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Dr Subterfuge posted:Deku has that nervous, cowardly vibe sometimes when he's interacting with people normally, so I can maybe see where that comes from, but he's anything but a coward when it comes to actual heroics. That's why he has One for All in the first place. Deku at the start of the series is a bit cowardly when it came to his own safety, like when Bakugou would mess with him and he would usually cower away. It wasn't until he started training with All Might that he began to learn to stand up for himself a bit. But even then he would still run into danger when other people's safety was on the line, like when he tried to save Bakugou from the sludge villain or even in that flashback when he tried to stop Bakugou and his friends from picking on another kid.
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Apr 3, 2018 05:07
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Deku's not a coward, he's just got some social anxiety. When the chips are down he's self-sacrificial enough to make Emiya Shirou blush.
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Apr 3, 2018 05:52
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Bikindok posted:It's just the obvious answer: My Hero Academia runs in Shonen Jump. Shonen Jump is supposed to appeal to japanese pre-teen boys. Japanese pre-teen boys don't care about girls fighting. This answer sucks because there have been other jump series where girls have gotten more focus in fights and such than MHA. Including series which are being released alongside it.
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Apr 3, 2018 07:32
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Apr 3, 2018 09:18
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SyntheticPolygon posted:This answer sucks because there have been other jump series where girls have gotten more focus in fights and such than MHA. Including series which are being released alongside it. Kishimoto while ultimately making his girl characters completely worthless and ancillary to the main plot (and being a bad writer in general) did let them have a halfway decent fight or two. I mean, over a gigantic 600+ chapter series but still.
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Apr 3, 2018 11:41
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Remember when Tenten almost got to be useful by picking up the artifact that would have sealed the bad guy away forever and totally fitted her combat expertise, then got whisked away into a magic dream tree and never appeared again.
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Apr 3, 2018 11:46
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Fabricated posted:It differs but WSJ definitely on average gives girls the short shrift. Big exceptions are rare. They definitely do but I find it weird to attribute series being bad about female characters as entirely the result of being in jump, because I think the exceptions at least prove that you can be better about it in some ways that I don't think MHA always is. I don't think the fact that jump and many shonen stories in general don't have the best track record in regards to female characters is enough reason to say "well these problems are just because of the magazine they're released in and the author can't help it so much". If Horikoshi really wanted to give the girls in 1-A fight scenes and have them get focus in important stuff I think he could do it, or at least he could do a better job of it than he has done in a few cases. Not that Horikoshi even writes the girls poorly or anything, he's a good character writer and the vast majority of his cast are very fun and entertaining. It's just sorta lame that consistently the girls don't get many fights (not that mha has a whole lotta fights per arc anyway, but still it's a trend) or tend to get much focus in the more heavy arcs. And I don't think it's super fair to just explain it away as "well that's jump I guess"
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Apr 3, 2018 13:06
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what series in jump has girls that fight a lot?
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Apr 3, 2018 13:35
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Kild posted:what series in jump has girls that fight a lot? Nezuko in Yaiba might as well have entrance music cause it's always a big deal when she fights.
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Apr 3, 2018 13:41
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Kild posted:what series in jump has girls that fight a lot? Food Wars does but that’s a different style of fighting and also a girl has never won a fight until like 10 chapters ago Bleach was ok about it?
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Apr 3, 2018 14:56
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TheKingofSprings posted:Food Wars does but that’s a different style of fighting and also a girl has never won a fight until like 10 chapters ago
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Apr 3, 2018 15:11
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Pour one out for Halibel, still trapped in that ghost Nazi's sex dungeon.
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Apr 3, 2018 15:14
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TheKingofSprings posted:Bleach was ok about it? Girls do get to be badasses, but it's definitely a mixed bag. The premise of the best arc is still "rescue the girl." Same with the one after that, actually, which was especially dumb because Orihime theoretically had godlike reality rejecting powers but were never really used. Not that I would really recommend anyone reading Bleach at this point. What I wish I'd done is just stopped watching the anime after the Soul Society arc and called it done.
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Apr 3, 2018 15:16
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you mean how they say she got captured by the quincies and then never mention her again? to be fair (and also insanely generous considering we're talking about bleach), she might have been a casualty of the cancellation since kubo would have stretched that poo poo out for years if they'd let him
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Apr 3, 2018 15:16
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Kubo left her alive (after Aizen killed her) so that she could be the ruler of Hueco Mundo, and then yeah she got capture and put in the ghost nazi dungeon, never to be heard from again.
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Apr 3, 2018 15:17
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Remember when Bleach had movies and an anime series. Remember when all that goodwill got pissed away through interminable pacing, so Kubo responded to being given one arc to wrap everything up by creating an entire alphabet army of lieutenants for the cast to fight, a baker's dozen of chapters at a time. Remember when Jump finally pulled the plug and he had to hammer out a finale in five chapters. Good times.
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Apr 3, 2018 15:29
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Okay, yeah, calling Deku a coward was unfair of me. He was kind of a weenie at first, though. girl dick energy fucked around with this message at 16:45 on Apr 3, 2018 |
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Apr 3, 2018 16:42
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Deku isn’t timid out of fear; he’s timid because he doesn’t really have a healthy regard for his own life.
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Apr 3, 2018 17:53
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You'd probably wind up pretty timid too if you grew up powerless in a society of super mutants who mostly heckled you for being powerless.
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Apr 3, 2018 18:01
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"I learned that courage was not the absence of fear, but the triumph over it. The brave man is not he who does not feel afraid, but he who conquers that fear." - Nelson Mandela Saying Deku is cowardly because he experiences fear is kind of ridiculous tbh
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Apr 3, 2018 18:32
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Fine, Aoyama then. Just not Mineta.
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Apr 3, 2018 18:59
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It's Mineta, get over it.
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Apr 3, 2018 19:06
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if anything mineta would be sanji or the invisible zombie guy
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Apr 3, 2018 19:08
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Bleach had enough sales to keep going. It ended because Kubo physically could not keep up with the weekly pace anymore and they weren't willing to cut him an Oda "take a break whenever you want" deal. Also the original point is "Bleach is still better about letting women fight than MHA" which, like, still isn't wrong. JahRoo posted:Kubo left her alive (after Aizen killed her) so that she could be the ruler of Hueco Mundo, and then yeah she got capture and put in the ghost nazi dungeon, never to be heard from again. The Baccano dude wrote a novel that resolved this.
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Apr 3, 2018 19:22
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But who is Sasuke?
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Apr 3, 2018 19:23
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Sasuke is a state of mind. Or a miserable pile of mind-controlled fans. Take your pick. Regarding girls getting in fights the like of which happens in MHA it could be any number of reasons, many of which have been covered. There only angle that doesn't seem to have been covered in the discussion is how uncomfortable it can be to watch or conceptualize harm to a female character. I mean, imagine Froppy, Uraraka or Mina getting seriously, sent-to-intensive-care messed up like Deku or All Might has. Now imagine trying to storyboard that. The Uraraka vs. Bakugo fight was pretty timid on the scale of what MHA has gotten up to. Edit: oh wait duh we have a prime example right in this thread. Take what happened to bee girl in Vigilante's and apply it to the female cast in the main series. That stuffs pretty uncomfortable yo'. EponymousMrYar fucked around with this message at 22:53 on Apr 3, 2018 |
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Apr 3, 2018 22:50
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Yeah but Deku, Aizawa, Iida, and Mirio are the only male characters who've ever been put through serious intensive harm, and lots of other boys get to fight. Todoroki's had 3 major encounters with villains (Stain, Moonfish, he fought solo in the USJ attack), and never got seriously injured in any of them. Kirishima and Suneater got some pretty intense fights in the Overhaul arc, but their actual damage was standard shonen scuff marks. There's no reason Ochako and/or Froppy couldn't have been in Suneater's place, or that their fight for the arc had to happen entirely off-screen. Like, I get the argument that Shonen Jump doesn't like girls getting beat up real bad, but MHA hasn't had someone get brutalized in MOST of its fights. We just remember the exceptions because most of the exceptions involve our protagonist, and half the time he's doing it to himself. I miss the determinator Ochako from the tourney a lot.
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Apr 3, 2018 23:04
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gnome7 posted:Like, I get the argument that Shonen Jump doesn't like girls getting beat up real bad, but MHA hasn't had someone get brutalized in MOST of its fights. We just remember the exceptions because most of the exceptions involve our protagonist, and half the time he's doing it to himself. Also, the already-mentioned Bleach has plenty of scenes where female characters (often very young-looking ones) get impaled or bisected, so clearly Jump has no hard editorial rule against it.
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Apr 3, 2018 23:37
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Would've been pretty easy to have Ryuko take the brunt of the damage in her dragon form for the theoretical girls' fight as the rest of the girls pile on the damage to the badguy. That circumvents the "oh gosh we can't see girls getting hurt" thing by having her not look like a human woman at the time. It would also make sense, having something like that be the "tank" and also because she's their mentor so she -should- be protecting them.
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Apr 3, 2018 23:38
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I don't want to see anyone get hurt just to prove a point.  Maybe the girls are just better heroes because they aren't winding up maimed all the time.
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Apr 3, 2018 23:42
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if a dragon is fighting some guy who is able to fight a dragon i'm not sure what a frog girl could contribute.
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Apr 3, 2018 23:46
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Tsuyu and Ochako's combo move seemed pretty good when they were fighting two giant guys, I'm sure they could come up with more stuff in that vein.
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Apr 3, 2018 23:52
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Give every girl their own Spopovich fight.
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Apr 4, 2018 00:48
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EponymousMrYar posted:There only angle that doesn't seem to have been covered in the discussion is how uncomfortable it can be to watch or conceptualize harm to a female character. I mean, imagine Froppy, Uraraka or Mina getting seriously, sent-to-intensive-care messed up like Deku or All Might has. Getting antsy about girls getting beat up is a lot of that Uraraka vs Bakugo fight is about. It was great because it came off as a direct rebuttal to the sentiment in this post. Though you just made me think of Fairy Tail and ugh. That's on the other end of bad.
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Apr 4, 2018 01:49
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Dr Subterfuge posted:Getting antsy about girls getting beat up is a lot of that Uraraka vs Bakugo fight is about. It was great because it came off as a direct rebuttal to the sentiment in this post. Though you just made me think of Fairy Tail and ugh. That's on the other end of bad. Still more dignified than Lucy, who for some reason still has an attachment to Aquarius just because of her mom despite Aquarius being a super bitch that ditched Lucy to get her rear end totally kicked like 3-4 times in a row
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Apr 4, 2018 01:54
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I'm trying to come up with a shonen jump manga other than Bleach, Flame of Recca, and occasionally Jojo where the females get to consistently demonstrate fighting skills as both villains and heroes on par with the male heroes and villains. It's hard. Naruto started with some good parity, but like every other aspect of that manga it degraded with time.
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Apr 4, 2018 02:09
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I'd be totally down for Uraraka having a really kickass CQC fight with a villain and have it basically be every bit as blood-spitting as most of Midoriya's fights Uraraka is cool and deserves a good serious fight
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Apr 4, 2018 02:47
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AndwhatIseeisme posted:I'm trying to come up with a shonen jump manga other than Bleach, Flame of Recca, and occasionally Jojo where the females get to consistently demonstrate fighting skills as both villains and heroes on par with the male heroes and villains. It's hard. Naruto started with some good parity, but like every other aspect of that manga it degraded with time. How about Buso Renkin? It was short-lived, but darn good. I've never read it, but I heard that Kekkaishi was pretty good on that account.
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Apr 4, 2018 03:04
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kekkaishi is good in general and worth a read. I don't remember it treating the girls particularly different for fights
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Apr 4, 2018 03:15
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kekkaishi was interesting because the female lead was explicitly weaker than the male lead despite the two of them sharing same basic power set, but she kept working at it and learned effective techniques that relied on fine control rather than brute force. it was also interesting in lots of other ways.
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Apr 4, 2018 03:46
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