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I was thinking Callidus, but that one works just as well.
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Mar 30, 2018 23:16
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Artum posted:Its not even a matter of being dependent on it, but getting stopped part way through setup leaving you critically exposed. They can't use it during deployment or before the game starts
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Mar 30, 2018 23:19
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TheChirurgeon posted:They can't use it during deployment or before the game starts As in a maneuver not deployment, i'd probably just headbutt my opponent if they nullified chapter master.
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Mar 30, 2018 23:22
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I'l drop my side of this if only because I obviously lack actual game experience (still building dat army, waiting on the Inceptors + skull heads and fire pads), I just think that the designers are accounting for limited detachments when allocating power. On another topic: has any book hinted at what Nulls/Culexii are meant to be? My guess has always been psychopaths, both for the lack of emotion and empathy (which forms a lot of the basis for chaos).
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Mar 30, 2018 23:26
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On a completely different topic then - I wish so hard that I had the level of talent to take the new sea elf on giant wave from https://www.warhammer-community.com/2018/03/30/april-white-dwarf-preview/, paint it up as if it was a wave of magma, and use it as an avatar of khaine.
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Mar 30, 2018 23:33
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Neurolimal posted:I'l drop my side of this if only because I obviously lack actual game experience (still building dat army, waiting on the Inceptors + skull heads and fire pads), I just think that the designers are accounting for limited detachments when allocating power. Nulls literally don't have souls, this makes you surprisingly powerful in this setting with the only drawback being other people abhor your presence and hate you instinctively, but might be able to work past that. They're not inherently psychopaths or anything and people like bequin in the eisenhorn series and sister alaya in watchers of the throne are great.
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Mar 30, 2018 23:33
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Artum posted:Nulls literally don't have souls, this makes you surprisingly powerful in this setting with the only drawback being other people abhor your presence and hate you instinctively, but might be able to work past that. They're not inherently psychopaths or anything and people like bequin in the eisenhorn series and sister alaya in watchers of the throne are great. Yeah I know the in-universe reason, just that a lot of 40k's roots are in satire and real-world analogs which made me wonder. E: One_Wing posted:On a completely different topic then - I wish so hard that I had the level of talent to take the new sea elf on giant wave from https://www.warhammer-community.com/2018/03/30/april-white-dwarf-preview/, paint it up as if it was a wave of magma, and use it as an avatar of khaine. You'd need to do a lot of kitbashing to accurately represent the avatar as drowning in the magma wave (presumably after being shot in the dick by a lasgun guardsman), though. Neurolimal fucked around with this message at 23:37 on Mar 30, 2018 |
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Mar 30, 2018 23:34
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People should just play with power points and unlimited detachments, as GW intended.
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Mar 30, 2018 23:41
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Neurolimal posted:Yeah I know the in-universe reason, just that a lot of 40k's roots are in satire and real-world analogs which made me wonder. I’ll admit that one area in which my painting skills are deficient is how to really evoke “I am about 100 points overcosted” in visual form.
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Mar 30, 2018 23:44
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Artum posted:As in a maneuver not deployment, i'd probably just headbutt my opponent if they nullified chapter master. It says it can't be used for those. The key to this will be like playing against Counterspells in Magic; you have to play around it until they don't have the CP to counter you, which means either avoiding critical CP-dependent moves until later in the game, or feinting with moves that aren't critical to your strategy early to bait out the counter. I wouldn't want to see counters in more than one or two armies, but I really like it conceptually because it introduces a very interesting mind game/yomi aspect to the game that isn't normally there. e: Though lol the nastiest possible use is denying your opponent's emergency invasion beam from a dying Monolith/Night Scythe. Prevent a unit from arriving and functionally destroy it and anything left off the table if that's the last one, but depending on the circumstances, you can just not set units up that way during deployment against Dark Eldar TheChirurgeon fucked around with this message at 23:55 on Mar 30, 2018 |
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Mar 30, 2018 23:53
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TheChirurgeon posted:It says it can't be used for those. I know.
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Mar 30, 2018 23:58
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TheChirurgeon posted:It says it can't be used for those. See, the whole “opponents literally can’t risk using normal parts of their army’s rules” thing is part of why I think this is so good.
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Mar 31, 2018 00:02
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TheChirurgeon posted:It says it can't be used for those. This is my view. It's good, but if your opponent is smart they will do as you say and bait it out or play around it. Counter spells in MtG (and this imo) almost get more power from getting into the opponents head and forcing them to address it rather than just jam down whatever. This will only be absolutely amazing when someone just lets lose their strategem dependant deathstar right into an open counter and let's themselves fall for the "gotcha"
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Mar 31, 2018 00:10
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Neurolimal posted:Tau, GK, and Marines were some of the best 7ed armies and few competitive armies that could actually be ran as armies and not, you know, "3 flyrants" or "5 daemon princes".
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Mar 31, 2018 00:34
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One_Wing posted:See, the whole “opponents literally can’t risk using normal parts of their army’s rules” thing is part of why I think this is so good. Mef989 posted:This is my view. It's good, but if your opponent is smart they will do as you say and bait it out or play around it. Counter spells in MtG (and this imo) almost get more power from getting into the opponents head and forcing them to address it rather than just jam down whatever. This will only be absolutely amazing when someone just lets lose their strategem dependant deathstar right into an open counter and let's themselves fall for the "gotcha" Yeah, though the coolest part about it is that you don't even have to use it--the threat of cancelling a key strategem will prevent your opponents from using their strategems, allowing you to not have to worry about it and use your points late in the game on other stuff, after it's too late for them to use them. Let the mind games begin!
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Mar 31, 2018 00:51
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The idea of baiting out couterspells in WH40K feels.... wrong. That said, I'm willing to entertain feeling wrong if it means that someone netlisting gets hosed really hard because they're following a play-by-flowchart army tactics guide and forget about it or are just really bad at guessing or baiting them out in the first place.
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Mar 31, 2018 00:59
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TheChirurgeon posted:Yeah, though the coolest part about it is that you don't even have to use it--the threat of cancelling a key strategem will prevent your opponents from using their strategems, allowing you to not have to worry about it and use your points late in the game on other stuff, after it's too late for them to use them.
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Mar 31, 2018 01:00
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Strobe posted:The idea of baiting out couterspells in WH40K feels.... wrong. I mean, to some extent I already do this with psychic denials anyway, using powers I don't care about first to try and bait them into attempting to deny those before the ones I want to succeed.
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Mar 31, 2018 01:08
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Karl Rove posted:What timeline are you posting from? The Matt Ward era. I admittedly didn't pay as much attention to 40k when that time rolled around. I'm still amazed that there are people who are into the concept of "the other, other, other Emperor's chosen elite, this time they're psychic, and so uber secret they genocide worlds to stay hidden" beyond whenever it's a FotM.
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Mar 31, 2018 01:08
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Mef989 posted:I mean, to some extent I already do this with psychic denials anyway, using powers I don't care about first to try and bait them into attempting to deny those before the ones I want to succeed. I play Tau. What is this 'psychic' you refer to? 
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Mar 31, 2018 01:09
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Gyro Zeppeli posted:I'm looking deeply at AdMech. I've always loved their models, and now ebay is full of cheap Skitarii. Corrode posted:Ad Mech aren't top tier but they're not garbage either. Good solid army. Their major problem is their limited unit selection, which leads to them being quite samey (although Thanqol has some ideas on them I've not really considered which might give a very different playstyle). Admech is rad. I think they're pretty much the perfect army. Even the limited unit selection winds up being cool because it means I can play any forgeworld and any set of tactics for them with the models I have, which serves to make them shockingly adaptable on the table. Everything does exactly what it needs to do and not one step more. Onager Dunecrawlers with Neutron Lasers are one example. They have exactly enough STR to wound Russes on 3s and exactly enough AP to mean that russes don't get a save at all in response, and their min damage of 3 means that three of them firing at a russ will 100% delete it. So their offensive power is exactly what it needs to be. But their defensive power is -also- what it needs to be - in that they can move and shoot with no penalty. So you can deploy your spidertanks out of LOS and then swing them around a corner with a respectable 8' movement range and delete a russ no problem. From there they've got a 5++ rerolling ones bubble and if they're not killed outright the nearby Dominus can bring one back up to full health in a single repair pass. It's not a complicated unit but, again as is the theme with AdMech, it fills its tactical role perfectly and not one step more. And they've got perfectly calibrated counters like this against every possible unit. Destroyers with grav cannons mince superheavy infantry like Custodes or light vehicles like sentinels. Kastellian robots can kill infinity guardsmen - two put down 36 shots wounding on twos and negating armour saves, which is basically 15 dead guardsmen - before you add any of their many potential rerolls and synergies. Sidonian Dragoons are perfect flankers and harassers who absorb crazy amounts of fire for what they cost and if left unattended will wind up in your enemy's tank line. Even Imperial Knights work great with AdMech armies despite/because they have no synergies with anyone else - the rest of the Admech army is somewhat slow and synergistic which means that it needs to advance in a bit of a clump, you can give a Knight an entire flank to itself and it'll move around at a shocking speed and prevent your opponent from concentrating their fire on your fire base. One CP per turn for a 4++ makes the Knight unstoppable. And while your armies will always be samey in terms of models, it means switching between FW tactics doesn't require any additional investment. For instance, just by adding a few more Destroyers than I normally do I get a fantastic Agrippia list which allows me the craziest overwatch in the game (5+, with two hits on 6's via a relic, which is mathematically equal to destroyers normal BS) and the ability to resurrect a crippled unit of Destroyers. Or I can switch that to Mars, put down a unit of six robots, and add 15 mortal wounds to my existing 108 shots. People talk poo poo about the AdMech codex being boring but I don't agree with that at all. Ply into it a bit and you can find interesting ways to get a tonne of mileage out of any unit, from a lance of 6 Sidonian Dragoons bringing down a Knight in a single charge, to getting Sicarian Infiltrators to a profile of 2+/5++ 3 STR7 attacks hitting on 2s and doing 3 hits on 5s. We also have the coolest models in the business. Literally the only thing we lack is a transport. AdMech is good. Buy in.
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Mar 31, 2018 01:13
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Thanqol posted:Admech is rad. I think they're pretty much the perfect army. Even the limited unit selection winds up being cool because it means I can play any forgeworld and any set of tactics for them with the models I have, which serves to make them shockingly adaptable on the table. Everything does exactly what it needs to do and not one step more. I’ll totally say Admech are tempting me pretty badly right now as I’m growing more disillusioned with Guard model range.
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Mar 31, 2018 01:27
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Pendent posted:I’ll totally say Admech are tempting me pretty badly right now as I’m growing more disillusioned with Guard model range. I love Guard thematically but their range is ancient and metal. If they do plastic guardsmen I'll come around. You can generally run Guard tactics with AdMech and be fine so if that's the tactical style you want, go for it.
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Mar 31, 2018 01:44
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Looks like the codex related content embargo has dropped cause the tabletop tactics Drukari intro battle report has been posted. It’s quite something. https://youtu.be/ChhwdS08HbY I am so very not loving reassured
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Mar 31, 2018 01:52
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Strobe posted:I play Tau. What is this 'psychic' you refer to? I don't remember where I read this idea, but I love the suggestion of kroot getting fleshed out to include shaman so that Tau get a psychic phase.
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Mar 31, 2018 01:59
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One_Wing posted:Looks like the codex related content embargo has dropped cause the tabletop tactics Drukari intro battle report has been posted. Please have a meltadown and convince me to give GW more money.
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Mar 31, 2018 01:59
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Honestly how dare they make me want to buy a box of wracks.
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Mar 31, 2018 02:00
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One_Wing posted:Looks like the codex related content embargo has dropped cause the tabletop tactics Drukari intro battle report has been posted. I realize this is a tough question based on the codex just coming out... but do the battle reports from this channel accurately represent good lists and games? Or is it more of a sponsored deal where they are playing to show off the model range?
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Mar 31, 2018 02:03
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JIZZ DENOUEMENT posted:I realize this is a tough question based on the codex just coming out... but do the battle reports from this channel accurately represent good lists and games? Or is it more of a sponsored deal where they are playing to show off the model range? Its about 60/40. Depending on who's playing they have some decent players (the main guy won heat 1 of the london GT iirc), but they do usually make concessions to having fun lists rather than being super competitive. Their preview games like this one do want to try to show off new units/strategems, but they don't go out of their way to use them if it would lose them the game.
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Mar 31, 2018 02:13
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Hyped about Dark Eldar. I was getting a bit frustrated with some of the infantry kits as you can tell they are not quite as modern, with join lines in weird and annoying places. They look super rad when they're finished but I wasn't really enjoying the build process. Giving me a second wind here.
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Mar 31, 2018 02:15
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JIZZ DENOUEMENT posted:I realize this is a tough question based on the codex just coming out... but do the battle reports from this channel accurately represent good lists and games? Or is it more of a sponsored deal where they are playing to show off the model range? One of those fellas was the guy who shocked everyone by winning the first heat of the GT a few months back with that ultramarines army with 6 tactical squads. They were good enough to make the internet poo poo itself inside out trying to explain that he was wrong and it didnt count because etc.
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Mar 31, 2018 02:15
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Booley posted:Its about 60/40. Depending on who's playing they have some decent players (the main guy won heat 1 of the london GT iirc), but they do usually make concessions to having fun lists rather than being super competitive. Their preview games like this one do want to try to show off new units/strategems, but they don't go out of their way to use them if it would lose them the game. Sell your collection and buy a DE army, they’re the only playable faction now.
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Mar 31, 2018 02:16
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Mef989 posted:I don't remember where I read this idea, but I love the suggestion of kroot getting fleshed out to include shaman so that Tau get a psychic phase. Just add Nicassar for floating psyker bears! If they want to give Tau interactivity in more phases then the obvious solution is to expand auxiliaries.
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Mar 31, 2018 02:25
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Artum posted:One of those fellas was the guy who shocked everyone by winning the first heat of the GT a few months back with that ultramarines army with 6 tactical squads. They were good enough to make the internet poo poo itself inside out trying to explain that he was wrong and it didnt count because etc. Can you elaborate on this story, because that both sounds hilarious and I quite like watching the TT guys battle reports because they seem like cool 'hams and not regular (read awful) 'hams.
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Mar 31, 2018 02:25
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hooman posted:Can you elaborate on this story, because that both sounds hilarious and I quite like watching the TT guys battle reports because they seem like cool 'hams and not regular (read awful) 'hams. If you dig back on their channel Lawrence does a breakdown on that list. At the end of the day he won because he’s a very, very skilled player though.
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Mar 31, 2018 02:29
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If we get a Kroot subfaction I really hope they in some way steal traits/special rules. They somewhat edge that way with the delf strat that lets an archon get more buff when they slay a character, give Kroot strats like that and make the base units average to compensate. Kroot shapers could be a risk/reward thing where they're even weaker, but can spread stolen buffs to X kroot within range each turn.
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Mar 31, 2018 02:31
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hooman posted:Can you elaborate on this story, because that both sounds hilarious and I quite like watching the TT guys battle reports because they seem like cool 'hams and not regular (read awful) 'hams. there's not a huge amount to tell. He won with an army that everyone was so convinced was bad people were running around insisting he only won because he didn't come up against xyz list, except it turned out he explicitly did and won.
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Mar 31, 2018 02:33
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Can anyone give me some feedback on this 1000pt Guard list? I'm just looking to play casual games. I have very little experience actually playing Warhammer, so I don't expect to be very good. I just want to push my plastic army men around a table and roll some dice, winning is secondary. What I don't want is to have a list that isn't any fun to play against or is cheesy. My entire philosophy for this list is to shoot at everything that moves and most of everything that doesn't. I realize that with Guard if the enemy comes into contact with me then we have a less than ideal situation. ++ Battalion Detachment +3CP (Imperium - Astra Militarum) [22 PL, 432pts] ++ + HQ + Company Commander [2 PL, 35pts]: Chainsword, Display Astra Militarum Orders, Grand Strategist, Kurov's Aquila, Plasma pistol, Warlord Primaris Psyker [2 PL, 46pts]: Force Stave, Nightshroud, Psychic Maelstrom + No Force Org Slot + Regimental Doctrine: Astra Millitarum/Imperium + Heavy Support + Heavy Weapons Squad [3 PL, 33pts] . Heavy Weapon Team: Mortar . Heavy Weapon Team: Mortar . Heavy Weapon Team: Mortar + Elites + Special Weapons Squad [2 PL, 45pts]: 3x Guardsman . Guardsman W/ Special Weapon: Plasma gun . Guardsman W/ Special Weapon: Plasma gun . Guardsman W/ Special Weapon: Plasma gun Special Weapons Squad [2 PL, 60pts]: 3x Guardsman . Guardsman W/ Special Weapon: Meltagun . Guardsman W/ Special Weapon: Meltagun . Guardsman W/ Special Weapon: Meltagun Special Weapons Squad [2 PL, 39pts]: 3x Guardsman . Guardsman W/ Special Weapon: Grenade Launcher . Guardsman W/ Special Weapon: Grenade Launcher . Guardsman W/ Special Weapon: Grenade Launcher + Troops + Infantry Squad [3 PL, 58pts] . 5x Guardsman . Guardsman W/ Special Weapon: Grenade Launcher . Guardsman w/ Vox-caster: Vox-caster . Heavy Weapon Team: Heavy bolter . Sergeant: Laspistol Infantry Squad [3 PL, 58pts] . 5x Guardsman . Guardsman W/ Special Weapon: Grenade Launcher . Guardsman w/ Vox-caster: Vox-caster . Heavy Weapon Team: Heavy bolter . Sergeant: Laspistol Infantry Squad [3 PL, 58pts] . 5x Guardsman . Guardsman W/ Special Weapon: Grenade Launcher . Guardsman w/ Vox-caster: Vox-caster . Heavy Weapon Team: Heavy bolter . Sergeant: Laspistol ++ Spearhead Detachment +1CP (Imperium - Astra Militarum) [35 PL, 570pts] ++ + HQ + Tank Commander [12 PL, 197pts]: Display Tank Orders, Heavy Bolter . Command Battle Tank: Battle Cannon + No Force Org Slot + Regimental Doctrine: Cadian + Heavy Support + Basilisks [7 PL, 108pts] . Basilisk: Heavy Bolter Heavy Weapons Squad [3 PL, 33pts] . Heavy Weapon Team: Mortar . Heavy Weapon Team: Mortar . Heavy Weapon Team: Mortar Leman Russ Battle Tanks [10 PL, 180pts] . Leman Russ Battle Tank: Battle Cannon, Heavy Bolters, Lascannon + Troops + Infantry Squad [3 PL, 52pts] . 7x Guardsman . Guardsman W/ Special Weapon: Flamer . Guardsman w/ Vox-caster: Vox-caster . Sergeant: Laspistol ++ Total: [57 PL, 1002pts] ++ Created with BattleScribe
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Mar 31, 2018 02:39
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Miles O'Brian posted:Hyped about Dark Eldar. I was getting a bit frustrated with some of the infantry kits as you can tell they are not quite as modern, with join lines in weird and annoying places. I feel the same way about the actual troops. However I love most of the vehicle and coven monster models. The reavers are dope as heck. And I looooove hat cool futuristic daft punk / motorcycle helmet with the big visor.
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Mar 31, 2018 02:58
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@Crini A few things pop out to me. First, you're just Astra Militarum. Picking a regiment gives you a free boost. Why does the warlord have a plasma pistol? Do you plan on using him aggressively? What's the plan with the special weapon squads. I don't see a transport, do you have a plan to get them into range? Your infantry squads all have vox casters. That's a little overkill when you can just take a couple of extra platoon commanders and spread your orders out with extra bodies (and extra orders). Vox casters are expensive for what you get. Grenade launchers are kind of mediocre. If you're going to add weapons to a tank, add them to the tank commander first (especially at lower points). Also, consider how much moving and shooting you plan on doing, it can really lower the value of the sponsons depending on your regiment.
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Mar 31, 2018 03:02
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