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Asphyxious posted:What year is it where Nefud is? Jesus Christ. It’s 2018 in Seattle. You know, the place that’s proudly ahead of the curve on most social justice issues in the US and kept net neutrality as an encore. Fans have been fixing lovely problematic stories using mental gymnastics for decades now and IDW Arcee isn’t any different. I’m not saying it isn’t offensive, I’m not saying it should be dredged up again or god forbid repeated. I’m sharing my own mental short circuit to find something enjoyable about it. Heavens to murgatroyd what a nazi I am!
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Jun 15, 2018 13:40
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The problem isn't that you found a way to enjoy it, what has rankled people is how you've accused people of "getting their rocks off" by being offended. That's bullroar and always has been.
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Jun 15, 2018 13:44
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I guess I forgot those people actually exist instead of just being a fun idea to laugh about.
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Jun 15, 2018 14:05
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You mean trans people?
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Jun 15, 2018 14:30
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Christ you’ve always been a useless little twat. Good to see you’ve learned nothing over the years.
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Jun 15, 2018 14:32
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hey guys check out my TRANSFORMERS!
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Jun 15, 2018 14:57
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TheDK posted:hey guys check out my TRANSFORMERS! Those are some sweet Transformers. Here is what I lovingly call the "Wrong Color Squad:" 
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Jun 15, 2018 15:26
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CAPT. Rainbowbeard posted:Those are some sweet Transformers. drat that G2 Bumblebee head is a lot cooler than I had realized. I would like a black repaint with either a red or purple visor. Then I could stick him in my evil-squad with the black MMC Cliffjumper I also want.
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Jun 15, 2018 15:28
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TheDK posted:hey guys check out my TRANSFORMERS! noice, i need to invest more in pocket scale. iron factory dudicus is rad, look into that!
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Jun 15, 2018 15:53
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DoctorWhat posted:noice, i need to invest more in pocket scale. iron factory dudicus is rad, look into that! It's definitely on my want-list. Might try to get a deal at TFCon Chicago if I can wait that long.
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Jun 15, 2018 15:54
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Trying to retroactively justify 1980s sexism is always going to be really awkward, but making being a woman some kind of hideous body horror fate is definitely towards the bottom of the list. Caminus was a lot more graceful, even if all women being from an alien planet is still a little weird. Windblade's a great addition to canon, even if I have a couple small issues with her design.
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Jun 15, 2018 15:55
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TheDK posted:drat that G2 Bumblebee head is a lot cooler than I had realized. I would like a black repaint with either a red or purple visor. Then I could stick him in my evil-squad with the black MMC Cliffjumper I also want.
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Jun 15, 2018 15:56
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SlothfulCobra posted:Caminus was a lot more graceful, even if all women being from an alien planet is still a little weird. Caminus seems more like it was just a colony that just happened to be mostly women, there are still men on it. Like the other colonies have female bots, so it comes across as a lot less weird and creepy.
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Jun 15, 2018 16:19
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SlothfulCobra posted:Caminus was a lot more graceful, even if all women being from an alien planet is still a little weird. Windblade's a great addition to canon, even if I have a couple small issues with her design. Did they ever get around to saying why Cybertron stopped having gender?
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Jun 15, 2018 16:19
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SlothfulCobra posted:Trying to retroactively justify 1980s sexism is always going to be really awkward, but making being a woman some kind of hideous body horror fate is definitely towards the bottom of the list. See the weird thing is, the cartoon has NEVER had a problem with lady Transformers existing. They were just a thing in the the G1 cartoon and in Beast Wars, no one blinked an eye. But for some reason in the comics they're this huge loving problem and of course the toyline
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Jun 15, 2018 16:23
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Burkion posted:See the weird thing is, the cartoon has NEVER had a problem with lady Transformers existing. They were just a thing in the the G1 cartoon and in Beast Wars, no one blinked an eye.
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Jun 15, 2018 16:37
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Burkion posted:But for some reason in the comics they're this huge loving problem and of course the toyline That's not just a TF problem though, lots of early toy lines never featured the women characters because execs thought that boys only wanted to play with male objects, and would classify female toys as "for girls," and not buy them. How wrong they were.
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Jun 15, 2018 17:11
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Anora posted:That's not just a TF problem though, lots of early toy lines never featured the women characters because execs thought that boys only wanted to play with male objects, and would classify female toys as "for girls," and not buy them. How wrong they were. That's still got nothing to do with the fact that the comics invented the problem of Transformers being mono gendered, which has NEVER been the case in the show or any toyline after G1. Even if Beast Wars basically just said a bunch of male looking figures were female. Like why did that become a thing in the comics? I was never aware that there was supposed to be a weird boys only thing on Transformers until I looked more into them
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Jun 15, 2018 18:01
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Toyhax/Reprolabels have previewed the stickers for IF Dudicus. Aww yiss.
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Jun 15, 2018 18:04
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Hey look! More transformers!
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Jun 15, 2018 18:06
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TheDK posted:Hey look! More transformers! I wonder if IF will make a Thunderclash out of their Tarn.
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Jun 15, 2018 18:08
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IF Legends scale are my new favourite toy line but god drat I wish they weren't so pricey for their size because they would be a ton of fun as a desk toy but also small enough to be easily stolen.
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Jun 15, 2018 18:10
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The_Doctor posted:I wonder if IF will make a Thunderclash out of their Tarn. You know I completely forgot about the IF DJD guys. Gotta add them to my want-list now, too. Thanks A LOT!
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Jun 15, 2018 18:11
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Burkion posted:That's still got nothing to do with the fact that the comics invented the problem of Transformers being mono gendered, which has NEVER been the case in the show or any toyline after G1. I think it would be more interesting if they didn't even have a concept of gender, why on earth does an alien robot have to have boobs? Though I would miss people melting down about gay robots.
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Jun 15, 2018 18:31
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TF Source tells me Predaking is up for pre-order. If somebody wants. Me, at this point I'd rather save for Feral Rex.
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Jun 15, 2018 18:32
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Fsmhunk posted:I think it would be more interesting if they didn't even have a concept of gender, why on earth does an alien robot have to have boobs? Though I would miss people melting down about gay robots. The problem here is that the concept of having no gender is impossible for the Transformers characters as they are. Megatron and Optimus Prime, to name only TWO, are extremely masculine characters. No Gender does not default to Male. It means that they are men. That means that there are, or should be, feminine Transformers. Like, most of the Transformers are written as male characters. The only one who is probably male but could work for either is like, Transformers Prime Soundwave. He's pretty non gendered just due to design and character
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Jun 15, 2018 18:40
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IDW already had that they didn't have the concept of gender - everyone's really confused when the Camiens came in using words like "she". And early on in MTMTE typically super-male Transformers like Rodimus and Drift have both masculine and feminine aspects to their designs, not to mention Chromedome and Whirl having nonhuman builds. I don't think more than that's needed. Anode makes it a little more unclear, too. You have to consider that it's weird that Transformers look human or speak English at all. If they didn't, though, people would not like them. 2007 movie was going to feature Transformers who did not talk because writers did not understand why alien robots should be humanlike and didn't realize people liked them as characters until they read message boards. Once they understand, female Transformers were fine - if they can have male voices they can have female voices. And the cartoons only have 10-20 minutes with an audience of small children to really bring this up. It's only Furman who has been a problem with how hostile and angry he gets with the concept of a female Transformer that's caused all this poo poo to begin with. Honestly, we can talk about how there's a possible Transformers concept and you can totally see a Transformer story where they're not gendered and the people who don't like it are totally out of it, man, but at the end of the day you're asking others to respect and understand something that only exists within your own head. If you like your ideas so much, write them and link them. Worked for James Roberts. Otherwise we're just like a tvtropes wild mass guessing page.
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Jun 15, 2018 19:11
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I think the 1980s were a drat avalanche of toy-marketing truisms from the market of toys for children really opening up. It's not particularly unusual for individual demographics to be targeted by advertising, but there was just such an amazing lack of subtlety that left very real societal scars. Toy marketing is even one of the reasons why women got pushed out of programming. The original G1 material did have a few feminine robots, but there was definitely a bias in the original material against them. All the girl robots except for one were supposedly "in hiding" for millions of years. Burkion posted:The only one who is probably male but could work for either is like, Transformers Prime Soundwave. He's pretty non gendered just due to design and character There were a lot of real interesting character designs with Prime. I always thought that Starscream seemed like he basically had the same sort of design as Arcee so that they were the same sort of "species" of transformer, so even though Arcee was the only female for the longest time, it wasn't like she was some kind of severe departure from the rest design-wise. Of course, as a kid I played the hell out of transmetal Airazor without ever realizing that it was supposed to be a girl, so I'm not good at catching onto things.
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Jun 15, 2018 19:12
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Beast Wars also lends itself to male and female gendered robots even more readily, though it's still there for G1 era, because the Maximals and Predacons were basically bio technological. They were a cybernetic race at that point, organic and technology mixed. Rattrap makes references about strip clubs on Cybertron, Tigertron and Airrazor were fuckin, and Silverbolt and Blackarachnia were REALLY loving. And well, a lot of ball jokes in Beast Wars. A lot of ball jokes. So many testicle jokes.
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Jun 15, 2018 19:27
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For the "what I would do if I could be in charge of a TF series" kind of brainstorming I like to do, I've actually put a lot of thought into how gender fits into Cybertronian society, not just among the Autobots and Decepticons stuck on Earth, but back home on Cybertron among the NAILS*, and to put it lightly like everything else regarding a race of immortal robotic shapeshifters^ it's extremely complicated and diverse *one of the core concepts for this idea is that both sides lost the war, but not in the way it usually happens(with Cybertron dying in some form), instead the civilian population just got sick of both factions and kicked them out, which is why there's a couple thousand space robots bumming around in our Solar System, they've got nowhere else to go ^another core concept is that Cybertronians are truly Immortal, sure you can blow up the rest of their body, but the Spark itself is truly indestructible, which is why the war between the Autobots and Decepticons has gone on so long, it's a problem that literally cannot be solved by violence
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Jun 15, 2018 19:46
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History Comes Inside! posted:IF Legends scale are my new favourite toy line but god drat I wish they weren't so pricey for their size because they would be a ton of fun as a desk toy but also small enough to be easily stolen. They’ve gotten a hell of a lot cheaper. Like, Warpath who’s coming very soon only cost me £22. That’s only a few quid more than a deluxe these days.
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Jun 15, 2018 21:54
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Fsmhunk posted:I think it would be more interesting if they didn't even have a concept of gender, why on earth does an alien robot have to have boobs? Though I would miss people melting down about gay robots. No, we can't have that. We can't not apply our hu-mon values to alien space robot toys. I like the gay (by Earth standards) robots, personally. I could stand to read more of that.
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Jun 15, 2018 21:58
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Fsmhunk posted:I think it would be more interesting if they didn't even have a concept of gender, why on earth does an alien robot have to have boobs? Though I would miss people melting down about gay robots. Roboobs are the dumbest goddamn thing. I agree that from an in-universe perspective where they're a mechanical race that don't reproduce so much as can build new friends, robots don't need gender. But I think the obvious problem is no gender very quickly becomes one gender becomes male by default because blocky robots with cannons and all the famous ones have appeared in media with obviously male voices. So then progressives are mad because all the robots are men even if they're not technically men, and the regressives are mad that all the robots are gay by default. You can't win. So whatever. Why not. Some robots are women because reasons that don't have to make any beep-boop logical sense. Of course this is still gonna make regressives mad because it acknowledges women as existing, but they're a demographic that, if you're making them happy, you're doing something wrong. I just.. I just wish said robot women didn't have roboobs. They're not mammals, got dangit!
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Jun 15, 2018 22:14
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Predaking is up for pre-order on BBTS and Amazon if anyone is gonna bite. $160 https://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B079VNNGM5/ref=sxts_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1529094864&sr=1&pi=AC_SX236_SY340_QL65&tag=transformers-20
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Jun 15, 2018 22:21
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All transformers should have a great rack.
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Jun 15, 2018 22:22
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I might add that Arcee was not added because of any angry feminists. According to what I read on TFwiki, Rod Friedman wanted a Transformer for his Transformer-loving daughter to be put in the movie. quote:And they were absolutely resistant to Arcee. I said I had a daughter who loves this stuff. There are other girls that like it. Put in a female Autobot! you have to remember, even with the IDW comics... we are not the target audience. Had the Transformers not been humanlike in the name of realism, I don't think we'd be talking about them today. And again, IDW did their best with that in the modern era. I've seen people get mad at designs like Aileron anyway and see it as more of a conspiracy against them. I don't see why more feminized designs make less sense than Ravage, Laserbeak, or Sky Lynx anyway.
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Jun 15, 2018 22:25
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the angry feminists thing was from Furman's story, and from there it seemed to become something apocryphally happened in real life in people's minds.
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Jun 15, 2018 23:41
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There were girl gobots first.
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Jun 15, 2018 23:51
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drrockso20 posted:^another core concept is that Cybertronians are truly Immortal, sure you can blow up the rest of their body, but the Spark itself is truly indestructible, which is why the war between the Autobots and Decepticons has gone on so long, it's a problem that literally cannot be solved by violence You mean they can make new toys without making new characters? Hasbro will give you all the monies.
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Jun 16, 2018 00:09
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Studio Series Ironhide looks quite good. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5lZiMX5Yl0w
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Jun 16, 2018 01:11
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