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So the 3 Datasheet restriction: this is units correct? I can have 2 units of 2 Dragoons in Admech and this is only 2 instances of the datasheet right?
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Apr 16, 2018 19:45
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EvilBeard posted:So the 3 Datasheet restriction: this is units correct? I can have 2 units of 2 Dragoons in Admech and this is only 2 instances of the datasheet right? Correct.
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Apr 16, 2018 19:47
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EvilBeard posted:So the 3 Datasheet restriction: this is units correct? I can have 2 units of 2 Dragoons in Admech and this is only 2 instances of the datasheet right? Correct. What I'm wondering about is tau drones, since the drones you take in random units actually use the Fast Attack Tactical Drones datasheet ("Note that this datasheet is also used for Tactical Drones that accompany many T’au Empire units"). That seems a little messy.
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Apr 16, 2018 19:48
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I like that having people declare that they will quit X forever stands as an indicator for both bad and good balance changes 
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Apr 16, 2018 19:49
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Mango Polo posted:fixed Can't argue with that
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Apr 16, 2018 19:52
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Safety Factor posted:Deathwing isn't hurt by the 0-3 limitation at all. You've got standard terminators, cataphractii, tartaros, and Deathwing knights to choose from plus all the characters. What screws them is the weird PL requirement when figuring out what gets to deep strike. Of course Deathwing armies are hurt by this. Deathwing armies are built with Deathwing Terminator spam in mind. Not for competitive reasons, mind you. I am rebuilding a Dark Angels army right now, having not played for a few editions, and with no intention of even running a full Deathwing list, I've still now got too many Deathwing models to ever feature them all together. Your point that I could just go buy Cataphractii and Tartaros Terminators and get functionally the same thing, at an added monetary and aesthetic cost, demonstrates that there should be a carve out. And presumably there will be. All Deathwing armies were a thing even when I played last (3rd ed). Deathwing Terminators counting as troops choices in a list that consists entirely of Terminators, Dreads and Land Raiders would be nothing new. All of which is academic since Terminators are not, apparently, any good right now and presumably they just got slightly worse.
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Apr 16, 2018 19:55
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Having meditated further - time to buy a hemlock, and sell my soul and play Ulthwe/Alaitoc. The new faq isn’t just “not a nerf” to Alaitoc, I think it’s actually a buff, as your opponent can’t get around the 12 inch rule by dropping in something like obliterators or flyrants on turn 1. Having a guaranteed battle round before anything nasty comes in close is great. Hemlocks are now probably the most cost efficient way to get access to jinx. Quicken caught a stealth nerf that someone on Facebook spotted - quicken and warptime both now cannot affect a unit that arrived from deep strike in the same turn, so you probably don’t need multiple warlock casters any more (though losing cheap slot fillers still stings). Need to work out my new LGT army ASAP, as I do unfortunately think my beautiful Biel Tan Brigade just goes on the scrap heap at this point, so I might have a lot of painting to do.
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Apr 16, 2018 19:59
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You know, there's another question. If I take 3 Raven Guard Hellblasters, can I take any Blood Angels Hellblasters? What exactly defines a datasheet?
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Apr 16, 2018 20:05
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Mango Polo posted:Huh. I actually agree. Are you having a ischemic attack or some sort of a stroke? 
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Apr 16, 2018 20:07
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One_Wing posted:Having meditated further - time to buy a hemlock, and sell my soul and play Ulthwe/Alaitoc. The new faq isn’t just “not a nerf” to Alaitoc, I think it’s actually a buff, as your opponent can’t get around the 12 inch rule by dropping in something like obliterators or flyrants on turn 1. Having a guaranteed battle round before anything nasty comes in close is great. This is my one disappointment with the FAQ - I was fully expecting to see the -1 traits get changed, since they've taken such a clear and hard move away from them in later books. That this isn't the case suggests they were wary about outright changing rules (as opposed to adding general restrictions). And yeah, despite apparently having a good relationship with Tabletop Tactics, they've completely missed a trick re: Lawrence's Eldar, which was already very strong and now sees most of its rivals weakened. Living Image fucked around with this message at 20:13 on Apr 16, 2018 |
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Apr 16, 2018 20:10
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FAQ is great and awesome.
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Apr 16, 2018 20:11
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Corrode posted:This is my one disappointment with the FAQ - I was fully expecting to see the -1 traits get changed, since they've taken such a clear and hard move away from them in later books. That this isn't the case suggests they were wary about outright changing rules (as opposed to adding general restrictions). Yeah, I don’t expect it to take long before the Alaitoc salt is everywhere - it’s not immediately obvious, but the more I think about it the more I’m boggling slightly at how good they now are. Assuming the LGT allows non-official colour schemes on armies, I’m almost certainly running my fire prism gunline as Alaitoc - a huge amount of the good counters are just dead in the water. Reapers being less good in such a gunline stings a bit, but they might still be good enough in moderation with an un-nerfed -1 trait. The other possible dark horse is support batteries - I’ve been itching to give them a try since I realised you could use celestial shield on them, but being paper thin to deep striking melee was a major downside. Not so relevant any more. Going to brainstorm some LGT options so I can build a shopping list.
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Apr 16, 2018 20:22
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Corrode posted:This is my one disappointment with the FAQ - I was fully expecting to see the -1 traits get changed, since they've taken such a clear and hard move away from them in later books. That this isn't the case suggests they were wary about outright changing rules (as opposed to adding general restrictions). The preamble when they were talking about the FAQ made it sound like they want to save major changes like that for the yearly Chapter Approved books, which is probably a mistake.
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Apr 16, 2018 20:29
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Great, now I need to dig out my Ripper Swarms I have lying around somewhere and pick up a couple Neurothropes (which I suspect will be dumped onto email soon enough from those running 4+): Battalion #1 Flyrant 209pts ++Adrenal Glands ++Monstrous Rending Claws ++Deathspitter Flyrant 209pts ++Adrenal Glands ++Monstrous Rending Claws ++Deathspitter 10x Termagant 40pts 10x Termagant 40pts 10x Termagant 40pts Exocrine 216pts Harpy 179pts ++2x Heavy Venom Cannon Harpy 179pts ++2x Heavy Venom Cannon Battalion #2 Flyrant 209pts ++Adrenal Glands ++Monstrous Rending Claws ++Deathspitter Malanthrope 140pts 10x Termagant 40pts 10x Termagant 40pts 10x Termagant 40pts Battalion #3 Neurothrope 70pts Neurothrope 70pts 3x Ripper Swarms 33pts 3x Ripper Swarms 33pts 3x Ripper Swarms 33pts 3x Ripper Swarms 33pts 1850pts exactly, 18CP (  )
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Apr 16, 2018 20:33
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I need to find something to spend 178pts on since I lost a squad of Mortars and my assassins, but my BA/IG list now has 20 CPs and loses out on very little damage output. Nice. For 16pts I might even take a Commissar again!
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Apr 16, 2018 20:44
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I finally got around to painting again and finished off a few things, bases aside!  A succubus assembled out of spare parts.  A full gang of wracks, which are an amazing kit that I want to do more of.  Out and about with dad!  and some rich flying jerks to round things out.
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Apr 16, 2018 20:53
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FiestaNinja posted:I finally got around to painting again and finished off a few things, bases aside! Those are some great, vivid colors there!
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Apr 16, 2018 20:55
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The extra CP alone is super exciting. Looking forward to dropping a bunch of demons then having enough CP to play around with some other fun tricks!
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Apr 16, 2018 20:56
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Kind of interesting that turn 1 deepstrikes are not okay, but forward deploying like Ghostkeels and Scouts is okay. I'd like a "only X% of your army may deep strike turn 1" or something.
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Apr 16, 2018 20:58
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I do feel it undercuts the Dark Eldar special detachment option which was neat, but they'd probably be stuck using normal detachment counts in tournament anyhow and the rest of their codex is in a good place.
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Apr 16, 2018 20:58
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Charging when you have the Fly keyword now ignores vertical distance. Does the "greater than 9 inches" deep strike ignore vertical distance?
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Apr 16, 2018 20:59
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Maneck posted:Of course Deathwing armies are hurt by this. Deathwing armies are built with Deathwing Terminator spam in mind. Not for competitive reasons, mind you. I am rebuilding a Dark Angels army right now, having not played for a few editions, and with no intention of even running a full Deathwing list, I've still now got too many Deathwing models to ever feature them all together. Your point that I could just go buy Cataphractii and Tartaros Terminators and get functionally the same thing, at an added monetary and aesthetic cost, demonstrates that there should be a carve out.  Or Deathwing Knights. I really like terminators.I just don't see being limited to 30 "Deathwing Terminators" as a big issue at normal game sizes. Deathwing finally got combat squads so even if you wanted to toss 5-man units everywhere, you can. However, I wouldn't even contemplate a Deathwing list without knights (mostly because I think they're cool models) and their elite-level characters are pretty strong. Those combined with support like dreadnoughts and a land raider or two and you're out of points pretty quick. I'd never be running 30+ standard terminators in 1850-2000 points though I can understand it being a problem in larger games. If it becomes a problem, talk to your opponent and try to work something out. And avoid tournaments. That's really all you can do.
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Apr 16, 2018 21:03
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Master Twig posted:FAQ is great and awesome.  , although it would have been nice to see more buffs to go with the nerfs. The original article on FAQs made it sound like they were going to do more to bring lesser-used units up to scratch. I was really hoping to see something good for Tyrant Guard or Maleceptors without waiting until Chapter Approved.Corrode posted:For 16pts I might even take a Commissar again! Was it my imagination or did the old commissar FAQ make Summary Execution mandatory? i.e. if you ever took a test you couldn't possibly pass and rolled a 1, you *had* to execute a dude and roll again, possibly getting a worse result. The current wording has the re-roll optional, and with the leadership bonus available for so few points I can definitely see them being used again.
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Apr 16, 2018 21:03
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chutche2 posted:Charging when you have the Fly keyword now ignores vertical distance. Does the "greater than 9 inches" deep strike ignore vertical distance?  Where are you seeing this at? I don't see it in the main FAQ
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Apr 16, 2018 21:05
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Pendent posted:
Check the core rulebook FAQ it got updated.
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Apr 16, 2018 21:06
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Pendent posted:
The BRB FAQ. Q: When a unit that can Fly declares a charge move against a unit that is on the upper levels of a ruin, do I need to include the vertical distance when making the subsequent charge move for the unit? A: No. A unit that can Fly effectively ignores vertical distances when making a charge move. Note though that the charging unit must still be within 12" (measured directly ‘base-to-base’, i.e. diagonally) to be able to declare the charge in the first place.
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Apr 16, 2018 21:07
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FiestaNinja posted:I finally got around to painting again and finished off a few things, bases aside! More like a succu-boss. These are great, I love the colors and the OG Homunculus.
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Apr 16, 2018 21:11
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Holy poo poo. Holy poo poo. I am going to abuse the absolute hell out of that.
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Apr 16, 2018 21:11
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Pendent posted:Holy poo poo. Yeah I'm putting vanguard in every list.
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Apr 16, 2018 21:12
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Which armies are most ripe for ebay ragequit bargains?
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Apr 16, 2018 21:14
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PierreTheMime posted:I do feel it undercuts the Dark Eldar special detachment option which was neat, but they'd probably be stuck using normal detachment counts in tournament anyhow and the rest of their codex is in a good place. It doesn't undercut anything. It just states the same position as GW has always had - if an event they don't run has a limit that says "3 detachments max, no exceptions" Johnny Drukhari can't turn up and say "But GW says DE are different!!" xtothez posted:
Yeah previously it was mandatory, so if you lost e.g. 10 dudes and could never pass, you absolutely had to lose 1 and then re-roll again (and potentially get a worse result than you started with). Now you can choose, so if you roll a 1 you can take that instead of being forced to lose 1+D6 dudes.
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Apr 16, 2018 21:16
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Lungboy posted:Which armies are most ripe for ebay ragequit bargains? Codex: Shield-Captain on Dawneagle Jetbike
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Apr 16, 2018 21:17
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Lungboy posted:Which armies are most ripe for ebay ragequit bargains? I'm feeling like it might be a good time to pick up an Eversor
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Apr 16, 2018 21:18
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PierreTheMime posted:Codex: Shield-Captain on Dawneagle Jetbike I was amazed not to see this eat a nerf of any kind.
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Apr 16, 2018 21:19
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Giant Isopod posted:Aww man, I just realized this fucks up my ability to use my penitent engine too - I was shuffling that off to my inquisitorial detachment so I didn't lose my stratagems. Well poo poo, I do the same thing. My secondary vanguard was crusaders, flagellants, priests and penitent engines lead by an Inquisitor. I really hope they add an exception fo Inquisitors but with how little attention they get that's probably not going to happen. Dammit I'm not made of cannonesses GW, give us a cool unnamed priest HQ to use! The named one is too expensive and use empared.
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Apr 16, 2018 21:20
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I imagine it’s a good time to buy a flyrant if you wanted one
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Apr 16, 2018 21:22
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Cainer posted:Well poo poo, I do the same thing. My secondary vanguard was crusaders, flagellants, priests and penitent engines lead by an Inquisitor. I really hope they add an exception fo Inquisitors but with how little attention they get that's probably not going to happen. I think what I might do is a spearhead with Canoness + 2x Exorcist + Penitent Engine, but that's only works for me because I don't use priests or flagellants. Exorcists don't lose anything from being in a ministorum detachment. So weird that they release Eisenhorn with rules - good rules! - while at the same time clearly not having a goddamn clue what to do with inquisitors.
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Apr 16, 2018 21:25
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Safety Factor posted:How many terminators we talkin'? I've got like 25+ and that's more standard terminators than I'd ever use in 2000 points. That's not even counting the cataphractii and tartaros from my 30k Dark Angels. I've got 35 at the moment. I grabbed the plastic ones from the 7th boxed set in bulk for cheap. And realistically I will have to get more since none of those are close combat. Your point about avoiding tournaments is fair. I mean, I love terminators but I'm building a lot of green wing and Ravenwing because, well, Terminators seem to suck. But I assume the new rules will be adopted as the default. Hate to be that guy asking for an exception to the rules - even when I don't anticipate anyone would actually object. Counting a particular elite choice as troops for specialized lists had long been a thing. Several flavours of Chaos Space Marines get it in 8th. Deathwing Squads seem like an obvious candidate for such treatment. Hopefully they fixed it. And thank you for the combat squad heads up. I had missed that. That does help.
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Apr 16, 2018 21:26
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Yeah I was all excited about taking Eisenhorn, a Daenonhost, and a few Assassins. Or Marbo and some Assassins.
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Apr 16, 2018 21:39
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Giant Isopod posted:I think what I might do is a spearhead with Canoness + 2x Exorcist + Penitent Engine, but that's only works for me because I don't use priests or flagellants. I think I'm just gonna have to bite the bullet and get Uriah Jacobus, he's twice as expensive points wise and no where near as useful but it'll do I guess, at least it's a cool model. Fingers crossed they work on ministorum when they update the sisters or give them a big fat "take these at no loss of strategems" for sister's lists rule.
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Apr 16, 2018 21:42
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