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Groovelord Neato posted:the whole thing is nonsense there isn't some decline of monogamy. losers always had a harder time loving than handsome/fit/successful men. Isn't there a decline in monogamy? Like, aren't young people getting married way less than previous generations?
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Apr 26, 2018 15:22
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Groovelord Neato posted:sex is a basal need in the same sense food and sleep are. and socially it's an issue as well - friends gab about that type of thing. so you have friends asking what'd you do this weekend and it just reminds you oh right i didn't get any. I’m aware, speaking from the same experience as you here, but if you have decent coping mechanisms and the ability to self reflect without self-loathing, it shouldn’t consume everything good in your life. That’s the root of these guys’ issues.
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Apr 26, 2018 15:24
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Guy Goodbody posted:Isn't there a decline in monogamy? Like, aren't young people getting married way less than previous generations? there's a decline but the thing that's nonsense is that it's some genuinely new thing that these poor innocent incels are facing
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Apr 26, 2018 15:24
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Also if everyone was polyamorous then in theory it should make it easier to get laid.
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Apr 26, 2018 15:26
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SENSUAL DAD KISS posted:What. We've got a billion years of evolution bearing down on us to gently caress and cum in each other. maybe it wasn't the same for everybody else, but i remember growing up with the idea that babies were a punishment for sex, not a goal Gynocentric Regime posted:It's not true. All of the studies I have read show people in developed countries are having less sex overall, with the youngest generations having fewer than previous generations at comparable age. Speaking anecdotally I know many many women who have had, or are having, years long dry spells. isn't this just an indication that "incels" are not just limited to men
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Apr 26, 2018 15:26
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Henchman of Santa posted:Also if everyone was polyamorous then in theory it should make it easier to get laid. yeah. with poo poo like tinder it's way way way easier to get laid. i just wish that poo poo had been around when i was younger. sex aint gonna help these clowns. they have deep seated issues beyond it.
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Apr 26, 2018 15:27
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And yea even if she was doing an uncritical statement of hate group dogma why wouldn't she at least mention that this 'decline in monogamy' touches all genders yet the 'incel' world is basically 100% men? Unless of course she was validating their view that it's basically impossible for a woman to not have sex when she wants to.
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Apr 26, 2018 15:29
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Groovelord Neato posted:yeah. with poo poo like tinder it's way way way easier to get laid. i just wish that poo poo had been around when i was younger. Tinder is a blessing and a curse, depending on where you are and what you’re looking for, but that’s a topic for another thread
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Apr 26, 2018 15:29
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Serf posted:maybe it wasn't the same for everybody else, but i remember growing up with the idea that babies were a punishment for sex, not a goal There was an article the other day -- the term "incel" was invented by a lady. Canadian, I think.
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Apr 26, 2018 15:30
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incels are just jealous that volcels are so powerful.
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Apr 26, 2018 15:33
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Guy Goodbody posted:Isn't there a decline in monogamy? Like, aren't young people getting married way less than previous generations? Yes, they are getting married less but that doesn't mean they aren't being monogamous. Last survey I read had about 80% of non-married people expecting all their relationships to be monogamous, and even among that 20% who did not expect all their relationships to be monogamous, a majority expected it some of the time. The real world isn't the internet, for every trans, poly, witch girl triad there are millions of boring normies who only gently caress one person, if at all. Serf posted:isn't this just an indication that "incels" are not just limited to men Incels is not a real thing though, no one is involuntarily celibate. What they are is celibate by choice because their standards may not align with the people with whom they could have sex if they wanted to. I remember on an episode of The F Plus a while back they read a post on a message board from an "incel" who turned down women for not being attractive enough, even though they were willing to date him. Gynocentric Regime fucked around with this message at 15:38 on Apr 26, 2018 |
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Apr 26, 2018 15:34
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https://twitter.com/ImWithLenin/status/989366928803155968
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Apr 26, 2018 15:36
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i wonder if the incels are a precursor to america's birth rate going into decline
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Apr 26, 2018 15:36
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Gynocentric Regime posted:Yes, they are getting married less but that doesn't mean they aren't being monogamous. Last survey I read had about 80% of non-married people expecting all their relationships to be monogamous, and even among that 20% who did not expect all their relationships to be monogamous, a majority expected it some of the time. The real world isn't the internet, for every trans, poly, witch girl triad there are millions of boring normies who only gently caress one person, if at all. yeah it's not like people are just suddenly not gonna be jelly if their partner fucks around on them.
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Apr 26, 2018 15:37
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Guy Goodbody posted:Isn't there a decline in monogamy? Like, aren't young people getting married way less than previous generations? There's a decline in traditional marriages but those aren't always correlated to monogamy. People in the past did plenty of loving on the side, it's just that divorce and open relationships were a lot less socially acceptable.
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Apr 26, 2018 15:40
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Groovelord Neato posted:yeah it's not like people are just suddenly not gonna be jelly if their partner fucks around on them. Exactly! I'm poly and have actually been in a triad with hookups on the side, however I am now married and monogamous and I haven't gone crazy from lack of group sex.
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Apr 26, 2018 15:40
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Serf posted:i wonder if the incels are a precursor to america's birth rate going into decline nah because they're not real. There have always been people with massive self-esteem/depression issues or victims of toxic masculinity or just plain unpleasant assholes who can't hook up with anyone. The 'incel' label is just a slice of those existing people deciding there must be a vast conspiracy against them.
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Apr 26, 2018 15:41
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it's like how there were always furries but the internet made them known.
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Apr 26, 2018 15:45
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sexpig by night posted:nah because they're not real. There have always been people with massive self-esteem/depression issues or victims of toxic masculinity or just plain unpleasant assholes who can't hook up with anyone. The 'incel' label is just a slice of those existing people deciding there must be a vast conspiracy against them. i mean like it was mentioned that young people aren't loving as much, for a variety of reasons
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Apr 26, 2018 15:45
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Serf posted:i mean like it was mentioned that young people aren't loving as much, for a variety of reasons No the least of which is economic concerns. People were loving a lot all the way through the 70s until the first crisis of capitalism and it's been downhill since the neo-libs took over.
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Apr 26, 2018 15:53
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Gynocentric Regime posted:No the least of which is economic concerns. People were loving a lot all the way through the 70s until the first crisis of capitalism and it's been downhill since the neo-libs took over. i figured it would be the primary reason tbh. most of my married friends talk about how they would like to have a kid, but the cost is too high, and both people have to work full time + to pay their existing bills. and the couples who have had kids regret it because they're going deeper and deeper into debt because of it
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Apr 26, 2018 15:56
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Serf posted:i wonder if the incels are a precursor to america's birth rate going into decline They're basically American hikkikomori, yes
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Apr 26, 2018 18:56
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love to read a screenshot of a tweeted photograph of a textprefect posted:There was an article the other day -- the term "incel" was invented by a lady. Canadian, I think. https://www.elle.com/culture/news/amp34512/woman-who-started-incel-movement/ quote:The site was populated by men and women, but certainly more men, which Alana had mixed feelings about. While the men were prone to antagonistic, repetitive complaining, she truly wanted her project to be a home for all incels; Motto fucked around with this message at 19:43 on Apr 26, 2018 |
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Apr 26, 2018 19:36
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y'all ahistorical af
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Apr 26, 2018 20:48
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i think it's a trap to view incels as personal failures. in a way it's like crime and poverty where there are institutinal structures that produce these kinds of people and saying they just need to be better people is kind of a nothing answer.
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Apr 26, 2018 21:12
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OmanyteJackson posted:i think it's a trap to view incels as ... people 
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Apr 26, 2018 21:17
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Incel/MRA/Gamergater/Anime Nazis are overlapping cross-sections of mostly white men who have been meticulously educated against having any kind of class consciousness, so when their world collapses they blame it on minorities and liberalism. It's complex but not complicated, and there's no real puzzle to it. The redpill/MGTOW community is an extremely toxic echo chamber, so anyone who's been a part of it for any length of time is probably as much a lost cause as PepeJudenjager1488.
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Apr 26, 2018 21:23
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What's mgtow
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Apr 26, 2018 21:55
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Men Going Their Own Way, a forum where guys who claim they have chosen celibacy talk about how women deserve to be raped for not giving them sex.
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Apr 26, 2018 21:59
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Didn’t Matt explain the red pill/incel /alt right as white men who were told their entire youth that they were destined for greatness, and when they got old enough to realize they’d never be more than mediocre they lashed out the only way they could, voting for the Chaos President and just generally being edgelord pieces of poo poo?
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Apr 26, 2018 22:12
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that sort of touches on it, it's a lot to do with being taught that they absolutely have to fulfill the masculine ideal their entire lives, how the lives they live have a bare minimum of what's acceptable to be a "man" which in the hellworld of late capitalism, turns out that kind of ideal doesn't actually exist anymore we have men being brought up believing these things aren't just the bare minimum but also that they would practically be handed to them, and of course since it definitely isn't, they lash out in particularly toxically masculine ways, a kind of toxic masculinity if you will this kinda poo poo is just gonna keep getting worse as the economy worsens, we live in a different world and men aren't being raised with modern expectations and with a more positive form of masculinity
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Apr 26, 2018 22:24
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OmanyteJackson posted:i think it's a trap to view incels as personal failures. in a way it's like crime and poverty where there are institutinal structures that produce these kinds of people and saying they just need to be better people is kind of a nothing answer. I agree with this and so did Nagel when she was on the show. She said something like "it's easy for people to say 'gently caress em they can just jerk off' but this is a lot of human misery that should probably be dealt with." If we can show compassion towards a convicted burgular we should be able to show it to frustrated virgins too. Human Tornada fucked around with this message at 22:55 on Apr 26, 2018 |
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Apr 26, 2018 22:52
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Edit: Phone posting. Quote is not edit.
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Apr 26, 2018 22:53
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sexpig by night posted:It's really weird to just uncritically describe the dogma of hate groups, especially in a book where she absolutely does critically look at the left's online stuff and outright takes the right's side often by saying being told to acknowledge systematic racism and all 'shames them for being white' and pushes them to the alt-right. It's an ethnography. That's the idea.
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Apr 27, 2018 00:40
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red19fire posted:Didn’t Matt explain the red pill/incel /alt right as white men who were told their entire youth that they were destined for greatness, and when they got old enough to realize they’d never be more than mediocre they lashed out the only way they could, voting for the Chaos President and just generally being edgelord pieces of poo poo? Pretty much, yeah. When I got old enough to realize that, I decided being destined for greatness is bullshit and I embraced the mediocrity instead of blaming women and minorities or whatever.
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Apr 27, 2018 01:10
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red19fire posted:Didn't Matt explain the red pill/incel /alt right as white men who were told their entire youth that they were destined for greatness, and when they got old enough to realize they'd never be more than mediocre they lashed out the only way they could, voting for the Chaos President and just generally being edgelord pieces of poo poo? I don't know if they thought they'd be "Destined for Greatness" more than just, fulfilled and happy. All of these guys have serious inferiority complexes and a severe lack of healthy relationships in general. cat doter posted:that sort of touches on it, it's a lot to do with being taught that they absolutely have to fulfill the masculine ideal their entire lives, how the lives they live have a bare minimum of what's acceptable to be a "man" which in the hellworld of late capitalism, turns out that kind of ideal doesn't actually exist anymore There is a fundamental problem is that the same traits we label as toxic (Individualism, competitiveness, aggression, risk taking) are rewarded by capitalism. CEO's have a higher representation of Sociopaths than the general public. The value of being any kind of masculinity besides toxic isn't as valuable as being ruthless and competitive, at least as long as income inequality and the wealth gap continues to grow.
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Apr 27, 2018 04:07
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sexpig by night posted:yea it was pretty funny. Like, having someone actually go 'well you asked who cares, I guess I do' is probably good on the podcast in general. Like when Amber and Virgil had to tell Matt 'no, dipshit, the first 'easter egg' was there because those guys wouldn't get credit otherwise it wasn't a 'self suck'' and all. Sometimes the Chapo guys need someone to go 'ok but shut up a second I need to make sure you understand how reality actually is beyond Twitter'. Matt told me on Twitter that he meant it was a self suck on the part of Spielberg to include it in the movie and like I gyess? But it's a scene by Cline so I blame it on him
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Apr 27, 2018 05:47
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Apr 27, 2018 06:16
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Hello
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Apr 27, 2018 06:53
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Why do people always bring up class and economics when talking about incels? Their frustrations stem from social and sexual failures, not poverty. You can't just blame not getting pussy on capitalism. poo poo, there were people like that in loving USSR. They just didn't have a semi-coherent ideology.
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Apr 27, 2018 07:52
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