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A for me. Even if it doesn't pass, i favor closer relations with France much more than with Hannover.
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Jun 6, 2018 20:21
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A
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Jun 6, 2018 20:29
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Ikasuhito posted:I love this. In a desperate attempt to avoid making enemies, were going to end up going into V2 with nobody liking us enough to be our ally.
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Jun 6, 2018 20:30
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A I guess, France is going to be a major power anyway with its existing territory, we might as well win some favor and also set up a solid Provencal state to ally with if we can't patch things up with the French.
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Jun 6, 2018 20:30
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Buffers, Buffers everywhere
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Jun 6, 2018 20:30
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C
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Jun 6, 2018 20:35
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A lets turn the big blue blob into a big blue buddy.
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Jun 6, 2018 20:48
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While having a strong France on the border is less than ideal, we're going to end up with a major world power on our border regardless thanks to Morocco. While neither option is ideal I think it is better to have two monsters as neighbors than one, that way you can play them off each other. France wants its borders restored to their natural spot along the Pyrenees, WE want our borders restored to its natural spot along that same line, so I'm going with A.
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Jun 6, 2018 20:48
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B While having better relations with Francgland now would be nice, we need votes RIGHT NOW for this congress, and that means getting Hannover to appreciate us. We can start raising relations with Frangland once we start the game and we're not right on top of each other.
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Jun 6, 2018 20:51
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Edit: Nevermind, going with A
Eleven Eleven fucked around with this message at 21:18 on Jun 6, 2018 |
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Jun 6, 2018 20:59
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Actually I forgot Bavaria also has a vote, in terms of pleasing vote-havers A is as good as B by that metric. Assuming the "other powers will remember the way we voted" doesn't mean that Russia will not like us because we essentially vote for France to become a GP. Also I do appreciate the argument that if we want old cores restored we should be voting in favor of that in this vote, so changing my vote to A.
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Jun 6, 2018 21:05
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God dammit, I wanted to never have to figure out what the Rhine Confederacy's deal was, and now it's back in existence, while plucky little Greece gets smacked down hard, expanding Moroccan power. Hopefully there'll be revolts in the future. On the one hand, France has long been the historical enemy of Al Andalus, and a bunch of nearby little nations would provide the perfect playground for expansion/puppeting/sphereing and all those things you can do with lesser nations in V2. On the other hand, while France is the supervillain of Europa Universalis, it's less of a threat in V2. People were talking about allying with them for help against Morocco, well they're a better ally if they're more powerful. Odds are Al Andalus wouldn't do so hot playing around with minor states anyways. Who knows, maybe they'd end up in their own quagmire of rebellions. Also notable is Bavaria, which while it is less of a priority, whatever happens with it can and will bite you all in the rear end just like it did last time.
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Jun 6, 2018 21:06
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Also out of curiosity I would presume that if the Congress is currently in process than that would mean the actual meat of the V2 conversion is at least mostly done? I'm not trying to demand Hashim devote his whole life to the LP but I'm just like wondering if we should expect the V2 updates and state of the world proper to begin shortly after the Congress is done or if you were doing the Congress first and then continuing conversion.
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Jun 6, 2018 21:09
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Edit: Doubleposted somehow, how embarrassing.
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Jun 6, 2018 21:09
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Clayren posted:While having a strong France on the border is less than ideal, we're going to end up with a major world power on our border regardless thanks to Morocco. While neither option is ideal I think it is better to have two monsters as neighbors than one, that way you can play them off each other. France wants its borders restored to their natural spot along the Pyrenees, WE want our borders restored to its natural spot along that same line, so I'm going with A. Yeah, I vote A for similar reasons. A strong France isn't great, but I think that we could also grow into allies, while the same cannot be said for Morrocco. Really, if you set aside the immense historical animosity, our interests align fairly well.
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Jun 6, 2018 21:16
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A Frankly, I'm not too concerned with this vote myself, but it seems like a good choice.
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Jun 6, 2018 21:17
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B At least for the congress, it seems that it's better to be friends with Hannover and have a buffer state between us and France. EDIT: as for the entire congress, I expect Morocco will always vote against us in any way they can, so we should try to get Russia and Hannover on our side to compensate for it. Franland is good to have a friend, but they only have one vote while the Hannoverians have two, so the math is pretty easy to me. Dance Officer fucked around with this message at 21:26 on Jun 6, 2018 |
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Jun 6, 2018 21:19
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A. Morocco already hates us. We should buddy up to France.
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Jun 6, 2018 21:28
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A - prop up our French allies against the Moroccan juggernaut.
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Jun 6, 2018 21:38
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It's going to be hilarious when we piss off the entire world to get France/England as an ally, and then it immediately disintegrates leaving unified Germany as the dominant european power.
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Jun 6, 2018 21:39
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A As distasteful as it may be to join up with France, it will be one of our closest threats. Even if we get Russia/Bavaria's support, they'll be too far away to help (or maybe even care) about our problems, especially if France decides to give us hell for voting against their interests. At the same time, if Morocco decides to start poo poo France is right there, capable of helping.
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Jun 6, 2018 21:40
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Honestly, I think A is the least worst option. Sure we don't really want to annoy the minor powers, but even less we want to annoy the United Kingdom of the Channel.
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Jun 6, 2018 21:40
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A
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Jun 6, 2018 21:47
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A. It's worth a shot.
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Jun 6, 2018 21:51
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B
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Jun 6, 2018 21:53
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A Let's not be hypocritical when we try and get back Catalonia etc.
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Jun 6, 2018 22:19
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After Naploean, France and Britian ended up allies after hundreds of years of fighting. Who's to say the same couldn't happen with us and France?
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Jun 6, 2018 22:20
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A, just to get the boost.
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Jun 6, 2018 22:29
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Going with A, yes. The restored Provence would be a nice friend to have too
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Jun 6, 2018 22:44
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We’re gonna vote to empower France, and they are likely to deny us the northeastern parts of Iberia anyways. That being said, I’m still voting A . There might not be formalized vote trading, but we can’t afford to piss off both of our neighbors even more.
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Jun 6, 2018 22:45
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A friendly France is a good France
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Jun 6, 2018 22:45
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crimea posted:Also out of curiosity I would presume that if the Congress is currently in process than that would mean the actual meat of the V2 conversion is at least mostly done? I'm not trying to demand Hashim devote his whole life to the LP but I'm just like wondering if we should expect the V2 updates and state of the world proper to begin shortly after the Congress is done or if you were doing the Congress first and then continuing conversion. I'd say the meat of the conversion is done, yeah. It'll still take a while to get all the pops, governments, parties, events and decisions properly done after the Congress is over though, so the LP isn't going to be starting up right away again. I'll also be taking ideas for events and stuff when the time comes, and probably some flags too, and incorporate all into the mod.
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Jun 6, 2018 22:53
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Mark me down for A. It'd look bad when we try to reclaim Catalonia. I also think that cosying up to France is the right move, I don't think we're going to get friendly with Morocco any time soon, and who else will be able to reasonably help?
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Jun 6, 2018 22:58
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A so we can befriend France.
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Jun 6, 2018 23:04
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Dance Officer posted:B (2nd edit: No, I'm just wrong. I somehow didn't notice Tirruni getting all the way to the Atlantic. I'm a dumdum) WE ALREADY BORDER FRANCE. (edit: i see you realized this as I was posting, but your continued vote for B is even less defensible now  ) People voting B are people in support of surrendering our patrimony to create a buffer state that will be guaranteed protection by Morocco and probably Hannover. There is no way that Morocco will ever let us take back Catalunya. Which means that we need to make nice with France, or face yet another hundred years of being crushed between two strong powers because we are too loving stupid to make nice with the French and focus on the one true enemy of the Iberian state. The clear way forward is a Russo-Gallic-Andalusian-Bavarian entente that will wreck the poo poo out of the Hannoverian-Almoravid-Celtic alliance. Anyone voting B is someone who is actively undermining the future of our nation, and who should be banished to the Balearics to spend their senility in the sun and shade. A, a thousand times A, or Iberia will continue to bleed from the cursed foolishness of our Satan-tainted, self-important, self-imposed shitheel strategery. (btw, can we get a rundown of what the various powers think about us right now? it might convince some people that they're not going to get poo poo from the Hannoverians regardless of how much sycophancy they exhibit) habeasdorkus fucked around with this message at 23:53 on Jun 6, 2018 |
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Jun 6, 2018 23:19
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A
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Jun 6, 2018 23:49
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habeasdorkus posted:(btw, can we get a rundown of what the various powers think about us right now? it might convince some people that they're not going to get poo poo from the Hannoverians regardless of how much sycophancy they exhibit) It's only been one round of voting, so relations haven't had a chance to change decisively just yet: Morocco: -175 Russia: +50 Hannover: +40 France: +40 Bavaria: +40 Hungary: +40 Armenia: +40 Egypt: +40 The default starting relations in vicky is -10, but our relations were boosted when we gave Zulfiqar a crown. I had our relations with Russia start at 0 instead, because we ended MotE with the highest relations with them. Morocco started at -200, for obvious reasons.
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Jun 6, 2018 23:59
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If we don't strive to keep Morroco at -200 for all of Vicky we will be doing this wrong.
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Jun 7, 2018 00:07
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A
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Jun 7, 2018 00:09
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I'm eagerly awaiting fighting for the return of our lost territory at the conference only to have it ripped away from us in the first crisis.
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Jun 7, 2018 00:10
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