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There seems to be this sort of Lovecraftian thang to Pdox games where the more time you spend with them the more insane you get
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Jul 27, 2018 14:09
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Pacho posted:Instead of a tech tree just inventions and discoveries that pop-up and spread from province to province. Invention chance depends on literacy/education/infraestructure, some inventions are pre-requisite for the next. So, a mix of current EU4 and Stellaris While probably realistic, we need to get in the spirit of Paradox 2.0 and have countries bid for inventions using monarch points a la papal control.
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Jul 27, 2018 14:28
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Morrow posted:While probably realistic, we need to get in the spirit of Paradox 2.0 and have countries bid for inventions using monarch points a la papal control.
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Jul 27, 2018 16:03
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Morrow posted:While probably realistic, we need to get in the spirit of Paradox 2.0 and have countries bid for inventions using monarch points a la papal control. You thought I meant I'd actually give you 50,000 monarch points? That was just American Humor
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Jul 27, 2018 16:40
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A major part of who adopted what technologies was down to who the elites were in a country at the time, what their vested commercial interests were, and how much legal power they had to ban technologies or grant monopolies and patents to inventors and industrialists. What I'm saying is that in order to truly simulate the industrial revolution you need a ck2-esque character system where you end up losing a war because ten years ago when you wanted to introduce railroads you couldn't because the king had invested all his money into canals.
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Jul 27, 2018 17:20
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Red Bones posted:A major part of who adopted what technologies was down to who the elites were in a country at the time, what their vested commercial interests were, and how much legal power they had to ban technologies or grant monopolies and patents to inventors and industrialists. What I'm saying is that in order to truly simulate the industrial revolution you need a ck2-esque character system where you end up losing a war because ten years ago when you wanted to introduce railroads you couldn't because the king had invested all his money into canals. On one hand, the CK2 character system is great and more games should use it. On the other, if there is any game that should support presenting systems as the faceless, characterless product of incentives rather than the result of specific actors, it's one representing the Industrial Revolution.
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Jul 27, 2018 17:23
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Jazerus posted:you guys do know that rome literally owned a little trading town in south india right? They didn't. quote:and that every emperor from augustus until the crisis of the third century sent enormous annual trade fleets from the red sea to india? quote:india was not a huge mystery to the romans in the way that china was, although the upper class doesn't seem to have been enthusiastic about going on these voyages so we don't have detailed accounts China wasn't that much of a mystery to India either, in fact, seems bizarre not to include south east Asia and how important it was to India.
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Jul 27, 2018 18:06
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Why would you try and start this back up
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Jul 27, 2018 18:10
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Seems bizarre how back in the day people would go berzerk if their tiny nation states' ancient representative wasn't fully described in complete detail in a paradox game, now we've sweved the other way around and if you're not giving the kashmir area a billion provinces to exemplify how incredible it was you're being eurocentric. Just make a goddamn good game about rome and the politics of the mediteranean all the way east of Alexander's conquests + western India. Hell, you could just make a game centered on the Latium area and then expand from there. Just don't repeat the absolutely awful previous experience and don't fall into the "we need to have every post code as a province" logic of HoI that makes the game 1) god ugly and 2) mandatory to forteit control to the AI because you can't be bothered to have your armies cross forty regions to go from Ravena to Mediolanum CharlestheHammer posted:Why would you try and start this back up It's a free country
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Jul 27, 2018 18:12
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They should just include the whole world so I can play as a band of struggling Paracas farmers.
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Jul 27, 2018 18:18
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If I can't play as a Native American tribe that may someday get to trade for a piece of Roman pottery that has been steadily traded further north over several centuries from a single Roman trading vessel that got lost in the Atlantic and marooned in Brazil, then what is even the point of making a Rome game?
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Jul 27, 2018 18:21
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I honest to god want to play as a minor Nervii tribe of 600 people who just migrates from one place to another and maybe after 150 years of gametime i can settle on northern italy and establish a 3k pop tribe who can provide trusted auxiliaries to the rising roman republic.
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Jul 27, 2018 18:21
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Mans posted:Seems bizarre how back in the day people would go berzerk if their tiny nation states' ancient representative wasn't fully described in complete detail in a paradox game, now we've sweved the other way around and if you're not giving the kashmir area a billion provinces to exemplify how incredible it was you're being eurocentric. That seems like a horrible mischaracterization of people’s argument.
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Jul 27, 2018 18:22
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Did you all know that, in vicky 2, you can conquer large unlanded states by releasing them as an OPM from the holding country, getting a conquer cb while doing a second war to free their cores, and then accepting the peace for conquest a day after you give them all their cores back? No? Did you know that you can bootstrap assimilation by forcibly deindustrializing areas such that there are 0 craftsmen pops, then closing down factories in a majority accepted pop area such that unemployment pushes them to move to these deindustrialized areas? After that you just build factories there, and the wrong culture pops will become good ol accepted pops when they promote to craftsmen! Nifty, huh? Good way to show the brits how you felt about 1812 if ya ask me.
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Jul 27, 2018 18:36
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When will Paradox finally make Empire Earth: The Grand Strategy Version?ThatBasqueGuy posted:Did you all know that, in vicky 2, you can conquer large unlanded states by releasing them as an OPM from the holding country, getting a conquer cb while doing a second war to free their cores, and then accepting the peace for conquest a day after you give them all their cores back? No? Does the culture thing work reliably though? I've had games as the USA in Ultimate where I had 0 accepted culture bureaucrats in a province and it somehow made all the immigrants flip to soldier upon culture conversion. Having a country with >50% soldier POPs is less fun than it sounds.
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Jul 27, 2018 19:41
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But I thought most people liked playing as Prussia 
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Jul 27, 2018 19:43
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ThatBasqueGuy posted:Did you all know that, in vicky 2, you can conquer large unlanded states by releasing them as an OPM from the holding country, getting a conquer cb while doing a second war to free their cores, and then accepting the peace for conquest a day after you give them all their cores back? No?
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Jul 27, 2018 20:12
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Strudel Man posted:Know that, hell, I don't even understand it. Force Uk to release Canda as an OPM. Justify a conquest on Canada, then justify a "liberate country" cb on UK. Declare war on both, full occupy canada while you fight the UK. Win the war with the UK, and stagger your peace requests just enough so that you can fufil the conquest CB before it becomes invalidated by canada not being an OPM. Sorry if it was unclear, low sleep GrossMurpel posted:When will Paradox finally make Empire Earth: The Grand Strategy Version? It does from what I can tell, but yeah there's nothing stopping the underlying mechanic (pops natural tendency to consolidate rather than split to save performance) from doing the same to other pop types given that there isn't one of that culture. The craftsmen one has been pretty consistent from my recent experiences trying to game it, but I'm not exactly sure what makes a pop feel it's acceptable to make its own classification vs promote into an existing one, esp for non-craftsmen. This is more for nations that aren't in New World/Oceania and don't get the huge flat bonus to assimilation to zapp their pops, although it can be used to augment it or to get rid of other nonaccepteds that have cores for whatever reason (Anglo-Canadian, Mexican, Cherokee, Caribeno, etc..) ThatBasqueGuy fucked around with this message at 20:44 on Jul 27, 2018 |
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Jul 27, 2018 20:41
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Did anyone ever figure out a way to give rebels some level of tech advancements so they don't get totally massacred after about 1860? I kind of feel like I once played a mod that did that but 
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Jul 27, 2018 21:12
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Just tech wouldn't be enough, they'd need fucktons of artillery to be competitive at all. Revolts are silly anyway. On one hand you have giant revolutions that should be nation-ending civil wars or wars for independence simply because hundreds of thousands of people rose up, but you just crush them within a month. On the other hand, I doubt most of the revolutions of 1848 consisted of rebels raising an army and fighting in a field battle.
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Jul 27, 2018 22:05
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ThatBasqueGuy posted:Force Uk to release Canda as an OPM. Justify a conquest on Canada, then justify a "liberate country" cb on UK. Declare war on both, full occupy canada while you fight the UK. Win the war with the UK, and stagger your peace requests just enough so that you can fufil the conquest CB before it becomes invalidated by canada not being an OPM. Sorry if it was unclear, low sleep As long as you start the conquest war before the CB becomes invalid you should be ok. I've used that exploit to get an extra state from Ethiopia when they declare war on Egypt for Eritrea. Since Egypt usually loses all their soldiers to the Ottomans Ethiopia won't have any trouble winning the war and they often take Sudan in addition to their original target bringing them above the state limit for protectorate/unciv conquest.
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Jul 27, 2018 22:44
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I've seen a couple mods do that, I believe HFM does as well. Think I've seen rebels with some arty as well, but I couldn't tell you if they spawned or were flipped from my standing army of only arty.
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Jul 27, 2018 22:48
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GrossMurpel posted:Just tech wouldn't be enough, they'd need fucktons of artillery to be competitive at all. Mans posted:They didn't. How mad are you that your side of the argument got humiliated out of the thread?
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Jul 27, 2018 23:06
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Nah, as always Mans is right.
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Jul 27, 2018 23:16
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Mans has never been right. But he is always angry.
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Jul 27, 2018 23:22
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Beamed posted:
gently caress off with this poo poo
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Jul 27, 2018 23:27
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ThatBasqueGuy posted:I've seen a couple mods do that, I believe HFM does as well. Think I've seen rebels with some arty as well, but I couldn't tell you if they spawned or were flipped from my standing army of only arty. The likelihood of seeing unit types appear depends on what pop the rebel is being drawn from. The only pops that can become artillery are capitalists, officers, or soldiers, and the odds are pretty low (10% for capitalists, 1.2% for officers or soldiers, according to the wiki). So certain rebel types you won't see artillery at all just because those pops aren't drawn to their ideologies, and even a rebellion that was made up exclusively of those pop types would still only have 1 artillery for every other 9 units, tops. I feel like what would be interesting is if pops could contribute cash to rebellions rather than just bodies - the number of people that join up to fight would determine the number of units spawned, and the amount of cash dedicated to the cause would determine the quality of those units - basically, they'd try to buy and stockpile goods off the market to produce the best units they can afford for the amount of manpower they have (with attention paid to getting a good mix of artillery/cavalry/infantry if they're able). This could also allow other nations to covertly fund rebel groups, so even a rebellion that's mostly made up of the lower classes could still be dangerous if it's being supported by a rich nation.
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Jul 28, 2018 00:14
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Magissima posted:But I thought most people liked playing as Prussia Prussia/Nazi fetishism makes it too squicky for me. I will also never play the Confederacy in any game ever, under any circumstances. Period. No exceptions. I'll play Nazi Germany before the CSA. Which is weird and illogical, because the Nazi's were definitely 'worse', but I have this utter, visceral, gut loathing of the CSA which goes beyond logic. I won't play mean ideologies in Stellaris either. It's pretty much rogue caretakers, egalitarianism, and xenophiles, with mix of materialism or spiritual depending on mood. I can't even pick mean dialogue in rpgs. 
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Jul 28, 2018 02:05
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I'm the same and really don't like playing historical bad guy nations but then in Stellaris I'm all Devouring Swarms and Exterminators and brutal slavers all the time.
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Jul 28, 2018 02:44
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Fintilgin posted:I can't even pick mean dialogue in rpgs.  I could never bear to do the bad karma options in Fallout 3. It always made me feel really bad. 
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Jul 28, 2018 05:00
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DrSunshine posted:
Same until I lived in a crappy town of 250, now I nuke megaton whenever possible
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Jul 28, 2018 05:04
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Just lol if you don't roleplay a lunatic tyrannical devil-worshipping mass-murderer every time you play CK2. CK2 doesn't even go far enough. I want to build forests of thousands of impaled corpses like Vlad Dracula.
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Jul 28, 2018 06:00
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Kenzie posted:Just lol if you don't roleplay a lunatic tyrannical devil-worshipping mass-murderer every time you play CK2. CK2 doesn't even go far enough. I want to build forests of thousands of impaled corpses like Vlad Dracula. You totally can, though, it just ends up being EXTREMELY tedious, as you methodically click "Pillage Holding" again and again and again...
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Jul 28, 2018 06:13
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I pretty much never play evil characters in RPGs, but in grand strategy games I'll play whichever nation looks interesting. I guess it's like that quote attributed to Stalin. I don't really get why you wouldn't want to play Prussia, anyway. They were aggressive and expansionistic, but not particularly 'evil' by the standards of their time. That said, I've never played as Nazi Germany in HoI, but that's just because it's too obvious a choice. For the same reason, I've never played the UK in Vicky.
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Jul 28, 2018 08:28
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Beamed posted:
Phlegmish posted:Nah, as always Mans is right. Thank you. We're the last of our kind.
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Jul 28, 2018 09:22
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Beamed posted:How mad are you that your side of the argument got humiliated out of the thread? I think I was on that side so for clarification I went to bed because I couldn't tell what was even being discussed any more and I had to get up for work. That said starting it up again like 3 pages later is dumb.
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Jul 28, 2018 12:44
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Fintilgin posted:Prussia/Nazi fetishism makes it too squicky for me. How does that work? I can understand wanting to play a nice guy in RPGs but what the gently caress does "Nazi fetishism" have to do with your playthrough of V2? I can understand not wanting to play Nazi Germany because of the ideology too, but this is weird. Where's the difference in being expansionist as France or Prussia or UK or Russia? How in the world is it possible that some idiot liking Prussia because of Nazism has any influence on what you play? How does that make Prussia "squicky"? How can meta knowledge of what people like to play a nation possibly have any impact on how you feel about the nation? To accurately summarize my feelings: 
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Jul 28, 2018 12:55
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I refuse to play the US in Vicky because of their treatment of immigrants under Trump.
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Jul 28, 2018 13:02
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Mans posted:I literally never heard of you and i have no idea what you're saying. I didn’t think people did this unironically anymore. It’s kind of sad.
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Jul 28, 2018 14:23
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BabyFur Denny posted:I refuse to play the US in Vicky because of their treatment of immigrants under Trump. I mean you joke but I would totally understand if someone didn't want to play the US because of the literal trail of tears decision.
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Jul 28, 2018 15:24
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