barrens.

always be closing
Jul 16, 2005
Gotcha so I'm p. Much on the right track. And you're not actually that far behind since you would theoretically be playing an etb tapped land t2 anyways.

suicidesteve
Jan 4, 2006

"Life is a maze. This is one of its dead ends.


I generally play them as late as possible or when it doesn't mess with the curve. So like, tap land, island, tap land, bounce land lets you have plays on every turn if your hand allows it where playing the bounce land on turn 3 shuts you off for an entire turn. If you somehow don't have a turn 2/3 play then get them out there, but be aware of how awkward they can make your mana.

Hellsau
Jan 14, 2010

NEVER FUCKING TAKE A NIGHT OFF CLAN WARS.
Welp Familiars is still great. Logged into MTGO for the first time in a month to play the Ravnica Throwback Gauntlet which yesterday's announcements said were running, spoiler alert they start tomorrow. Decided to run a Pauper League instead and 5-0ed.



Round 1: Monoblack. Mulldrifter is still great. I actually managed to lose game 2 when my opponent went Phyrexian Rager, Pestilence, Pestilence, and I found zero Snaps or Horrors to blow them out, so they went Merchant into Merchant to burn me to 0. Won game 3 easily through double Choking Sands double Wrench Mind.

Round 2: UG Turbofog. Opponent drew three Jace's Erasure after seeing 20 cards in game 1 and I couldn't find a Familiar or a Horror fast enough, then they lost two games easily because I brought in four Pyroblasts. Brainstorm is real good against opposing Jace's Erasures.

Round 3: Burn. Lost game 1 (it was actually close because I drew two gainlands) and won both sideboard games through bringing in 8 cards.

Round 4: Boros Monarch. These new builds take what was previously a slightly advantaged matchup and makes it very nearly unwinnable for them. Zero Rally the Peasants and zero Kuldotha Rebirths removes their swarm blowout wins, and they really suffer for it. I'm still struggling to actually figure out a sideboard strategy but at this point I'm going to just keep all the Stonehorns in and see if they can ever beat it. Most of the winning lists aren't playing a single land destruction spell, which seems bonkers to me since the maindecks all seem to be teching against each other for the mirror, and having a couple Earth Rifts to blow up bouncelands and help with the Tron matchup seems good. Siding into Gorilla Shamans for opposing artifact lands and Earth Rifts for their bouncelands seems like a really good way to just demolish the mirror, dunno. Either way I bring in 3 Hydroblast and some number of Dispels for opposing LD and Pyroblasts already so I guess I'll see how the Boros decklists evolve.

Round 5: Tron. I beat Tron. It wasn't even a bad build or a poor draw from them - game 1 they got me but it was reasonably close even though they started with Swiftwater Cliffs into Flame Slash my Familiar Tower, Flame Slash my Familiar Mine, Power Plant go, play Painted Bluffs and Mulldrifter, play Tower Mulldrifter! They were playing at least 6 counters maindeck plus more in the side, and I managed to pull through in game 2 because they inexplicably decided to waste premium counterspells on a Familiar and a Mystical Teachings, and then decided to try to push through an Ulamog's Crusher as a win condition when I was at 21 and had 5 creatures in play. They had 2 minutes left before they finally conceded as I had two Walls, two Familiars and a million counterspells and a Flicker in hand. I sided all my black out for game 3, sided in all Stonehorns, all my sideboard cards except the Circles, and basically decided that I wasn't going to win the game through any way but time out. They then mulliganed, played a Mine, and never played another card.

Seriously I'd play Tron if I topdecked into natural tron as often as my opponents do. Either way Familiars just smashes all the Plains and Forest decks and beats all opposing midrange decks handily, so if you play fast and don't mind getting ranched by Tron and nut draws from the aggro-combo decks, play this poo poo. Incidentally, this deck gets worse in paper play, even though you get to play Capsize as a tutorable game-ender, because a lot of my wins come down to timing my opponents out and it turns out timing out in paper is substantially worse at winning matches. That was not what I expected.

I'm currently trying to figure out a Tron-based version of this. A Tron deck wins against Familiars since it just has a massive mana advantage for (seemingly) zero work. If I can figure out a Tron-based Flicker deck that jams four Stonehorns, suddenly I've got a deck that beats all the midrange nonsense, beats all Plains and Forest based decks, and presumably can handle the mirror better than Familiars can. We'll see how that works.

Network42
Oct 23, 2002
I've been seeing a red LD type deck online with Stone Rain, Crack the Earth, and thermo-alchemist. Anyone have a list? I can't seem to find one searching.

Hellsau
Jan 14, 2010

NEVER FUCKING TAKE A NIGHT OFF CLAN WARS.

Network42 posted:

I've been seeing a red LD type deck online with Stone Rain, Crack the Earth, and thermo-alchemist. Anyone have a list? I can't seem to find one searching.

This is the Crack the Earth decklist I have built in paper. Note that it was built in August 2016 so it's....slightly out of date.

2 Bloodfell Caves
4 Chromatic Star
4 Crack the Earth
4 Evolving Wilds
2 Goblin Matron
4 Great Furnace
3 Gurmag Angler
4 Ichor Wellspring
1 Krark-Clan Shaman
4 Kuldotha Rebirth
4 Lightning Bolt
2 Beetleback Chief
2 Mogg War Marshal
4 Molten Rain
8 Snow-Covered Mountain
1 Snow-Covered Swamp
1 Sparksmith
1 Terminate
4 Terrarion
1 Warren Weirding

2 Ancient Grudge
2 Gorilla Shaman
2 Grotesque Mutation
2 Krark-Clan Shaman
3 Pyroblast
2 Relic of Progenitus
2 Terminate

Mezzanon
Sep 16, 2003

Pillbug
Started week two of a local paper pauper league that I’m running. Good meta so far:

2 U Delver
1 UR Delver
3 Izzet Blitz
1 Burn
2 Elves
2 Affinity
2 Tron
1 Mono B
1 UB Control
1 Temur Control
1 Dredge
1 Acid Trip

Mezzanon
Sep 16, 2003

Pillbug
Played R2 of my local paper modern league and got paired against 16 land mono-u delver.

Won 2-1

G1: lost the die roll, opponent has timely counterspells and 2x delver and I don’t gain a significant amount of life. Also I draw 2 spreading seas.

Side out: 3x seagate Oracle, 4x spreading seas
Side in: 3x geist, 2x counterspell, 1x dispel, 1x Sunlance

G2: I gain about 16 life while running my opponent out of resources. Eventually I have 4 flying attackers to my opponents one flying blocker

G3: every creature my opponent plays gets removed, I dispel an annul, I Kor sanctifier a curse of chains, then bounce it and get a spire golem next turn. That’s all she wrote.

uPen
Jan 25, 2010

Zu Rodina!
VS UB control in paper pauper this weekend:
I'm casting Mystical Teachings for U to search up Mystical Teachings for U to search for dispel.
Opponent 'This seems unfair.'

Familiar is nothing if not a shitload of fun.

Hellsau
Jan 14, 2010

NEVER FUCKING TAKE A NIGHT OFF CLAN WARS.
Went 5-2 in the Pauper Challenge today with Stonehorn Tron, finishing in 11th. Top 7 were all 6-1s so missing on the one spot doesn't feel too bad except the way I lost game 3 of match 7 was miserable. My tiebreakers were loving atrocious after round 6 so I knew I had to win to make it, and I couldn't. Here's what I'm working with:



First things first - do not play this deck. It's quite good, however you aren't fast enough to play it. Even I was nearly too slow to play it and I am comically fast at Flicker loops.





Those opponents were on Rebels (non-Tron) and GWr Midnight Gond / flashback abuse deck, and if I weren't as abnormally quick as I am I would have lost both matches to time. It's absurd how many clicks it takes to actually win, and I suspect I need to add one or two additional Dinrova Horrors, but we'll get to that. Here's how my matches went:

Round 1: Rebels. They can never win this match, except game 1 they searched for a whole boatload of creatures - they had 15 creatures in play while I had to Capsize their lands + my Dignitary to keep locking down combat. Eventually I capsized all of their lands, then all their creatures, and beat them to death with a bunch of 1/3s and 1/4s and ended that game with 9:23 left on my clock. For game 2 I got to bring in Gutshots to Flicker loop Walls to actually be able to kill my opponent's creatures, and finished the game with 2 minutes left. I have no doubt that 99% of MTGO players would have timed out in my position there, against a deck where you've got to be 90%+ favored.

Round 2: Tron mirror. Game 2 I kept a hand of Oracle, Oracle, Prohibit, Pyroblast, Wall, Island, Grotto, and did not draw a tron piece in my top 20ish cards, by which point my opponent had Horror+Wall+Flicker. I drew no Teachings, Horrors or Walls in the top 27 cards in game 3, but I did draw 13 lands! I lost horribly. Tron mirrors are dumb.

Round 3: RDW. My opponent kept a bad hand game 1 (bolt, bolt, Dash Heelcutter turn 3? that isn't keepable) and brought in WAY too many sideboard cards. I mean yeah they found two Smash to Smithereens and three Molten Rains but their Mogg Conscripts didn't do anything because they didn't have creatures. Pulse of Murasa is a messed up magic card against red decks.

Round 4: UR Delver. I won the games where I drew Mulldrifters and lost the game I didn't draw a Mulldrifter or a Flicker or a Teachings. Incidentally games 1 and 2 my opponent turn 1 Delver blind flip - I won game 2 (barely), and in game 1 I would have won if my opponent did not blind flip the actual first turn OR they didn't topdeck a Gush into their third Lightning Bolt. This would have been a real miserable match to lose.

Round 5: GWr Midnight Guard/Presence of Gond combo, with Battle Screech + Rally the Peasants to steal wins, and a bunch of Soul Wardens/Attendants to buy time. Against this deck they're huge dogs because they can't interact with Flicker+Wall and Stonehorn does good work....but I can't actually kill their poo poo. My opponent cast two Commune with the Gods, milling themselves for 10, so I decided to win by decking them. That involved Flickering/playing Stonehorns 46 times against an opponent with multiple Midnight Guards, Soul Wardens and Soul's Attendants in play - it was a nightmare. Eventually we got into a groove where I could burn as much of their clock off as I spent Flickering, and once I stocked up 20 combat steps skipped I took off all my stops and we just had an F6 war where we hoped the other player's client would crash first - but it never happened. Ended with my opponent on 12:00 and me at 12:30. During sideboarding I redid my stops and restarted the client, finished sideboarding, clicked submit, kept a hand with 3 lands, Wall/Stonehorn/Flicker and a Capsize....and skipped my first turn because my goddamn stops didn't save. I still won that game with 7 minutes left because Stonehorn Dignitary is a hero and Capsize/Horror laughs at Journey to Nowhere. A single targeted draw spell would make these kind of matches trivial, and it makes me want to play a single Compulsive Research which you can loop with Flicker on two Walls to mill the opponent, but I'd vastly prefer to play an instant speed spell so it could be fetchable with Teachings. I'm not sure if there's actually an instant that does that at a reasonable rate.

Round 6: BR Madness Kiln Fiend Angler. Basically take all the good cards out of UR Kiln Fiend and add Anglers, Faithless Looting + Fiery Temper, Chain Lightning and Fireblast, and Anglers and Blightnings for black. I almost lost game 2, even though I had 3 mulldrifters and a land after getting turn 3 Blightninged, because I drew an absurd number of lands from them, but my opponent missed on burn the turn I was forced to tap out of Dispel mana to Capsize their two lethal Gurmag Anglers and then it was trivial to win.

Round 7: Game one my opponent went Island Faerie Miscreant, turn two Island two Miscreants. I someone won that game because I drew three Mulldrifters in 20 cards and had early Tron. Game 2 I lost because I drew zero mulldrifters in 25 cards + 3 card on the bottom that Oracles sent there and drew 12 lands (plus two Maps), so...that was frustrating. Game 3 I had a zero land 7, zero land 6, and a 1 land Map 5, kept a land on top (neither were Tron lands) and my opponent went 1-drop into Ninja. Turn 4 I had to Evoke a Mulldrifter - if that Mulldrifter was an Oracle, I believe I win that game even from my disasterous position. That was not a good way to go out.

So...Tron is stupid. This version compared to the Familiar version trades reliability and versitility for Tron, which is a good trade. This version is worse against the aggro decks where an 0/3 matters, but it's still wildly favored against Forest and Plains decks, while also not being a total dog to Tron. The problem with Tron is just drawing all mana - it's not uncommon to have gone 20 cards deep, have 8 lands in play, two in hand, and a couple Signets or Prisms. Speaking of Prism, this deck wants Prisms 5-8 and probably Prisms 8-10 if it could. Signets unfortunately are the next best ways to get colored mana - Prismatic Lens doesn't cut it since you really need that colored mana on time. However, Signets make casting off-color or sideboard cards a pain in the rear end. I was liberally siding those Signets out and feeling good about it.

Changes: I'm going to add a Compulsive Research or Deep Analysis or an equivalent Instant effect either main or side so I can actually kill my opponents. Signets are going in lieu of a fourth Map (to maximize early Tron) and another mana source. The Haunted Fengraf is awesome since it makes post-Tron Maps useful. I would really love another good spellland, but I'm probably just going for a 5th Shimmering Grotto since there's not a whole lot of spell lands in Pauper that are late-game-useful. I might be forced to go back to that lovely cycling land that always clunked up my or my opponents draws, but maybe something that just turns a late Map in 5:Draw a Card is good enough. More Horrors would make the Tron mirror much better, and make actually finishing games in a reasonable amount of time much more likely. The UG gain land has been pretty terrible for me, only casting three cards in the deck, and I'm replacing it with an Unknown Shores since if you need Green you probably have a Prism or Grotto by then. I have no idea what counters to play, except that Prohibit and Condescend have been great an equal amount of the time and worse than a proactive card an equal amount of time. Condescend is certainly much worse post-sideboard when opponents bring in Dispel and Pyroblast, so they get routinely swapped for my own Blasts/Dispels. Prohibit mostly just stays in all the time. 4 Stonehorns is great and I would not trim them. 3 Walls and 4 Oracles/4 Mulldrifters has been great, and I'd play more Mulldrifters if I could. The Teachings package has been great and I don't want to swap to Forbidden Alchemy at all. Crop Rotation is the first thing sided out if the opponent can possibly have Dispel, but it's been fine maindeck as a weird land searcher/ritual that you can Teachings for. Capsize is a backup Wall/Flicker to lock people with Stonehorn if you have an absurd amount mana, which Tron frequently does. All I'd really want is an efficient, powerful targeted instant speed draw spell to Teachings for, and I don't think such a thing exists in Pauper.

For the sideboard, a 3rd Hydroblast would be fine but it's not necessary. Pulse of Murasa does some messed up poo poo to Burn and RDW, and even against Affinity you can sometimes just go up enough life that Atog+Fling can't kill you. It'd be nice to have more Hydroblasts against the Boros Monarch decks but they're inexplicably moving away from sideboard Molten Rains and totally explicably moving away from Kuldotha Rebirth, so Hydroblast is still fine against them but not vital. Not having to run out Bouncelands against potential LD makes this much less risky, and Pulse of Murasa (again) comes through to just raise dead your destroyed Tron piece. I would appreciate Hydroblasts 3 and 4 against Kiln Fiend but that's a pretty slim need. Gut Shot is absurd against Delver decks and is a card worth bringing in against decks you're already heavily favored against - just killing your opponent's turn 1 play buys you a lot of time, but it really is there to make the Delver matchup better by making Spellstutter unreliable while killing turn 1 Delvers or Faerie Miscreants to prevent a snowball game. I want to try one Serrated Arrows over a Gut Shot, but it's probably better as a Gut Shot. Reaping is just to make sure you win the grindy matchups, but it's the first card on the chopping block. I'm going to test a Deep Analysis in its place, as a mixture of a loopable win condition and a way to outgrind an opponent. Shattering Pulse and Allay are my preference over Ancient Grudge and Ray of Revelation, mostly because you often just want to kill the first target and don't care about flashing it back, and if you want to kill two things you're much more likely to want to kill 5+ things. The exception is that Grudge is MUCH better in the mirror since you just get to take out two Prisms/Signets with minimal investment, but I'm already tight for space for the Tron mirrors, bringing in 3 Dispel and 4 Pyroblasts. I'm not sure what I'm going to even cut in the mirror anymore with the removal of Signets (which I was already totally cutting during sideboarding to minimize the damage Grudge could do) so whatever, Shattering Pulse gets to stay. Pulse is pretty messed up against Affinity/Boros/anything with artifact lands.

Welp that's a lot of words for a deck that none of you can play fast enough to reliably avoid timing out with. Long story short ban delver ban gush ban probe ban flicker ban tron.

Some Numbers
Sep 28, 2006

"LET'S GET DOWN TO WORK!!"
The only common instants that target a player to draw are Inspiration and its Surge clone and Oona's Grace. Oona's Grace might not actually be that bad.

You could also run a Vision Charm, which is U, Instant, Mill 4.

Hellsau
Jan 14, 2010

NEVER FUCKING TAKE A NIGHT OFF CLAN WARS.

Some Numbers posted:

The only common instants that target a player to draw are Inspiration and its Surge clone and Oona's Grace. Oona's Grace might not actually be that bad.

You could also run a Vision Charm, which is U, Instant, Mill 4.

Vision Charm does nothing EXCEPT mill, which isn't the point. Familiars gets to run a bunch of Compulsive Researches, so even if they've got 10 cards left against the opponent's 40 and a million life, Familiars can deck the opponent, but with a card that is otherwise good. Oona's Grace might actually be worthwhile, it's a draw engine that you can Teachings for, hm.

Anyway made changes, went into a league, played against Boros, they kept a hand on the play of one RW Gain land, a Relic, and did not play a second land OR crack the Relic for literally six turns. Eventually I played a Dinrova Horror, Flickered it and a Mulldrifter, and then they conceded when I cast Mystical Teachings. Literally never play Relic of Progenitus, it's apparently too tempting to avoid making really stupid plays with it.

Elyv
Jun 14, 2013



Mental Note might be worth considering.

suicidesteve
Jan 4, 2006

"Life is a maze. This is one of its dead ends.


Isn't Thought Scour just a Strictly Better Mental Note?

Some Numbers
Sep 28, 2006

"LET'S GET DOWN TO WORK!!"
Especially in this case, since Mental Note literally can't target the opponent.

Elyv
Jun 14, 2013



Er yes I meant Thought Scour, I conflated the two.

Hellsau
Jan 14, 2010

NEVER FUCKING TAKE A NIGHT OFF CLAN WARS.
Okay looking at the UR Delver list (6th) that beat me in the win-and-in, I'm real salty about losing to it. They apparently boarded in 8-11 cards - they played four Pyroblasts and three Relics, AND played at least one Stormbound Geist. What the gently caress did they take out? They kept in all four Skreds for game 2 at least.

Bah. Decent top 8 for Tron too.

Mezzanon
Sep 16, 2003

Pillbug

Hellsau posted:

Okay looking at the UR Delver list (6th) that beat me in the win-and-in, I'm real salty about losing to it. They apparently boarded in 8-11 cards - they played four Pyroblasts and three Relics, AND played at least one Stormbound Geist. What the gently caress did they take out? They kept in all four Skreds for game 2 at least.

Bah. Decent top 8 for Tron too.

I was just looking over and saw your name in the 11th place spot.


How loving bananas is that G/W/R splinter twin deck though?

Mezzanon fucked around with this message at 23:20 on Feb 26, 2018

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Hellsau
Jan 14, 2010

NEVER FUCKING TAKE A NIGHT OFF CLAN WARS.

Mezzanon posted:

How loving bananas is that G/W/R splinter twin deck though?

It's probably fine except Midnight Guard gets owned by Bolt and the deck can't beat Counterspells and Mulldrifters and Electrickery is a problem for your plan and you'd be under constant time pressure and actually going infinite isn't really feasible online and your manabase is underwhelming and you get owned by Viridian Longbow pretty hard.

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