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I R SMART LIKE ROCK: Mar 10, 2003; I just want a hug.; Fun Shoe

Comedy option right now is that one of the Birb / Rhj combo is Cell and the other is Gero. Then of course they�d be at each other�s throats while the rest of us watch in horror

# ? Apr 3, 2018 17:33

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# ? Jun 9, 2024 21:57

Cartridgeblowers: Jan 3, 2006; Super Mario Bros 3

Okay then let's just give up. I'm ready.

Cell or gero whoever claims first I pledge my loyalty to you and will help you win the game.

# ? Apr 3, 2018 17:34

I R SMART LIKE ROCK: Mar 10, 2003; I just want a hug.; Fun Shoe

I think killing Cell would be better overall. No one wants Cell to win. So Gero this is your chance to shine

# ? Apr 3, 2018 17:36

50 pounds of bread: Sep 27, 2006

Following my gut! ## vote rhj

# ? Apr 3, 2018 17:45

I R SMART LIKE ROCK: Mar 10, 2003; I just want a hug.; Fun Shoe

I'm not sure why but I was reminded of this interaction yesterday:

Rhjamiz posted:

I've been consistently on town's side the entire game. If you all think I'm scum, then just vote for me and let's get this over with.

Xad posted:

Sure thing pal

##vote rhjamiz

Mona later makes a point that Xad was dunking on Rhjamiz, which is either bussing or legit not on the same team

Monathin posted:

If a couple more people want to power up the Kikoho, that's fine. Better to ensure Xad's destruction.

Xad's self-destruct if nothing else probably clears Rhjamiz.

So that kind of leaves one option, imo.

##vote chaoslord

# ? Apr 3, 2018 17:53

50 pounds of bread: Sep 27, 2006

Well, I don't think rhj is cell, because I think cell killed Mona, and I think he is immune to doc protects.

# ? Apr 3, 2018 18:15

I R SMART LIKE ROCK: Mar 10, 2003; I just want a hug.; Fun Shoe

50 pounds of bread posted:

Well, I don't think rhj is cell, because I think cell killed Mona, and I think he is immune to doc protects.

Are you saying you think Rhjamiz is Gero / Android 20?

# ? Apr 3, 2018 18:20

50 pounds of bread: Sep 27, 2006

Yeah.

# ? Apr 3, 2018 18:34

50 pounds of bread: Sep 27, 2006

That, or birdstrike is.

# ? Apr 3, 2018 18:34

50 pounds of bread: Sep 27, 2006

Crazyeyes and i are the only confirmed townies in my eyes right now, and i fully expect us to both be targeted tonight. Im planning on protecting one of us tonight, so hopefully only one of us dies.

# ? Apr 3, 2018 18:36

I R SMART LIKE ROCK: Mar 10, 2003; I just want a hug.; Fun Shoe

Yo 50 these are the only times that you bring up Rhjamiz

50 pounds of bread posted:

The other two people voting mord right now (gtg didn't hold their unvote) are rhjamiz and Willie Dee.

Willie see seems to be getting their bearings for mafia in general, it's difficult for me to have an opinion on them until they get into the rythym of the game more.

Rhjamiz has a different approach to the case than asiina, and it's one I feel is fairly safe, but also better. Their point is that when questioned, mord doubled down on what they perceived to be a weaker part of the case, then proceeded to backpedal when he received real pressure.

This is a far stronger case, and I would find the mord case more worthy if it was based off of this point. However, I feel that the easier approach taken by asiina and seemingly parroted by multiple people, reeks of scum manipulation. Because I think asiina and mord cannot be scum together, and that asiina is by far the scummier of the two, this argument has fallen to the backburner for me.

I will write up the people who have already unvoted mord in a bit, I need to run to the store.

50 pounds of bread posted:

Jeabus next.

Jeabus is another jokevote, but their reactions to the situation deserve comment.

They correctly point out two major points that I completely agree with.

First, mord is more likely scum than lumpen given info that we have. Mainly xad corroborating the claim.

The second is that mords aggressive insistence on flavor arguments being putting his neck out too far for scum. This point is WIFOM, but I think is more likely to be true than not. This is also the complete contrary to rhjamiz case, which is the other side of that WIFOM, however gains power if it's to be perceived mord backed off after receiving pressure.

I do not find any cases against jeabus compelling at all, because I can see a clear train of thought with no perceived calculated wordsmithing.

but Rhjamiz brings you up a lot in their post history here's some samples:

Rhjamiz posted:

I'm going to try to get my thoughts down here before the thread gets away from me;

I still believe Mord to be the best scum candidate at present and will not change my vote unless a better candidate appears. Mord's initial double-down on the weakest part of his reasoning when things were uncertain, only to quickly abandon it when the heat turned up on him comes across as scum behavior and further confirms my feelings on the matter. I can elaborate further if needed, but I'm phone posting so apologies if I'm generalizing.

I'm almost certain Lumpen is town right now; his actions post-claim make sense from a Town perspective, and I don't see how a Scum Gambit would be worth the risk.

I have a much weaker Town read on 50. I agree with him that there is no false choice between Mord and Lumpen. I disagree that Mord is just being dumb Town. What I don't understand was going hard on defense for Mord and pointing at Lumpen, and it feels like he set up the idea of that false choice himself. However, 50's playstyle is one I am strongly biased against; playing flippant and disruptive Town only helps Scum in my experience, either as cover for your own future Scum play, distracting less experienced Town players into false cases against you, or allowing the actual scum to build an weak but emotionally persuasive case against you.

That said, I feel people who play this way tend to have weaker scum games and while I disagree with 50, I can sorta understand his angle, which feels Towny.

Rhjamiz posted:

I'll engage with this.

I suppose a lot of my suspicion grows from several disconcerting conveniences, rather than thinking that you are outright lying about your powers. I happen to believe you actually can do most if not all of what you claim. I just think that a smart Cell would basically hide behind the truth and re-flavor their powers to fit their fakeclaim, making it far easier to avoid being caught out in an obvious lie.

I don't believe 50's result has any actual bearing on your alignment, because we have no idea how this poo poo works and he won't tell us, so we have to rely on his judgement of the results and his judgement has been, frankly, very questionable in this game, so I prefer to judge that on my own. Until 50 fully explains what the gently caress it is he can do, his vouch means nothing to me. I believe 50 is Krillin, and that's about it. 50 is an extremely convenient role to hide behind for Town status right now, which makes me suspicious.

I believe:

Nat20 would absolutely give Cell a Goku safe claim.

That your abilities post-HTC are, frankly, almost absurdly powerful and far out of proportion compared to the results others have reported. If you are town, you are effectively unkillable. Yeah, if you take someone with you who has a kill you die, supposedly, but let's be honest; that is not a real weakness going into D3. By then you'll have a confirmed town, or an absurdly strong town read, and you can just take them with you forever, making the both of you immortal. Entirely removing the ability for scum to eliminate a major potential threat to them feels very unbalanced.

I believe you can jail/hide yourself and a target. If you were Cell or Scum, lying about that would get you caught out really quick. The BP PGO, on the other hand, bothers the hell out of me. One shot or not, it effectively discourages any and all investigation, tracking, or copping. Town won't risk checking you for fear of dying, and Scum can't touch you for the same reason.

I believe the sum of your abilities are geared toward your own personal survival. I believe that if I were going to make a Gimmick SK or 3p for this massive game, I might give them a lot of self-preservation abilities in order to give the poor fucker a shot at making it all the way to the end to get a shot at winning.

Basically;

I believe you can do probably most of what you say you can do, but that none of it is actually helpful for Town. This makes me suspect you might be Cell.

It feels like Rhjamiz is legit scum hunting. Where it feels like earlier in the game you were scum hunting but now all your hot takes have disappeared

Also isn't it odd for Town to have both a Bodyguard and a Doctor?

# ? Apr 3, 2018 18:57

I R SMART LIKE ROCK: Mar 10, 2003; I just want a hug.; Fun Shoe

50 pounds of bread posted:

Crazyeyes and i are the only confirmed townies in my eyes right now, and i fully expect us to both be targeted tonight. Im planning on protecting one of us tonight, so hopefully only one of us dies.

What about Little Mac?

# ? Apr 3, 2018 18:57

50 pounds of bread: Sep 27, 2006

I R SMART LIKE ROCK posted:

What about Little Mac?

I'm still not sure.

I feel like you guys should feel safe about me after 18's flip, despite mord turning out to be evil. The person I was connected to was town, I think they had the wool pulled over their eyes.

# ? Apr 3, 2018 19:11

Crazyeyes: Nov 5, 2009; If I were human, I believe my response would be: 'go to hell'.

Really between RHJ and bird imo.

# ? Apr 3, 2018 19:22

I R SMART LIKE ROCK: Mar 10, 2003; I just want a hug.; Fun Shoe

Birdstrike posted:

At this stage I�m leaning Xad over crazyeyes for probable Gero.

Rhj I�d also consider because bodyguard is a good role to claim for recruiter. If you�re seen visiting someone and they don�t die you can claim bodyguard.

I�m happy to vote Mord today he�s not being honest. It�s probably about time 50 have us more information on what he did with 18 too.

I R SMART LIKE ROCK posted:

Yo 50 these are the only times that you bring up Rhjamiz

but Rhjamiz brings you up a lot in their post history here's some samples:

It feels like Rhjamiz is legit scum hunting. Where it feels like earlier in the game you were scum hunting but now all your hot takes have disappeared

Also isn't it odd for Town to have both a Bodyguard and a Doctor?

I'm leaning Rhjamiz so far but I kinda want to hear from Birdstrike again

# ? Apr 3, 2018 19:34

I R SMART LIKE ROCK: Mar 10, 2003; I just want a hug.; Fun Shoe

Birdstrike posted:

ahaha holy poo poo

RHJ visited Sal

Birdstrike posted:

##vote RHJ

Birdstrike posted:

lmao

This feels like a natural reaction to finding that out that information

# ? Apr 3, 2018 19:37

birdstrike: Oct 30, 2008; i;m gay

I�m awake. I�ve been reading early game Rhj and I can see them as Gero.

Rhjamiz posted:

I see this as the opposite. Why would Town need to build a flavor-case against you? Anyone else, I could understand, but you gave us information as soon as the game started, so it's not like he had nothing else to go on. He had enough for an early Day 1 case for or against lynching you, in any event.

Further, when someone else claimed to be a Town-aligned villain, the immediate jump to "It must be the Z Fighters" rather than "Is this a lie?" or "I guess there might be Towny villains/androids?" also does not strike me as a Town reaction. I don't see how these actions come from a Town perspective.

Given all that, he seems the scummiest to me at the moment.

##vote Mordiceius

Early game vote on Mord who flipped android aligned. Mord and willie did a similar thing voting each other. It�s a common scum move to vote for a teammate as a way to get into the game early before later findin a reason to move off them.

Rhjamiz posted:

I'm going to try to get my thoughts down here before the thread gets away from me;

I still believe Mord to be the best scum candidate at present and will not change my vote unless a better candidate appears. Mord's initial double-down on the weakest part of his reasoning when things were uncertain, only to quickly abandon it when the heat turned up on him comes across as scum behavior and further confirms my feelings on the matter. I can elaborate further if needed, but I'm phone posting so apologies if I'm generalizing.

I'm almost certain Lumpen is town right now; his actions post-claim make sense from a Town perspective, and I don't see how a Scum Gambit would be worth the risk.

I have a much weaker Town read on 50. I agree with him that there is no false choice between Mord and Lumpen. I disagree that Mord is just being dumb Town. What I don't understand was going hard on defense for Mord and pointing at Lumpen, and it feels like he set up the idea of that false choice himself. However, 50's playstyle is one I am strongly biased against; playing flippant and disruptive Town only helps Scum in my experience, either as cover for your own future Scum play, distracting less experienced Town players into false cases against you, or allowing the actual scum to build an weak but emotionally persuasive case against you.

That said, I feel people who play this way tend to have weaker scum games and while I disagree with 50, I can sorta understand his angle, which feels Towny.

Notable weak town read on 50

Rhjamiz posted:

I agree that b-'s explanation is fine, but the unnecessary inflammatory nature of it, coupled with that initial weak dodge, really stinks. How does it benefit Town to pick a fight like this when asked to expand on basic reasonings? I won't buy a "just gauging reactions" defense if it shows up. I'd be fine with switching my vote to b- if it comes to it.

I also want to hear more from willie. I find it hard to believe you have no reads at all at this point in the day. You don't even have guesses or opinions? Give us something to read you by, if nothing else.

Call out of willie who I think would have still been android aligned at this point

Rhjamiz posted:

I would vote for b-minus1, Mord, or willie, which is roughly my order of most scummy to least scummy.

I think Mord and willie are there to get town cred if one of them flipped.

Rhjamiz posted:

I am dropping willie from my list of would-vote and replacing him with Dancer, who's "reads" were... uh. Interesting. Especially how he ends it with a vote on someone for whom his only comments were A) wrong and B) "he voted for lumpen to see what his thing is" but with no actual read behind it. And then ducks into the aether again.

Conveniently drops willie from suspect list

Rhjamiz posted:

I do not see this case against fifty, and I'm all the more suspicious of it considering that two of my scum picks are the ones voting for it right now, while the rest have gone silent.

Does not see case against 50

Rhjamiz posted:

This argument is pretty drat convincing to me, and would explain his desire to breadcrumb Krillin on Day 1 which runs directly counter to his assertion that "it's way more powerful if nobody knows it."

##vote 50

The next day is voting 50. I don�t think 50 and Rhj are teammates.

# ? Apr 3, 2018 21:52

I R SMART LIKE ROCK: Mar 10, 2003; I just want a hug.; Fun Shoe

Oh gently caress it ##vote Rhjamiz; let�s end this charade already

# ? Apr 3, 2018 22:11

Rhjamiz: Oct 28, 2007

The only people who benefit from rushing this vote are scum. At this point I'm forced to assume everyone on it is scum because it doesn't make sense otherwise.

Rip this town

# ? Apr 3, 2018 22:38

birdstrike: Oct 30, 2008; i;m gay

there was a fire alarm at my hotel
it�s too early for that

# ? Apr 3, 2018 22:45

50 pounds of bread: Sep 27, 2006

##unvote

You're not wrong. I just am at a loss at this point. I don't see any scenarios I find more likely.

# ? Apr 3, 2018 22:46

birdstrike: Oct 30, 2008; i;m gay

Rhjamiz posted:

The only people who benefit from rushing this vote are scum. At this point I'm forced to assume everyone on it is scum because it doesn't make sense otherwise.

Rip this town

if that was true this game would be over

nice try though

# ? Apr 3, 2018 22:46

Rhjamiz: Oct 28, 2007

Birdstrike posted:

if that was true this game would be over

nice try though

Birdstrike posted:

if that was true this game would be over

nice try though

Really? 3 votes, four to hammer and 7 alive, but the game would be over? Please. It's you, your scum buddy, and Cell. The rest of us are town and you want the day done so no one has a chance to look too hard.

# ? Apr 3, 2018 22:49

50 pounds of bread: Sep 27, 2006

Assuming I'm anything but town is kinda crazy tho.

# ? Apr 3, 2018 22:51

Rhjamiz: Oct 28, 2007

I'm feeling like I'm going crazy, yes. Talk to me if we make it to tomorrow.

# ? Apr 3, 2018 22:55

birdstrike: Oct 30, 2008; i;m gay

Rhjamiz posted:

Really? 3 votes, four to hammer and 7 alive, but the game would be over? Please. It's you, your scum buddy, and Cell. The rest of us are town and you want the day done so no one has a chance to look too hard.

sorry I thought it was 6 alive

# ? Apr 3, 2018 22:56

I R SMART LIKE ROCK: Mar 10, 2003; I just want a hug.; Fun Shoe

I mean here�s the deal; someone has to be lying at this point. So unless someone has some brilliant case to make; we�re pretty much guessing

# ? Apr 3, 2018 23:02

I R SMART LIKE ROCK: Mar 10, 2003; I just want a hug.; Fun Shoe

Rhjamiz posted:

The only people who benefit from rushing this vote are scum. At this point I'm forced to assume everyone on it is scum because it doesn't make sense otherwise.

Rip this town

I honestly have no clue at this point. The strongest case at the moment is that you and Birdstrike have contradictory claims. While we technically shouldn�t fall into the false narrative of only two choices. There is simply no way to square your two claims if you both are town afaik

# ? Apr 3, 2018 23:12

birdstrike: Oct 30, 2008; i;m gay

I R SMART LIKE ROCK posted:

I honestly have no clue at this point. The strongest case at the moment is that you and Birdstrike have contradictory claims. While we technically shouldn�t fall into the false narrative of only two choices. There is simply no way to square your two claims if you both are town afaik

Are you willing to assume 50 is town?

# ? Apr 3, 2018 23:14

birdstrike: Oct 30, 2008; i;m gay

If 50 was the killer I don�t see why he wouldn�t just claim he protected me as claimed power role instead of saying he visited Monathin and Monathin died anyway. It�s a risky play.

I�m willing to take LM and Crazy as town based on what other flipped town players said they did.

The only way Rhj�s version makes sense, assuming 50 is town, is if one of the claimed vanillas was also a killer. But if I was lying about my results on them, why wouldn�t they counterclaim and vote me?

# ? Apr 3, 2018 23:17

I R SMART LIKE ROCK: Mar 10, 2003; I just want a hug.; Fun Shoe

Birdstrike posted:

Are you willing to assume 50 is town?

50 has been shady all game. I�ve noticed that their posting style has changed a bit over the course of the game. Where early it was spitting mad fire where now it�s much more subdued

I R SMART LIKE ROCK posted:

Yo 50 these are the only times that you bring up Rhjamiz

but Rhjamiz brings you up a lot in their post history here's some samples:

It feels like Rhjamiz is legit scum hunting. Where it feels like earlier in the game you were scum hunting but now all your hot takes have disappeared

Also isn't it odd for Town to have both a Bodyguard and a Doctor?

It may be that this read was actually correct. 50 is jumping on the confusion and is trying to sneak a win

The only problem is how do we resolve the Android 18 thing? Wait.... Mord was the one who confirmed that and ended up being Android

# ? Apr 3, 2018 23:22

I R SMART LIKE ROCK: Mar 10, 2003; I just want a hug.; Fun Shoe

##unvote

# ? Apr 3, 2018 23:22

I R SMART LIKE ROCK: Mar 10, 2003; I just want a hug.; Fun Shoe

Where is everyone else?

# ? Apr 3, 2018 23:31

Rhjamiz: Oct 28, 2007

No idea. The lurking bothers me.

# ? Apr 3, 2018 23:37

50 pounds of bread: Sep 27, 2006

18 was town and didn't counterclaim. Mord used her for town cred to push goku. My alignment is the 2nd easiest alignment in the thread to deduce.

# ? Apr 3, 2018 23:41

birdstrike: Oct 30, 2008; i;m gay

I�ve done some more rereading and Rhj�s claimed actions don�t add up, specifically that he bodyguarded b-minus on night 2.

Rhj went after b-minus pretty much all of day 2, voting him and calling him a �strong scum read.�

Even after b-minus�s claim Rhj still had suspicions about the claim

Rhjamiz posted:

He has also been entirely too evasive and still refuses to answer direct prods, so I'm finding this result claim to be seriously loving suspect. I'm willing to believe he is a Watcher/Tracker, but I am struggling to reconcile this with his behavior and the ease with which this could be a scum gambit.

Later on, does this post in response to binus look like Rhj had a town read on him?

Rhjamiz posted:

Is there a reason you are just chastising Lumpen and fluffposting, and not actually scumhunting?

I don�t think Rhj believed b-minus at the time enough to bodyguard him. I think he claimed to have protected b-minus later on for town cred.

# ? Apr 3, 2018 23:46

Rhjamiz: Oct 28, 2007

I protected b- on the off chance he was telling the truth, because I knew that if I did not, I would feel stupid if he died and flipped watcher.

# ? Apr 3, 2018 23:57

I R SMART LIKE ROCK: Mar 10, 2003; I just want a hug.; Fun Shoe

50 pounds of bread posted:

18 was town and didn't counterclaim. Mord used her for town cred to push goku. My alignment is the 2nd easiest alignment in the thread to deduce.

I�ve been thinking on that exact problem 50. Why would 18 have outed themselves at that point in the game? We assumed there was still a Cell running about

willie_dee posted:

Can I just say I do not feel this game has been newbie friendly and have found it very difficult to keep track of everything.

Are we all set on Mord telling the truth?

willie_dee posted:

I don't think this can be true as Mord came out before it was revealed 18 and Krillin fell in love.

Why would willie_dee undercut Mord like that? Since Mord was claimed town at that point. Then seems to support Mord against my prognostication of 18 being on their own. This all happens on the same day and is pretty confusing

# ? Apr 4, 2018 00:03

50 pounds of bread: Sep 27, 2006

If you want to not believe me go ahead.

Check out day 2. Look at what I said to asiina. Do you know why I believed her immediately?

My result n1 was my action was successful. I targeted jeabus. Jeabus died anyway. Asiina claimed she pulled me off my target. I told her that while I believed her that her action hurt town.

Despite the fact that you are right about me being a bit shifty with my personality, my actions add up to everything. I have been super consistent.

# ? Apr 4, 2018 00:12

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# ? Jun 9, 2024 21:57

I R SMART LIKE ROCK: Mar 10, 2003; I just want a hug.; Fun Shoe

Hey Rhjamiz how do you feel about 50?

For the record I�m not happy about the lurking either. If scum wins by coasting to victory that�s pretty lovely

# ? Apr 4, 2018 00:13

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