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Doc Aquatic posted:Or alternatively, the setting is entirely appropriate for kids that age, because when you're like nine or ten years old is when something being really slick and dark and full of edgy stuff appeals most. God knows when I was that age I was writing stuff so edgy it makes me cringe now, and by the time I got into 40k in my teens I had already outgrown most of the aesthetic. How’s “too pro-fascist” float you? The difference in 40K is that in all the YA dystopias, the murderous bigoted authoritarian government is the bad guys.
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May 22, 2018 05:55
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Pieces of Peace posted:How’s “too pro-fascist” float you? The difference in 40K is that in all the YA dystopias, the murderous bigoted authoritarian government is the bad guys. You could say the same for Harry Potter.
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May 22, 2018 05:55
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Subjunctive posted:Yeah, as the parent of a 10-year-old, I don’t think it’s implausible that they could filter the universe to be acceptable while still maintaining meaningful connection to the canon. I mostly know 40K from reading F&Fs though. Maybe it’s even worse than SotDL, which Serf is successfully tweaking to be less crazy. I might be out of date with the lore, but outside slaanesh and the dark eldar, there's not a lot I'd straight-up exclude, content-wise, for the 10-11 demographic. My main worry, more than anything, is that Games Workshop pretty much made themselves into the 'Wow! Cool robot!' meme over the last 30 years, where they kind of forgot that it was a parody of fascism, and became a celebration of it, instead. Like, I'd want to screen the books more for 'does it think xenophobia and totalitarianism is okay' before I'd screen it for 'does a dude get totally blown up by psychic powers'. Editing to respond to the top of the page, since I missed it while I was responding: Yeah, no poo poo, obviously that's bad. I was responding to the people worrying about how kids might read about a violence, when reading about a violence is literally one of the favorite things for a nerdy kid to do.
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May 22, 2018 05:57
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Doc Aquatic posted:I might be out of date with the lore, but outside slaanesh and the dark eldar, there's not a lot I'd straight-up exclude, content-wise, for the 10-11 demographic. My main worry, more than anything, is that Games Workshop pretty much made themselves into the 'Wow! Cool robot!' meme over the last 30 years, where they kind of forgot that it was a parody of fascism, and became a celebration of it, instead. Like, I'd want to screen the books more for 'does it think xenophobia and totalitarianism is okay' before I'd screen it for 'does a dude get totally blown up by psychic powers'. Yeah, fair point. I mean, it’s not like Cold War sci-fi was free of jingoistic racism and all that other crap. You summed up my attitude pretty well: I wouldn’t ban my kids from reading that but I’d sure as hell want to read it myself first and talk to them about it. I just have a lot of adult friends who still take nerd poo poo at face value.
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May 22, 2018 06:04
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Pieces of Peace posted:Yeah, fair point. I mean, it’s not like Cold War sci-fi was free of jingoistic racism and all that other crap. You summed up my attitude pretty well: I wouldn’t ban my kids from reading that but I’d sure as hell want to read it myself first and talk to them about it. I just have a lot of adult friends who still take nerd poo poo at face value. Do you mean that you’re worried that inappropriate politics will leak into their kids’ book? Do you pre-screen everything your kids read? I’ll admit I don’t have time for that.
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May 22, 2018 06:07
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My concern would absolutely be about the fascism. 40K has been an incredible, unintentional engine for making horrible nerds feel ok spouting fascist 'jokes' in relative public. If the setting isn't about how evil the Imperium is, and has even a vaguely Imperium-like Imperium, I don't want kids reading it, honestly.
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May 22, 2018 06:08
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How do you feel about Harry Potter? If you pay attention to the politics, they aren’t great.
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May 22, 2018 06:11
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Subjunctive posted:How do you feel about Harry Potter? If you pay attention to the politics, they aren’t great. The house slaves stuff is pretty bad. Like house elves are basically slaves and it's made clear the enjoy. Though, that might have more to do with social conditioning considering how happy Dobby was. But the whole thing is handled really bad. It really makes Hermione seem like a whiny teenager for you know trying to stop slavery. And that's just the tip of the iceberg.
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May 22, 2018 06:17
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Subjunctive posted:How do you feel about Harry Potter? If you pay attention to the politics, they aren’t great. JK Rowling the person has awful politics. Harry Potter's isn't any more particularly worse than most YA novels with a vague sense of liberalism and anti-authoritarianism. I don't think a complete lack of materialist dialectic is enough to disqualify it and the likes of the Hunger Games as being "bad", and even then there's still a gulf between that and cheerleading for fascism.
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May 22, 2018 06:19
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Harry Potter has some very unformed and questionable stuff. The fascists are still the bad guys, even if wizarding society overall can be analyzed and found to be pretty terrible. That's a pretty straightforward distinction!
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May 22, 2018 06:26
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gradenko_2000 posted:JK Rowling the person has awful politics. Harry Potter's isn't any more particularly worse than most YA novels with a vague sense of liberalism and anti-authoritarianism. I don't think a complete lack of materialist dialectic is enough to disqualify it and the likes of the Hunger Games as being "bad", and even then there's still a gulf between that and cheerleading for fascism. The bigotry and slavery elements are pretty bad, as is the focus on tribalism at a mostly white private school. Rowling herself has said that the Ministry of Magic is reminiscent of unsavory regimes. We haven’t yet seen what will be in the My First 40K books, or what will be endorsed by the material. But some pretty bad poo poo (banking goblin underclass, really?) is already in very wide circulation. I am much more concerned with what my kid reads about interpersonal stuff and matters of self-perception.
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May 22, 2018 06:27
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All YA writers should be woke AF because conservstism and neo-liberalism are failed ideologies.
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May 22, 2018 06:29
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I'll mirror what others have said and say that 40k is more or less aimed at children already and yeah middle schoolers love edgy poo poo. As for it being bad for them...like, have you seen the internet? Frankly, if they push it as either comical over the top fascism, or tone down the fash, I'll semi-begrudgingly that over what they'd otherwise be inundated with. Frankly the only problem is that it's not just all orks all the time. EDIT: if it is just straight up glorifying fascism then gently caress this, of course. ProfessorCirno fucked around with this message at 07:20 on May 22, 2018 |
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May 22, 2018 06:47
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A good way to test if 40k is bad for your kid is to give them a few months with the IP and ask them their opinion on Female Space Marines If they get angry at the idea, it's bad for them If they think it'd be a cool idea, they're safe If they grow up and do this, then uh 
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May 22, 2018 07:18
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Xarbala posted:If they grow up and do this, then uh Why is her posture so bad?
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May 22, 2018 07:21
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Angrymog posted:Why is her posture so bad? Chapter mutation.
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May 22, 2018 07:35
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40k for Kids seems pretty doable because even aside from people's brains exploding there's a lot of stuff that's just a really gory joke in the setting. Hell, that might be how they make it be not fascist propoganda; just make fun of the Imperium being dumbshits all the time. "So you worship the blessed human form?" "Of course! Anyone who diverges must be purged!" "...and you have two hearts and spit acid?" Xarbala posted:If they grow up and do this, then uh That's an incredibly Yamato-esque face.
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May 22, 2018 07:46
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Desiden posted:1. Making boxed sets and bundles actually save some money over buying the contents piecemeal. and actually pointing that out to help drive sales. Imagine if Catalyst actually did something on this list (other than 4) for Battletech 
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May 22, 2018 07:49
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Doc Aquatic posted:My main worry, more than anything, is that Games Workshop pretty much made themselves into the 'Wow! Cool robot!' meme over the last 30 years, where they kind of forgot that it was a parody of fascism, and became a celebration of it, instead. Like, I'd want to screen the books more for 'does it think xenophobia and totalitarianism is okay' before I'd screen it for 'does a dude get totally blown up by psychic powers'. I came here to repost this:  Now imagine that, but instead of an adult not getting the message, the target demographic is 8-12 year olds. Lemon-Lime fucked around with this message at 08:29 on May 22, 2018 |
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May 22, 2018 08:22
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So, what's the goon opinion on Genesys, and the new l5r? I'm considering buying the begginers' box of the later when it's out. I just don't have that much time to read the beta for now and most l5r fans are unrepentant grognards, so I don't really trust their opinions on systems and settings.
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May 22, 2018 08:32
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Here's a talk Vincent Baker gave at Ropecon 2013, about game design and the original release of Apocalypse World. I've advanced it to an interesting point. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XQbRevAu1dI&t=1500s So. Don't be afraid to alienate people - their rants will start conversations. Have rules that need some effort to understand - the questions will start conversations. And I thought about my time trawling the RPG stack exchange looking for the single non-d20 question per two pages of d20 questions and I wondered - is D&D poorly balanced and confusingly written on purpose?
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May 22, 2018 10:09
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Glazius posted:And I thought about my time trawling the RPG stack exchange looking for the single non-d20 question per two pages of d20 questions and I wondered - is D&D poorly balanced and confusingly written on purpose? not at all. Every post-TSR iteration of D&D has been earnest and deliberate in wanting to be clear and balanced - they just didn't succeed at it. EDIT: a better example of a game that's "confusingly written on purpose" would be Hackmaster 4th Edition, where it's almost like the players and DM are encouraged to look for contradictory rules to one-up each other with.
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May 22, 2018 10:16
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Gotta admit, having all the RPG forums filled with 95% D&D talk is one way to market effectively
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May 22, 2018 10:23
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Glazius posted:is D&D poorly balanced and confusingly written on purpose? Never attribute to marketing genius that which can be adequately explained by incredibly lovely designers. Those forums are full of D&D questions because D&D is poo poo and is the face of the hobby, not because D&D is deliberately obtuse so it can be talked about online to somehow magically become popular. 
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May 22, 2018 10:31
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Trip report from my bud's homebrew system: "Okay, to calculate your AC, you just add up the basic value plus the average of your Agility and Intuiton plus your dodge skill plus your parry rank, which is a third of your weapon group skill. Oh but when you fight unarmed you only get the parry bonus against other unarmed attacks. That's all for melee defense too, scratch the parry rank against ranged attacks. And if you're caught unaware, skip the dodge skill as well. Now that's your basic AC; add your armor bonus to get your armored AC. If the attack roll is below basic AC, it's a miss, if it's above armored AC, you take full damage, and if it's between basic and armored AC you take damage but get to subtract your armor's damage reduction score. Any questions?"
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May 22, 2018 12:16
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ask him about grappling
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May 22, 2018 12:19
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My Lovely Horse posted:Trip report from my bud's homebrew system: 
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May 22, 2018 12:19
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gradenko_2000 posted:not at all. Every post-TSR iteration of D&D has been earnest and deliberate in wanting to be clear and balanced - they just didn't succeed at it. I'd say there's no "almost" about it, but to this day I cannot tell if HM4 was the product of someone with a genuine axe to grind with AD&D2 or if the first-level fireball, twenty pages of cantrips, and many rules explanations which used parallel logic to AD&D2 ones to spit out opposite results (one being "NPCs can have d4 HP because in real life people can die from even small injuries" in AD&D2 getting the "NPCs can have d4+20 kicker HP because in real life people can survive even great injuries" revamp) are a winking in-joke.
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May 22, 2018 13:20
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gradenko_2000 posted:JK Rowling the person has awful politics. Harry Potter's isn't any more particularly worse than most YA novels with a vague sense of liberalism and anti-authoritarianism. I don't think a complete lack of materialist dialectic is enough to disqualify it and the likes of the Hunger Games as being "bad", and even then there's still a gulf between that and cheerleading for fascism. Harry Potter is the story of a high school jock who drops out of school and becomes a cop.
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May 22, 2018 13:39
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Who the hell cares about Harry Potter in 2018. Other than absolute cretins.
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May 22, 2018 13:49
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Anyone with kids reading them, probably.
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May 22, 2018 13:49
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The next movie comes out this year.
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May 22, 2018 13:51
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Subjunctive posted:Anyone with kids reading them, probably. Absolute cretins.
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May 22, 2018 13:52
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kids?  ???
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May 22, 2018 14:15
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I was thinking about how they could have handled this better and I think something like Gundam Build Fighters would have been better. Kids getting into the hobby, making armies that match their personalities, and spotlighting special characters. They could fight out battles, learning the rules in a way that teaches the reader, and then they can show the armies battling it out in the 40K universe. It just hops over all the fluff and doubles down on selling the models. I wish GW had used the CalArts style for the artwork to drive people even more insane.
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May 22, 2018 15:32
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I finally finished translating LOST, the free indie Japanese TRPG I was working on. I just need to post up one more chart when I get home and it’ll be 100% complete and playable. There’s some bonus stuff like sample scenarios and an expansion that I’ll start working on next but I’m also hoping to run a PbP playtest here and get some feedback. I’ve literally been translating this thing on my lunch break at work and throwing it up on a free Wordpress blog so hopefully with feedback from folks (or some help) I can touch it up into something better formatted and more appealing, but at the very least it’s playable. https://ancientscars.wordpress.com/project-1-lost-trpg/ I’m gonna try and have the Recruitment thread for the playtest up tonight.
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May 22, 2018 17:37
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Oh man, that definitely looks interesting.
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May 22, 2018 17:53
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oh poo poo I forgot to mention how there's also a skill for how well you can wear armor next to the dodge skill and how magic armor conveys an additional armor bonus and damage reduction rating that is counted separately
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May 22, 2018 17:59
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My Lovely Horse posted:Trip report from my bud's homebrew system: there is no goddamned excuse for them to still be calling it Armor Class!!! 
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May 22, 2018 18:02
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Okay to be completely fair the term "armor class" is me translating the term he actually uses to something immediately recognizable. I think he just called it defense score. I kinda checked out at "1/3 your weapon skill."
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May 22, 2018 18:12
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