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Poil
Mar 17, 2007

Groogy posted:

No Brahmin replace Dhimmi for them but they in total get 5 estates.
Thank the gods they won't be demanding 10% of the land anymore. :v:

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White Coke
May 29, 2015

Groogy posted:

No Brahmin replace Dhimmi for them but they in total get 5 estates.

Nobles, Jains, Clergy, Brahmin, and Rajputs/Marathas?

Groogy
Jun 12, 2014

Tanks are kinda wasted on invading the USSR
Yepp for Muslim Indians. They also get a unique Iqta variation called Indian Sultanate and we've put their tolerance modifier there so we can have more interesting stuff in their ideas.
Though with estates, they are not gonna be a "walkover" at early game. That's the idea/hope though....

Fister Roboto
Feb 21, 2008

Wafflecopper posted:

How do you not end up miles behind on admin as a horde? I've been playing Great/Golden Horde lately and find that the constant conquering means constant coring which means no admin for tech (yes I'm burning everything as I go and set admin focus on day 1) which means unbalanced research which means corruption which combined with poor land and gently caress all admin to spend on states means I'm always broke which aghghgjgj

You don't have to core every province you take. You can release or feed provinces to a vassal, or heck even return them to their original owner after razing them.

Also you don't even have to be always at war as a horde anymore. If you have Rights of Man you can strengthen your government to get 10 unity at the cost of 100 MIL.

Tahirovic
Feb 25, 2009
Fun Shoe
It's still worth to go to war just to take provinces and then return most of them after razing. This has some really odd opinion/ae behaviour tough.
The main problem I always have with hordes is money, because you usually end up with poor land and the tribes make this worse by demanding ever more land.

Gort
Aug 18, 2003

Good day what ho cup of tea
Must say I like the idea of supporting estates being a bit of a gamble, but not one you're forced to take.

oddium
Feb 21, 2006

end of the 4.5 tatami age

does anything knock a country out of empire rank other than joining the hre

e: separatist sentiment three times in 10 days..... it happened to me... it can happen to you !!

oddium fucked around with this message at 00:16 on May 25, 2018

Groogy
Jun 12, 2014

Tanks are kinda wasted on invading the USSR
Damned Populists :argh:

https://twitter.com/SirVogelius/status/999964701449707520

(I haven't read CreteLP but I get people don't like Populists)

aphid_licker
Jan 7, 2009


Qara Qonlyu is fun. Almost caught up a horrible tech lag in time to fight off - weakened by Lithuania - Russia and now I'm probably finally going to get owned by the Ottomans. Took a break when they declared, didn't have the nerve to do this right away after the Russia thing.

Flavius Aetass
Mar 30, 2011
Populists did nothing wrong

Poil
Mar 17, 2007

Since the game keeps track of if your territory is not connected and you get things like Milanese Balkans or whatever can you put in an AE reduction "prettying borders" if the peace deal would unite your lands? :v:

skasion
Feb 13, 2012

Why don't you perform zazen, facing a wall?
There’s already a ruler personality that does that I think.

Tevery Best
Oct 11, 2013

Hewlo Furriend
What ships should I use for exploration? Heavies? Or is it actually more cost-effective to use something cheaper?

THE BAR
Oct 20, 2011

You know what might look better on your nose?

Tevery Best posted:

What ships should I use for exploration? Heavies? Or is it actually more cost-effective to use something cheaper?

Lights will do just fine; they even sail faster than heavies. Transports and galleys can't explore.

MatchaZed
Feb 14, 2010

We Can Do It!


Flavius Belisarius posted:

Populists did nothing wrong

Trying to get our own leader assassinated. Helladid the Elder. Helladid the Younger. Not strangling every member of the Sons of Zeus in the cradle.

appropriatemetaphor
Jan 26, 2006

Can you even send heavy ships to explore?

Fister Roboto
Feb 21, 2008

Yes, and I don't know why it's even an option because they're worse at it in every way.

THE BAR
Oct 20, 2011

You know what might look better on your nose?

Fister Roboto posted:

Yes, and I don't know why it's even an option because they're worse at it in every way.

And attrition is percentage based, isn't it?

Creed Reunion Tour
Jul 3, 2007

by Cyrano4747
Grimey Drawer
Is there any word on when the next expansion will be released? I'm having a fun game playing as Bremen thunderdoming the northwest part of Europe and would like to know if I should dome faster.

Gamerofthegame
Oct 28, 2010

Could at least flip one or two, maybe.

Fister Roboto posted:

Yes, and I don't know why it's even an option because they're worse at it in every way.

Gives them something to do, I guess.

feller
Jul 5, 2006


Creed Reunion Tour posted:

Is there any word on when the next expansion will be released? I'm having a fun game playing as Bremen thunderdoming the northwest part of Europe and would like to know if I should dome faster.


I suspect you have at least a month, but that's just a gut feel based on what they're showing in the dev diaries.

Detheros
Apr 11, 2010

I want to die.



Well I have all these permanent claims on southern Italy, I better get ready to betray my ally Spa-



Never mind. :stare:

oddium
Feb 21, 2006

end of the 4.5 tatami age

groogy would it be possible for the unrest map mode or the rebel types map mode to show you how close the rebel group is to popping. something like

Groogy
Jun 12, 2014

Tanks are kinda wasted on invading the USSR
Anything is possible, but yeah definitely.
It might though end up being something like the trade mapmode that just sucks CPU to render everything in it. Rendering individual stuff in the mapmodes is expensive as hell.

spacebard
Jan 1, 2007

Football~
Dammit, Groogy. Did you have to hack my game to prove a point?

I was like let's see how well Ming is doing this game:



Oh, okay, then. Have fun, Japan.



An OPM Manchu in Korea and that's Hadramut in Taiwan... And uh,





:stare:

I wondered why they were still around and the Ottomans weren't much help in the League War :(



And Fetishist Welayta.



And Aragon released the good ol' Anglican Ummayads after it finish eating up Castile.

:getin:

I love this game.

aphid_licker
Jan 7, 2009


Yeah sometimes when you look at the map after a couple hundred years it's like drat this is cool as hell.

BigRoman
Jun 19, 2005
Is the reformation bugged in the latest version?

I stamped out the 3 protestant centers of reformation, then only 2 reformed centers of reformation spawned (even though there were more than 2 reformed princes), so I stomped those out and force converted a majority of the princes. Since I figured there would be no religious war, I passed ewiger landsfreide. Now I have a few random opm princes converting back to the protestant faith (despite no active centers of reformation). Is this a bug? Or are there random events for opm german princes to switch to protestant?

ro5s
Dec 27, 2012

A happy little mouse!

BigRoman posted:

Is the reformation bugged in the latest version?

I stamped out the 3 protestant centers of reformation, then only 2 reformed centers of reformation spawned (even though there were more than 2 reformed princes), so I stomped those out and force converted a majority of the princes. Since I figured there would be no religious war, I passed ewiger landsfreide. Now I have a few random opm princes converting back to the protestant faith (despite no active centers of reformation). Is this a bug? Or are there random events for opm german princes to switch to protestant?

Were their provinces protestant? They might have switched their religion instead of converting them.

BigRoman
Jun 19, 2005
no, they were definitely opm catholic states to start. One of them I had force-converted earlier

oddium
Feb 21, 2006

end of the 4.5 tatami age

dev diary, mission trees for a bunch of people, mostly the major players in india and also taungu. plus mission trees for the russian states if you have Third Rome

next week groogy is introducing a third revamped system the same way governments and estates were revamped

JerikTelorian
Jan 19, 2007



So I'm finishing my first game of EU, as Spain, and I've questions about some of the mechanics.

1.) Taxes seem to be way less important in the late game compared to production. Counting Houses are often giving me like 0.4 ducats or more increased production income, but I've never really seen more than than mid-teens for building new Temples/Cathedrals. Is it better to just invest in production income from start, rather than taxes (i.e., building Workshops instead of Temples)? I'm not 100% clear on the equations, but it seems like once Manufactories are a thing production income is just straight up better.

2.) There was a discussion about drilling, and whether the professionalism or the drill bonus was the "better" benefit of drilling, though I'm not sure I know which was the end take there.

3.) Is there are reliable way to get PUs? I've had royal marriages with several states (France, Provence, and a variety of vassals) but never once ever saw the option for a PU, or any way to pursue one, really. Is getting a PU just a luck thing?

4.) What are people's thoughts on Trade Companies vs turning those territories into States?

As an observation, I think it'd be neat to see a Liberalism angle offered in opposition to Absolutism in the end-eras of the game. A big call from lots of colonial governments was inclusion in Parliament, and I think it'd be cool to offer that as a way to unify the colonial and Metropolitan governments. Right now Absolutism seems 100% better than a Constitutional Government, save for having to lose 75 admin points on that "Pamphlets" event every so often.

JerikTelorian fucked around with this message at 16:12 on May 29, 2018

Kanfy
Jan 9, 2012

Just gotta keep walking down that road.

oddium posted:

dev diary, mission trees for a bunch of people, mostly the major players in india and also taungu. plus mission trees for the russian states if you have Third Rome

next week groogy is introducing a third revamped system the same way governments and estates were revamped

Would be convenient for everyone involved to include a link to the DD in question.

oddium
Feb 21, 2006

end of the 4.5 tatami age

Kanfy posted:

Would be convenient for everyone involved to include a link to the DD in question.

ah good call. dev diary here

Poil
Mar 17, 2007


:shepface:

RabidWeasel
Aug 4, 2007

Cultures thrive on their myths and legends...and snuggles!

oddium posted:

dev diary, mission trees for a bunch of people, mostly the major players in india and also taungu. plus mission trees for the russian states if you have Third Rome

next week groogy is introducing a third revamped system the same way governments and estates were revamped

Based on the mysterious comment about increasing development I'm going to say they're introducing some kind of natural development growth, which would actually be amazing (since Imperator clearly also has this mechanic and it's something people have been complaining about forever)

Also I am liking how much cool poo poo they seem to be throwing into this one patch, makes me want to pick the DLC up on day 1 rather than wait for a sale.

Wafflecopper
Nov 27, 2004

I am a mouth, and I must scream

So I'm doing Great Khan and just finished taking over China. In the peace deal after the last war with Ming, I took all their remaining provinces, including Aleut (in Alaska), which was in an unexplored part of the map. Ming's last few troops were in that province, and became separatists since Ming no longer existed. I got vision of the province when I took it, but the surrounding sea zones remained unexplored, leaving me no way to take it back from the rebels. This meant they slowly filled their victory bar, and now Ming has all their mainlaind cores back. That's pretty loving retarded. 7000 guys hanging out on some Alaskan islands force me to cede China. What the gently caress.

e: I got to keep Aleut though!

e: Why is razing costing me MP during the reconquest?

Wafflecopper fucked around with this message at 17:49 on May 29, 2018

aphid_licker
Jan 7, 2009


RabidWeasel posted:

Based on the mysterious comment about increasing development I'm going to say they're introducing some kind of natural development growth, which would actually be amazing (since Imperator clearly also has this mechanic and it's something people have been complaining about forever)

Also I am liking how much cool poo poo they seem to be throwing into this one patch, makes me want to pick the DLC up on day 1 rather than wait for a sale.

Natural dev growth that is offset by having armies tromping through, epidemics etc. doing damage would be cool.

Firebatgyro
Dec 3, 2010

oddium posted:

e: separatist sentiment three times in 10 days..... it happened to me... it can happen to you !!

It can't because if, like me, you just don't click on the popup you can't get the event again until it auto-accepts in like 2-3 months.

Cynic Jester
Apr 11, 2009

Let's put a simile on that face
A dazzling simile
Twinkling like the night sky

JerikTelorian posted:

1.) Taxes seem to be way less important in the late game compared to production. Counting Houses are often giving me like 0.4 ducats or more increased production income, but I've never really seen more than than mid-teens for building new Temples/Cathedrals. Is it better to just invest in production income from start, rather than taxes (i.e., building Workshops instead of Temples)? I'm not 100% clear on the equations, but it seems like once Manufactories are a thing production income is just straight up better.

2.) There was a discussion about drilling, and whether the professionalism or the drill bonus was the "better" benefit of drilling, though I'm not sure I know which was the end take there.

3.) Is there are reliable way to get PUs? I've had royal marriages with several states (France, Provence, and a variety of vassals) but never once ever saw the option for a PU, or any way to pursue one, really. Is getting a PU just a luck thing?

4.) What are people's thoughts on Trade Companies vs turning those territories into States?

1. Not really. Just build whatever gets you more gold in the short term, as gold in the short term means more dudes, which is more wars, which is more territory, which is more gold. Rinse and repeat.

2. Drill is a decent bonus, but early game I value the gold from turning down my slider during peacetime higher and mid to late game my armies are usually busy 24/7, so even though my income is high enough to run all my armies at max maintenance all day every day, I usually don't find myself drilling all that often. My biggest issue with drill is the duration it lasts. A few battles and you're looking at no drill, so dedicating lots of gold that could be used on more dudes seems a tad wasteful.

3. Luck. There are ways to game the system, but they all involve luck to some degree. If someone has the same family as you, you can claim their throne under certain conditions, but getting your family on the throne of someone not your vassal is entirely luck based. And PUing one of your vassals it pointless.

4. Never not trade company. The extra merchants alone are huge.

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Wafflecopper
Nov 27, 2004

I am a mouth, and I must scream

Alright, it took a bunch of extra game/irl time I could have used to make the map a bit prettier by taking Korea and SE Asia, but I took Ming over again and got Great Khan and the horse grazing one (got Gold Rush on a previous attempt). Thanks everyone who posted horde tips upthread, I think I got the hang of it now.



Shoutout to AI Italy, something I've never seen before

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