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Just noticed that Crete looks like it has at least 10 or so provinces.... 
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Jul 23, 2018 15:08
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Crazycryodude posted:Just noticed that Crete looks like it has at least 10 or so provinces.... LP when
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Jul 23, 2018 15:08
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I’m surprised there are still people doing the it’s called Europa..... defense unironically
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Jul 23, 2018 15:09
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I think they should make Wiz do another Crete LP when it's released.
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Jul 23, 2018 15:10
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The Bold Kobold posted:I'm going to boycott this game until I can play Native Americans.
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Jul 23, 2018 15:11
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CharlestheHammer posted:I’m surprised there are still people doing the it’s called Europa..... defense unironically Why is it so strange that developers making a game they deliberately called Imperator Rome are focusing on areas historically strongly involved with Rome? What is the confusion in that message?
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Jul 23, 2018 15:21
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Fellblade posted:Why is it so strange that developers making a game they deliberately called Imperator Rome are focusing on areas historically strongly involved with Rome? Because a title is just a title. It has no bearing on the game itself. Like Europa Universalis hasn’t been euro centric since early three. If your gonna put something in the game flesh it out, don’t just have it exist. Do you get mad that Victoria 2 has very little focus on GB?
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Jul 23, 2018 15:26
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The title is amongst the most important things when you are releasing a game, it’s a statement of intent with regards to the market they are targeting. They are primarily targeting people who want a game based around playing as Rome as it becomes the Republican Empire. It’s not called Alexander’s Legacy or something like that, which might even have been the kind of option discussed given the time period. The fact India is in the game at all is a great thing for the exact reasons you apparently think I am railing against. I have no problem with India getting more focus, but being surprised or upset when it doesn’t get as much focus as Rome in a Roman game is pretty silly.
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Jul 23, 2018 15:36
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CharlestheHammer posted:
This is what DLCs are for my man
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Jul 23, 2018 15:38
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Ironically the screenshots show that the Greeks are getting a lot of focus despite being called Imperator. Plus it starts in the period before imperator was used weird that I thought the name was supposed to be important. It’s not it’s just a name. It’s literally meaningless.
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Jul 23, 2018 15:40
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Right, sure, and when Pdx looks at their metrics in a few years they won’t see 80% of people playing as Rome.
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Jul 23, 2018 15:42
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Senor Dog posted:This is what DLCs are for my man It should be fine on release, which it might be. We don’t know yet. You can add more in DLC but it should be perfectly fun to play in the base. My point is getting hung up on the name is dumb. Fellblade posted:Right, sure, and when Pdx looks at their metrics in a few years they won’t see 80% of people playing as Rome. There it is.
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Jul 23, 2018 15:43
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DrSunshine posted:This is the same "Name" fallacy that comes up again and again in Paradox's forums. Crusader Kings is not just about being a crusader king, and in fact some of the most fun gameplay is in the other 75% of the map. It wasn't at launch though, most of that stuff was added in expansions.
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Jul 23, 2018 15:44
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Fellblade posted:The title is amongst the most important things when you are releasing a game, it’s a statement of intent with regards to the market they are targeting. 100% it is called that because there are more people who will buy a game specifically marketed as a "Rome game" than as a "Hellenistic period game", rather than for any other reason. I am expecting the game to have a stronger focus on the Hellenistic world than on Rome simply for geopolitical reasons, though Rome will probably have an ungodly amount of unique content. Crazycryodude posted:Kinda seems like there's a weirdly large amount of wasteland, especially east of Turkey. Also yeah lol at India looking like it's getting shafted but honestly these days it would be weird if there was a Paradox game that wasn't highly Eurocentric.  Also not sure what 'these days' means as Paradox games have progressively been getting less Eurocentric, not more (the HoI series may violate this because I don't play them)
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Jul 23, 2018 15:45
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"These days" means all of Paradox history really, although yeah they've been getting better over time.
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Jul 23, 2018 15:48
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CharlestheHammer posted:Ironically the screenshots show that the Greeks are getting a lot of focus despite being called Imperator. imperator is definitely used in inscriptions of the 2nd century BC, not sure about the 3rd.
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Jul 23, 2018 15:58
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CharlestheHammer posted:There it is. ???
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Jul 23, 2018 15:59
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Astroclassicist posted:imperator is definitely used in inscriptions of the 2nd century BC, not sure about the 3rd. Imperator is used by Scipio Africans during the second Punic War. I think that is where it first started or at least the first time we know about. Records on when a term is first used aren’t exactly a thing.
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Jul 23, 2018 16:00
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My fav thing to track they level of Eurocentrisisms is to check the cultural mapmode in EUIV
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Jul 23, 2018 16:21
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That's nothing compared to Africa and Asia in V2 iirc
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Jul 23, 2018 16:50
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80% of people would play as Rome regardless of whether the game is named Caesar Simulator 2 or Ashoka's Butthole. Rome is what most westerners are most intimately familiar with in this period and so it also makes a lot of sense to market the game based on that. They haven't said it with this title (yet), but the devs have explicitly said Crusader Kings is just a name and not what the game is actually about. I expect Rome will get the most focus out of any individual region in the game (from a money-making standpoint it would be weird if it didn't) but the idea that the game is gonna be about Rome to the exclusion of other places very much goes against what Paradox devs have been saying is their philosophy for this kind of thing in recent years.
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Jul 23, 2018 16:50
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https://youtu.be/4OwN7eYZseI
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Jul 23, 2018 16:54
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i'd have a real hard time choosing between playing with ceasar stimulator 2 or ashoka's butthole
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Jul 23, 2018 16:57
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Prav posted:i'd have a real hard time choosing between playing with ceasar stimulator 2 or ashoka's butthole You Would be lost if you didn’t play Caesar stimulator 1.
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Jul 23, 2018 16:59
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CharlestheHammer posted:Because a title is just a title. It has no bearing on the game itself. Agreed, India shouldn't be in there at all.
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Jul 23, 2018 17:05
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DrSunshine posted:
That said, I don't really hold out much hope for something approaching historical accuracy on this front - Paradox seems pretty content to use province values as levers to balance their games rather than as a base which to built balancing around. Which to be fair, is probably way easier, but it essentially also leaves basic gameplay questions unanswered that end up causing problems anyway - such as the problem of snowballing and the general balance between small and large states.
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Jul 23, 2018 17:09
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If my boss came in and told me I had to work on that map I would just walk out and never return
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Jul 23, 2018 17:47
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Phlegmish posted:Agreed, India shouldn't be in there at all. Yea the game is called emperor of Rome so obviously we need to get really specific with the culture and history of pre-Gujarati India and the 50 nearly identical states in China at the time. I also think it would be really important to flesh out the Congo’s rich history during this time period since it was they who had the biggest impact to societies everywhere.
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Jul 23, 2018 18:00
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SnoochtotheNooch posted:Yea the game is called emperor of Rome so obviously we need to get really specific with the culture and history of pre-Gujarati India and the 50 nearly identical states in China at the time. I also think it would be really important to flesh out the Congo’s rich history during this time period since it was they who had the biggest impact to societies everywhere. this but unironically
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Jul 23, 2018 18:19
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Are we really still having this discussion in AVC 2771
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Jul 23, 2018 18:21
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This game is called imperator of Rome so obviously it should not have any faction but Rome. Greeks? Get the gently caress out of here. Gaul? Don’t need them. Asia Minor? The Middle East? Sorry this isnt Antiochus 2 It should just be the city of Rome that’s it.
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Jul 23, 2018 18:36
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Ms Adequate posted:Are we really still having this discussion in AVC 2771 There wasn't that much discussion, I was mainly just calling anybody who expects the same amount of detail in India as in Rome at launch a moron.
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Jul 23, 2018 18:37
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CharlestheHammer posted:This game is called imperator of Rome so obviously it should not have any faction but Rome. Why, that scarcely sounds at all like an honest representation of what anyone is saying.
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Jul 23, 2018 18:37
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Strudel Man posted:Why, that scarcely sounds at all like an honest representation of what anyone is saying. Nah that is basically the logical conclusion of that blade dudes argument. It’s not a good faith argument
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Jul 23, 2018 18:43
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Province density is deliberately skewed not because the game is focused on Rome but because paradox's dlc model is based around slightly redrawing the provinces one region at a time forever.
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Jul 23, 2018 18:46
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CharlestheHammer posted:Nah that is basically the logical conclusion of that blade dudes argument. The actual argument is that with always-limited development time, you pick a central focus for your game, and as elements get further from that center they are necessarily given less detail.
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Jul 23, 2018 18:48
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Strudel Man posted:Rather, an extension to absurdity. Yea really silly poo poo like that. It’s not a very intelligent argument mostly because it’s based on rather insane assumptions. Like the name of the game matters.
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Jul 23, 2018 18:50
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CharlestheHammer posted:Nah that is basically the logical conclusion of that blade dudes argument. What exactly do you expect to get outside of the Roman/Parthian empires? If they didn’t interact in a a meaningful way with Rome or Greece during this time period not much was recorded. And if there is a history of them then it wasn’t as colorful as the go to sources for Rome/Greeks. If anything I’d like to see varying governing systems, like nomads/republics/feudal systems in ck2. I don’t really know much/care about the raja bagpur during this time period.
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Jul 23, 2018 18:51
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SnoochtotheNooch posted:What exactly do you expect to get outside of the Roman/Parthian empires? If they didn’t interact in a a meaningful way with Rome or Greece during this time period not much was recorded. And if there is a history of them then it wasn’t as colorful as the go to sources for Rome/Greeks. If anything I’d like to see varying governing systems, like nomads/republics/feudal systems in ck2. I don’t really know much/care about the raja bagpur during this time period. We also know very little about the Parthians or even the Gauls. This is not a problem that only effects the Indians. It actually a problem for most of the factions. If you set a game in this time period you are gonna run into this issue a lot.
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Jul 23, 2018 18:54
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Sio posted:Province density is deliberately skewed not because the game is focused on Rome but because paradox's dlc model is based around slightly redrawing the provinces one region at a time forever.
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Jul 23, 2018 18:58
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