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punk rebel ecks posted:Why even go to college of you are going to be a housewife? frankly japan's "college" "experience" is ideally suited to a post-graduate's future of using zero of the skills they were educated in.
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May 11, 2018 19:57
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punk rebel ecks posted:Why even go to college of you are going to be a housewife? Because getting into better companies gives you access to better men. And a better job in the meantime. Also college in Japan is not hard. Getting in a good one is hard, but it's basically 3 years of loving around and 1 year of job hunting once you get in.
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May 11, 2018 19:57
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Education is a good thing even if you never need to use what you learn
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May 11, 2018 19:59
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Andrast posted:Education is a good thing even if you never need to use what you learn well you're guaranteed to have nothing to use after college in japan! (Japan's colleges are really, really, REALLY loving bad)
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May 11, 2018 20:03
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Yeah there's exceptions, but they're pretty bad. You can actually get a decent education, but there's literally no reason to do so. There's no academic probation, no downsides to poo poo grades, and employers do not care at all about our grades or what you studied the vast majority of the time. The exception will be things like engineering positions and other hard science related work, but for most jobs your education means literally nothing. All you need is the college name.
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May 11, 2018 20:06
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Japanese colleges are worse than American colleges?
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May 11, 2018 20:18
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Boy are you slow or something
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May 11, 2018 20:22
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LimburgLimbo posted:Boy are you slow or something Yeah I went to college in the United States.
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May 11, 2018 20:24
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There's a spectrum of quality to universities in both the US and Japan, you see. I wonder what part of the spectrum you're on. Also maybe what university you went to.
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May 11, 2018 20:28
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Please explain to me the gap between Japanese and American colleges.
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May 11, 2018 21:02
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punk rebel ecks posted:Please explain to me the gap between Japanese and American colleges.
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May 11, 2018 21:05
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Kilroy posted:It's almost exactly 10,000 km, on average. "Km"? I assume that stands for "killer miles".
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May 11, 2018 22:01
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punk rebel ecks posted:70% of women quit their jobs after having their first child? The most impressive part of that article is the journalist for a British organisation claiming that 70,000 yen a month for full time child care is expensive. Almost everything to do with children is a fuckload more expensive in Japan than the UK but childcare sure as gently caress isn't.
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May 11, 2018 23:09
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What spectrum of policy changes might lead to improved gender equality and less...horribleness...in Japan?
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May 11, 2018 23:36
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I came back from maternity leave to find that my boss’s new hobby is molesting employees, so I will soon be joining the statistics! But one major problem is that Japanese work life is not compatible with raising children like at all. I have to pick up my children no later than 6:30 every day, because the daycare closes then. At least 3 times a week my boss tries to make us stay later than that for some dumb bullshit. Most of the time it isn’t even work, it’s like looking at his vacation photos or something. Some of my coworkers with older children are hanging out with him till like midnight sometimes.
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May 12, 2018 00:21
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punk rebel ecks posted:Why even go to college of you are going to be a housewife? Because it’s one of the things that correlates most highly with educational attainment of children. Also many people start out not wanting that role but are forced into it.
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May 12, 2018 00:30
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LyonsLions posted:I came back from maternity leave to find that my boss’s new hobby is molesting employees, so I will soon be joining the statistics!
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May 12, 2018 00:54
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punk rebel ecks posted:Please explain to me the gap between Japanese and American colleges. ookiimarukochan posted:The most impressive part of that article is the journalist for a British organisation claiming that 70,000 yen a month for full time child care is expensive. Almost everything to do with children is a fuckload more expensive in Japan than the UK but childcare sure as gently caress isn't.
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May 12, 2018 03:05
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mystes posted:Luckily there's no such crime as sexual harassment. ICYMI, mystes is referring to noted living fossil Taro Aso's comments regarding sexual harassment: https://japantoday.com/category/politics/Protesters-in-3-cities-criticize-Aso-over-sexual-harassment-comments
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May 12, 2018 03:43
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punk rebel ecks posted:70% of women quit their jobs after having their first child? Reading this PDF brief, I found the following segment interesting.  It seems like the best thing would be for the government to enforce (not just legislate) stricter labor laws. The Labor Standards Act tried to somewhat help with the Karōshi problem for example, but in the end, you cannot realistically keep a healthy life-work balance in a society where you are expected to either completely sacrifice yourself for your job, or abstain from every economic activity because you are supposed to fit the housewife archetype. Legislating voluntary stuff is like pissing in the wind for things like these (as evidenced by the paternity leave rates for example). Am I completely in the wrong here? (I don't have any actual insight on Japan and hows it works).
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May 13, 2018 09:24
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One should add that in Japan having children out of wedlock isn't really a thing, to the extent that I'd call it one of the genuine cultural differences between Japan and other western countries.
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May 13, 2018 09:44
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Dante80 posted:Reading this PDF brief, I found the following segment interesting. The average marriage age for women in France and Germany is both 30. France and Germany have 50% higher labor productivity than Japan and correspondingly better work-life balance. Germany has literally the same TFR as Japan and has for decades, while France’s is the highest in the developed world and has been for 20 years or more https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_age_at_first_marriage icantfindaname fucked around with this message at 10:54 on May 13, 2018 |
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May 13, 2018 10:42
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Like I said the significance of the marriage statistic in comparison to other countries is that Japanese people don't have kids until they marry. I haven't looked up the newest statistics for Germany but in my generation I know more people who had kids without being married than with being married. Asking why people don't marry or marry late makes sense in the context of birthrate in Japan while it does not nearly make as much sense in Germany or France or the US. EDIT: Let me also add that the birthrate in Germany is surging pretty dramatically at the moment. I have not looked into the reasons in detail though. true.spoon fucked around with this message at 11:07 on May 13, 2018 |
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May 13, 2018 11:00
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Dante80 posted:Reading this PDF brief, I found the following segment interesting. Another things that's important to look at here is that Japanese men do not help with housework worth a drat. Like this is borne out by studies. Even when they work the same hours as males of other countries they help at far less of a rate, thus both child rearing and housework is left almost entirely to the woman, with few exceptions. It's another factor to why Japanese women can't or won't continue working.
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May 13, 2018 12:28
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Dante80 posted:It seems like the best thing would be for the government to enforce (not just legislate) stricter labor laws. (*: Incidentally, it's not like this would have been limited to cases where the work could be defined in advance, so there wouldn't be anything to stop them companies from just giving more work to employees the second they finished and were trying to go home, even if they had already worked more than 40 hours that week.) It seems like restrictions on overtime just result in employees being forced to underreport overtime, and in terms of voluntary programs even minimal things fail completely, for example the government's "Premium Friday" initiative last year to get companies to let employees out early on a whopping one day a month turned into a complete joke (I think it turned out that even the government offices involved with promoting the program weren't actually participating?)
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May 13, 2018 14:15
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true.spoon posted:Like I said the significance of the marriage statistic in comparison to other countries is that Japanese people don't have kids until they marry. I haven't looked up the newest statistics for Germany but in my generation I know more people who had kids without being married than with being married. It’s ‘surging pretty dramatically’ frok like 1.48 to 1.52. That’s a tiny, basically irrelevant increase, sorry. Japan’s has also been slowly creeping up over years https://www.thelocal.de/20170515/germany-sees-highest-birthrate-since-reunification-still-lags-behind-in-europe icantfindaname fucked around with this message at 15:09 on May 13, 2018 |
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May 13, 2018 15:06
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mystes posted:This is doubtless true. Everyone realizes that it's a problem, which is one reason that (supposed) labor reform is currently key goal of the Abe administration. The problem is that a real solution would probably look something like a hard cap on working hours so instead the Abe administration has been pushing things like its "discretionary labor system" which was touted as a way to allow employees to work fewer hours as long as they could get their work done(*) but in effect would have just eliminated companies' obligation to pay overtime (they are moving forward with expanding the "high-level professional" system which is similar but more restricted in terms of the people it applies to). However, the administration ended up abandoning the "discretionary labor system" (at least for the time being) when it was discovered that there were serious problems with the survey data that supposedly supported the idea that employees would work fewer hours under this system (they were comparing maximum hours on one side with average hours on the other side, among other things.) The problem is that Japan’s labor productivity is so low compared to the first-world frontier countries (literally $40 gdp/hour worked in Japan and $60 in the usa, france and germany. Although interestingly much worse in other Anglosphere countries, like $47 or $48 in the UK and Canada and less than $40 in New Zealand, so it’s not just Japan). I’m not sure why that is exactly, probably a combination of bad management and bad labor laws, but as for Abe’s labor reform it seems to me that the Western press is so intensely critical of Japan’s present system of ‘lifetime’ tenure and labor regulation they can’t really criticize any attempt to change it, particularly in terms of equalizing the status of full-time and part-time positions. Of course they do because this is Japan and the place cannot be /will not ever be allowed to be seen as progressed in any way compared to white northern European countries, but what can you do? On the positive side though, the shrinking labor force may actually serve as enough of an impetus for the management side at least to do something about this. I don’t think this guy’s scenario is that outlandish a possibility, although obviously wait and see https://mobile.twitter.com/rihostetter/status/937677571629522944 icantfindaname fucked around with this message at 19:13 on May 13, 2018 |
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May 13, 2018 15:18
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icantfindaname posted:It’s ‘surging pretty dramatically’ frok like 1.48 to 1.52. That’s a tiny, basically irrelevant increase, sorry. Japan’s has also been slowly creeping up over years Look I am not trying to tell you that Germany is better than Japan and I understand your frustration with how the low birthrate in Japan is discussed in western media but you are making it too easy if you suggest that Japan is just like Germany and that there is nothing else to see here. EDIT: Also it appears that in Japan the number of births in a given year is dropping while the birthrate (or rather fertility rate which seems to be what is described in the articles) is growing due to quirks in how the fertility rate is calculated. Which again is quite different from the growing amount of births in Germany in the last couple of years. true.spoon fucked around with this message at 18:12 on May 13, 2018 |
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May 13, 2018 17:22
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This is weird - he's saying this is going to happen but not even hand-waving how. It seems like he's assuming total output will remain the same or increase, and therefore productivity will have to increase to make up for the drop in the labor force. But that doesn't follow, obviously - output could just decrease. e: ah, he works in finance. Well, that explains it.
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May 13, 2018 18:24
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Kilroy posted:This is weird - he's saying this is going to happen but not even hand-waving how. It seems like he's assuming total output will remain the same or increase, and therefore productivity will have to increase to make up for the drop in the labor force. But that doesn't follow, obviously - output could just decrease. Yeah this assumes that policies and corporate decisions that increase labour productivity will just magically happen because of course everyone in Japan is actually working toward a target total national productivity without any current incentives to make labour more productive (or issues which get in the way of that and don't magically disappear just because people aren't having as many babies).
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May 13, 2018 18:27
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I CANNOT EJACULATE WITHOUT SEEING NATIVE AMERICANS BRUTALISED!
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true.spoon posted:A newer article from the same source states the number for 2016 as 1.59. You wouldn't call that a significant increase in such a short time? Imagine two or three more years of such increases (which to be fair is unlikely, though the trend will probably continue for a while). That’s a little better, but I’d wait for it to persist for more than a year or two to say it’s a real trend break. Per that article the increase is mostly among recent immigrants, and the German government has tightened migration substantially since the wave in 2015 and I would expect that tightening to continue. As for Germany vs Japan, obviously they’re not exactly the same, but considering Germany has also had a prolonged period of very low TFR and for the last 25 years or so has almost mirrored Japan’s exactly, I think it’s the most immediately obvious comparison, plus the many other political-economic and historical parallels. I think erring on the side of equating the two makes more sense than insisting they’re completely different because white brains work different than Asian brains or whatever which seems to be the conventional wisdom here Frankly IMO it’s pretty weird the birthrates have mirrored each other so closely when the children out of wedlock rate is so different/possibly other aspects of family structure being different. Unfortunately I don’t know enough about demography to go really in depth
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May 13, 2018 18:49
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Kilroy posted:This is weird - he's saying this is going to happen but not even hand-waving how. It seems like he's assuming total output will remain the same or increase, and therefore productivity will have to increase to make up for the drop in the labor force. But that doesn't follow, obviously - output could just decrease. suck my woke dick posted:Yeah this assumes that policies and corporate decisions that increase labour productivity will just magically happen because of course everyone in Japan is actually working toward a target total national productivity without any current incentives to make labour more productive (or issues which get in the way of that and don't magically disappear just because people aren't having as many babies). Japanese companies have an incentive to keep output at least constant because they're capitalist companies that want to make money, which means they have an incentive to increase productivity if their access to labor continues to shrink. Obviously that's hand waving away a huge amount of details, and it's not clear that incentive is enough to overcome the structural barriers to it happening, but I think in a napkin-math sense it's at least a plausible statement. At least IMO icantfindaname fucked around with this message at 19:19 on May 13, 2018 |
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May 13, 2018 19:01
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They always have an incentive to increase productivity, though. If they had a way to do it on their own, it probably would have been done by now. To me, this is honestly sounding a bit too much like the whole "the free market is literal magic" thing people tend to do.
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May 13, 2018 19:15
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AnoHito posted:They always have an incentive to increase productivity, though. If they had a way to do it on their own, it probably would have been done by now. To me, this is honestly sounding a bit too much like the whole "the free market is literal magic" thing people tend to do. The Japanese workforce is now shrinking very fast, which has not been true before. 20 or 30 years ago you had a flat workforce, and 50 years ago you had an expanding one, so companies could just hire more people and not care about productivity, which is what what they did in the boom years. Still not magic, and not guaranteed to happen, but there is a new incentive now in the fact that the workforce is shrinking when it wasn't before
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May 13, 2018 19:29
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There's an incentive for sure but that doesn't mean gains will actually outpace or even keep up with the issues. That guy calling it "basic math" is being needlessly stupid.
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May 13, 2018 19:33
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true.spoon posted:Like I said the significance of the marriage statistic in comparison to other countries is that Japanese people don't have kids until they marry. I haven't looked up the newest statistics for Germany but in my generation I know more people who had kids without being married than with being married. It's due to all of those dirty filthy migrants who can't be any benefit to society that all the Europeans hate. quote:At 607,500 births, some three percent more babies were born to German women in 2016 than in the previous year. Meanwhile the number of births in German hospitals to non-German mothers shot up by 25 percent to 184,660.
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May 13, 2018 19:39
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punk rebel ecks posted:It's due to all of those dirty filthy migrants who can't be any benefit to society that all the Europeans hate. yeah but obviously all those kids will end up dropping out of school and living in ghettos and raking it fat stacks of benefits cash whenever they aren't mugging middle class germans. this is due to reasons which definitely have nothing to do with any sort of failure to integrate immigrants into society, the reasons are that they're lazy criminals, you see 
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May 13, 2018 22:34
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icantfindaname posted:Japanese companies have an incentive to keep output at least constant because they're capitalist companies that want to make money, which means they have an incentive to increase productivity if their access to labor continues to shrink. Obviously that's hand waving away a huge amount of details, and it's not clear that incentive is enough to overcome the structural barriers to it happening, but I think in a napkin-math sense it's at least a plausible statement. At least IMO
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May 14, 2018 05:50
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https://toyokeizai.net/articles/-/218313 posted:移民の受け入れは、治安悪化、賃金下降を招きデフレを強める、神社がモスクに変わったり、日本の文化を守ることが難しくなったりする、といったデメリットがあることは間違いない。 Welp pack it in folks. Immigration can never work. Also check out his opening statements to point #3. Nice framing there  I want to make a "citation needed" hammer and just repeatedly whack him in the face with it. Weatherman fucked around with this message at 02:09 on May 15, 2018 |
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May 15, 2018 01:46
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Is that shrines turning into mosques thing a meme now? I’ve heard that several times, and as near as I can figure the origin of it is that the town of Ise built a prayer room for Muslims to use, not in the shrine or anything but in a tourist center.
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May 15, 2018 03:05
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