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redreader posted:Except it's Chloe, and also Rachel. Rachel becomes a movie star who has meltdowns on twitter, and Chloe goes to jail. And Max fades to a distant memory because she's an awful friend and ghosted Chloe like the day her dad died.
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Apr 24, 2018 04:29
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redreader posted:Except it's Chloe, and also Rachel. Rachel becomes a movie star who has meltdowns on twitter, and Chloe goes to jail. Ideally she gains a renewed sense of hope, goes back to school and becomes a scientist but yeah, that's probably more likely. Though the final journal entry in BtS does make it seem like Chloe was actually starting to get back on the mend thanks to Rachel, a pity that didn't last long. internet celebrity posted:And Max fades to a distant memory because she's an awful friend and ghosted Chloe like the day her dad died. 2 days later technically but yeah, made even worse by the fact she left her a heartfelt message promising to stay in touch. Also to twist the knife further, in the Sacrifice Chloe timeline that message is the last real communication she ever had with Max prior to her death aside from a few half-assed text responses. Larryb fucked around with this message at 04:57 on Apr 24, 2018 |
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Apr 24, 2018 04:49
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internet celebrity posted:And Max fades to a distant memory because she's an awful friend and ghosted Chloe like the day her dad died. Yeah, but she was about 12 years old when she did that.
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Apr 24, 2018 05:25
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Larryb posted:Ideally she gains a renewed sense of hope, goes back to school and becomes a scientist but yeah, that's probably more likely. Though the final journal entry in BtS does make it seem like Chloe was actually starting to get back on the mend thanks to Rachel, a pity that didn't last long. Doesn't Chloe mention she's registered to college in the San Francisco timeline? That seems odd, considering she dropped out of Blackwell. Then again, I suppose you could no-prize it and say she went to whatever public school there is for Arcadia Bay-ians who don't get into Blackwell and finished high school that way. She'd technically have graduated a year before Rachel, but I could see her cooling her heels until Rachel graduated from Blackwell so they could ride off into the sunset together (even if Rachel's plans had changed). Yvonmukluk fucked around with this message at 07:17 on Apr 24, 2018 |
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Apr 24, 2018 07:14
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Yvonmukluk posted:Doesn't Chloe mention she's registered to college in the San Francisco timeline? That seems odd, considering she dropped out of Blackwell. Then again, I suppose you could no-prize it and say she went to whatever public school there is for Arcadia Bay-ians who don't get into Blackwell and finished high school that way. She'd technically have graduated a year before Rachel, but I could see her cooling her heels until Rachel graduated from Blackwell so they could ride off into the sunset together (even if Rachel's plans had changed). I beleive so, yes. Though weren't Chloe and Rachel the same age/in the same grade level? I suppose she could have also waited until they got to LA and enrolled in a school there (or just got a GED). In LiS Episode 1 there is a Blackwell report card in Chloe's room from 2011 (a year after BtS takes place) but I guess you could rationalize it as Chloe having canonically just gotten suspended back then or James making good on his offer to get her back in (which doesn't seem likely as if you told Rachel the truth at the end Chloe basically just ruined his life and destroyed his daughter's trust in him permanently) and then got kicked out for good a year later. Like most of the slight inconsistencies in BtS it's extremely minor though ironically if they had set the game a year later than they did it would have also fixed the plot hole of Victoria, Nathan, etc. still being seniors in 2013 despite being sophmores with Chloe 3 years earlier.
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Apr 24, 2018 11:26
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There's no point in trying to figure out the inconsistencies in age among the various characters of LIS because there is no proper explanation of it. I think it's rather obvious that some time late in the development of LIS, somebody made the decision to make all of the high school students 18, despite the fact that this doesn't really make sense. Releasing a game with drug use, abortion, sex, and so on amongst underage people was deemed to be a risky move, so the simple fix was to make everyone 18. They even had to go back and make Nathan 18 during the time when Rachel died, which made Nathan 19 and still in high school during the game. Lots of clues were accidentally or on purpose left in the game which point to this being true. For example, there is one point in Max's journal where she talks about beginning her junior year at Blackwell. Warren's birthdate would make him 16, according to the file on him in the principal's office. There's the fact that Blackwell is referred to as a school for seniors, which makes no sense at all because everyone knows Rachel, who went to the school last year. Or the fact that Nathan and Victoria clearly went to the school last year, among others. Max was meant to be 16 or 17, I'm guessing barely 17. Having halfassedly made everyone 18 very late in development, there were bound to be all sorts of inconsistencies and there's no point in looking for ingame explanations of them because there are none.
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Apr 24, 2018 15:55
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There are such things as finishing schools in the US but those are quite rare. Blackwell makes sense as a four year private high school +1 year finishing program without any inconsistencies in the timeline or age of the characters but it’s not worth scrutinizing in any more detail than that.
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Apr 24, 2018 16:00
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exquisite tea posted:There are such things as finishing schools in the US but those are quite rare. Blackwell makes sense as a four year private high school +1 year finishing program without any inconsistencies in the timeline or age of the characters but it’s not worth scrutinizing in any more detail than that. That explanation doesn't make sense either. Max's journal starts with the following: quote:I GOT ACCEPTED INTO BLACKWELL ACADEMY. So it's a school exclusively for seniors, no kids allowed, meaning no younger students and no grades below (or above) senior. Of course, 2 pages later in the journal, it says: quote:I feel like burning all my clothes, then just raiding a thrift store to build up a new Max wardrobe over my junior year. As I said, there is no way to resolve these inconsistencies, it's a puzzle with a bunch of pieces that don't fit together. As it's doubtful they meant to design it that way, this strongly suggests some late development changes which nobody bothered to fully think through.
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Apr 24, 2018 16:35
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Plus the school is basically just a backdrop while the real focus is on the characters themselves. Not to mention that if you assume everyone we know came to Blackwell at the same time Chloe did that would mean that Warren started high school when he was 11 years old. Like I said, it's an extremely minor issue and as far as I'm aware there are no other major inconsistencies between the two games. Hell, they even managed to include some really obscure details from the first game. For example, in one of the photo montages (the one where she looks like she's about to knife David) Chloe has the same streak of blue in her hair we see her get in BtS Episode 3. Also in an optional conversation in the Willlam lives timeline Chloe will quote a passage out of Joyce's self-help book from BtS episode 1. It even helps explain the difference between BtS Frank and LiS Frank (having to kill your best friend and bury him in an unmarked grave will kind of stress a guy out, not to mention the whole Rachel thing later on). So yeah, if the school timeline is the only thing the writers slipped up on then I'd say they did a pretty drat good job overall. Larryb fucked around with this message at 17:15 on Apr 24, 2018 |
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Apr 24, 2018 16:50
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I think there's actually some background stuff in BTS that talks about Blackwell being planned to be made a pure finishing school (as it was in Season 1).
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Apr 24, 2018 17:29
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Being only familiar with the US school system due to media I thought that it was a college/artschool thingy. As in the students come in at 17-18 and leave at 21-22.
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Apr 24, 2018 17:33
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Zedd posted:Being only familiar with the US school system due to media I thought that it was a college/artschool thingy. As in the students come in at 17-18 and leave at 21-22. It's explicitly stated in the first game that it was a finishing school for Seniors (though as mentioned, there is also a journal entry where Max talks about her junior year there) but BtS changed it to a private 4 year high school. It's possible there was some redistricting and things changed in the 3 years between the two games but it's probably best just not to think about it too hard.
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Apr 24, 2018 17:53
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Yvonmukluk posted:I think there's actually some background stuff in BTS that talks about Blackwell being planned to be made a pure finishing school (as it was in Season 1). The creators of Before the Storm had a problem, in that Blackwell being a high school only for seniors meant that the school couldn't be featured in their game. Obviously this wouldn't work, everyone wanted the school to be in the game, so they did away with the "school for seniors" idea and had it be a normal high school. They also straight out ignored things like the fact that Victoria wasn't supposed to be there yet (she came to the school for Mark Jefferson), because they wanted her to be in the game. Once again, there's no point in trying to figure out some ingame cause for the various inconsistencies involved. In BTS, they all stem from "We wanted all these characters here in this high school, so we put them there".
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Apr 24, 2018 18:00
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Larryb posted:finishing school for Seniors 
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Apr 24, 2018 18:13
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https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Finishing_school Unless there's another type out there I don't know about they seem primarily aimed at young women so this could be a case of French writers not being entirely famillar with how the American school system works. Also, I know that Chloe got into Blackwell thanks to a scholarship from the Prescott Foundation and the fact that she's actually kind of a genius when she applies herself but is it ever really explained how Max got in? I'm assuming it was either through a scholarship of her own or the fact that she comes from an upper middle class family that could probably afford the tuition fees. Ed: Nevermind, the game literally states that Max has a scholarship more than once. Larryb fucked around with this message at 19:11 on Apr 24, 2018 |
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Apr 24, 2018 18:30
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When they were innocent children, Max and Chloe loved to pretend that they were pirates. Now, with that in mind, let's take another look at the conclusion of Life Is Strange. That moment when Max and Chloe stand at the edge of a cliff, facing down the storm to end all storms. When Chloe urges Max to use the butterfly photo to escape this nightmare and allow her to die in the bathroom so nobody will have to die. Or to put it another way...that moment when she pleads for her first mate to get in the life boat and let the captain go down with her ship. I'll just leave that here... Eshettar fucked around with this message at 23:38 on Apr 25, 2018 |
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Apr 25, 2018 23:34
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Here's actually a pretty good defense for the Sacrifice Chloe ending that I found elsewhere (though granted a lot of the points in it have been made here before):quote:I have a good reason for sacrificing Chloe: *she tells you to*. I don't agree with all of it granted (she was actually more concerned about her mom, not to mention that there were reasons for Chloe's behavior and the fact that a lot of the bad blood between them was mostly David's fault even if he meant well) but otherwise it does kind of sum up my feelings on the matter pretty well. To be fair, Max is sort of a victim herself in that she didn't ask to be suddenly granted time powers only for the universe to constantly punish her for daring to use it and it is true that at first Max had no idea about the possible consequences for her actions (such as her first photo jump for example) and was genuinely trying to help but there are also other choices you can make later that, if you stick with them, are unquestionably her fault (such as getting Frank killed and letting the tornado take out the town) as in-universe Max knew that she could go back and fix those things but made a conscious choice not to. Granted, all 3 of our main girls have made stupid mistakes in their lives (such as Chloe leaving the keys in the door which allowed Damon access to the dorms in the first place and Rachel's wild nature and need to escape leading to her own demise as well as kind of inadvertently stabbing the one person she could actually trust in her life in the back) but the fact that Max's choices can lead to several people getting killed kind of makes them a bit more extreme in my opinion. It's also true that she's kind of a bad friend and a bit of a flake (though a lot of that probably came from guilt on her part and not really knowing what to say, and the longer she put it off the harder it got) but moving in and of itself wasn't actually Max's fault and I think her parents deserve some of the blame for how things turned out. At the funeral you see them standing apart from everyone else and they seem to be in a bit of a hurry to leave and based on the texts from the first game her dad seems alright but her mom is a bit overbearing and is kind of quick to jump to conclusions (not to mention the not-so-subtle hints from both of them that Max should move back to Seattle and look for another school). It should also be noted that Chloe is never mentioned once in regards to them aside from a postcard in the alternate timeline, which makes me think that maybe Max and Chloe's parents weren't quite as close as their daughters were nor did they really encourage Max to keep in touch after the move. Larryb fucked around with this message at 01:36 on Apr 26, 2018 |
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Apr 26, 2018 00:17
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I mean there's a pretty big difference between euthanising a terminally ill person who wants to die, and allowing a depressed girl to commit suicide by time travel to save a town. I don't think you have to respect the wishes of the latter at all.
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Apr 26, 2018 02:12
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WhiskeyWhiskers posted:I mean there's a pretty big difference between euthanising a terminally ill person who wants to die, and allowing a depressed girl to commit suicide by time travel to save a town. I don't think you have to respect the wishes of the latter at all. It's not a fair trade either way but as I've said before, would either of them really be happy with that decision? Chloe knows that her life came at the cost of her mom, her friends and countless others (many of whom had nothing to do with the whole mess) and Max has to live with the fact that she just let it all happen. In the other ending, while Chloe once again has to pay for the mistakes of others (though her spirit lives on much like was the case with William and Rachel) but her death winds up solving most of the major problems and gives Max a second chance to achieve the dreams she gave up. While sacrificing the bay does give the two of them a clean slate in a sense, it's also probably not great for their relationship in the long run as now they're basically forced to stay together out of guilt. While they're not the only ones responsible (Rachel's family, the Prescotts, Jefferson, Wells, David, Victoria, etc.), all 3 girls did in some way have a hand in the situation getting as bad as it did (even if it wasn't always their fault explicitly). As alluded to in the analogy a few posts above, one of the rules Max and Chloe had as kids was "Always protect fellow pirates" so therefore as captain, Chloe took responsibility and volunteered to go down with the ship to save her first mate. Her sacrifice was made for the sake of those she loved, not just out of a sense of self-loathing. Of course, there are still pros and cons to both endings, such as the logical fallicy of trying to solve a problem (presumably) caused by time travel with more time travel and the fact that Max had no way of knowing this wouldn't just blow up in her face like the last two times she tried to change a major event, but I just think Sacrifice Chloe works a little better from a narrative standpoint if nothing else Larryb fucked around with this message at 17:04 on Apr 26, 2018 |
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Apr 26, 2018 03:00
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Look, if any gay first mate didn't rip their gay lover captain off a sinking ship they're a bad gay pirate and not living up to the code to always protect fellow pirates. 
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Apr 26, 2018 04:56
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It's really not about what the player character would do, it's about what Max would do, and in that moment I don't think there's any way she'd abandon Chloe on the off chance that maybe this photo jump wouldn't severely gently caress everything up like it has every time before.
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Apr 26, 2018 09:17
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I can't believe DontNod tricked us into playing a Final Destination game with time travel mechanics.
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Apr 26, 2018 11:56
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LoseHound posted:it's clear that Max was meant to be shocked into extreme action by the trauma of Chloe's near-death and was granted time powers so that she could end the horrid scourge of The Bay. To be fair, only a handful of Arcadia Bay residents are complete assholes. I generally group the characters into 3 categories (not a complete list but feel free to lump whoever I left out into the section you feel appropriate): Decent yet Fallible: Kate Marsh Steph Gingrich Willam Price Samuel Taylor Mikey North Drew North Dana Ward Chloe Price Rachel Amber Max Caulfield Middle Ground: Sera Gearhardt Joyce Price Rose Amber Warren Graham Frank Bowers Taylor Christensen Victoria Chase Raymond Wells David Madsen Nathan Prescott Human Scum: Sean Prescott Eliot Hampden Damon Merrick James Amber Mark Jefferson Larryb fucked around with this message at 00:19 on Apr 29, 2018 |
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Apr 29, 2018 00:06
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So Nathan, who drugged Rachel which lead to her death, scores higher than Eliot, who merely was a bit stalkerish and tried to block Chloe from leaving a room so he could talk at her?
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Apr 29, 2018 03:01
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Orange Sunshine posted:So Nathan, who drugged Rachel which lead to her death, scores higher than Eliot, who merely was a bit stalkerish and tried to block Chloe from leaving a room so he could talk at her? The only reason he's not on the bottom list is because Nathan is legitimately mentally ill and does show repentance via the phone call at the end (but even if killing Rachel was an accident he is still guilty regardless which is why he's on the very bottom of the middle list), the other characters on said list do no such thing. Victoria is where she is because she has her own issues to deal with and is capable of showing remorse while Wells is just a pathetic man overall. Joyce could be higher but she is a bit selfish and has a tendency to defer to David even when she doesn't actually agree with him (like him hitting Chloe for example), Sera's heart was in the right place but it still strikes me as weird that she would all of a sudden give up and start defending the man that recently had been nothing but an absolute monster to her and while Rose is nice she's also a complete doormat (with the sole exception of the dinner with Chloe at the end of Episode 2). I agree that Eliot probably doesn't belong with the others on the bottom comparatively speaking but we're not really shown anything particularly good about him either (he was also getting violent with her and acting like she owed him something, to the point where Chloe felt threatened enough to do that whole subtle call to the police). The middle list is mostly characters that don't really fall into either of the other two extremes in my opinion. They also have to have at least one likeable (or at least sympathetic) quality about them, Eliot does not. Unrelated, but this is great:  Any idea who made this? I found it on Michel Koch's twitter along with a bunch of other LiS related fanart Larryb fucked around with this message at 15:40 on Apr 30, 2018 |
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Apr 29, 2018 03:28
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Larryb posted:To be fair, only a handful of Arcadia Bay residents are complete assholes. Ehhh that remark was mostly just me being flippant and snide because the phrase "Chloe was meant to die" is preloaded with a lot of stuff I find gross. I don't really want to get into it, but part of my negative reaction to the ending was because it reminded me of a lot of stuff about American politics that I can't stand.
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May 1, 2018 00:13
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LoseHound posted:Ehhh that remark was mostly just me being flippant and snide because the phrase "Chloe was meant to die" is preloaded with a lot of stuff I find gross. I don't really want to get into it, but part of my negative reaction to the ending was because it reminded me of a lot of stuff about American politics that I can't stand. That's understandable, and while I think Sacrifice Chloe works better from a narrative standpoint I don't necessarily believe that Chloe was meant to die (she simply chose to) nor do I believe the storm was actually Max's fault. Think about it, the only real proof we have is a theory Warren came up with on the fly and there's also the fact that Max had a vision of the storm before she even got her time powers, though it could possibly be argued that the opening sequence actually wasn't a dream but rather the end of a previous cycle we didn't see (Max makes the same expression when she wakes up that she does when she comes back from a photo jump). I like to think that it's either this Max or the one from the William Lives timeline that appears to Max Prime at the end of the nightmare (though it just being the embodiment of her own self-doubt works too). Thanks to BtS I now choose to take a line from Chloe in Episode 5 literally instead ("This is could be Rachel's revenge....our revenge"). At the end of BtS Episode 1 when Rachel kicks over the trash can she lets out this weird animal-like scream that seems to stir up the wind and spread the flames. Later, after she gets stabbed by Damon in Episode 3 the fire suddenly goes out on its own. If thinking her dad was cheating was enough to start a massive wildfire I'd imagine that her literally dying and having all her dreams stolen from her by someone she trusted would be enough to subconsciously summon up a huge storm to smite the town that caused her and Chloe so much pain. In this scenario, Chloe and Max basically serve as the Ariel and Miranda respectively to Rachel's Prospero, using the former to carry on her legacy (having already at that point inherited many of Rachel's mannerisms, even her blue hair was inspired by Rachel's earring) and guiding the latter along as the doe while at the same time protecting her from the storm. At the end you can either let her win by sacrificing the town or break from the script and sacrifice Chloe, removing the instrument of Rachel's revenge and pacifying her spirit in the process (much like how in The Tempest it was Miranda's devotion to Ferdinand that convinced Prospero to abandon his plans in the end). Continuing that analogy, like Ariel in the play Chloe is also granted her "freedom" at the end no matter what ending you pick, either by nobly sacrificing herself to stop what she (inadvertently) helped start and being reborn as the blue butterfly or by obeying the will of her "master" and having the last remnants of her past (besides Max of course) stripped away from her. Hell, being the embodiment of the Chaos Butterfly and all it's possible that it was Chloe herself that subconsciously granted Rachel and Max their respective powers (they both first used them while in Chloe's direct presence during a traumatic moment after all), though Rachel doesn't seem to have any control over her ability and instead it manifests unconsciously through her rage. There does seem to be something special about Chloe at least even if she never had a power of her own. That does sort of bring up an interesting question though, would things have been any better or worse if the situation was reversed and Chloe was the one who had been granted the Rewind power instead of Max? Larryb fucked around with this message at 18:53 on May 1, 2018 |
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May 1, 2018 01:06
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So uh, the upcoming comic is called Life is Strange: Dust and picks up after Max and Chloe let Arcadia Bay get hosed up by the storm and everyone dies. https://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2018-05-03-life-is-strange-official-comic-continues-one-of-the-games-endings
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May 3, 2018 10:54
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BAE IS CANON
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May 3, 2018 11:14
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Was there ever any doubt. 
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May 3, 2018 11:33
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get hosed warren
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May 3, 2018 11:40
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unpopular opinion but I hope they don't start milking this cow until it's dead.
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May 3, 2018 11:52
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exquisite tea posted:BAE IS CANON WE WIN AGAIN
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May 3, 2018 12:19
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Makes sense considering that's the ending that lends itself the most to any real sequel potential, looking forward to seeing how this goes. Do we have a start date for this series yet or is it still just some time later this year?Tired Moritz posted:unpopular opinion but I hope they don't start milking this cow until it's dead. Eh, considering Season 2 (or whatever it ends up being called) is starting fresh with a new cast and setting that will (presumably) have little to no connection with the first game, continuing the story of the old cast in comic form is a nice comprimise in my opinion. Especially if this series winds up continuing past the intial miniseries they've got planned as I think there's a lot of potential stories they could tell. Speaking of the next game, I'd imagine we're going to start getting some real information soon since it's DontNod's next major project after Vampyr (we might even see something later this month in fact). I wouldn't expect the first episode to drop until like mid to late fall at the earliest though.
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May 3, 2018 12:49
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I'm ready to slam-down the preorder whenever. And I am very much in the mind that preordering tends to be dumb.
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May 3, 2018 12:51
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As if Bae is canon. But, I am curious about this since that ending does have the most potential, if only because the other ending, the REAL ENDING, is an actual ending. I'll hella fight you.
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May 3, 2018 13:00
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it'll be two volumes of chloe and max feeling survivor's guilt
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May 3, 2018 13:19
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I suppose there is some stuff you could do with Sacrifice Chloe such as seeing how Max deals with both the grief of letting Chloe die as well as the knowledge of a week that only she remembers (you could even have Ghost Chloe pop up in her dreams to guide her along like William did in BtS) but yeah, while the Bay ending feels more complete to me the Bae ending does have a lot more story potential. Aside from that though, with Chloe and Max's story now complete (and then some thanks to the prequel) I think it's time we let them rest and instead move on to watching the life and suffering of a whole new group of people (though I wouldn't mind seeing some BtS characters like Steph and the Norths pop up again one day). I am curious as to what they're going to do since they pretty much have free reign to do whatever they want this time around. Maybe they'll shake things up a bit and we won't be playing as a teenage girl this time around (or hell, maybe even have a male protagonist for once). Not sure if it'll deal with another natural disaster or have it's primary antagonist be another adult white male in some sort of position of power but I wouldn't doubt it. Either way, I'm looking forward to what's to come.
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May 3, 2018 13:26
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There are plenty games where I can play defaultwhitemale.exe so I rather they either don't do that.
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May 3, 2018 14:13
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Zedd posted:There are plenty games where I can play defaultwhitemale.exe so I rather they either don't do that. Fair point. I do hope our new protagonist is more of a Chloe than a Max as far as personality goes (or maybe a mixture of the two) though as at times Max felt like more of a blank slate used as a proxy to tell the story of the game's actual star Chloe Price, though that could have been the point. After all, we end up learning more about her and her backstory than we do about the character we're actually playing as, Chloe is one of the main driving forces of the first game's plot and she's the one that gets the Big drat Hero moment at the end. Time travel is also kind of tied to Max's character so I hope there's a new gimmick this time around. I suppose a new twist on the old power could work too as long as it's done well. Since BtS turned out to be way better than I expected and this game does bring back the same director and writer as the orignal I'm more inclined to give this game the benefit of the doubt this time around (though I wouldn't mind seeing Deck Nine take another crack at the franchise one day to be honest). Hopefully the character models will actually be able to emote properly this time around at the very least. Larryb fucked around with this message at 14:29 on May 3, 2018 |
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May 3, 2018 14:22
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