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C-Euro posted:I forgot that Wizards was planning to do away with general Masters sets and start doing themed ones instead, that seems like a bad move if you're worried about sustained interest in Masters sets. Agreed. Imagine how much Bloodghast would be today without IMA, or Vials. Thoughtseize with original art, Glimpse the Unthinkable, Cryptic, O-Stone, Canopy, Grove, Bauble, KOTR, Ancestral Vision...there is a shitload of modern playable stuff in there. The mythic slots have all the EDH stuff like Avacyn, The Praetors, Necro, and the first Flusterstorm reprint...isn't that what these masters sets should be?
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Aug 14, 2018 03:35
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GoutPatrol posted:Agreed. Imagine how much Bloodghast would be today without IMA, or Vials. Thoughtseize with original art, Glimpse the Unthinkable, Cryptic, O-Stone, Canopy, Grove, Bauble, KOTR, Ancestral Vision...there is a shitload of modern playable stuff in there. The mythic slots have all the EDH stuff like Avacyn, The Praetors, Necro, and the first Flusterstorm reprint...isn't that what these masters sets should be? Flusterstorm was rare!  They could've totally printed it at mythic though and we all would have just shrugged. Agreed that valuable stuff should be at rare and big flashy stuff should be mythic but that's a trend that's going to be very tough to buck considering other Masters sets (and regular sets in many cases)
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Aug 14, 2018 03:45
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C-Euro posted:I forgot that Wizards was planning to do away with general Masters sets and start doing themed ones instead, that seems like a bad move if you're worried about sustained interest in Masters sets. The biggest problem with IMA wasn't the content (although some people were upset that after prices dropped, the value in the set wasn't very high, but that's stupid because the whole point is to lower prices). The problem was marketing related. Players assumed that "iconic" masters meant that they were reprinting the most iconic cards from old sets. This was reinforced by Imperial Recruiter and Mana Drain being spoiled early. Turns out, they meant "iconic" as in "iconic creature types." I literally thought that was a joke, but MaRo gave that as a straight answer on his blog.
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Aug 14, 2018 03:46
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wotc love weasel words
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Aug 14, 2018 04:09
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C-Euro posted:So Modern has gotten a lot more expensive in 2018. I don't quite agree with everything in this article but you'll never guess what the solution is to constantly increasing Modern prices. I'm the %9223 price increase for Goblin lore.
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Aug 14, 2018 04:14
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It didn't have Force of Nature or Leviathan of Shivan Dragon and a lot of the cards had bad new art. Wtf do I want to see some red tornado when I can see some sick jellyfish?!
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Aug 14, 2018 04:15
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ShadeofBlue posted:The biggest problem with IMA wasn't the content (although some people were upset that after prices dropped, the value in the set wasn't very high, but that's stupid because the whole point is to lower prices). The problem was marketing related. Players assumed that "iconic" masters meant that they were reprinting the most iconic cards from old sets. This was reinforced by Imperial Recruiter and Mana Drain being spoiled early. Turns out, they meant "iconic" as in "iconic creature types." I literally thought that was a joke, but MaRo gave that as a straight answer on his blog. Iconic Masters was a hilarious joke and an surprisingly good draft format if you didn't have to play triple price to pay into one, but nobody is going to give like the next three Masters set the light of day now unless they reprint Tabernacle or something after that one.
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Aug 14, 2018 04:42
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wotc will never help drop the cost of modern or legacy with their "masters" sets, since the cost of packs / printing cards is static, dropping the cost of entry into older formats only hurts their bottom line; if you help drop prices too much people arent gonna spend thirty dollars on drafts. if your masters sets sucks you eventually print a decent one again and people are going to keep spending thirty dollars on a draft. the excuse to print chaff because they're supposed to be competitive draftable sets just helps that bottom line too. this is all way more cynical than people generally assume.
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Aug 14, 2018 04:45
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Why is Karn liberated not banned? The restart the game stuff seems like the kind of mechanic that would be awful for tournament play. Isn't expected that if you're in a position to use it you're already far ahead enough that it would be bad?
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Aug 14, 2018 07:04
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It's not "restart the game", it's "restart the game and you get a whole bunch of extra stuff that all but ensures you'll win it".
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Aug 14, 2018 07:10
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ilmucche posted:Why is Karn liberated not banned? The restart the game stuff seems like the kind of mechanic that would be awful for tournament play. Isn't expected that if you're in a position to use it you're already far ahead enough that it would be bad? More or less. If you're in the position where you're going to get real equity out of the game reset with Karn, you're probably already somewhere between 'ahead' and 'really ahead' anyways and popping the reset is pointless. And on the fringe case where you're going to get an advantage you don't already have (somehow) on a Karn that's managed to reach +14, it's... probably not going to be a long game.
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Aug 14, 2018 07:20
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precision posted:You're not wrong, but none of that is an excuse for what happened to me (and apparently happens reliably whenever anyone casts a second Nexus). Yeah, this is fair and true but lol wotc digital BaronVonVaderham posted:In my case it was day 2 of a GP and I had a legitimate shot at top 8 still, so I had every reason to not concede Oh yeah,I wouldn't concede day 2 of a gp either there, totally changes the cost benefit calculation.
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Aug 14, 2018 07:25
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GoutPatrol posted:Agreed. Imagine how much Bloodghast would be today without IMA, or Vials. Thoughtseize with original art, Glimpse the Unthinkable, Cryptic, O-Stone, Canopy, Grove, Bauble, KOTR, Ancestral Vision...there is a shitload of modern playable stuff in there. The mythic slots have all the EDH stuff like Avacyn, The Praetors, Necro, and the first Flusterstorm reprint...isn't that what these masters sets should be? Primeval Titan was reprinted at mythic and despite that being the fourth non-promotional printing, I imagine that it helped a little bit. I also like it when uncommons like Swords to Plowshares, Electrolyze, and Lightning Helix make it in. Reprints of Serra Ascendant, Archangel of Thune, Auriok Champion, Magus of the Moon, Lotus Cobra, Obstinate Baloth, Glimpse the Unthinkable, and Mishra's Bauble were all appreciated. But any reprint set that goes earlier than Mercadian Masques is going to be a complete letdown because of the reserved list. I know that I was a defender of Masters 25, but that was a really weak set in the end.
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Aug 14, 2018 07:26
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If you skipped the comments section of that SO article I'd advise going back, it's a salt mine of the highest quality.SaltyBoi posted:Why everyone has the fixation that new players should be able to afford to build any modern deck at low cost? It cost me thousands over 17y of playing to have enough cards to build most modern decks: why a new player would be warranted the same at a fraction of the price and time? Because otherwise they can’t play the format? Well, let that be: what’s the downside? AceClown fucked around with this message at 08:41 on Aug 14, 2018 |
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Aug 14, 2018 08:39
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Good ol' gently caress You, Got Mine mentality. Some idiots would rather keep their thousands of dollars in MTG cards in their closet rather than have card prices be affordable enough that they can have opponents to play with.C-Euro posted:I forgot that Wizards was planning to do away with general Masters sets and start doing themed ones instead, that seems like a bad move if you're worried about sustained interest in Masters sets. Iconic Masters was a huge disappointment, since if you compare it to Modern Masters 2017 the reprints of high demand cards are kind of a huge downgrade. The theme of "iconic creature types" was a joke. Then Masters 25 came out and was total garbage, so Iconic Masters looks a lot better in comparison. In hindsight yeah Iconic Masters helped drop prices on lots of medium-demand/low-supply cards and that's cool, but boxes ended up going for like $130 or something, and that's just such a huge discount on MSRP that I'm assuming LGSes weren't particularly happy about it. It's real hard to justify paying $30 for an IMA draft. If Iconic Masters was a $4 a pack set, it'd have been a mild hit. ilmucche posted:Why is Karn liberated not banned? The restart the game stuff seems like the kind of mechanic that would be awful for tournament play. Isn't expected that if you're in a position to use it you're already far ahead enough that it would be bad? If you play first on the restarted turn, the creatures you start with aren't affected by summoning sickness. Generally that means the opponent is starting far behind, and might actually just be dead in 1-3 turns.
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Aug 14, 2018 10:39
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AceClown posted:If you skipped the comments section of that SO article I'd advise going back, it's a salt mine of the highest quality. Someone give that loving loser a swirly, please.
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Aug 14, 2018 10:47
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AceClown posted:If you skipped the comments section of that SO article I'd advise going back, it's a salt mine of the highest quality. It's pretty impressive that that guy spent 17 years spending money on a format that has only existed for 7 years, with cards that go back 15 years.
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Aug 14, 2018 12:09
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Lone Goat posted:It's pretty impressive that that guy spent 17 years spending money on a format that has only existed for 7 years, with cards that go back 15 years. Bought a dozen boxes of Onslaught before realizing he's made a terrible mistake.
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Aug 14, 2018 13:59
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ilmucche posted:Why is Karn liberated not banned? The restart the game stuff seems like the kind of mechanic that would be awful for tournament play. Isn't expected that if you're in a position to use it you're already far ahead enough that it would be bad? I've watched a lot of coverage with Karn, and I think I've seen it restart a game... once If your opponent can't attack it down you would probably rather use its minus to exile something. If you're worried about them blowing it up with something else - they probably would have done it already if they could. So unless you see an infinite combo coming or you're super low on life and worried about a lightning bolt off the top, you're happy with the incremental value of exiling a card from hand, the exiling a permanent for the rest of the game
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Aug 14, 2018 14:20
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hey guys remember brawl wizards wants you to remember brawl https://magic.wizards.com/en/articles/archive/feature/announcing-brawl-championship-2018-08-14
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Aug 14, 2018 16:12
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excellent idea for the casual format, a competitive tournament with a huge prize!
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Aug 14, 2018 16:16
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Gavin's "data shows that the number of Brawl events being run in stores is growing over time." Maybe he meant cumulatively?
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Aug 14, 2018 16:16
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Elyv posted:hey guys remember brawl But lets not make putting it in our flagship new digital product a priority where it would be a perfect fit for our vision of the economy.
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Aug 14, 2018 16:18
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Isn't brawl the format nobody showed up for at a GP recently?
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Aug 14, 2018 16:20
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Sickening posted:Isn't brawl the format nobody showed up for at a GP recently? Somewhere in Europe, Spain I think.
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Aug 14, 2018 16:21
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Sickening posted:Isn't brawl the format nobody showed up for at a GP recently? Meet the current Brawl champion: https://twitter.com/untapnl/status/1012749398022000641
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Aug 14, 2018 16:26
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Why doesn't Grove of the Burnwillows see more play?
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Aug 14, 2018 16:30
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precision posted:Why doesn't Grove of the Burnwillows see more play? Because punishing fire is banned in modern.
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Aug 14, 2018 16:31
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Because red is a bad color now that the creatures in the format are all 0-1 mana X/4s and 5s so there's no reason to splash it in Tron.
suicidesteve fucked around with this message at 17:05 on Aug 14, 2018 |
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Aug 14, 2018 17:02
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suicidesteve posted:Because red is a bad color now that the creatures in the format are all 0-1 mana X/4s and 5s so there's no reason to splash it in Tron. Faithless looting both exists and is one of the best cards in the format. Its even one of best enablers for said x/4s and ×/5s. Red is currently played in several top decks because of this. The real bad color right now is green which had been reduced to a splash color for the colorless decks that want ancient stirrings, and decks that want noble hierarch.
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Aug 14, 2018 17:08
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Grove of the Burnwillows is a good card if you are playing a RG deck that doesn't care about your opponent's life total or are playing RG Eldrazi(because then it's a triland). Both of those things exist, but neither is particularly common.
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Aug 14, 2018 17:10
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red is a bad color because snapcaster mage
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Aug 14, 2018 17:15
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AnEdgelord posted:Faithless looting both exists and is one of the best cards in the format. Its even one of best enablers for said x/4s and ×/5s. Fine. Red is a bad color for controlling the board which used to be its entire purpose in RG Tron and UWR Control. Now that it can't do that because Wizards just loves their cost reduction mechanics it is no longer a good splash for the purposes of surviving the early game.
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Aug 14, 2018 17:19
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dammit I hate brawl but I want that Adelitz playmat
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Aug 14, 2018 17:47
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Elyv posted:Grove of the Burnwillows is a good card if you are playing a RG deck that doesn't care about your opponent's life total or are playing RG Eldrazi(because then it's a triland). Both of those things exist, but neither is particularly common. Well I mean, most people consider losing 1 or 2 life to crack fetches to be incidental enough to not matter, so a land that always ETB untapped, always taps for 1 with no downside, and can always tap for one of two colors the turn it comes down... seems pretty drat great for the downside of "you might give your opponent 1 or 2 life over the course of the game". I'd just never seen the card before today and was amazed I've never seen it played. Maybe a better question would be, if there was a land for every color pairing that did the same thing, wouldn't they be considered anywhere from "insanely good" to "insanely insanely good"? TheTofuShop posted:dammit I hate brawl but I want that Adelitz playmat I'm still not clear on what Brawl even is.
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Aug 14, 2018 17:53
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precision posted:I'm still not clear on what Brawl even is. 60 card singleton EDH with only Standard legal cards.
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Aug 14, 2018 17:55
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Rinkles posted:Gavin's "data shows that the number of Brawl events being run in stores is growing over time." I'm sure he had a very specific cutoff date, say a month or two after it was introduced, where it could only be shown to have grown It seems like an easy thing to fudge anyhow
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Aug 14, 2018 17:55
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seeing as how the data he's using can't be legally acquired by literally anyone outside of wotc he could just be 100% lying, it's kind of irrelevant whatever his number fudging is
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Aug 14, 2018 18:00
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precision posted:Well I mean, most people consider losing 1 or 2 life to crack fetches to be incidental enough to not matter, so a land that always ETB untapped, always taps for 1 with no downside, and can always tap for one of two colors the turn it comes down... seems pretty drat great for the downside of "you might give your opponent 1 or 2 life over the course of the game". Grove used to be a $45 card. It since saw a reprint and also the main deck that was using it had to adapt to the metagame and the red splash stopped being worth it. The only other RG decks in the format are RG eldrazi, which still uses 4 because it's a triland. Jund doesn't want it because it already has a pretty aces manabase and doesn't need it. It's used in legacy because of punishing fire, which is banned in modern because grove exists. Any other RG decks would be zoo style decks that really don't want their opponent to gain 1-4 life off of them. There may come a day again where tron wants the red splash and plays it again. If it was in other colors there is a chance they would get used, but probably only about as much as much of a chance as grove already is.
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Aug 14, 2018 18:07
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precision posted:Well I mean, most people consider losing 1 or 2 life to crack fetches to be incidental enough to not matter, so a land that always ETB untapped, always taps for 1 with no downside, and can always tap for one of two colors the turn it comes down... seems pretty drat great for the downside of "you might give your opponent 1 or 2 life over the course of the game". There's also a full double cycle of painlands, such as Karplusan Forest. Karplusan Forest is probably better than Stomping Ground if you're not playing with fetches, but who does that? The blue ones, especially the blue white one, would be extremely strong because the decks in those colors are less likely to care about the opponent's life total.
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Aug 14, 2018 18:18
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