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Koramei posted:If you don't go republican every time in FotS what's even the point It’s a challenge by throwing everything at you grinding you down. I don’t consider that real challenge. If your only way to make the game challenging is to throw out half the game it’s bad sorry. As to your question unironically yes.
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Mar 21, 2018 03:09
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Anyone tried this Rome 2 mod compilation: Nordo's Better Rome II Compilation 19.0? Does anyone have a better suggestion?
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Mar 21, 2018 03:28
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I'm noticing battles look better in ThroB. Not great, just... better. Apparently there are only matched animations for kills, so there's less awkward shuffling. One thing that kills the battles for me in the Warscape games is seeing a bunch of nobodies with their weapons drawn doing that back and forth spinning animation looking for a dance partner. I notice little to no rubber banding on individual soldiers (which has been a big stickler for me after going back to the Warscape games after Warhammer). There seem to be some generally improved animations as well as transitions between animations. Cavalry charges look better but still kinda poo which I guess is just something we're gonna have with games using this framework. It's not ideal, but god does it show more visual polish than Attila/Rome 2.
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Mar 21, 2018 06:55
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I'm going to go all TWC for a second but I have a history question: did anyone eery actually wear animal pelts during the games' time periods by just draping the pelt over their shoulders? Velites and specific legionaries wearing their animal hats is one thing, but I really question whether people just tossed an animal skin over their cloak like they do in Attila instead of making a full cloak.
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Mar 21, 2018 07:55
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I thought everyone hated matched combat.
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Mar 21, 2018 08:35
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Shogun 2 was great at the time, recently my graphics card exploded so I had to switch to that and it's decent but I think some of people's love for it is: A) its by far the most technically optimised out of the total wars (runs amazing on ultra with 1gb vram, has SLI support etc) and FAST TURN TIMES!!!! B) Has the best unified art style of any of the total wars, even though the units look ugly as hell close up and are all identical this probably allows for A C) Has rock paper scissors units without there being a hundred permutations of each, which some people love and some people (raises paw) dont D)FotS is the best and last gunpowder TW Despite this as soon as I could I went back to the more modern games and though good it has some problems: I think the campaign layer is limited and easy, generally I steamroll across several factions with a single stack. Siege defence looks sweet but is a bit meh, super easy on defence and super hard on offense and the higher tier your city the worse it is at defence (though this makes you choose between small easily defended forts and sprawling cities). No unwalled towns to attack, AI can March in and burn your farms which would be a neat thing if it didn't just result in making the AI fight you harder. In FotS there's not a huge amount of reason to upgrade your gun levies since guns kill everything no matter who holds them. Despite the rock paper scissors balance and limited units the game is still not that balanced, basically any western unit shits all over everyone especially ships and I see the point but then the only reason to not rush those Spanish armoured soldiers every time is role playing. I would genuinely like to know what things people think makes FotS the best? Maybe I'll go back and give it another go, I definitely liked it when it came out. It's definitely up there but I think it now beginning to age poorly and wonder if this is just one of those things that hangs around as gospel for a while. Communist Thoughts fucked around with this message at 13:07 on Mar 21, 2018 |
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Mar 21, 2018 13:03
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nopantsjack posted:I would genuinely like to know what things people think makes FotS the best? Maybe I'll go back and give it another go, I definitely liked it when it came out. To me, especially FotS, is how uncluttered and straight to the point it is, which CA would only manage to get it right again in Warhammer. As I mentioned before, empire management in TW games is dull, and CA should not try to turn it's campaign map into Civ-lite. The realm divide and by extension end game also works properly in FotS where the realm is, you know, actually divided, and has an extra-option for challenge in the form of Republic. Something that all TW really struggle, offering the player different forms of challenge, that isn't either AI cheats or player RP. The part that to me has aged really bad is the entire naval aspect across all 3 campaigns. Boat spam is real, and the naval battles CA never managed to get it right. I believe that despite some folk grumbling about it, everyone is secretly happy that there are no boats in Warhammer, and if it wasn't for auto-resolve issues there would be no issues with how Warhammer does it's naval side of things. Rome 2 and Atilla have all these systems and mechanics grafted on the campaign that aren't interesting or just a chore design to slow down the player. Food, sanitation, popgrowth, taxes, endless options of building chains which barely matter, and none of it makes for a interesting game. Warhammer is doing the right thing by getting rid of all of it and shifting it into the armies or the faction gameplay itself, and I hope CA continues on and eventually just gets rid of city management and province all together, and make it about fighting for control of regions and space on the map, so we can have more fights on open field and in interesting maps. And maybe finally deliver what they been trying to do since Empire(and now in ToB) which is fighting for map objectives instead of going straight to cities.
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Mar 21, 2018 14:03
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I’d say Rome 2 is the best TW so far. I wish Atilla was better but it wasn’t different enough from Rome 2 and really fails to capture the migratory chaos of the period very well. Focusing to much on the Huns. Ironically BI, for all its faults still does that part better. People got displaced and they were hard to deal with if they migrated full force at you in that game.
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Mar 21, 2018 16:15
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ToB just got pushed to May 3 https://www.totalwar.com/blog/britannia-release-date-change
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Mar 21, 2018 16:16
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Twigand Berries posted:ToB just got pushed to May 3 In other news, Norsca delayed till August.
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Mar 21, 2018 16:18
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As much as I love DeI Rome 2 kinda sucks without it. For me the best vanilla TW would be Warhammer 1. I prefer DeI but WH1 is unarguably a better game from my PoV. It did a get a bit bloated and slow towards the end though culminating in WH2 mortal empires being about the most bloated and slow TW since Attila with a series of problems any total war player could immediately predict since they boasted about the huge map and most factions ever in a TW. Thinking back on it, with it's beautiful art direction, reasonable balance and strong optimisation was Shogun 2 developed by a different team or something? Those are some very un-CA traits.
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Mar 21, 2018 16:33
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Also despite it not being objectively the best BI probably was the most fun I had in any TW game without mods.
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Mar 21, 2018 16:52
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nopantsjack posted:As much as I love DeI Rome 2 kinda sucks without it. For me the best vanilla TW would be Warhammer 1. I prefer DeI but WH1 is unarguably a better game from my PoV. Napoleon was also pretty good, it even shares a lot of the strengths of Shogun 2 with limited scope, more focused roster, and was a solid release, but it still had that Empire:TW stink all over so nobody bothered with it. I also imagine that it was do or die for CA in general at the time. Empire was a disaster and Napoleon disappointing in terms of sales and attention, so all hands on deck. But then Rome 2 and Atilla releases happened and it looks like they learned nothing.
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Mar 21, 2018 17:10
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Edgar Allen Ho posted:In other news, Norsca delayed till August. which brings our award winning two part series of Warhammer Total War to a close.
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Mar 21, 2018 17:40
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nopantsjack posted:As much as I love DeI Rome 2 kinda sucks without it. For me the best vanilla TW would be Warhammer 1. I prefer DeI but WH1 is unarguably a better game from my PoV. I vaguely remember reading around the time of Shogun 2's release that since Shogun was the first game in the series, they felt a lot of pressure to get the sequel right and went to great lengths to make a game that was "worthy" of being a Shogun sequel. The art direction really is fantastic and it's a shame they've never come anywhere close to that in subsequent releases. The load times, though... oof. Not a problem these days, but I hesitate to say S2 was super well optimized just because of those awful load times. Electronico6 posted:Napoleon was also pretty good, it even shares a lot of the strengths of Shogun 2 with limited scope, more focused roster, and was a solid release, but it still had that Empire:TW stink all over so nobody bothered with it. I also imagine that it was do or die for CA in general at the time. Empire was a disaster and Napoleon disappointing in terms of sales and attention, so all hands on deck. Empire is the best selling TW game of all time, actually. A lot of that is from steam sales, so I'm not sure how it compares revenue-wise, but it wasn't a disaster by any means.
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Mar 21, 2018 17:41
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Gadzuko posted:
It's the fastest selling title I think. But yes in sales it wasn't a disaster, but the actual release and game was almost apocalyptic. The fanbase broke bad at the time, and I don't think it ever truly recovered.
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Mar 21, 2018 17:56
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Total Warhammer 1 also had a delay and turned out as their best release, so I wouldn't worry about the quality of ToB being negatively impacted by this. But yeah, Norsca and further TWW2 releases are delayed to August.
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Mar 21, 2018 17:59
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Edgar Allen Ho posted:In other news, Norsca delayed till August. really? Lol People are going to flip their lid
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Mar 21, 2018 18:01
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Captain Beans posted:really? Lol Not really, just a joke, but I wouldn't expect a major TWW2 update to come in very close to a new game's release.
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Mar 21, 2018 18:11
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When was the last time arrow damage had good feedback in Total War? I think it was probably Medieval 2? I rarely use arrow units in the more modern games because they lack the solid punch that those Medieval 2 arrows had when they scored a kill. That probably goes for the death sounds in general, actually. Rome 1 and Medieval 2 had those awesome bone crunching sound effects whenever a model died.
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Mar 21, 2018 18:29
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Apparently you haven't tried to roll bow heavy in Shogun 2, it has the most satisfying arrows in the entire series by a mile. also they definitely lack the impact but Rome 2 / Attila arrows kinda grew on me. Slings doubly so. Having an army half composed of slingers and just watching the enemy melt under a hail of stones never gets old. Just make sure to turn the projectile trails off.
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Mar 21, 2018 18:34
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Koramei posted:Apparently you haven't tried to roll bow heavy in Shogun 2, it has the most satisfying arrows in the entire series by a mile. I tended to run heavy naginata armies in Shogun 2 so arrows were rarely a problem for me and I usually finished my campaigns before getting to Bow warrior monks. I am specifically talking about arrows though. I loving love slingers and javelins in Attila and Rome, especially when you turn a man into a pincushion.  And when I play warhammer I roll with Greenskins or Beastmen and outside of Da Rusty Arrers and the ROR Wolf archers there is practically no reason to get more arrows when you could just get more boyz or rock lobbas. Arc Hammer fucked around with this message at 18:49 on Mar 21, 2018 |
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Mar 21, 2018 18:47
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I'm doing a bow ashigaru heavy Oda run right now, it's best with bow warrior monks but all the Shogun 2 arrows are pretty great if you watch for the impacts. Incidentally, it's my first time playing them and I'm realizing how hilariously overpowered Oda is. Head on in spear wall, long-yari ashigaru beat literally everything--even naginata warrior monks, and you can have so many armies because you can just run full ashigaru for everything because of their extra morale. For a long time I'd wanted to do a campaign where I just conquer Kyoto and trigger realm divide as soon as I got to it rather than after I built up, but I finally did that this game and it's almost anticlimactic, the Oda armies just demolish everything and can cover every front effortlessly. I even went fully into gun research to the exclusion of almost everything else (I don't even have fire arrows) and have barely used them, but because of the Oda stuff I'm not hurting for it at all. Koramei fucked around with this message at 19:11 on Mar 21, 2018 |
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Mar 21, 2018 19:05
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I'd still get gunpowder ashigaru so I could recreate Nagashino and pretend like I'm player Samurai Warriors again.
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Mar 21, 2018 19:11
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Electronico6 posted:It's the fastest selling title I think. But yes in sales it wasn't a disaster, but the actual release and game was almost apocalyptic. The fanbase broke bad at the time, and I don't think it ever truly recovered. Yeah, I had forgotten how badly people lost their poo poo when Empire came out initially. The massive hype, the switch to Steamworks, lack of mod support, all combined to just break some people's brains. Koramei posted:Apparently you haven't tried to roll bow heavy in Shogun 2, it has the most satisfying arrows in the entire series by a mile. Slingers are awesome, I never used slingers at all until my most recent campaign to check out the new Rome 2 changes and I was blown away. So satisfying. Also confirming that Shogun 2 has amazing arrows and that's one of the main reasons I still go back and play it, you don't need bow monks. Just mass whatever arrows you can, samurai are death machines but even ashigaru can massacre dudes. Outside of Warhammer a S2 arrow barrage is my favorite thing to zoom in on in TW games.
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Mar 21, 2018 19:14
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nopantsjack posted:Shogun 2 was great at the time, recently my graphics card exploded so I had to switch to that and it's decent but I think some of people's love for it is: None of the Clausewitz TW games have ever been that great because the campaign AI is programmed to be annoying rather than fun. The AI is programmed to be a poo poo and do some of the things a human player might do in the same situation, but the game mechanics are too shallow for the player to respond in a meaningful way. When the AI sends a single unit to raid your farms, there's nothing to be done besides ignoring it, or conquering the AI. When the AI invades you then runs into your heartland by keeping juuuust ahead of pursuing armies, all you can do is reload or lose something important. In FotS, this comes to a head with bad naval battles, bad naval autoresolve, and an AI that will build and send fleets at you all game. FotS has a lot of toys to play with in land battles. It's not really a balanced game because you can break the ai over your knee by just researching a few techs, but it's also pretty fun as a result.
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Mar 21, 2018 19:52
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Slim Jim Pickens posted:None of the Clausewitz TW games have ever been that great because the campaign AI is programmed to be annoying rather than fun. The AI is programmed to be a poo poo and do some of the things a human player might do in the same situation, but the game mechanics are too shallow for the player to respond in a meaningful way. When the AI sends a single unit to raid your farms, there's nothing to be done besides ignoring it, or conquering the AI. When the AI invades you then runs into your heartland by keeping juuuust ahead of pursuing armies, all you can do is reload or lose something important. In FotS, this comes to a head with bad naval battles, bad naval autoresolve, and an AI that will build and send fleets at you all game. Clausewitz TW games?
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Mar 21, 2018 20:36
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PirateBob posted:Clausewitz TW games? bluhhhhhhhhh warscape
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Mar 21, 2018 20:41
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Clausewitz is what Paradox named their engine iirc
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Mar 21, 2018 20:46
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Slim Jim Pickens posted:bluhhhhhhhhh warscape Are you talking about the engine used for Empire and later games?
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Mar 21, 2018 21:12
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PirateBob posted:Are you talking about the engine used for Empire and later games? Yeah
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Mar 21, 2018 22:09
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Slim Jim Pickens posted:None of the Clausewitz TW games have ever been that great because the campaign AI is programmed to be annoying rather than fun. The AI is programmed to be a poo poo and do some of the things a human player might do in the same situation, but the game mechanics are too shallow for the player to respond in a meaningful way. When the AI sends a single unit to raid your farms, there's nothing to be done besides ignoring it, or conquering the AI. When the AI invades you then runs into your heartland by keeping juuuust ahead of pursuing armies, all you can do is reload or lose something important. In FotS, this comes to a head with bad naval battles, bad naval autoresolve, and an AI that will build and send fleets at you all game. I think this annoying rather than fun AI culminates in Warhammer sadly, the battle AI is better than its ever been, the AI can use cavalry for example and always tries to get your rear skirmishers by going around the side whereas in Rome/DeI it just plows cavalry right into your pikes (though DeI at one point had rather impressive BAI where it would correctly use reserves and was actually pretty dangerous because of it since it wouldnt just lay its whole army across your anvil. That seems to have gotten lost in some update or DLC patch somewhere) but the campaign AI is basically just a dick. Always hovering outside of reach, never giving you an equal battle if it can help it, you really have to game it with ambushing to get it to ever put its army in a disadvantageous or neutral position. Its a bit better than Attila's AI though which had that but it wouldnt even stop running when you approached its final city, it'd just let you roll over Rome or whatever while it hides at the edge of the screen, whereas the WH AI at least makes last stands. What faction/goal would people suggest if I give FotS a go? I've nearly run out of factions in DeI so could probably use a break. (hmm orr I could play Parthia and conquer the world with cataphracts or Skythia and burn greece to the ground... or the custom indian faction, those armoured macemen and armoured elephants seemed pretty tough last time i was- NO! help!)
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Mar 21, 2018 22:15
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Gadzuko posted:Also confirming that Shogun 2 has amazing arrows and that's one of the main reasons I still go back and play it, you don't need bow monks. Just mass whatever arrows you can, samurai are death machines but even ashigaru can massacre dudes. Outside of Warhammer a S2 arrow barrage is my favorite thing to zoom in on in TW games. I usually favour ashigaru, but bow warrior monks are just terrifying. You can put them on the walls in a siege battle and just forget about that part of the map. Naginata warrior monks I could take or leave.
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Mar 22, 2018 01:45
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Fall of the Samurai multiplayer battles sre some of the most fun I've had with these games. I tended to prefer melee-heavy armies with a unit of gun cavalry as harassers, jockeying for position to stay out of LoS and picking off vulnerable units before the big charge. Gun units might be deadly at range, but get them stuck in melee with some katana kachi and they melt quickly.
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Mar 22, 2018 10:35
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Played some FoS as Satsuma, gunpowder battles are good fun but I actually found the campaign layer fairly... Unfun? Hard to raise enough money and all the good buildings and tech have heavy PO costs (which is something I'd associate more with Attila and DeI, but in DeI at least you can totally trivialise PO as any civilised faction) and my settlement income just kept going down for no reason I could tell, I had positive growth. It also hard crashed my computer with no mods which is bizarre. So I went back to DeI because I have a problem, Scythia rules, the basic bitch horse Archer you can recruit anywhere is all you need to conquer the world from turn 1, it's basically very light shock cav/archer hybrid for the upkeep of a Greek levy slinger. Only issue is I only just figured out a barbarian Empire hinges on it's many toilets and nomads can't build toilets!
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Mar 22, 2018 11:38
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Started a game as the Oda last night. Man, Shogun 2 is such a great game. Going back to it from newer titles, the things I miss most are: 1. No minimum size for grouping units. I always like to have my general unit as hotkey 1, but you have to have 2 or more to group. 2. Using arrow keys to move whole formations. That's really helpful to shuffle your line around and keep formations. 3. On the overmap, using tab to bring up the big sortable map. 4. Right clicking in battle to drag a route for units. Features I like from the old title: 1. Global food as the only food number that matters. That's real convenient. 2. Raising troops without a general. Really convenient to build a yari ashigaru to boost public order and beef up a garrison at the cost of ~80 upkeep/turn. Also it's nice to send reinforcements of elite troops recruited from regions where they get bonuses without having to shuttle them with a general. Nobunaga came of age at 14 years old, and the very next turn the Hattori declare war and send a 3/4 stack against him in the capital, defending with a garrison and 4 spare units. He handled it nicely.
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Mar 22, 2018 17:47
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You can move your formations with ' and / for forward and back and rotate your groups with l and ; in Shogun 2, which is a much bigger pain than using the arrow keys but I'm pretty sure you can remap them just fine. You can also set waypoints with shift right click or shift double right click to set unit paths, although it's also a bit more fiddly than the right click drag of the newer games. The having to group your units in order to have a hotkey is a royal pain, no doubt about it though.
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Mar 23, 2018 12:03
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hot tip: control-g unlocks formations so you can click and drag them. still need 2 people tho
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Mar 23, 2018 14:18
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nI9VO_P6bSg
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Mar 23, 2018 17:58
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I have to say I'm really liking their latest Let's Plays. Long enough to get a good mix of story, combat and mechanics while not being so long that I lose interest.
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Mar 23, 2018 18:18
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