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My friend who organizes the big game nights around town has come to an agreement that we immediately slam a game on the table when Terraforming Mars guy shows up.
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Jul 20, 2018 21:12
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| # ? May 30, 2024 13:38 |
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Lorini posted:Not me. After watching Paul Grogan's rule video, reading the rules, and talking with Vital over Messenger, there's just too much hidden information in the game for us. Not just the money, but the objectives as well. From what I can tell,you really won't know who is winning or losing during the game and that's not a situation I like. Not that we have to play beat up the leader but it's still nice to know what you should work on (other than MO POINTZ) to compete. Must be nice having big name designers at your fingertips, and I mean that with all seriousness, I'm jealous!
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Jul 20, 2018 21:24
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Just add him as a friend! He doesn’t really 'know' me. We played a ton of Lisboa when it came out and he added me as a friend. No biggie.
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Jul 20, 2018 21:39
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FulsomFrank posted:What's the game??? It’s Dark Souls. While not very new anymore, is still one of the most recent games in our group. And the dude is still waiting on some kickstarter bonus expansions. Which, from what I can tell, does nothing to fix any of the game’s many problems, but simply adds more poo poo. More cards, more cardboard, more loving miniatures. I’ve played the game twice, and both times were long slogs. The game is drowning in randomness, and the players never have any meaningful decisions to make, and the game hammers both of these problems home by making you replay huuuge chunks of the game several times before progressing to the anti-climactic boss fight. Also the rules are a mess. I’d be happy if I never saw the inside of that box ever again. And I’d also hope my friend would learn from this to never back kickstarter games that sell themselves solely on IP and miniatures. But he seems really dedicated to «making it work». He has even come up with a couple of house rules, which I admit makes the game slightly more interesting, but is nowhere near being the rebuild the game needs. Guess I’ll just keep repeating that it wasn’t really my thing.
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Jul 21, 2018 00:27
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Lorini posted:Just add him as a friend! He doesn’t really 'know' me. We played a ton of Lisboa when it came out and he added me as a friend. No biggie. This is how I made friends with Jean-Christophe Bouvier of Rallyman. He discovered I had done a rough translation of the expansion so we could play it early and asked for my help with the first english printing. Real nice dude.
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Jul 21, 2018 00:31
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Lorini posted:Just add him as a friend! He doesn’t really 'know' me. We played a ton of Lisboa when it came out and he added me as a friend. No biggie.  I've never played a game of his. 
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Jul 21, 2018 01:07
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silvergoose posted:
So you're going to introduce yourself as "Hi I'm silvergoose, I've never played a game of yours but wanted to hang out with a boardgame celeb" right??? 
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Jul 21, 2018 03:44
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My biggest complaint with Escape plan is the shipping is gross. 59 USD? gently caress you.
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Jul 21, 2018 04:08
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Cthulhu Dreams posted:My biggest complaint with Escape plan is the shipping is gross. 59 USD? gently caress you. gently caress the shipping companies and trade war tariffs. Shipping hasn't been reasonable for over a decade.
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Jul 21, 2018 05:57
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I got the Agricola 5 and 6 player expansion. Played with 5 last night and it's pretty intense! I feel like the expansion is well balanced. The new cards are powerful but there are as many 5+ player cards as there are 1-4 player cards so you're likely to get a bunch. I really love Agricola. I got Scythe for my birthday. Haven't tried it yet but can't wait! Any obvious pitfalls I should look out for?
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Jul 21, 2018 06:01
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a7m2 posted:I got the Agricola 5 and 6 player expansion. Played with 5 last night and it's pretty intense! I feel like the expansion is well balanced. The new cards are powerful but there are as many 5+ player cards as there are 1-4 player cards so you're likely to get a bunch. I really love Agricola. Eh no pitfalls, watch the Watch It Played video and skim the rulebook and have a good time with it. The enlist bonus recurring bonuses can be confusing to some people but the rulebook is very clear. Any other issues you can just search for and find Jamey clearing them up on BGG.
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Jul 21, 2018 07:15
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Lorini posted:So you're going to introduce yourself as "Hi I'm silvergoose, I've never played a game of yours but wanted to hang out with a boardgame celeb" right??? Or maybe "Hi I'm one of the three organizers of VlaadaCon, dedicated to playing games by...wait you're not Vlaada!?"
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Jul 21, 2018 12:04
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Bodanarko posted:Eh no pitfalls, watch the Watch It Played video and skim the rulebook and have a good time with it. The enlist bonus recurring bonuses can be confusing to some people but the rulebook is very clear. Any other issues you can just search for and find Jamey clearing them up on BGG. Watching videos to learn to play games is so annoying to me and I hope there's never a time when that becomes the standard way to learn. It just feels so time consuming compared to reading something.
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Jul 21, 2018 12:24
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Taear posted:Watching videos to learn to play games is so annoying to me and I hope there's never a time when that becomes the standard way to learn. In general, I share your distaste for video vs. reading, but the one thing game videos do that doesn't happen with rulebooks is show the game elements in their places, show them in motion, et cetera. Game manuals often show their components one time. You don't need to flip around in the manual to remind yourself what this or that component looks like: the videos are always showing it, as they also show you what you do with it. I have gotten a lot out of instructional videos for my most complex games.
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Jul 21, 2018 12:37
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Taear posted:Watching videos to learn to play games is so annoying to me and I hope there's never a time when that becomes the standard way to learn. It's hell to me. I have a friend who doesn't read rulebooks and instead spends his time watching a couple of hours long rules videos. He is a criminal
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Jul 21, 2018 13:12
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I think some of the rules videos out there are really good - I mean people learn differently, so YMMV - Watch it Played and Gaming Rules are really good.
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Jul 21, 2018 13:18
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Mojo Jojo posted:It's hell to me. I have a friend who doesn't read rulebooks and instead spends his time watching a couple of hours long rules videos. He is a criminal A friend of mine does, it's like...I can read the manual when I'm doing other stuff and take it in but I can't do anything else if I'm watching a video, it demands all my time. And I tend to drift so I miss useful important stuff. homullus posted:In general, I share your distaste for video vs. reading, but the one thing game videos do that doesn't happen with rulebooks is show the game elements in their places, show them in motion, et cetera. Game manuals often show their components one time. You don't need to flip around in the manual to remind yourself what this or that component looks like: the videos are always showing it, as they also show you what you do with it. I have gotten a lot out of instructional videos for my most complex games. I guess as long as I've got the game and I've seen the stuff in it I'm fine.
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Jul 21, 2018 13:42
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I massively prefer to set things up and learn by trying to perform things as soon as they are introduced. Eventually working towards doing my own turn solitaire. Which makes sense, because when someone is teaching me a game I pick it up the quickest when we are actually playing through a turn. If I own the game, having it set up for a couple days and playing through a few turns each day will help me really internalize it.
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Jul 21, 2018 14:48
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a7m2 posted:I got Scythe for my birthday. Haven't tried it yet but can't wait! Any obvious pitfalls I should look out for? One common pitfall is thinking about it like a typical combat-focused DOAM game. You don't want to build a murderball of mechs to smash the other's--you can only get 2 stars from winning combats (unless you're Saxony), and stars don't win the game by themselves, they just end it. Winning a combat often leaves you weakened to the point where someone else can then attack you. Mechs are more often used as deterrents and for transporting workers. At the beginning of the game, examine your player board thoroughly and figure out the synergies. You'll want to get to the point where you can frequently use both a top and bottom action each turn. You don't need popularity until the end of the game, but it's a score multiplier, so getting to the top tier and ending the game before others do can be highly effective. Recruits are more powerful with fewer players. Getting to the factory is a good idea even if you can't hold it, because it will give you an extra move action and moving as often as possible is the way you grab a lot of points toward the end of the game.
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Jul 21, 2018 15:00
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Good teaching videos are a lifeline to me and my gaming partner. Watching Rodney, Paul Grogan or Heavy Cardboard easily explain games where the written rules seem badly written or at least totally opaque is a far more efficient use of my time.
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Jul 21, 2018 15:14
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CaptainRightful posted:One common pitfall is thinking about it like a typical combat-focused DOAM game. You don't want to build a murderball of mechs to smash the other's--you can only get 2 stars from winning combats (unless you're Saxony), and stars don't win the game by themselves, they just end it. Winning a combat often leaves you weakened to the point where someone else can then attack you. Mechs are more often used as deterrents and for transporting workers. All of this, solid advice. All I'd add is to really highlight that turn to turn you should always be working toward a specific star, but never just be doing stuff that's "generally good". Have your star in mind, and know roughly how many turns it's going to take. Moving around, exploring, heading to the factory etc, that's all stuff you're doing when you can't repeat an action you need toward a star. Oh, and because it wasn't really spelled out, when you get your board, look at the gold reward for actions. You don't want to take a factory card that does an action your board would score big gold for. I can't really recommend Rodney from watch it played's video enough, I know people are anti rule videos, but honestly it's just the easiest most efficient way to learn the rules, he's very succinct. I basically try to imitate that video whenever I teach it. !Klams fucked around with this message at 15:19 on Jul 21, 2018 |
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Jul 21, 2018 15:16
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I want videos to learn how to play, and rule books written like reference sheets to help me answer rules questions. Learn to play rulebooks like Vlaada does are horrible and I can’t stand when companies use them. They’re worse for learning how to play than watching a video, and they make finding information afterward needlessly complicated. When I’m going to start playing a new game I always start by looking to see if one of the better youtubers has done a video of it.
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Jul 21, 2018 15:34
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I like rules explanation videos because they tell me how the game works before I buy it. I can't read a rule book before I buy the game, and I'm not buying a game if I don't know the mechanics before hand.
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Jul 21, 2018 16:01
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The best system is the FFG current model of a learn to play book and a rules reference
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Jul 21, 2018 16:02
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Rutibex posted:I like rules explanation videos because they tell me how the game works before I buy it. I can't read a rule book before I buy the game, and I'm not buying a game if I don't know the mechanics before hand. Yep this too. Paul Grogan's rules explanation of Escape Plan is why I'm not buying it. Given the price of games now, investing 30-60 minutes in watching a video about the game seems cheap.
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Jul 21, 2018 16:09
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Most rule books are posted either on bgg or the publisher’s site
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Jul 21, 2018 16:18
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Mojo Jojo posted:The best system is the FFG current model of a learn to play book and a rules reference This was invaluable for learning and then getting targeted clarification for Twilight Imperium, I agree. I'm glad Root looks to be using the same system.
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Jul 21, 2018 16:18
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I like to use videos to contextualize the rulebook. Ideally this will be a straight "learn to play" video but gameplay footage works in a pinch. Watching a video then reading the rules to fill in the gaps is my MO.
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Jul 21, 2018 16:23
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Mojo Jojo posted:The best system is the FFG current model of a learn to play book and a rules reference That’s a great system but FFG is awful at it. Vladaa does it best.
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Jul 21, 2018 16:24
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Mojo Jojo posted:The best system is the Edited for truth. A thorough index and logical numbering system is ideal for looking up rules, making the sequential order of sections almost irrelevant.
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Jul 21, 2018 16:54
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CaptainRightful posted:Edited for truth. A thorough index and logical numbering system is ideal for looking up rules, making the sequential order of sections almost irrelevant. Yeah this. Vlaada sucks at it too, at least in the case of his game that most needs it - Mage Knight. That rulebook / learn to play combo is atrocious.
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Jul 21, 2018 16:54
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Agreed upon separate but comprehensive tutorial and reference rules supremacy. The sin that so many commit is having rules only ever appear in the tutorial books and not the reference too. Many are so poorly executed that I think the concept as a whole has a bad rap.
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Jul 21, 2018 17:01
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Rutibex posted:I like rules explanation videos because they tell me how the game works before I buy it. I can't read a rule book before I buy the game, and I'm not buying a game if I don't know the mechanics before hand. I've never seen a game where you can't find the manual online. Everything's on there and that's how I always read them. I agree that "Learn to play" is often poo poo and because it leaves stuff out it can make a really difficult time of it. I'm thinking of Forgotten Stars there more than anything, there's so much stuff that's missed out. CaptainRightful posted:One common pitfall is thinking about it like a typical combat-focused DOAM game. You don't want to build a murderball of mechs to smash the other's--you can only get 2 stars from winning combats (unless you're Saxony), and stars don't win the game by themselves, they just end it. Winning a combat often leaves you weakened to the point where someone else can then attack you. Mechs are more often used as deterrents and for transporting workers. This makes me think of Twilight Imperium (at least the third one) so much.
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Jul 21, 2018 17:04
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Mojo Jojo posted:The worst system is the FFG current model of a learn to play book and a rules reference
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Jul 21, 2018 17:35
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Tangentially related to this video topic, what steps/process does everyone use when scoping out and determining whether or not to buy a game? Mine is something like this: Learn of the game Read recent threads and text reviews on BGG Look through/ask in this thread for opinions Watch rahdo's runthrough if he has one Watch any other YT reviews if i can tolerate them play it locally if possible (rare) Buy/Not buy it
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Jul 21, 2018 18:32
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Taear posted:I've never seen a game where you can't find the manual online. Everything's on there and that's how I always read them. the 18xx and winsome games I believe? Bodanarko posted:Tangentially related to this video topic, what steps/process does everyone use when scoping out and determining whether or not to buy a game? 1 ask this thread/discord that's it I do generally try to play the game before buying though and that's the number one reason why I don't really do Kickstarter. Bottom Liner fucked around with this message at 18:41 on Jul 21, 2018 |
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Jul 21, 2018 18:36
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Bodanarko posted:Tangentially related to this video topic, what steps/process does everyone use when scoping out and determining whether or not to buy a game? Same except add a penultimate step of: will this game be equal to or better* than a current game? If better, how much trouble is it worth selling the old and buying the new? * I make exceptions for midweight Euros because they’re so inoffensive but interesting enough, but I’m closing that loophole.
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Jul 21, 2018 18:40
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John Bohrer (Winsome Games) proudly displays his dad’s patent attorney number on his work and the best way to get the rules is hush hush from people you trust. Also Kickstarter Games often have no or draft rules on a time pressure product. Makes you wonder.... 
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Jul 21, 2018 18:41
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Winsome Games is everything bad about the hobby in one neat little package. It's like the other side of the CMON coin.
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Jul 21, 2018 18:50
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Unboxing Container right now. A couple of questions: 1) Lorini, do you still need a writeup for the Investment Bank, or did you find the rules for it? 2) Should I bother with the Investment Bank? I know it's there to alleviate the Death SpiralTM of the original version, but I figure if you point that out while teaching, it shouldn't be too much of an issue, and I absolutely loved the time I played the original version. 3) I got the 15 extra containers. Is the shorter game significantly different in any way other than "shorter"? 4) Why are all of the containers individually bagged?!
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Jul 21, 2018 19:06
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