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One of the main lessons of the entire Dune series was the importance of change, adaptation, forward thinking, creativity. For his son to employ a Star Wars author, an author in the scifi field requiring or permitting the least amount of creativity or novelty, is especially harsh. I don’t care that his son wrote prequels, I don’t even care that he wrote them badly. Some of Frank’s other non-Dune novels were pretty bad but were still interesting and creative. I think I and most of the rest of us care because he wrote them boringly, fixating of little details in the Dune books and expanding them to ridiculous proportions of importance while neglecting the overall whole.
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May 1, 2018 08:07
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I keep wondering if anyone has rendered the fat off the underlying philosophy of dune. Not what Frank said it was, but what he actually wrote, and what is actually there in the pages as less than subtle frank-talking-at-the-reader stuff, and seeing if it at all checks out into a working philsophical/religious framework. i only say that because lol the litany actually worked for me in my life so i really wonder if some of the other stuff, if assembled and stripped of narrative would look like a coherent philosophy but then i think... frank would probably hate that, and i hope it doesn't exist.
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May 1, 2018 08:42
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but still secretly i hope someone makes a Frankish bible and starts a Church Of The Divided God.
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May 1, 2018 08:46
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Murray Mantoinette posted:One of the main lessons of the entire Dune series was the importance of change, adaptation, forward thinking, creativity. For his son to employ a Star Wars author, an author in the scifi field requiring or permitting the least amount of creativity or novelty, is especially harsh. I don’t care that his son wrote prequels, I don’t even care that he wrote them badly. Some of Frank’s other non-Dune novels were pretty bad but were still interesting and creative. I think I and most of the rest of us care because he wrote them boringly, fixating of little details in the Dune books and expanding them to ridiculous proportions of importance while neglecting the overall whole. Anderson isn't even creative by the standards of Star Wars novelists. Let that poo poo sink in.
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May 1, 2018 09:02
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Ouch
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May 1, 2018 09:14
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I follow the Fallen Moon and think that Muad'Dib lives still on a giant pile of spice. Don't let those Durian bastards know though.
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May 1, 2018 09:29
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basic hitler posted:frank herbert could have written a loving prequel. he would have prequeled the ultimate prequel. people would be talking about how frank wrote the only good prequel ever. God gently caress this is like a spell of undoing for most modern fiction and that's a good thing.
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May 1, 2018 09:56
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exmachina posted:I follow the Fallen Moon and think that Muad'Dib lives still on a giant pile of spice. Don't let those Durian bastards know though. Shut up you idiot. You wanna get the surface of the planet incinerated?
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May 1, 2018 10:06
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basic hitler posted:People itt seem to be misremembering paul's relationship to the golden path. Well yeah. I'd like to think that it was atreides sence of duty that made him do the needful but come to think of it Paul was more Atreides than Leto and he couldnt. The whole superpredator thing seems more primal and fremen than Atreides.
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May 1, 2018 10:31
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Remember how in Children of Dune like a third of the book covers an assassination plot of the Chile twin emperors of the galaxy and the plot revolves around training killer tigers, and there’s no backup plan?
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May 1, 2018 12:58
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Liquid Dinosaur posted:Remember how in Children of Dune like a third of the book covers an assassination plot of the Chile twin emperors of the galaxy and the plot revolves around training killer tigers, and there’s no backup plan? well how else are you supposed to kill two children
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May 1, 2018 14:05
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To be fair, Shaddam in Dune didn't have a backup plan for if Paul survived. Arguably a much bigger screw up.
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May 1, 2018 15:50
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Forget you losers, I'll do it myself
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May 1, 2018 15:56
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Shai hulud
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May 1, 2018 16:50
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sweet geek swag posted:To be fair, Shaddam in Dune didn't have a backup plan for if Paul survived. Arguably a much bigger screw up. Honestly the entire plan against the Atreides was a big gamble. If anyone managed to escape with credible evidence of Sardaukar legions on Arrakis, it would have been all-out galactic war once the Landsraad found out. If anyone managed to get the family atomics off-planet, they could have hit the Harkonnens or the Emperor - what do the remnants of a dead House have to fear any longer?
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May 1, 2018 17:15
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I've kinda been wanting to read this, but it looks dense. Is it a particularly complicated slog of a read, or is it quite digestible. I'm not looking for Da Vinci Code or anything, but just wondering. Also which version should I get. Cheers 
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May 1, 2018 17:23
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It's not an easy read and you have to be willing to accept that you aren't going to get immediate explanations for technology, traditions, factions, acronyms, and whatnot, nor full biographies of named characters. It all comes together, though, and it's worth it. It's not "light reading" on your first (or probably second) go, though. One of the most rewarding works of fiction, to me.
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May 1, 2018 17:47
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Farmer Crack-rear end posted:Honestly the entire plan against the Atreides was a big gamble. If anyone managed to escape with credible evidence of Sardaukar legions on Arrakis, it would have been all-out galactic war once the Landsraad found out. If anyone managed to get the family atomics off-planet, they could have hit the Harkonnens or the Emperor - what do the remnants of a dead House have to fear any longer? How are family atomics actually employed? A guidance system seems like it'd veer too close to thinking machine territory. E: not to mention the guild monopoly on interstellar travel. Would you basically have to FedEx your nukes to the opposing house?
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May 1, 2018 18:00
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henpod posted:I've kinda been wanting to read this, but it looks dense. Is it a particularly complicated slog of a read, or is it quite digestible. I'm not looking for Da Vinci Code or anything, but just wondering. Personally, I found it pretty smooth reading. Unlike a lot of "world builders" that drone on and on, Dune does a lot with details without getting boring. It's more like a painting than a book. The prose is straightforward and there's a good mix of description and dialogue. I don't know if there's more than one version but it's my policy not to read abridged stuff, since you might miss something good.
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May 1, 2018 18:04
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If you can watch back to the future and understand what's going on you'll get dune. nerds like to sit around and pretend that this book is pondering deep mysteries or some poo poo, while ignoring how loving ludicruous it is that a planet full of water starved junkies take over the universe... at least until you get to the book where grown women gently caress little boys to awaken their prior selves. lmao but yeah you shouldn't read it if you're over 16 FAGGY CLAUSE fucked around with this message at 18:43 on May 1, 2018 |
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May 1, 2018 18:41
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LONG LIVE DUKE LETO! *holds pug in one arm, blaster in another*
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May 1, 2018 18:54
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I always wondered why they wouldn’t clone Gurney instead of Duncan so you can get that sweet mandolin action through history.
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May 1, 2018 18:59
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FAGGY CLAUSE posted:If you can watch back to the future and understand what's going on you'll get dune. nerds like to sit around and pretend that this book is pondering deep mysteries or some poo poo, while ignoring how loving ludicruous it is that a planet full of water starved junkies take over the universe... at least until you get to the book where grown women gently caress little boys to awaken their prior selves. lmao He who controls the spice controls the universe Idiot
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May 1, 2018 19:06
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everyone girl wants feyd, no girl wants rabban
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May 1, 2018 19:33
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Dune is actually pretty deep compared to most fiction hth
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May 1, 2018 19:40
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Started reading dune this week. Paul is an annoying piece of poo poo. Thanks for reading
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May 1, 2018 21:12
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Dune rules but the real hardcore Dune nuts treat it like a religion. It's just space opera. Chill out and ride the worm.
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May 1, 2018 21:20
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Dune is a great piece of fiction and has a richer world and much denser storytelling than nearly anything genre-comparable.
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May 1, 2018 21:22
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When I was a kid, I bought a copy of the Dune RPG off a game store nerd for $40. He had bought up the copy before it went out of print. I really pressed him hard, but he caved and sold it to me. Still have it. Anyways it's going for $1,000 on ebay right now. Edit: Plz don't doxx, hunt me down and rob/murder me.
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May 1, 2018 21:22
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Is it fun to play?
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May 1, 2018 21:25
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I'll buy it from you for $42 + shipping, so you'll make a profit
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May 1, 2018 21:28
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BONGHITZ posted:Is it fun to play?
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May 1, 2018 22:01
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You could play a house minor attached to Atreides, or Harkonnen or even Wallach, Moritani or Corrino. Players would be like little league mentats, swordsmen, BG adepts, nobles, etc. I sketched out all these ideas. A guild heighliner has an accident in orbit. A demagogic cult emerges on a nearby moon and begins to cause concern to the great house. Various feuds with other house minors. Or just start them off on Salusa Secundus and the adventure is to escape SOMEHOW and then find a house minor to take them in. Or be Atreides and go to Arrakis when the timeline catches up. Then join the Fremen or become smugglers. Or alternatively, be an Atreides ally still on their planet as it tries to get a grip on the situation after their strongest ally is destroyed. So many possibilities! drat I should do a play by post game Edit: Also Matt Colville worked on it. He's a popular YouTuber now.
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May 1, 2018 22:11
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The Harvard Lampoon spoof of Dune, DOON, is legit hilarious.
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May 1, 2018 22:22
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There's a famously good Dune board game, of course long out of print, and an okay serial-numbers-filed-off RPG called Burning Sands where players are some combination of Jihadis and members of a Great House fighting over "The Salt."
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May 1, 2018 22:26
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Planet Athas in the D&D Dark Sun campaign world is basically high fantasy Arrakis. Planet Angelis in the 40k setting, called GORKAMORKA by it's green-skinned residents, is also very Duneish
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May 1, 2018 23:01
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BONGHITZ posted:LONG LIVE DUKE LETO! *holds pug in one arm, blaster in another* That pug is my spirit animal.
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May 1, 2018 23:04
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I was reading a dune blog about that dinner party scene and I realised that this: "My son displays a general garment and you claim it's cut to your fit?" is actually a perfectly propos riposte, not a random comment to fit in the code word. That's puzzled me for like 35 years. E: quote:"What the Baron will, I may," Lotto said firmly, striking the desk with his fist. "What I will, the Baron may or may not -- depending on whether I do." sebmojo fucked around with this message at 23:09 on May 1, 2018 |
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May 1, 2018 23:04
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Communist Walrus posted:How are family atomics actually employed? A guidance system seems like it'd veer too close to thinking machine territory. Stuff like that is fine according to the lore. The prohibition is against "machines that think like people" so the missile wouldn't be one that could intelligently pick its own target. Electronics aren't totally forbidden and exist everywhere but a guidance system would have be limited to pretty simple stuff. Like "here is the target, fly at it" levels of things. Cruise missiles that just stayed X feet off the ground might be pushing it but simple systems are not verboten. Seeing as how atomics are rarely used in anything Dune I figured they were mostly just warheads that didn't get attached to much of anything because nobody ever used them. It was similar to how things are now; don't put me into a desperate enough situation to use atomic bombs because I have loving atomic bombs. They were more a ceremonial piece than an actual weapon designed to be used. I think the other side of it was a weapon of last resort; kind of a thing like "if I can't have it then nobody can." If you're facing total, irreparable defeat you just blow your world right the gently caress up and take out any invaders with it. I don't remember there being many details beyond "they exist." This was also before the Cold War ended so literally everybody reading knew exactly what "everybody has a gently caress load of nuclear weapons" meant. henpod posted:I've kinda been wanting to read this, but it looks dense. Is it a particularly complicated slog of a read, or is it quite digestible. I'm not looking for Da Vinci Code or anything, but just wondering. It's dense but you don't really notice; Frank Herbert was a very, very good story teller. The story is mostly told around Paul's point of view and at the get go he's a sheltered 15 year old shithead that knows gently caress all about much of anything. You pretty much just learn about the whole situation and setting as he does so it works very well that a lot of things without details are thrown at you at first. Which is also why it's brilliant world building as it goes. You know it's science fiction and space travel exists because they're planning a space trip but they don't really explain how it works at first. Then you learn how space travel works and the fact that it literally can't work without spice...which comes from the planet they're going to. ...oh poo poo, important stuff is about to happen, isn't it?
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May 1, 2018 23:08
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Atomics are strange beasts. The stoneburner in Messiah could have theoretically burned a hole to the core of the planet and destroyed it, and the radiation released by it meant that if you could witness the explosion you were left blind. These aren't really things atomic weapons do in our world. Paul detonates some in Dune to make some light terraforming happen so he can clown the harkonnen/sardukar, and those seem more typical in nature. as for how they're used, yes they're mostly a pile of weapons meant to ensure that the house is exceptionally difficult to engage in total war with. It's part of why kanly and all these other idiotic things are a part of the highborn social order. both times, the nukes were basically planted and set off. obviously there are fights, but because of how shield warfare is more or less the status quo of Dune through to Messiah, it might be that they just fly around in shielded planes, secure an area, plant weapon, fly off, detonate. of course you're supposed to airburst atomic weapons to maximize destruction but who knows if frank knew that, there's nothing to imply they're using missiles, although they wouldn't be against the jihad. Riot Bimbo fucked around with this message at 23:32 on May 1, 2018 |
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May 1, 2018 23:29
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