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BoJack is a case of reformative justice v. retributive justice and I think that’s an interesting story to tell, especially in our dumb mass-incarceratey-society. You can root for him to do better, heal, and try to help those around him (or do good for others if the people he has hurt do not want him near them) without wanting him to return to his height of fame/power/etc. You can despise what he’s done without wanting to isolate him from society.
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Jul 10, 2018 02:37
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I was going to reply to that terrible post but given their current status I took a look at their rapsheet and that's three bans in less than a year? Impressive.
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Jul 10, 2018 02:50
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Who hurt you, caganer?
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Jul 10, 2018 02:53
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Billzasilver posted:Who hurt you, caganer? Statistically, probably BoJack.
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Jul 10, 2018 02:59
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Zulily Zoetrope posted:Bojack is an incredibly flawed person, but he actually tries to be better, and has several moments of clarity amongst his many fuckups. I don't see how you can compare him to Walter White or Space Todd who have basically no redeeming qualities. One of the things I really like about Bojack (and generally hate about prestige dramas) is the show never presents Bojack's destructive behavior as anything other than repulsive. I feel like in a lot of dramas, which are hypothetically about a character's corruption or moral failings are not so secretly celebrating the horrible actions and encouraging viewers to treat the protagonists fall as a power fantasy. With Bojack they go out of their way to show how Bojacks behavior hurts everyone around him including himself. Not to sound like a stuck up moralist, but the hypocrisy always sticks out to me and this show does a really good job of not falling into that trap.
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Jul 10, 2018 03:22
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Caganer posted:like i liked to tell students whining about their grades in grad school: it doesn't matter how hard you tried, you didn't meet expectations Haha poo poo I hope you're not a grad school teacher. Hell I hope you don't have power over anyone in any real capacity
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Jul 10, 2018 03:31
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Lurdiak posted:Have you not been paying attention to every other character in the show? They're all struggling with the same general things Bojack is, but with varying degrees of damage, including none at all in Mister Peanutbutter's case. In what universe is getting dumped by all 3 of your wives not damaging? Just because he’s got a big smile doesn’t mean he’s not hurting and Mr. PB is such a great character because of the moments when the facade drops and he’s a very sad dog. I also feel like the point of my last post is that Diane basically nuked her entire life, her marriage and took advantage of Bojack’s generosity (noticeably taxing his relationship in the process) and... basically gets a raise? She gets a better position or recognition, she gets off scott free with lying to her husband, whom she then dumps because his grand romantic gestures grew tiresome (!) and just mooched off her rich friend for like two months, basically being a worse Todd. This show is about a lot of things, but dealing with the repercussions of your mistakes isn’t really one of them, as illustrated by Herb just saying “no dude I don’t accept your apology you suck, gently caress you.” and dying without giving any closure I dunno, if season 5 comes and goes without something relating to Penny or Sarah Lynn biting Bojack in the rear end I’ll be surprised. Not necessarily disappointed, but definitely surprised.
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Jul 10, 2018 03:41
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That's such a gross misinterpretation of everything that happened to Diane. She has never felt any fulfillment in any work she has done during the series, most notably when crashing hard after failing to write the memoir or St. Clair, "taking advantage of Bojack's generosity" is more like stress eating and avoid confrontation with your problems along with someone else who did this their entire life, PB saw clear through her lies and they're getting therapy over it in the next season and their marriage is obviously going to ruins ever since that moment, culminating with the "grand gesture" that missed the point over her feelings as much as your post. Add to that her failure to integrate her liberal views with her work, being the black sheep of her family, having pretty much no profitable career options and being reduced to ghostwriting Tweets, having no one to confide her deep fears aside from Bojack, and probably a dozen things I've forgotten, she's clearly and obviously not coming on top in this story.
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Jul 10, 2018 03:54
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Uh, Diane wrote a best selling memoir that relaunched Bojack’s career into the stratosphere and could have gone on to do basically anything else. I can’t recall there being any plot point about her not being able to find work, and it’s actually her own disillusionment that causes her to abandon her book//report on the rich philanthropist guy. If she wanted another Pulitzer bait that was it. And again, her job is basically tweeting for a feminine Vice/Medium/Mother Jones type, and she had that hugely successful piece about guns. That’s a sweet loving gig. I dunno maybe it’s just my personality but I feel like Diane’s life is great and it’s just not what she wants because she’s a very persnickety person who can’t just settle for the mountain of miracles that keep raining down on her. Who the gently caress cares if she’s alienated by her family, that’s why she lives allllllllllll the way the gently caress in LA, realistically if you don’t live in the same state as your family they shouldn’t have any power or influence over you and your life, and she already seems more successful and fulfilled than any of them. I don’t think she and Mr. PB are right for each other at all, but I honestly never got what she could see in him given the way she acts in literally every single scene of this show. Or maybe I’m just triggered by having been married to/lived with/dated 3-4 shades of Diane “if something doesn’t go exactly the way I have painted it in my head it’s wrong and I refuse to be happy about it” Nguyen
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Jul 10, 2018 04:09
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Well I appreciate that you're straight up just projecting your hang ups onto the character, that's refreshing
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Jul 10, 2018 04:27
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Bust Rodd posted:Or maybe I’m just triggered by having been married to/lived with/dated 3-4 shades of Diane “if something doesn’t go exactly the way I have painted it in my head it’s wrong and I refuse to be happy about it” Nguyen It's this 
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Jul 10, 2018 04:29
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Nah you guys are right, Diane’s perfect and everything is happening to her and she’s always handling it to the best of her ability guys, just like Bojack and Princess Carolyn.
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Jul 10, 2018 04:31
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a crisp refreshing Moxie posted:It's this
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Jul 10, 2018 04:31
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Bust Rodd posted:perfect just like Bojack and Princess Carolyn. uhhhhhhhh
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Jul 10, 2018 04:32
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Season 1 Diane wants to be a legit writer and even mocks BuzzFeed. Season 4 Diane is working at PopSugar meets Jezebel and would kill to be at an outfit like Mother Jones or Vice (both of which, sure, are guilty of dumb clickbaity poo poo but they also do legit investigative reporting).
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Jul 10, 2018 04:33
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Bust Rodd posted:Nah you guys are right, Diane’s perfect and everything is happening to her and she’s always handling it to the best of her ability guys, just like Bojack and Princess Carolyn. That's definitely what everyone is saying you've captured the zeitgeist of this thread
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Jul 10, 2018 04:36
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Yeah I’m a Bojack shitposting Super Amadeus what can I say
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Jul 10, 2018 04:40
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It's nice when you see a post that seems crazy and then the person turns out to actually be crazy.
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Jul 10, 2018 05:01
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Billzasilver posted:uhhhhhhhh you're missing the point, he's being sarcastic and saying Diane is not the only trainwreck in the show she and MPB are just somewhat more functional trainwrecks than BoJack and PC
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Jul 10, 2018 05:08
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Samuringa posted:I was going to reply to that terrible post but given their current status I took a look at their rapsheet and that's three bans in less than a year? Impressive. He didn't meet expectations
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Jul 10, 2018 05:37
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Here's a sketch for u doods.
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Jul 10, 2018 05:38
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Majestic. Also,Smirking_Serpent posted:Best friend [M20] gets angry at me [F23] for not liking the same TV show as him and then tells me I need to see a psychiatrist because I can't handle "adult themes"
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Jul 10, 2018 07:24
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Man that was an interesting story and I don't regret reading it in the least.
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Jul 10, 2018 08:06
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i am the bird posted:Season 1 Diane wants to be a legit writer and even mocks BuzzFeed. Season 4 Diane is working at PopSugar meets Jezebel and would kill to be at an outfit like Mother Jones or Vice (both of which, sure, are guilty of dumb clickbaity poo poo but they also do legit investigative reporting). I’m not sure girlcroosh is even up to the terrible standards of Jezebel. It reminds me of babe.net which tries ridiculously hard to be woke and cool. Woah, that Reddit guy needs to dump his friend. Today she’s refusing to watch Bojack Horseman, next time it could be Rick and Morty.
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Jul 10, 2018 10:00
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diane has the same problem bojack does, accomplishments and success cannot and will not make them happy and they need to do like cuddlywhiskers said and give up on material things (diane craves wisdom, bojack craves satisfaction) and seek inner spiritual happiness
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Jul 10, 2018 17:03
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Samuringa posted:Add to that her failure to integrate her liberal views with her work, being the black sheep of her family, No, that's her brother Gary.
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Jul 10, 2018 17:14
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Bust Rodd posted:This show is about a lot of things, but dealing with the repercussions of your mistakes isn’t really one of them, as illustrated by Herb just saying “no dude I don’t accept your apology you suck, gently caress you.” and dying without giving any closure I don't know what universe you live in where Herb dying after telling Bojack to gently caress off and that he'll never forgive him, Sarah Lynn dying in his arms, or Penny being traumatized by the very sight of Bojack isn't repercussions. What exactly do you want to happen to Bojack? The whole point is that he's wealthy and well-regarded in spite of his personal life being a shitshow and hating himself. It's not an accident that Todd is simultaneously the only character who is destitute and disregarded but also happy and healthy.
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Jul 10, 2018 18:03
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Like the whole point of the last season is that Bojack had to work really loving hard to try to carve some happiness for himself. He was sincerely contrite and apologetic to his friends who at most responded with fine but still gently caress you a little bit and had to work through the voice in his head to do good by Hollyhock Even the one indulgence he was gonna give himself re; telling his mom to go gently caress herself he gave up on to give her just a tiny bit of happiness in her final days
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Jul 10, 2018 20:47
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I'm rewatching the entire series and both drug trip episodes Downer Ending and That's Too Much, Man! are really fascinating to me. Both episodes feature Bojack skipping time because of the effects drugs are having on him, which is upsetting in itself. In Downer Ending they play with it but what they do in That's Too Much, Man! is even more affecting. At one point its implied that the bender Bojack and Sarah Lynn go on is weeks long. There's something very chaotic about losing time and just skipping through life like that. The episode is like a psychological horror movie with the characters of Sarah Lynn and Bojack very willingly letting go of their well-being and unrepentantly gambling with their lives.
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Jul 10, 2018 21:38
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I can't remember did Sarah-Lynn actually use the BoJack heroin? I know they found it but then the Oscars happened. Just kinda interesting that BoJack ends up killing her in more than one way
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Jul 10, 2018 21:57
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Aces High posted:I can't remember did Sarah-Lynn actually use the BoJack heroin? I know they found it but then the Oscars happened. Just kinda interesting that BoJack ends up killing her in more than one way They snort it back at her house. I think it’s unclear how much time lapses between that and the planetarium, though.
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Jul 10, 2018 23:06
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I'm not going to inject heroin with you....we're going to snort it like sophisticated adults.
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Jul 10, 2018 23:33
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DoubleCakes posted:I'm rewatching the entire series and both drug trip episodes Downer Ending and That's Too Much, Man! are really fascinating to me. Both episodes feature Bojack skipping time because of the effects drugs are having on him, which is upsetting in itself. In Downer Ending they play with it but what they do in That's Too Much, Man! is even more affecting. At one point its implied that the bender Bojack and Sarah Lynn go on is weeks long. There's something very chaotic about losing time and just skipping through life like that. The episode is like a psychological horror movie with the characters of Sarah Lynn and Bojack very willingly letting go of their well-being and unrepentantly gambling with their lives. The AVClub article on the episode suggests they tripped for at least six weeks 
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Jul 10, 2018 23:45
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Aces High posted:I can't remember did Sarah-Lynn actually use the BoJack heroin? I know they found it but then the Oscars happened. Just kinda interesting that BoJack ends up killing her in more than one way She literally OD'ed on Bojack. It's a bit on the nose.
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Jul 11, 2018 01:18
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In the nose, surely
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Jul 11, 2018 01:29
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Ghost Leviathan posted:Majestic. Also, The composition doesn't work as well without the tail and it took me a few seconds to realize he doesn't have one. I think it was the right way for the designs to go but it ends up feeling weird when you're drawing a horse.
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Jul 11, 2018 01:46
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bojack kills
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Jul 11, 2018 06:54
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Pick posted:The composition doesn't work as well without the tail and it took me a few seconds to realize he doesn't have one. I think it was the right way for the designs to go but it ends up feeling weird when you're drawing a horse. Yeah, was weird in that bit where you see Bojack's butt and it's basically human but brown and hairy. The show is pretty self-awarely half-assed with the animal gimmick, see birds flying by flapping their arms.
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Jul 11, 2018 11:17
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Ghost Leviathan posted:Yeah, was weird in that bit where you see Bojack's butt and it's basically human but brown and hairy. The show is pretty self-awarely half-assed with the animal gimmick, see birds flying by flapping their arms. It's pretty weird in a lot of ways, like how Bojack references himself as, like, a horse in that he weighs 800 lbs and etc., except he like clearly doesn't. It doesn't bother me at all, in fact I like that they prioritize being funny.
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Jul 11, 2018 14:47
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Ghost Leviathan posted:Yeah, was weird in that bit where you see Bojack's butt and it's basically human but brown and hairy. The show is pretty self-awarely half-assed with the animal gimmick, see birds flying by flapping their arms. The orca dancers smoking underwater got me to spit take TWICE
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Jul 11, 2018 15:00
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