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It would be a shame to outright ban CI, it's the kind of card the restricted limit was made for: it's fun dumb jank for the most part that needs some combos gently trimmed when they've overgrown. But really the thing that elevated the ID to greatness is that in the post-rotation world it's main weakness (aggresive cred denial by the runner) was rendered moot with Stinsons and lack of Siphons and stuff.
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Feb 22, 2018 10:46
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Deviant posted:i'm sorry (EDIT) did we live in a world where gabe, account siphon, desperado, and sneakdoor (EDIT) didn't exist? I dropped out at around the same time, but I switched out Gabe for Andromeda so that I was nearly guaranteed to get all of those cards in my starting hand, along with an HQ interface. On occasion they would let me win the game in 2 turns. To that end, I can see why they banned Siphon since getting it in your starting hand and using it Turn 1 essentially turbo-fucks the Corp for the rest of the game, but lol at Tapwrm and Gang Sign being effective replacements. Both require the Corp to be ahead of you, which I guess might work if you're Iain Stirling but no one else. LuiCypher fucked around with this message at 17:10 on Feb 22, 2018 |
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Feb 22, 2018 17:04
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Gang Sign is bad because it doesn't require you to run, and not running keeps the Corp from interacting with it. Tapwrm is good because it forks the Corp into two hard choices and also requires a run.
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Feb 22, 2018 17:38
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Is anyone going to store champs at FFGC on Saturday?
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Feb 22, 2018 20:35
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I'm not local to FFG HQ, but I do have an OP event next weekend I'm looking forward to
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Feb 22, 2018 21:56
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Let's say, hypothetically, I'm a total scrublord, and I don't even have a corp deck together for Saturday - NBN or Weyland? Any ID suggestions for either? e: I really dig Jinteki in theory but I am nowhere near good enough to actually win games with it, as I've found. H-B looks cool too but I don't really "get" it and would probably end up running terrible poo poo like O2 Shortage.
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Feb 23, 2018 00:16
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I'm a total scrub and went with NBN for my first SC this weekend (SoCal). There's a really fun Haarpsichord Studios deck on NetrunnerDB that I've been playing on JNet. It takes a little bit of getting used to, but allows for some good easy mindgames and is a slightly different approach to play to corp than most decks. The idea of the deck is very straightforward: swap for high point agendas with Exchange of Information, force the runner to make bad plays/get tagged with An Offer You Can't Refuse, and score out from under them with Franchise City. Bonus points if you get them to run through a Data Raven/Thoth into a Quantum Predictive Model.
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Feb 23, 2018 01:22
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food court bailiff posted:Let's say, hypothetically, I'm a total scrublord, and I don't even have a corp deck together for Saturday - NBN or Weyland? Any ID suggestions for either? I'm a sucker for Spark but you can run better NBN glacier setups out of basically anything else. Controlling the Message is still good - combine it with Aryabhata Tech to make the runner feel bad. Tagstorm decks aren't as popular with Misdirection out there so Sync has fallen off. I'd suggest running CtM with MCA Austerity Policy to fast advance things out. Weyland has a lot of fun poo poo now. Builder of Nations is viable, usually combo-ing out with advancement tokens and constant meat damage. Jemison doesn't have enough support but if you wanna be a crazy diamond, go nuts. Skorpios or Gagarin are for if you hate people. Titan Fast Advance using Dedication Ceremony on Reconstruction Contract to cheat out Atlas scores is pretty okay too.
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Feb 23, 2018 01:58
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Does anyone have any hot & dirty tips for deckbuilding? Like, basic directional stuff? To explain more, I have had some success with Runner decks because I fundamentally understand the Runner's position more, but I'm falling pretty flat on my face in terms of executing the grand plans I have for my corp decks. As I've been playing more games, I've come to realize that I need to rethink the way that I look at Corp, and that I need to make sure I have victory conditions that aren't contingent on the runner doing what I want them to do, because then I just sit there waiting for the runner to take my bait and watching them not while they build their engines. I feel like this concept might have been helpful to have known going into deckbuilding just to speed the process up. So what do you guys find in general deck building philosophy for both Corp & Runner that has worked for you? I'm less interested in great combos (although those are always cool) and more interested in general theory. 
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Feb 23, 2018 02:09
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I'm rubbish at corp deckbuilding but a good rule of thumb would be: how can you make tons of money while also keeping the runner poor? Start with your own economy and a strategy that works reasonably within that economy (keep it simple to start), then focus on how you can make the runner's economy tank or work against them. Jam a bunch of games with an easy-to-play/straight-forward deck, then add some spice to taste.
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Feb 23, 2018 03:07
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First is to figure out how you want to win. Fast Advance/Glacier/Kill? Get the core cards required for that win condition into your deck. Generally that'll get you about 20-25 cards with your agenda suite. Next is to figure out how to win the economic metagame. How do you tax the runner of their 3 resources- Credits, Clicks and Cards- as well as how do you boost your own economy. Add those in- that'll probably be another 20-ish cards. Start adding in card synergies until you feel sastisfied. Now that you're over 49 cards, start cutting the weaker parts of the deck until you get to that 49 card count. Now test it over like 20-ish games and start seeing where your weak points are, and what cards feel like they aren't doing their job. Cut those cards, and add in cards that help defend your weaker points, and continue to iterate.
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Feb 23, 2018 03:58
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Corp isn't all that different from the runner at the highest level. You need some idea of how you're going to win, ideally a backup plan in case that doesn't work, and some way to disrupt your opponents plan, or at least to seize the initiative if you can. You want them to be reacting to you, not vice versa. With the runner the way you do that is obvious: you make runs on servers, or at least you threaten them. It's not as intuitively clear as the Corp, since thematically they're the defenders. The most obvious way is to just rush agendas out. That way you threaten to win before the runner can set up, you force them to dig for breakers (spending clicks and maybe discarding cards they'd rather keep), etc. You can also do it with reactive cards like HHN or Sea Source, assets the runner can't afford to ignore like Urban Renewal or MCAP and so on. If you can get to five points the runner will have to check every face down card you play, which is a really powerful position to be in Basically try to execute your plan without giving the runner space to execute theirs. In general as the Corp (unless you're playing Prison or something similar) you're the one on the clock, as a late game runner will usually have an advantage. Zephro fucked around with this message at 18:17 on Feb 23, 2018 |
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Feb 23, 2018 18:14
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If you're going for a glacier-y deck aiming to build impassable/extremely costly to run servers to score agendas behind in the mid-to-late game be sure to pack some assets or upgrades you can use to bait/force runs. There will be situations where the runner is waiting patiently amassing heaps of gold that will render them completely unstoppable. In such cases, you will need them to give it a shot so they break their bank and give you a short window to rush something out before they are able to afford the next expensive run.
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Feb 23, 2018 18:22
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It's super old and about MTG, but this article is a good idea at thinking about your overall goal of the deck and then building around that. It isn't exactly apt but Rush decks, Tempo decks and Control decks are somewhat applicable to many corp builds (ignoring combo decks as I don't think combo decks are really apt for learning how to build a corp), and knowing whether you want to be the aggressor (or how aggressive you want to be) is a big part of building decks. If you think you are a rush deck you want to focus on drawing cards, cheap burst economy and cheap, gear checking ICE, and possibly a way to fast advance your agendas to keep you going. You don't care about the runner setting up or long term taxing of the runner, and you often only have one real path to victory: to score 7 points before the runner (often with a final score of 7-5 or something similar). Tempo decks are fast, but don't need to be as fast as a rush deck. You basically want to stay one turn in front of the runner, which usually requires more than one way to tax the runner as you go. If you hear about "never advance" styles of scoring it is usually in a tempo deck - an ideal game you install a card in a remote every single turn, forcing the runner to have to waste resources to check it to see if it's an agenda, a trap, or just bait that doesn't really matter one way or another (could be a limited econ card, or an upgrade like Cyberdex Virus Suite, or something else that isn't relevant that particular turn). A lot of hybrid rush/kill decks fit this mold - you go fast, but you have options (HHN for example) to punish a runner who gets too greedy or plays too aggressively. Here the kill is usually a backup win plan, and you are still trying to get to 7 quickly, but you have more options based on the runner you are facing and how they play. You probably won't win a long game against the runner, but you also don't have to win by turn 10 or so to have a chance. Control decks get much broader in their style, but the main idea is finding a way to stabilize and tax the runner out of a resource. Glacier decks, asset spam (some varieties), prison decks. It's harder to generalize them, at least for me, so I'm sure other people can speak about them more.
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Feb 23, 2018 20:34
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Last night I go to the FLGS to pick up a bunch of datapacks to round out my decks for today. Today I realize that the FLGS is open for like two friggin' hours before the tournament, and if i would have grabbed the datapacks today, they would have waived my entry fee.
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Feb 24, 2018 15:37
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food court bailiff posted:Last night I go to the FLGS to pick up a bunch of datapacks to round out my decks for today. Dang. I feel like any FLGS worth its salt would just recognize you bought a bunch of packs in preparation and waive your entry fee anyway.
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Feb 24, 2018 16:25
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Yeah, they were cool about it, so I'm going to get my rear end kicked for free. e: lol more people here have played in Worlds than haven't. At least I lucked into a first round bye so I got some sweet Shaper tokens I don't know what they are and I won't be eliminated right away. update: tokens are a sweet click counter, I'm just dumb. And I achieved my goal of winning a game!! 
Rockman Reserve fucked around with this message at 00:11 on Feb 25, 2018 |
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Feb 24, 2018 17:27
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Rules question: my opponent uses Kit and Inversificator to break the subroutine on Kakugo and passes it, and uses the trigger on Inversificator to swap Kakugo with another piece of ICE elsewhere. Does Kakugo's on-passing effect still fire?
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Feb 25, 2018 00:52
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The classic Spark problem is every Spark deck is better in another ID that gives some other benefit. Fine, every now and again you'll cripple some poor Runner, or make them fail a run into a facecheck and win off it, but by & large, it'll rapidly become irrelevant.
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Feb 25, 2018 01:05
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I'm glad you guys posted other things so I can keep posting about this tournament without triple-editing or double-posting. Today, I died to both a Boom! and a Brainstorm+does it even matter lol It was awesome. sorry i'm just really hype to have played with a bunch of cool people, this game owns. this is literally the only store card game event i've ever been to where nobody said something lovely, even as a "joke".
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Feb 25, 2018 01:19
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food court bailiff posted:sorry i'm just really hype to have played with a bunch of cool people, this game owns. this is literally the only store card game event i've ever been to where nobody said something lovely, even as a "joke". I remember a while back someone posted a complaint on stimhack that all the good runners were women and a mod closed the thread saying basically "look i get this is in good faith but please try to be understanding of other people's experiences; also Noise has been top tier for months now git gud scrub"
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Feb 25, 2018 01:24
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StashAugustine posted:I remember a while back someone posted a complaint on stimhack that all the good runners were women and a mod closed the thread saying basically "look i get this is in good faith but please try to be understanding of other people's experiences; also Noise has been top tier for months now git gud scrub" Wait what? Edit:. Oh, lady runner IDs, I see what they meant.
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Feb 25, 2018 02:14
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TL;DR: Nerds are awful and female characters being good at things is scary and unrealistic. (Noise really was top-tier at the time, too, pretty indisputably.)
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Feb 25, 2018 02:16
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I am reading people's reports of their SCs today and it's like opposite land, tons of people running Sunny, monoliths everywhere, madness. At the store I played at, I don't know if anyone other than me was running as someone other than MaxX or Ayla. I did see a monolith though, not in my game but in an absolutely absurd Round 4 finish I got to watch that ended in a psi-or-die with both players at like 3 cards in their decks. Rockman Reserve fucked around with this message at 03:00 on Feb 25, 2018 |
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Feb 25, 2018 02:24
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Speaking of awesome female runners and also store champs, I did really bad in the sc I went to today but there was a lot of people playing Smoke and I was given the Smoke poster that came with the kit, the only smoke themed item other than the sc winner plaque that I was missing. Next week is another sc and I since I have all the prizes from the current kit that I want I was thinking of running dumb jank with the goal of pulling off a dumb combo at least once during the tournament. Current ideas include: -Skorp with 1x takeover + 3x vanity as my entire agenda suite, goal: host them all in one server using 3x full immersion rec studio. Maybe include a self-destruct to blow it all up -AGI with OfferYCR that bounces the runner into a remote with trap ice, and a self-destruct powered by a bunch of stacked upgrades -Bookmark + Severnius Stim Implant to draw almost my entire deck and make a big R&D run (or HQ vs CI). Maybe ProCo for draw+money and feedback/sports hopper to survive snares and other traps
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Feb 25, 2018 06:59
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Baron Fuzzlewhack posted:Rules question: my opponent uses Kit and Inversificator to break the subroutine on Kakugo and passes it and uses the trigger on Inversificator to swap Kakugo with another piece of ICE elsewhere.
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Feb 25, 2018 09:41
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Zephro posted:Presumably yes? I played against someone on jnet where this happened at least once a turn, and I questioned it and didn't get a solid answer. It was the first time I'd played against Inversificator so I decided to just go with the other person's ruling and look it up later, but I had a feeling they were playing it incorrectly. They still had a Feedback Filter out to counter the net damage from Kakugo, but that would have drained their money a lot faster in that game.
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Feb 25, 2018 17:46
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You still passed Kakugo, it does not care that it is no longer in the same server. It fires.
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Feb 25, 2018 18:05
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I do not think enough was done to nerf CI. Even if VLC is banned, Brain Rewiring still makes the deck work fine. Maybe I'm crazy. Someone tell me I'm crazy, because I don't want to keep having to run at HQs with half a deck in them every game.
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Feb 26, 2018 16:26
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food court bailiff posted:I do not think enough was done to nerf CI. Even if VLC is banned, Brain Rewiring still makes the deck work fine. Maybe I'm crazy. Someone tell me I'm crazy, because I don't want to keep having to run at HQs with half a deck in them every game. Slot. The. Strike.
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Feb 26, 2018 16:39
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Well clearly I'm a damned idiot because I was just sitting here thinking "huh, what should I slot in as my Runner restricted, I don't really need that Mopus with this goofy cheap Smoke". Thanks. plus Smoke + employee strike is thematic af
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Feb 26, 2018 16:43
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Baron Fuzzlewhack posted:Rules question: my opponent uses Kit and Inversificator to break the subroutine on Kakugo and passes it, and uses the trigger on Inversificator to swap Kakugo with another piece of ICE elsewhere. I would say yes, because even if you switch the ICE around the runner still had to pass Kakugo to use Inversificator's effect. Let's look at the text: "Inversificator" posted:
Bolded for emphasis. The card's text specifically says you have to pass the ice with Inversificator to trigger its swap effect. Therefore, the runner still passes Kakugo and still triggers its net damage effect.
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Feb 26, 2018 18:50
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food court bailiff posted:Well clearly I'm a damned idiot because I was just sitting here thinking "huh, what should I slot in as my Runner restricted, I don't really need that Mopus with this goofy cheap Smoke". Thanks. But if CI has half their deck in their hand then they just play a counter current on the next turn. He's definitely planned for Strikes. Slot the Information Sifting?
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Feb 26, 2018 22:47
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AgentF posted:Slot the Information Sifting? Yes. Every game I win against CI is from this one run. The only time I lost was because it was on the bottom of my deck 
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Feb 27, 2018 08:28
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AgentF posted:But if CI has half their deck in their hand then they just play a counter current on the next turn. He's definitely planned for Strikes. Yeah the Strike is bad if you can't get it out super early but if you can beat the corp to the punch even a little they're going to have to waste credits on getting rid of it with another Current or whatever, so their hand limit goes down (at least a little) anyway. Plus Sifting isn't MWL and there's so much CI here I think I'm just going to run both. 
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Feb 27, 2018 16:46
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I am doing another SC tomorrow (because holy poo poo the local scene by me is cool). Someone convince me not to try to run BoN at 49 cards.
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Mar 3, 2018 03:00
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food court bailiff posted:I am doing another SC tomorrow (because holy poo poo the local scene by me is cool). Someone convince me not to try to run BoN at 49 cards. Nah, do it.
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Mar 3, 2018 04:12
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food court bailiff posted:I am doing another SC tomorrow (because holy poo poo the local scene by me is cool). Someone convince me not to try to run BoN at 49 cards. Good luck dude! I’m playing on Saturday too! No Tricks Smoke / Panama Front here.
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Mar 3, 2018 07:57
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Oof. 2-6 and only cuz I got a bye. Hope you did better ZZ!
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Mar 4, 2018 00:41
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1-5. I got absolutely rolled.(Admittedly, my first paper game with Palana, I missed every ID trigger -- you'd think my opponent would have said something...) I'm retiring Smoke for the foreseeable future. I play way too conservatively running her and build her too dependently on getting every piece together.
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Mar 4, 2018 04:45
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