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New Defect card, Boot Sequence: 0 cost, gain 10(13) block, innate, exhaust. Basically it's Anchor as a card. Pretty handy. Plus it's not ethereal so you can just save it until later if nobody's attacking on turn 1, then pull it back later with All for One/Hologram/Scrape/whatever. Also they deprecated Reprieve, which is very fair because that was a grossly overpowered card. They really gotta figure out this focus stuff though.
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May 3, 2018 16:19
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Wow that boot sequence sounds like it's great one-of. Defect has trouble with a lot of packs because they have a heavy turn one (parasite + slaver, 5 mini slimes etc.). Making it innate prevents you from picking more than 2 unless you get Bag if Preparation. Focus is a crazy good stat and I don't see any way to balance it being in a non-power card. Allocate was too good, reprieve was too good. Maybe reprieve should have been "end your turn. If this was the first card you played gain 1(2) focus".
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May 3, 2018 17:19
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If anything I'd make it like Concentrate. Discard 3(2) cards, gain 1 Focus. That way it still bends your turn over sideways but if you have a good draw-based deck you can work around it and take advantage of it. I agree that it's definitely an incredibly powerful attribute right now, but without it orbs feel too weak. RyokoTK fucked around with this message at 17:35 on May 3, 2018 |
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May 3, 2018 17:32
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RyokoTK posted:New Defect card, Boot Sequence: 0 cost, gain 10(13) block, innate, exhaust. Basically it's Anchor as a card. Pretty handy. Plus it's not ethereal so you can just save it until later if nobody's attacking on turn 1, then pull it back later with All for One/Hologram/Scrape/whatever. Nah it is ethereal, but it shouldn't be, makes it too situational and you really want to be careful with innate cards because unlike Silent your starting hand is just 5.
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May 3, 2018 19:20
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Marketing New Brain posted:Nah it is ethereal, but it shouldn't be, makes it too situational and you really want to be careful with innate cards because unlike Silent your starting hand is just 5. It is not ethereal, but it does exhaust when you play it. 
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May 3, 2018 19:25
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Kaethela posted:It is not ethereal, but it does exhaust when you play it. Huh, weird, I thought it was also ethereal. Yeah I guess that's a fair bit better. I've managed a few 3 energy wins on A15 and you really need a critical mass of draw and 0 energy spells. I'm glad they removed flux capacitor, I'm hoping they change Fission to be 1-> 0 instead of 2>1 because as it is, not that exciting. Marketing New Brain fucked around with this message at 01:54 on May 4, 2018 |
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May 3, 2018 20:29
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not really enjoying how dependent the mass -0 card build is on AFO. Tried a run without it yesterday and just petered out on docu and deca.
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May 3, 2018 20:37
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 So Bottled Echo Form is great! Echoed Aggregate + Conserve Battery. Another Echoed Aggregate and Double Energy into Tempest+. No focus so it was only 972 damage. I'm a little sad that wasn't a turbo+ because theoretically I could have cast a 130+ charge chain lightning afterwards. I think together those two would have been enough combined damage to kill everything from act 1 to the finish line.
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May 3, 2018 22:08
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There really needs to be 1 more card or relic that interacts with 0-cost cards. Right now we have Scrape and All for One. And I guess Unceasing Top/shuriken/kunai. But you really need All for One if you want to win. I'm not sure if just scrape + shuriken is enough to carry a deck for example. I think there also needs to be a way of getting extra Claws. Making it common would be too easy but usually you only see 1 per run and its clearly balanced around you having 2. By itself its just Bad Rampage. Maybe if there was a card that generated random 0-cost cards. Like 2 energy, put 3 0-cost cards in your hand, Exhaust. maybe even 3 0-cost attacks. A Moose fucked around with this message at 15:35 on May 4, 2018 |
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May 4, 2018 15:32
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Finally installed the beta build the other day and after playing Defect a lot I really wish there was another source of Focus. Grabbing a lot of channeling cards early feels like a waste if you don't luck into one of the focus cards by floor 2, since frost is almost irrelevant by that point and at 2 block it just doesn't cover up all the chip damage from how slowly you kill poo poo. Otoh, if you do get almost any source of focus, most of the orbs become insanely powerful. Maybe making focus more plentiful but changing how it buffs orbs would be a good way to go.
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May 4, 2018 18:45
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That's kind of how I feel about it too. If they could make a vanilla orb a little stronger but reduce the effects of Focus that seems like it would be a better way to balance it, but even one Defragment+ turns the orb meta upside down. Too bad it's uncommon so you can't count on getting it in a given run.
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May 4, 2018 19:03
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Defragment makes orb loadouts work, but there are other sources of +focus. I've won runs where my only source of it was a single Biased Cognition - that one has to sit around until 5-10 orbs are ready to go, but it melts face once active.
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May 4, 2018 20:30
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A Moose posted:There really needs to be 1 more card or relic that interacts with 0-cost cards. Right now we have Scrape and All for One. And I guess Unceasing Top/shuriken/kunai. But you really need All for One if you want to win. I'm not sure if just scrape + shuriken is enough to carry a deck for example. I have won with this deck without All for one but I had 4 claws and a bunch of hologram+. Edit: In base game, not ascension.
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May 4, 2018 21:28
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Something I found out during today's daily: The relic that gives you +6 Max HP every time you gain a curse applies when transforming a curse. A nice bonus on top of getting that dreaded Normality out of my deck.
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May 5, 2018 03:51
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power word- Jeb! posted:I have won with this deck without All for one but I had 4 claws and a bunch of hologram+. I’ve gotten the powers deck and the orb deck to work on A15 but the one good version of this deck I had went up against time eater, and RIP.
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May 5, 2018 04:01
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ahaha, the daily challenge in beta branch. all for one has a hilarious interaction with snecko eye, and you get offered like 3 of them before you even reach the first boss 
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May 5, 2018 20:11
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Had another weird Defect card interaction. Echo form and sunder vs the triple life link slimes in act 3. Normally if you echo sunder and the first one kills, the second sunder fizzles and you don't get the second helping of 3 energy. The slimes still exist though, so the second sunder goes off and checks that yes, that slime is dead, give that energy. I mean at that point you're already winning but I love finding these weird edge cases.
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May 5, 2018 21:03
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Just had this absurd run with Silent: After I got the worm and happy flower (which is one of my favourite relics) I thought I had a good chance, but then I got the kunai and dead branch along with shiv generators and realised it's going to get messy. Flying knee is an insane card and let me go literally crazy even when I was confused. Thank god I didn't get the time boss because playing about than 20 cards a turn is really great. With a turn 1 that plays after image, backstab, shiv, shiv, shiv and adrenaline I had a full hand and 6 energy. I don't think I was ever seriously threatened even when I drew badly. I still think Silent is probably the easiest class to get get a good run with because her cards usually give you extra energy (and their requirements are usually fairly easy to meet) and let you draw cards while discarding bad ones. Nothing beat's the Ironclad's Flex+ , Flex+, Flex+, Offering+, Limit Break, Double Tap, Whirlwind+ to kill anything in a single round but it makes the class very reliant on a single card. I have never had a Ironclad victory without finding whirlwind fairly early.
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May 6, 2018 14:32
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Defect is the most powerful character in the game imo. Most evergreen cards, most viable build paths, by far easiest to infinite with. So many relics at every level finish the run on it's own, usually regardless of build path. The absurd amount of card manipulation makes me feel like I'm playing magic.
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May 7, 2018 03:25
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I'm fine with that. It's a single player game so having a broken class is fine.
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May 7, 2018 03:51
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The dumb part of defect is that you need to always play a "good card" build. Orbs are interesting but need so much to line up to get working.
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May 7, 2018 03:55
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drat theres a pretty big difficulty jump between the first and second floors huh? cruised through 1 and then died like 2 fights into 2
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May 7, 2018 05:05
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Awesome! posted:drat theres a pretty big difficulty jump between the first and second floors huh? cruised through 1 and then died like 2 fights into 2 This has been my experience with ascension runs as well. If I can beat act 2, I can almost always beat act 3. Beating act 1, however, isn’t a great indicator of clearing act 2.
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May 7, 2018 05:22
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Awesome! posted:drat theres a pretty big difficulty jump between the first and second floors huh? cruised through 1 and then died like 2 fights into 2 I am on a 7 game winstreak with the defect and the hardest fights are consistently the act 2 hallway fights. The ones with chosen (hex guy) plus another enemy are especially dangerous.
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May 7, 2018 05:40
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drat snecko eye and multiple sunders turns the defect into a joke. cruised to a close victory against timekeeper
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May 7, 2018 05:55
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can someone explain defect to me like i'm the biggest idiot on the planet? i can function pretty well at a10+ on silent just by drafting generically good cards but trying to do that on defect seems to be a one-way street to no-whale-bonus-ville even on a0.
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May 7, 2018 06:17
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Reiterpallasch posted:can someone explain defect to me like i'm the biggest idiot on the planet? i can function pretty well at a10+ on silent just by drafting generically good cards but trying to do that on defect seems to be a one-way street to no-whale-bonus-ville even on a0. From what I can tell, Defect lives or dies based on its 0-cost cards, energy gain, and card churn. Orbs are a neat gimmick but take way too long to wind up, so you're much better off grabbing cards that are overall good and high amounts of recycle/draw. All For One and Skim are top notch, Hologram up there too. Echo Form always. Of course, I could be completely off since I haven't actually cleared any Defect runs myself. 
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May 7, 2018 06:31
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Reiterpallasch posted:can someone explain defect to me like i'm the biggest idiot on the planet? i can function pretty well at a10+ on silent just by drafting generically good cards but trying to do that on defect seems to be a one-way street to no-whale-bonus-ville even on a0. I don't want to go too in depth but here's some basic tips: Most of the Defect's comes through linear scaling. Your uncommon/rare card picks should dictate what scaling you use. Blizzard - frost orbs, Thunderstrike - lightning powers, Multi-cast - dark orbs. And if you have some irrational hatred for orbs pick up lots of Streamlines. Because the defect is all about scaling, the first few turns suck while you try to set everything up. Success as the defect comes down to damage mitigation in those early turns and speeding up your scaling. A single Boot Sequence works well at keeping you alive. Do not ignore card draw as getting your cards in a bad order is often what ends your run. Seek and Reboot are pretty good for avoiding this but you still want at least one Skim. Echo Form and Creative A.I. are absolutely broken so you should always pick them up. I also suggest finding a way to increase your focus and number of orbs. Fission is one of the worst rare cards but if you have no Capacitors you should definitely take it. Basically what I'm getting at here is the Defect's rares are super powerful. Aside from bosses the best place to get rares are from elites. Luckily, the Defect is the best class for fighting act 1 elites but only if you remember to draft a couple good attacks early. Cold Snap and Ball Lighting are not amazing cards but they will carry you through act 1. If you got poo poo luck on the rare drops and haven't figured out a way to scale yet pick up a darkness source in act 2. With Dualcast, one dark orb can get you through fights you have no business winning. (Champs HATE him! He's got one WEIRD orb for slaying the spire and now YOU can too)
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May 7, 2018 09:28
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Also why y'all hating on orbs?
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May 7, 2018 09:30
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Has anybody had luck with dark orbs? They have the potential for some fun orb juggling combos, but they've never really worked that well for me.
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May 7, 2018 09:52
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Lichtenstein posted:Has anybody had luck with dark orbs? They have the potential for some fun orb juggling combos, but they've never really worked that well for me. they're pretty good 
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May 7, 2018 09:58
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Sparticle posted:Also why y'all hating on orbs? 
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May 7, 2018 10:20
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got my first defect win from going all in on frost orbs and blizzard (got a cold snap, glacier, and blizzard early and pretty much just went "well ok i guess that's the deck now") picked up a consume hoping to get a source of orb slots at some point, but i didn't pick up a capacitor until act 3, and even then it ended up being a dead card more often than not. would've kicked rear end if i got a fission at some point though
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May 7, 2018 11:36
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ninjewtsu posted:picked up a consume hoping to get a source of orb slots at some point, but i didn't pick up a capacitor until act 3, and even then it ended up being a dead card more often than not. would've kicked rear end if i got a fission at some point though I'm kinda wondering if it'd be legit to intentionally go down to a single slot and just go all-in for focus-boosted evoke effects.
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May 7, 2018 11:44
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Sparticle posted:they're pretty good That's awesome but I don't usually have two hours to mash the End Turn button.
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May 7, 2018 12:20
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My best run with the Defect (out of like...four) was when I decided to go all in on lightning orbs and it's definitely very cool. The power that channels two lightning when you take attack damage + the attack that does 7*(the number of times you've channeled lightning this combat) is hilarious.
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May 7, 2018 14:20
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Sparticle posted:Also why y'all hating on orbs? The problem with orbs, in a nutshell, is the classic issue with combo decks that have more than two useless-on-their-own pieces. To make orbs work, you need cards that generate: 1. Orb slots 2. Focus 3. Orbs And to a lesser extent (if you have enough of 1-3): 4. Orb-scaling finisher (Blizzard/Thunderstrike/Multicast) This extends to both deckbuilding, where you have to weigh the criticality of picking up stuff like Capacitor and Defragment against the fact that they are near-Curses in usefulness for a while, and combat, where even a deck stacked and balanced with all 3 will get you smacked around for however many rounds it takes you to draw and play them. This doesn't make orbs terrible, but it does tend to make them noticeably less-consistent than other archetypes. I think the key to 'fixing' this, assuming the developer even wants to, is to do with 1 and 2 what they did with 3: make cards that generate Slots or Focus do something (anything) additional, poorly and/or optionally.
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May 7, 2018 20:50
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Avasculous posted:The problem with orbs, in a nutshell, is the classic issue with combo decks that have more than two useless-on-their-own pieces. To make orbs work, you need cards that generate: The problem with focus is that it has to be the hardest part to get because the game is boring as poo poo when you get 5 focus and any way to generate frost orbs. You can get by for all of act 1 and most of 2 just on spamming orbs to evoke them quickly. You only need lots of focus for the later part of the game. Orb slots are slightly easier to get, but are more curse-like early on because you want to be evoking more. Orb generation should be the easiest to get and its in a good place right now.
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May 7, 2018 21:15
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Lichtenstein posted:I'm kinda wondering if it'd be legit to intentionally go down to a single slot and just go all-in for focus-boosted evoke effects. That's what Consume is for. Play it twice and you have one Orb slot and 6 focus.
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May 7, 2018 21:51
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A Moose posted:The problem with focus is that it has to be the hardest part to get because the game is boring as poo poo when you get 5 focus and any way to generate frost orbs. You can get by for all of act 1 and most of 2 just on spamming orbs to evoke them quickly. You only need lots of focus for the later part of the game. Orb slots are slightly easier to get, but are more curse-like early on because you want to be evoking more. Orb generation should be the easiest to get and its in a good place right now. Yeah I agree with the sentiment but I disagree with the way to make focus hardest to get. Right now it's purely 'hard' to get from a deckbuilding perspective, because Focus-generating cards do nothing else, and you either take them early and kneecap your deck for a while or gamble on seeing them late and kneecap your deck by not having them when they don't. That's the inconsistency I mean, and it feels more RNG-driven than strategic. I would rather see the cards that generate focus (and slots) do more flexible things so they aren't a near-dead pick early, but generate focus in a more costly way/tradeoff-ish than Defragment (like Consume for example) so they aren't no-brainer picks either. For the one or two of you who might be familiar with Magic: The Gathering or even have a M:TG avatar, it's like the difference between basic and nonbasic lands. Avasculous fucked around with this message at 22:54 on May 7, 2018 |
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May 7, 2018 22:49
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