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 Stuff like this that acknowledges that 99% of the population had guns, but imply that if only the 1% of Jews had them then the Holocaust never would have happened tell me that these people would do absolutely nothing as long as it doesn't personally affect them.
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Apr 2, 2018 16:04
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Scruff McGruff posted:I suspect it also has something to do with it being easier for people to accept a kid snapping because of abuse than it is to accept a kid just being a straight up killer. The same way some people prefer the idea that school shootings are false flags perpetrated by a shadowy cabal, because at least in that narrative there was a reason for it and someone was in control of it happening instead of the reality that someone just felt like killing kids that day. This is entirely accurate. There’s a very strong opposition to the idea of a child being broken. Psychiatrists aren’t allowed to diagnose anyone under the age of 18 with sociopathy, and while the official reason is that their personalities haven’t matured enough, the real underlying reason is an insulation from the disturbing fact that sometimes people are either born or quickly via environmental factors become monsters and there’s nothing anyone can really do about it. Edit: The most notable example I can recall of this is a six year old my mother treated who had made very detailed and meticulous plans to murder his parents.
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Apr 2, 2018 16:16
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The nazi's definitely would have been like "Ooo, ya know, we would kill all the jews but they probably have some rifles and poo poo so we'll just leave them alone, we won't roll in with tanks and a battalion of SS troops and kill them all. Lets just go fight the Red Army in the frozen tundra, it's probably safer. Cancel the Holocaust, CURSE YOU PRIVATE FIREARM POSSESSION!" 
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Apr 2, 2018 16:20
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The problem with the idea of Tru Americans having guns to prevent the equivalent of the Holocaust in America is that it assumes that the right wing gun nuts wouldn't be the ones leading the Jews into the chambers. Gun nuts will do anything to ensure that they are on the blunt side of the bayonet.
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Apr 2, 2018 16:27
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There's an old Onion article that feels really relevant right now. 62-Year-Old With Gun Only One Standing Between Nation And Full-Scale Government Takeover Fake edit: https://www.theonion.com/62-year-old-with-gun-only-one-standing-between-nation-a-1819574418
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Apr 2, 2018 16:29
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There's no shortage of historical examples of how minority groups get treated if they try armed resistance. If they had had Fox News during the Sioux wars, they'd be calling the Ghost Dance a Weapon of Mass Destruction and every day you'd see talking heads argue about whether or not the Ghost Dance could work, and if the United States should try and acquire the same capabilities as a deterrent.
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Apr 2, 2018 16:34
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Shadin posted:This is entirely accurate. There’s a very strong opposition to the idea of a child being broken. Psychiatrists aren’t allowed to diagnose anyone under the age of 18 with sociopathy, and while the official reason is that their personalities haven’t matured enough, the real underlying reason is an insulation from the disturbing fact that sometimes people are either born or quickly via environmental factors become monsters and there’s nothing anyone can really do about it. Also in the recent slenderman attempted murder those two preteens did. The republican judge really did not want to let the "mastermind" get the diagnosis/treatment she needed because he felt that would let her "get away" with the attempted murder. He had no problem trying her as an adult though.
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Apr 2, 2018 16:35
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Dr. Arbitrary posted:There's no shortage of historical examples of how minority groups get treated if they try armed resistance. I mean, take a look at the Black Panthers and what happened with them
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Apr 2, 2018 16:38
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duz posted:Also in the recent slenderman attempted murder those two preteens did. The republican judge really did not want to let the "mastermind" get the diagnosis/treatment she needed because he felt that would let her "get away" with the attempted murder. He had no problem trying her as an adult though. Being committed to a mental institution as punishment for a crime gets a really weird rap. Yeah you are being treated for a mental disorder, but it's not like it's an outpatient thing. You're still in prison, the walls are just soft.
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Apr 2, 2018 16:38
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Insanity is not a 'get out of jail' card in most places.
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Apr 2, 2018 16:42
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ChristopherRobin posted:
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Apr 2, 2018 17:47
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ChristopherRobin posted:
Oh, here's a nice Youtube video on this exact line of bullshit. The modification of weapons laws to specifically target the Jewish population came after Kristallnacht. It came 5 years after Dachau was established and 3 years after the Nuremberg laws. Also yeah, it's not like the Jewish population never fought back.
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Apr 2, 2018 17:53
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Shadin posted:This is entirely accurate. There’s a very strong opposition to the idea of a child being broken. Psychiatrists aren’t allowed to diagnose anyone under the age of 18 with sociopathy, and while the official reason is that their personalities haven’t matured enough, the real underlying reason is an insulation from the disturbing fact that sometimes people are either born or quickly via environmental factors become monsters and there’s nothing anyone can really do about it. Yah there was a good article a while back about treating kids who had been identified as psychopaths at an early age. Usually because they attack siblings and pets with the intent to kill as like 3 year olds. And explain their plans to parents because they are little kids who don't understand yet why they would conceal plans to murder family members.
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Apr 2, 2018 18:00
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Arglebargle III posted:Yah there was a good article a while back about treating kids who had been identified as psychopaths at an early age. Usually because they attack siblings and pets with the intent to kill as like 3 year olds. And explain their plans to parents because they are little kids who don't understand yet why they would conceal plans to murder family members. God what do you even do if your kid is a sociopath? That sounds like a nightmare.
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Apr 2, 2018 18:05
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Lightning Knight posted:God what do you even do if your kid is a sociopath? That sounds like a nightmare. you have to send them to a facility for early intervention to basically drill instructor a sense of emotional resonance into them, and teach them that negative social behavior has consequences. sociopaths aren't inherently monsters, they just have broken emotions and so normal feedback loops of empathy, guilt, and shame to correct bad behavior won't fire properly. you want to do this as soon as possible, but the problem is that nobody wants to admit their eight year old girl is a full on sociopath. it's a very tricky condition to diagnose in children, since the younger they are they dont have much control or understanding of their own emotions anyway and its hard to tell broken emotions from just someone who is bad at handling their emotions because they're six. but let it go too long and it becomes more difficult to teach a sociopath how to human before they start ending up in jail
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Apr 2, 2018 18:11
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Man, that's awful. Young children are basically sociopaths already, trying to pick out the ones that are actually dangerous is a hell of a thing.
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Apr 2, 2018 18:32
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When an entire population has arms it's incredibly easy to declare them all enemy combatants and waste them without a second thought.
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Apr 2, 2018 18:39
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DreamShipWrecked posted:Why are these fucks turning a spree killer into a misunderstood antihero Because they're on the side of the white supremacist murderers. Until the shooting, they were always saying that kids today are too coddled, I was bullied and I turned out okay, and women are too quick to accuse people of sexual harassment, so we gotta elect this sundowning anus-faced clown to grab our daughters by the pussy and trigger them snowflakes! It's just like how they're fine with talking about running over Black Lives Matter protesters but start clutching their pearls about Nazis getting punched.
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Apr 2, 2018 18:59
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boner confessor posted:you have to send them to a facility for early intervention to basically drill instructor a sense of emotional resonance into them, and teach them that negative social behavior has consequences. sociopaths aren't inherently monsters, they just have broken emotions and so normal feedback loops of empathy, guilt, and shame to correct bad behavior won't fire properly. you want to do this as soon as possible, but the problem is that nobody wants to admit their eight year old girl is a full on sociopath. it's a very tricky condition to diagnose in children, since the younger they are they dont have much control or understanding of their own emotions anyway and its hard to tell broken emotions from just someone who is bad at handling their emotions because they're six. but let it go too long and it becomes more difficult to teach a sociopath how to human before they start ending up in jail Yeah, you don't even get true emotional resonance in them, you just get enough that they can mostly function in society without too many ill effects. I remember a story about one kid who was institutionalized after murdering the family cat and talking about how he was going to do it to his sister next. After lots of intensive training and therapy, he presented as mostly normal... until he mentioned things like he still didn't think other people were real, or that he had to constantly remind himself that lying or hurting people caused problems. Basically it's the sociopathic behavior you see in MMOs where the people aren't "real" and there aren't any consequences, except that's the way they're perceiving real life.
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Apr 2, 2018 20:01
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ChristopherRobin posted:
The USA marched 100.000 citizens into concentration camps during WW2. Where were all the freedom loving gun owners standing up to tyranny?
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Apr 2, 2018 20:38
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Courtesy of my lovely cousin
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Apr 2, 2018 22:16
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Ainsley McTree posted:Courtesy of my lovely cousin Sure, when Bundy does it he is a hero but when I take over a McDonalds to protest a parking ticket I'm "deranged"
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Apr 2, 2018 22:22
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Trivia posted:When an entire population has arms it's incredibly easy to declare them all enemy combatants and waste them without a second thought. It really doesn't matter if they have arms or not. What matters is that they happen to be "military-aged males". That sounds threatening enough for nobody to give a gently caress if you murder them.
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Apr 2, 2018 22:38
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Other chickhawk poo poo those fuckers are on record saying "Make sure to use your wife and kids as human shields, got to protect the DPS after all."
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Apr 2, 2018 22:43
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Ainsley McTree posted:Courtesy of my lovely cousin lol, I just had this pop up too. I love how it says right there in the post that when the BLM did something that might have been illegal he sued them for it and the courts agreed that they were indeed in the wrong and corrected it. Like it literally explains that they went through the established process of redress and it worked as intended. The standoff had absolutely nothing to do with it and didn't affect that outcome. This post is just the ultimate embodiment of gun fantasy impotence.
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Apr 2, 2018 22:59
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Also wasn't the Bundy case thrown out because of a mistrial, not because the judge ruled Vanilla ISIS was in the right?
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Apr 2, 2018 23:11
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the guy that posted these has managed to be bad enough to be banned from Twitter https://twitter.com/BettyBowers/status/980819542120239104?s=19
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Apr 2, 2018 23:34
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Ainsley McTree posted:Courtesy of my lovely cousin Pretty sure Bundy was cleared of his criminal charges related to the standoff, but nothing more. He still owes money and he still isn't allowed to tresspass on Federal land. He just got off the hook for his mini-rebellion.
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Apr 2, 2018 23:54
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seiferguy posted:Vanilla ISIS That is a loving pro tier username.
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Apr 2, 2018 23:58
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OwlFancier posted:That is a loving pro tier username. Did you miss those when they first went around then? I think there was also "Y'all Qaeda" and another one as well.
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Apr 3, 2018 00:27
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Evidently because I had a good laugh at that one.
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Apr 3, 2018 00:28
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Don't forget Yeehawdists, and its various spellings.
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Apr 3, 2018 00:33
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Yokel Haram was probably my fave of the bunch.
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Apr 3, 2018 00:35
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boner confessor posted:you have to send them to a facility for early intervention to basically drill instructor a sense of emotional resonance into them, and teach them that negative social behavior has consequences. sociopaths aren't inherently monsters, they just have broken emotions and so normal feedback loops of empathy, guilt, and shame to correct bad behavior won't fire properly. you want to do this as soon as possible, but the problem is that nobody wants to admit their eight year old girl is a full on sociopath. it's a very tricky condition to diagnose in children, since the younger they are they dont have much control or understanding of their own emotions anyway and its hard to tell broken emotions from just someone who is bad at handling their emotions because they're six. but let it go too long and it becomes more difficult to teach a sociopath how to human before they start ending up in jail It's also actually perfectly possible for a child to grow out of sociopathy. I read recently that antisocial behavior, whatever the underlying disorder, is generally called "conduct disorder" before the age of 15. It's possible that a child can just be born a remorseless monster but that is extraordinarily rare. There's also the problem that children just are pretty narcissistic by nature. Their brains aren't all there yet and almost everybody grows out of that. For a lot of reasons something can go wrong; one of them is just "this person's brain was never right and never will be." Charles Manson in particular was already committing burglaries before he was even a teenager and was just a monster his entire life. There's no confirmation but there's belief that Ted Bundy committed his first murder at 15. Some people just come out incredibly wrong. Awful trauma during childhood can put somebody on that path or make it worse but really it's a complex thing. Which is actually the first thing I came here to post...it's easier to deal with mass murder, mass shootings, school shootings, serial killers, and whatever if we can figure out that one trait that they all share. If we can find that one thread then we can say "this isn't our fault at all, these people were just broken." Then we can ignore our violent culture, our gun fetishism, and our love of carpet bombing countries we don't like and watching it on the news. America is an inherently violent culture and that doesn't help. Yet everybody wants to blame the music, blame the video games, blame the movies, blame the media every time somebody shoots up a place. We want to magic the problem away without actually having to do anything. It's easier to find something to blame than it is to actually fix the problem. It's also terrifying to think that the problem of people who can do such things won't go away. Whether we like it or not some people are just psychotic. Others are mostly normal but snap for some reason. The thing is it's common to believe that if we can find the profile of a mass murderer then we can prevent it before it happens. This is part of why mental health keeps getting brought up even though we know the gun crazies that want to blame insanity for everything don't want to actually fund any solution other than more guns and more prisons. If you can find the profile then you can find the people to watch and catch them before they put their plans in place. The problem? There loving isn't one. The "bullied loner" narrative sounds great because it suggests that you can fix the problem by just ending bullying. Simple! Convince people not to bully each other as kids and nobody shoots up a school ever again. Plus basically everybody agrees that it would suck to have your kid be bullied into becoming violent or self-destructive so it isn't hard to get support for. Well I mean social support. We just need to say "don't be a dick" at people a lot while the conservatives hem and haw about actually funding the efforts. Then they start scoffing and saying "bullying isn't the problem people just need to be tougher and learn to take the knocks" and nothing ever changes. The problem isn't even guns in and of itself. There's no one thing that can solve the whole problem. The issue is that we can't admit that the problems even exist in the first place. Guns is part of it. Society is part of it. Bullying is part of it. Dismal mental health treatment is part of it. Even if we fix all of those things the problem won't completely vanish which is the other thing; everybody only ever wants a magical solution that will 100% vanish all the problems. There isn't one so nothing ever changes. And despite all that each side of the argument says "my solution is 100% perfect and will fix it if you people would quit sabotaging it." The problem isn't one side or the other; the problem isn't individuals that fit a profile. The problem is us collectively. We can't prevent every shooting but we can do things to reduce them but that would involve admitting America's problems overall. Good loving luck on that one.
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Apr 3, 2018 00:38
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Yes but in the meantime you could make guns slightly more difficult to purchase than McDonald's cheeseburgers, like most civilised countries have and that would go a long way towards stopping, you know, people getting slaughtered in historical-record numbers
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Apr 3, 2018 00:52
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They let his little rebellion win because the government learned from Waco and doesn’t want another unibomber. That’s why these redneck gun orgys get to sit in their poo poo for a month while they stare at each other and then leave.
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Apr 3, 2018 01:08
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Weatherman posted:Yes but in the meantime you could make guns slightly more difficult to purchase than McDonald's cheeseburgers, like most civilised countries have and that would go a long way towards stopping, you know, people getting slaughtered in historical-record numbers Yup. Our stupid gun laws are definitely the biggest problem I just get tired of people acting like it's the only problem. I really do wonder how much of the problem would be solved by just closing the drat gun show loophole nationwide. Allowing private citizens to just go "well hey I didn't think he'd murder anything so I sold him a gun. What's the big deal? Just ignore that I didn't even ask his name or anything. Who am I to judge?" is a massive problem.
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Apr 3, 2018 01:09
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So what I'm taking away from all of this is... people who were jewish bullied hitler in high school?  Wow these fucks are dumb / cruel and selfish / both.
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Apr 3, 2018 01:17
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If i didn't sell him a gun he would have just murdered all those people with his bare hands. Wouldn't you rather be shot than beat to death? So in a way, the guns are a net positive
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Apr 3, 2018 01:17
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Dr. Arbitrary posted:There's no shortage of historical examples of how minority groups get treated if they try armed resistance. In an alternate universe it was a weapon of mass destruction and that's how we got Shadowrun.
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Apr 3, 2018 01:45
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