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Wow, that mod is really good so far some minor issues here and there but something like a unit cap is something i have wanted for some time now!
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Mar 20, 2018 19:33
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I got pretty far in a wood elf campaign. My favorite part was turn 2 I couldn't afford my army. But that went away really fast. The amber cost for the oak of ages was much higher but didn't seem to be a concern.
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Mar 20, 2018 19:42
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S.J. posted:When something says 'active if casting' I assume that's only when your wizard is literally going through the casting animations for your spells? It means that when your wizard actually finishes the animation and casts the spell, the effect goes off, which in this case is a 10 second debuff. Different casting passives have different durations and targets but always apply when the spell actually casts. And for me the other big difference between C&C and SFO is that SFO gives me a bunch of new late game options for my doomstack while C&C kind of gets rid of doomstacks altogether with the global unit caps, which I prefer
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Mar 20, 2018 20:30
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Armies in C&C are really interesting; at first glance they look incredibly boring because each stack is going to have a shitload of core units, but all the units that got capped generally got noticeable buffs which means that using them feels really special and how you leverage your capped units generally swings the battle a lot. I'm normally in the camp of "gently caress units being locked behind tiers it's boring to use all spearmen for 70 turns" but the mod does a pretty good job of making me excited to incorporate one or two special units into an army as opposed to counting the turns until I can afford to replace my entire line with Swordmasters or whatever. Of note is that C&C also removes all interdependent building requirements so you don't have to worry about stupid poo poo like having to build an armory to recruit halberdiers, which helps mitigate the need to build far more military buildings than vanilla.
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Mar 20, 2018 21:07
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Estranged On The Range posted:Wow, that mod is really good so far Yeah, appreciate people bringing this mod to my attention, still in the looking things up stage, a few bugs that will probably be ironed out here and there, unit capacity stolen from tomb kings is always welcome, it worked out well for tomb kings. Some random observations in this mod so far: Unit HP was buffed out the wazoo, empire troops seem to be the baseline with basic infantry having 30k hp on ultra and 22.5k on large. On the undead side, tomb king units all have perfect vigor, vampire counts more fleshy like crypt ghouls or vampire units like vargheist and lords and tomb king lords instead of crumbling have a buff that says "this unit has full autonomy and will flee the battle if it turns against them" but those units don't have perfect vigor. Zombies have 180 models with 3 melee attack/defense and 5 weapon damage with zero AP, goblins have 200 models with better stats and a tiny anti-large but can break Casket of souls is insanely strong and downright broken, 500 range, fires 20 projectiles at a time and each barrage seemed to wipe out 80% of a unit, did a custom battle of a normal fund 12400g casket of soul army vs a 12400g greenskin army of gobbos/orc boys/black orcs/grimgor and the caskets wiped out every single unit below black orcs in one good hit, black orcs took two hits, grimgor then took 5 minutes of bashing his head against unkillable skeletons before he gave up. Same result against a full empire swordsman army, these things melt anything they fire at in 1-2 volleys. On the tomb king spell side, their cheap buff spells are all AOE and every spellcast is a global heal for 100 per second for 8 seconds, realm of souls is 100 per second for 10, 20, 30 seconds. Miscast damage is NOTICEABLE, Khatep went from 15k hp to 10k on a single miscast. Lore of metal has -75% mapwide enemy armor for 10 seconds per spellcast, but all the spells are long cooldown and high cost including searing doom, Plague of rust is a permanent debuff on a single unit, for 90 seconds they have -25% armor and then every 90 seconds after that it decreases another 25% until they have no armor, other lores have some other one time use permanent debuffs. Lore of death's passive life leech basically looks to be 1/3rd duration spirit leeches on the 2 closet units to the caster. Runelord runes have limited 1-3 uses, but some new effects like a vortex and a immobilize and the lord's runes is twice as powerful as the heroes. Slayers are a unit size of 30 with insane damage. There are still some borked numbers on a few things, like the lizardman public order building gives 450 income on the 2nd tier, 75 on the 3rd, they forgot to add a zero, in custom battles some lords mount options have negative costs, getting a horse on gelt makes him 650 cheaper, the first tier of the empire forge is 6000g and the final one is 1000g, these things will be easy to have fixed in short order at least and are just some numbers being wrong. The forge building is capital only and doesn't seem to be tied to unit recruitment in anyway, but instead each forge has a 300-500 income penalty and buffs all of your units by 1-2%, so there is a trade-off there, dwarves seem to have the best forges. It would be nice if it told you somewhere what new traits like "Preysighted" "Crusher" "Stunned" do before you'd invest in them. 15% global upkeep penalty seems to be gone, but every unit seems very expensive by itself. Spellcasters start the game with all their spells available and have the option to pick bound spells as part of their "pick 1 of 3" thing, this makes spellcasters way deadlier in the AI's hands and you might see something besides searing doom or fireball spam from the AI. Lords feel "samey" but can still be different from eachother in that every lord has basically the same skill lines, but you can make different choices for different units, though I'm sure some of the "pick 1 of 3" choices will have obvious "best" choices. Skaven get a food building, +3 food for -100 income up to +5 food for -200 income, replaces the trash pit chain. Goblin shaman get the same goblin buffing skill focus skarsnik and goblin warbosses get, something I always wanted a mod to do, they actually become a worthwhile lord to get. Ra Ra Rasputin fucked around with this message at 22:33 on Mar 20, 2018 |
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Mar 20, 2018 21:12
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That's interesting, I'll have to give it a try when I have time to see if I like it better than what SFO has done.
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Mar 20, 2018 21:38
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I am playing as beastmen in C&C and I haev never been so excited for ungors.
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Mar 20, 2018 21:42
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Ungors with poison but 75% more upkeep? Hell yes. Warhounds and poison warhounds with stalk? Oh hell yes. Harpies, chaos spawn, and manticores with sunder armor? Oh boy!
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Mar 20, 2018 21:49
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Man, it's a good thing that the usual red line skill buffs were taken out of C&C, because having Free Company with those stat boosts and Poison would be insanely effective. I also like some of the stat boosts you can choose, not just abilities: there's a pick for Empire State Troops that gives them a strong +15 armor in exchange for a speed penalty, which is a very good deal and also sounds like an option on tabletop that you could pick for them.
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Mar 20, 2018 22:32
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Some other changes: Shielded and Unshielded units seem to have -2 weapon strength +4 melee defense if they have a shield. Gor herds without shields only have 8 melee defense but trade that for a lot of attack/charge/damage Archer units have a stat that varies between Abysmal Accuracy on goblins to Poor, Decent and Excellent Accuracy on elves. Highelf archers (light armor) replaced by a unit called Hawkeye, 15 unit size, inspires other nearby archers to reload faster, high armor piercing and good stats. Martial Prowess melee defense replaced by 10-15% physical defense. Murderous Prowess is 50% damage/charge bonus, 75% and cause fear for mastery. Giants have 1200 weapon damage, Yeah. Chaos Marauders are expendable meatshields, Chaos also seems to have access to some basic beastmen infantry, including ungor raider archers, but don't have lord skills effecting them, could be unintended for them to have access to them, who knows, new mod jank. Most lords seem to get their big mount at level 23, that includes Helman Ghorst's cart, boo. Frenzy changed to +10 melee attack -5 defense. Ra Ra Rasputin fucked around with this message at 23:03 on Mar 20, 2018 |
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Mar 20, 2018 23:00
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lol
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Mar 20, 2018 23:10
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If you guys have feedback suggestions or find any bugs, send them into his steam community discussion on the mod page. He has been rather responsive and quick to fix the smaller things people are finding.
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Mar 21, 2018 01:32
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Third World Reggin posted:If you guys have feedback suggestions or find any bugs, send them into his steam community discussion on the mod page. He has been rather responsive and quick to fix the smaller things people are finding. Yeah, I posted the bugs I noticed on his bug thread, he already fixed it it seems. Skarsnik now instead of having a duplicate lightning strike in his skill tree now has 25% charge bonus for his army which is pretty nice. Ra Ra Rasputin fucked around with this message at 01:41 on Mar 21, 2018 |
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Mar 21, 2018 01:39
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I really like the Martial Prowess change in particular because it means that high elf infantry don't suddenly forget how to fight when they take casualties like in vanilla.
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Mar 21, 2018 01:56
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I think it's still when above 50%, it just means the bonus isn't obliterated by arrows and siege as easily. I haven't really gotten into a campaign with this mod yet, but a friend is experiencing some ... issues ... with the extra health on everything, he sent his cavalry charging into the back of a infantry block engaged with his line, didn't really do much besides send the units flying a bit, so he charged again and again, only so many units went flying from the charge they were now surrounding his infantry because they flew over the line. Ra Ra Rasputin fucked around with this message at 02:30 on Mar 21, 2018 |
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Mar 21, 2018 02:20
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Does anyone have that quote from Warhammer Fantasy Roleplay about Skaven? The one with the head height and leadership? Google failed me. 
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Mar 21, 2018 04:38
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I'm trying out the mod and one thing I really like initially is that heals or DoTs actually show how much they are affecting the unit. For example, Usirian's Incantation of Vengeance has a 25% chance to do 2 damage to each unit per second over 30 seconds. Restless Dead heals 100 damage per second over 8 seconds (prioritizing wounded units over ressurecting dead ones). This is a detail the stock game and none of the other mods really added, so it makes me happy.
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Mar 21, 2018 05:41
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Jum-Jum posted:Does anyone have that quote from Warhammer Fantasy Roleplay about Skaven? The one with the head height and leadership? I just saw it but can't remember were.
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Mar 21, 2018 06:13
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Third World Reggin posted:If you guys have feedback suggestions or find any bugs, send them into his steam community discussion on the mod page. He has been rather responsive and quick to fix the smaller things people are finding. Thanks for wasting all my spare time with this mod.  It's really good. Dryads with vanguard are hilariously strong.
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Mar 21, 2018 12:46
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Dogs of war when
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Mar 21, 2018 13:33
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Jum-Jum posted:Does anyone have that quote from Warhammer Fantasy Roleplay about Skaven? The one with the head height and leadership? "Body language plays a large role in Skaven communication. Posture, especially, is an indication of a Skaven's attitude towards his peers, underlings, and superiors. It is important for a lesser Skaven to keep his nose below the level of his master's. This can result in entire rooms of Skaven who seemingly bob their heads at random because each is attempting to give respect to those above him while at the same time maintaining his superiority over those below his station." - Children of the Horned Rat, page 42
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Mar 21, 2018 13:51
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Daeren posted:"Body language plays a large role in Skaven communication. Posture, especially, is an indication of a Skaven's attitude towards his peers, underlings, and superiors. It is important for a lesser Skaven to keep his nose below the level of his master's. This can result in entire rooms of Skaven who seemingly bob their heads at random because each is attempting to give respect to those above him while at the same time maintaining his superiority over those below his station." - Children of the Horned Rat, page 42 My hero!
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Mar 21, 2018 14:13
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OK, I've made it to about turn 160 in my Belegar campaign with Celtik's AI mod, and unfortunately I can't progress in the meantime because some weird bug is making it so that ruins I'm colonizing end up giving me a Tomb Kings ritual resource building I can't raze nor convert instead of the dwarf regional settlement, so I can't expand anymore. I can definitely say, however, that the AI mod is a winner when it comes to making the game harder. The biggest change it does is that it makes the AI build out their settlements in a more profitable/defensive manner, which meant that my steamrolling of the Greenskins after I took the best provinces in the Badlands (Karak-a-Karak down to Black Crag) still had to contend with walled settlements the entire way. The default setup seems to be income building + walls + variable (resource, recruitment, etc.), so in line with their bonuses, this makes the AI a serious threat once they get momentum. And the AI definitely knows how to use the income, because my near-nonstop wars against the Orcs would see me killing off armies with Belegar then frantically trying to secure as much territory as I can before the next Greenskin army rolled out and/or popped Waaaghs! and forced me back into the field. In hindsight, testing the mod with loving Belegar of all starts was kind of an insane decision, but it was fun nonetheless. What I don't like, however, is that the AI is still mercenary as ever when it comes to taking settlements of the wrong climate, nor do they endeavor to maintain coherent borders. I understand that this isn't the point of the mod, but it still sucks seeing the Empire become a dumb mishmash of Bretonnian, Elector Count, and a vassalized Grey Mountain dwarf clan's holdings while they were waging a hellwar against both the Vampires and the Chaos hordes. In terms of weird AI developments, a big shocker was finding out that the Vargs lost half its regions in Norsca to some Dark Elf invaders from across the oceans, which I hope would lead to some cool battles in the future. Another surprise was the Wood Elves getting murdered because they let the Beastmen just roll over King's Glade and the Oak, which was extremely strange and lead to a runaway Tilea conquering Skavenblight, the ruins of Estalia, Carcassone, and eventually King's Glade, leading to war against the disunited Wood Elf realms that remained. If that weird colonization bug gets fixed, I'll push to finish the game. Barring any cool new poo poo, however, I think I'll wait for the Norscans to return in May before starting a new campaign once more, with the AI climate change mod I used before on top of Celtik's mod. Hopefully they won't clash too much.
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Mar 21, 2018 16:20
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Mortal Empires turn length is the worst. I just beat SFO (short campaign) by Turn 160. At 2 minutes a turn, that's 5 hours of just watching things happen. I'd like to just have the screen turn black or something while all their poo poo happens.
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Mar 21, 2018 16:28
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jokes posted:Mortal Empires turn length is the worst. I just beat SFO (short campaign) by Turn 160. At 2 minutes a turn, that's 5 hours of just watching things happen. I'd like to just have the screen turn black or something while all their poo poo happens. I just Alt tab and read the forums for a minute between turns.
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Mar 21, 2018 16:30
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I do too, but it's still annoying coming back to a diplomacy popup that happened a second after I alt-tabbed away.
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Mar 21, 2018 16:31
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Is it actual processing time for their turns? Could someone make a mod that just changes the fast forward from 4x or whatever it is to 999x and make it go by instantly? Also, Cold Ones might not be the best units, but they look like little Compy dinosaurs running across the map and it's adorable.
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Mar 21, 2018 16:55
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Reik posted:Is it actual processing time for their turns? Could someone make a mod that just changes the fast forward from 4x or whatever it is to 999x and make it go by instantly? CPU processing time takes up most of it. Fast forward just makes the actual units move faster when you can see them. The best way to speed up end turn times is to turn down the number of decisions the AI can make, but that makes the AI weaker in a game that was already not super hard. There's a mod to drastically turn down AI->player diplomatic offers, which does help
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Mar 21, 2018 16:57
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Skarsnik C&C trip report Nasty skulkas are your only good unit for a long time accuracy: goblins < night goblins, night goblin fanatics < wolf riders, chariots, spider riders trolls are really useful Your upgrade for goblins are leadership, weapon damage, and melee defense. You get this three times. Missile units are ammunition, reload, and range. You get this twice. Mounted units are charge bonus, missile resistance, and armor piercing. Again, twice. Squigs are physical resistance, armor piercing, bonus vs infantry. Again twice. Weird part is armor piercing is +6 and bonus vs infantry is +5 so one of these is way better. Giants can get 40% missile resistance, giant spiders 30%, and trolls can get 12 leadership or 30% missile resistance. Fanatics were changed to a single cast vortex spell that kinda sits in front of the unit that casted it. I have yet to see it move. It is good. I am really afraid of dwarven miners since they beat up everything I have except for my mounted units, squigs, and some skulkas. 
Third World Reagan fucked around with this message at 17:07 on Mar 21, 2018 |
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Mar 21, 2018 17:01
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Kaza42 posted:CPU processing time takes up most of it. Fast forward just makes the actual units move faster when you can see them. The best way to speed up end turn times is to turn down the number of decisions the AI can make, but that makes the AI weaker in a game that was already not super hard. There's a mod to drastically turn down AI->player diplomatic offers, which does help It's not bad for the first like 20-30 turns, but it starts ballooning. And then, once it's just the player versus some other world-spanning empire the turns aren't bad but that's like turn 250. This should be in the OP or something, but if you pause during other factions' turns, you can change the camera settings and movement speed of other factions (by relation to you or individually) so that the camera just ignores neutral factions and they move nearly instantly, or they just move fast and you watch.
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Mar 21, 2018 17:05
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Third World Reggin posted:Skarsnik C&C trip report Think you can do a Grimgor preview?
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Mar 21, 2018 17:18
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Dandywalken posted:Think you can do a Grimgor preview? Sure. Let me go switch over. Also A+ 
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Mar 21, 2018 17:19
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Mar 21, 2018 17:22
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Grimgor has more of the same except for no repeat skills. So he has the same goblin, squig, and other unit buffs just not multiple times. Waaagh! path is level 10 Chariots are 30 charge, 35% missile resistance, or poison Orc Boys and Savage orcs get armour rending, prey sighted (chases down the enemy faster), or stubborn (??) All orc boar boys get 15 armor, 25 charge, or armour sundering Black orks get magical attacks, 15 melee defense, or unbreakable and +50% upkeep Biguns get +10 vs large, stunned, or expert charge defense The more neat choices are between hold the line, iron-hard, or from the front at level 10 and foe-seeker, deadly onslaught, or da green tide at 14.  A tier 4 barracks gets you 8 orc boyz, 5 arrer boyz, 5 nasty skulkers, 4 orc big uns, and 2 black orks. And that is the poo poo I love right there. Having a limit to these guys makes your core units more important and makes regiments of renown feel more special. I have been using chariots way more often than normal now. The only down side is they seem to run over people a lot and when they stand up, your cav is inside of the enemy unless you micro. This was my army turn 5 where I was defending against hordes of goblins.  My orc boar boyz and arty did a lot of work.
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Mar 21, 2018 18:00
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I'm doing a Khatep run with that mod. Obviously unit cap is unaffected, but the limitless vigor is great. The biggest improvement is that Lore of Nehekara having the buffs/debuffs be a huge AoE effect. I regret not getting an extra charge of sandstorm because for an embedded spell it is devastating. I'm guessing vortex spells in general were massively buffed. I can't wait to get his Casket since I heard that it is OP as poo poo. I don't care, given that they are normally 5k a pop. Looking forward to having a couple in his stack and just bombarding the gently caress out of enemies.
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Mar 21, 2018 18:22
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Stubborn in C&C buffs a wavering unit with Unbreakable for a time, IIRC.
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Mar 21, 2018 18:25
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The goblin shaman lord gets a choice between spell group A or spell group B.
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Mar 21, 2018 18:30
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My approach to end turn times is disabling or speeding up as much movement animation as I can and not using Cyrnos Faction Unlocker. The last time I tried that mod it had 1.5x longer end turn times on my CPU, which after 150-200 turns is pretty brutal. I still hope that someone will figure out how to replicate the technical features that mod has without any of the content additions. turn off the TV fucked around with this message at 18:42 on Mar 21, 2018 |
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Mar 21, 2018 18:40
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Why don’t night goblins have frenzy? I know it’s probably to balance the savage orcs having it, but they could at least give it to the fanatics.
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Mar 21, 2018 19:06
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Third World Reggin posted:Skarsnik C&C trip report You do realize that bonus vs infantry applies to both attack and damage, right?
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Mar 21, 2018 20:07
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