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Pound_Coin posted:You friend is talking massive amounts of poo poo. The UK has far more worker protections than even the best states in the US, including legally mandated sick leave, holiday pay, maternal leave etc, Compare this to the US where you don't have "workers rights" you have "right to work" states where you can be let go at any time for any reason and they don't even have to tell you. I think said friend had the same weird blindness a lot of Americans have where they think that Europe (or at least the UK) must have the same or worse terrible employment system we do, or for every thing they have that's better there's a "cost of living" shift that renders it null, or something like that. It's some kind of weird subconscious American exceptionalism that tons of people have and it's super annoying to deal with.
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Aug 20, 2018 16:10
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I've heard bizarre poo poo like "Well sure they have healthcare and maternity leave but I heard eggs cost twice as much so really they're not any better than here" a depressing number of times.
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Aug 20, 2018 16:12
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spacetoaster posted:I was at the black sea drinking a beer when I heard a drum playing and someone, in bad russian, chanting about earth/fire/water. Going for central Asia Russia as a proof Europe is hosed up is kind of cheating, might as well call North America communist because of Cuba. Regardless, unless one of the black guys was shot by a cop afterwards and the other put into re-educational work training in a state facility I can't really think more harshly about this fringe-euro place you visited.
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Aug 20, 2018 16:13
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BioMe posted:Going for central Asia Russia as a proof Europe is hosed up is kind of cheating, might as well call North America communist because of Cuba. Wasn't there a big string of immigrant murders a few years ago in Germany that the authorities didn't give a poo poo about because it must just be those immigrants murdering each other, and then it turned out it was a bunch of white nationalists doing it
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Aug 20, 2018 16:18
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BioMe posted:Going for central Asia Russia as a proof Europe is hosed up is kind of cheating, might as well call North America communist because of Cuba. It was just a funny story you pedantic little poo poo. And it wasn't asia/russia. The EU has a couple of nations on the black sea and the dudes were just spouting random words. I spoke the them later in the day, when they put on some normal clothes, and they were college students just making some spending money.
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Aug 20, 2018 16:20
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ate all the Oreos posted:Wasn't there a big string of immigrant murders a few years ago in Germany that the authorities didn't give a poo poo about because it must just be those immigrants murdering each other, and then it turned out it was a bunch of white nationalists doing it Possibly, I'm not saying Europe is perfect, just that American's basking in their purely rhetorical superiority is pretty funny considering how much worse real skeletons and ongoing problem they have. spacetoaster posted:It was just a funny story you pedantic little poo poo. And it wasn't asia/russia. The EU has a couple of nations on the black sea and the dudes were just spouting random words. Sorry for not picking up on a non-sequitur then?
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Aug 20, 2018 16:25
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BioMe posted:Possibly, I'm not saying Europe is perfect, just that American's basking in their purely rhetorical superiority is pretty funny considering how much worse real skeletons and ongoing problem they have. Yeah I think everyone here recognizes that America's worse about pretty much everything than Europe 
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Aug 20, 2018 16:31
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America is better at that stick-to-itiveness 
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Aug 20, 2018 16:39
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ate all the Oreos posted:Yeah I think everyone here recognizes that America's worse about pretty much everything than Europe IDK some posters seem pretty mad about arguing against a point they definitely didn't try to make 
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Aug 20, 2018 16:40
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ate all the Oreos posted:Wasn't there a big string of immigrant murders a few years ago in Germany that the authorities didn't give a poo poo about because it must just be those immigrants murdering each other, and then it turned out it was a bunch of white nationalists doing it Yes, they were only discovered because they also killed a cop, before that it was simply the "Döner Murders". You know, because immigrants sell kebabs and are routinely shot execution-style with suppressors for no reason, must be the gangs. It's especially grievous since the age-old joke is that roughly half the neo-nazis in Germany are police informants. They also neglected to inform the vast majority of the 35,000+ people found on the various death lists discovered during the investigation, and those few they did inform weren't provided any protection whatsoever. Another guy had acquired a fake identity as a Syrian asylum seeker and was planning false flag attacks, thankfully they caught that shithead in time.
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Aug 20, 2018 16:49
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Pound_Coin posted:"right to work" states where you can be let go at any time for any reason and they don't even have to tell you. "Right-to-work" is the policy that means non-union members at a workplace do not have to pay union dues while receiving all the material benefits of being a union member (aka enforcing freeloading to bust unions).
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Aug 20, 2018 16:54
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comedyblissoption posted:"At-will employment" is the policy that lets employers fire you for any reason or no reason at all (except if it would violate federal discrimination laws, but good luck proving that). During the monthly all hands meetings at a former job, the CFO would get up and remind everyone of their at will employment status. Basically she would get up there and tell us that she could fire any of us at any time because it was "not a right to work state." This happened every single month that I worked there
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Aug 20, 2018 16:59
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Pound_Coin posted:You friend is talking massive amounts of poo poo. The UK has far more worker protections than even the best states in the US, including legally mandated sick leave, holiday pay, maternal leave etc, Compare this to the US where you don't have "workers rights" you have "right to work" states where you can be let go at any time for any reason and they don't even have to tell you. Yeah pretty much this. The idea of a minimum wage job in the US having any protections, let alone sick leave or vacation time, is pretty drat laughable. And when you say "right to work" it sounds like you're referring to "At-will employment" laws which were an amazing power move from corporations. They allow so many companies to get around basically every worker protection law that's on the books. You're disabled/non-hetero/non-white huh? Well, as long as we don't specifically ever say "You're fired because of your disability/sexuality/race" we no longer have to worry about proving otherwise, even if that's the real reason. Also as soon as you take any sick time, we'll let you go for "reasons" that we don't have to state. But hey, at least this way you worker plebs don't have to continue working at a job for 2 weeks after you announce you're leaving! What a great bargain for you commoners! Right to work laws on the other hand are just the laws that were passed in order to remove unions' abilities to get funds, thereby killing the vast majority of unions in those states.
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Aug 20, 2018 17:03
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comedyblissoption posted:"At-will employment" is the policy that lets employers fire you for any reason or no reason at all (except if it would violate federal discrimination laws, but good luck proving that). But in exchange you get the right to leave whenever you want, you can just quit any time!!!!* *If you actually do this without giving two-weeks notice you will be forever unable to use them as a reference and your new employer will probably hold it against you
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Aug 20, 2018 17:06
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Americans are getting absolutely annihilated by their corporations and it's incredibly weird that they're not causing more poo poo about it. Your work conditions are atrocious Are americans just unaware of how it SHOULD be or do they just not give a gently caress
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Aug 20, 2018 17:09
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Zzulu posted:Americans are getting absolutely annihilated by their corporations and it's incredibly weird that they're not causing more poo poo about it. Your work conditions are atrocious But my friend, have you heard about bootstraps?
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Aug 20, 2018 17:13
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Chiming in on the amazon poo poo. Did six months in BNA3 a few years ago. Had (still have) a huge beard and people on my shift called me Gandolf. It's a nightmare job, but it was fun watching the fats quit after the second day from sore feet.
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Aug 20, 2018 17:14
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Revdomezehis posted:But hey, at least this way you worker plebs don't have to continue working at a job for 2 weeks after you announce you're leaving! What a great bargain for you commoners! But also if you don't you're hosed. Just unofficially.
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Aug 20, 2018 17:14
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Also keep in mind that "At-will employment" is the default policy in all 50 states. The only time you can't be practically fired for any reason in all 50 states is if you have a labor contract stating otherwise and tiny exceptions. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/At-will_employment Typically when you're fired it's immediate. However when you are quitting, it's customary to give 2 weeks notice like a good little Obedient Worker.
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Aug 20, 2018 17:16
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Zzulu posted:Are americans just unaware of how it SHOULD be or do they just not give a gently caress Based on the stories here it sounds like they think they have it how it should be and please don't talk about other countries because it's unpatriotic, or something.
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Aug 20, 2018 17:17
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Zzulu posted:Americans are getting absolutely annihilated by their corporations and it's incredibly weird that they're not causing more poo poo about it. Your work conditions are atrocious At least they had the presence of mind to ban yellow unions many, many decades ago, I'll give them that.
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Aug 20, 2018 17:18
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Iron Crowned posted:During the monthly all hands meetings at a former job, the CFO would get up and remind everyone of their at will employment status. Basically she would get up there and tell us that she could fire any of us at any time because it was "not a right to work state." Did she have a visible erection while saying this?
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Aug 20, 2018 17:20
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Zzulu posted:Americans are getting absolutely annihilated by their corporations and it's incredibly weird that they're not causing more poo poo about it. Your work conditions are atrocious The American media is a propaganda device that does not want to inform Americans of the laws and standards regarding maternity, sickness, and vacation in other countries.
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Aug 20, 2018 17:21
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Oscar Wild posted:Did she have a visible erection while saying this? Absolutely. She was refered to around the office as "six inch clit," and the only time you ever saw her smile was the days when someone got fired.
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Aug 20, 2018 17:24
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Zzulu posted:Americans are getting absolutely annihilated by their corporations and it's incredibly weird that they're not causing more poo poo about it. Your work conditions are atrocious A bunch of people are aware of it and agitating about it but they have no platform because: comedyblissoption posted:There are multiple instances ITT of the American media celebrating people donating vacation time to coworkers for maternity or sick leave. And yet a lot of people seem to think the media has a left bias 
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Aug 20, 2018 17:28
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Also the current institutions are great at burying anyone who might be a better option, like how you've probably not heard of Pete Buttigieg despite him having a fantastic name.
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Aug 20, 2018 17:33
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comedyblissoption posted:The American media is a propaganda device that does not want to inform Americans of the laws and standards regarding maternity, sickness, and vacation in other countries. lol you're over-thinking this. Americans aren't clueless that about that fact that other countries have job security/healthcare/vacations. We aren't lied to about that. The lies are that these things come at the cost of inviting Immigrant Hordes, having grandma condemned by a Death Panel, and lazy moochers living the high life off your tax dollars.
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Aug 20, 2018 17:46
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People in the US also have this weird culture of being proud of 60-80 hour workweeks. Like it's a sign of weakness if you don't put in a bazillion hours of work/week. Seems the weirdest thing ever to be proud of, but I'm just a lazy European I guess?
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Aug 20, 2018 17:46
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Chomp8645 posted:lol you're over-thinking this. I wouldn't be so sure buddy, I've had a lot of people outright refuse to believe me when I tell them about Europe's mandatory vacation time or maternity leave. Chomp8645 posted:The lies are that these things come at the cost of inviting Immigrant Hordes, having grandma condemned by a Death Panel, and supporting lazy moochers who will crash the economy and national budget. Yeah the few people who actually know about it come back with "b-b-but cost of living is higher!" or something like that.
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Aug 20, 2018 17:48
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Calico Heart posted:So I live in the UK and only recently found out about Americans being scared to phone in sick for work or actually take the holiday time in their contract. To me, this was absolutely mind-blowing, even on a minimum wage job (I have worked my share or boring lovely jobs). I could maybe imagine phoning in and my boss being disappointed I couldn't make it in, but I can't imagine fearing for my livelihood every time I got a cold. We have a labor board but people living paycheck to paycheck can't afford to get fired then go to the labor board and wait for a dispute to resolve which will probably not end in their favor because "Right to Work" means employer can fire you for any reason except for if you are gay/black/etc (some class/group protected by law). And they'd have to be 100% morons to get caught for that considering they can just fire you without cause and that's fine so they'd have to literally in writing tell you you're being fired for being gay (or what have you). But yeah, being afraid to call in sick because of retribution either by firing or a cut in hours is a Real Thing. Many people can't afford to call in sick either, because paycheck to paycheck.
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Aug 20, 2018 17:49
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ate all the Oreos posted:I wouldn't be so sure buddy, I've had a lot of people outright refuse to believe me when I tell them about Europe's mandatory vacation time or maternity leave. A lot of people view that as Europeans being lazy and inferior to red blooded Americans!
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Aug 20, 2018 17:49
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Kazak posted:
p u r e i d e o l o g y
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Aug 20, 2018 17:50
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Iron Crowned posted:A lot of people view that as Europeans being lazy and inferior to red blooded Americans! Yeah I've heard "gosh they're on vacation again, don't they know we need to get stuff done???" as recently as two weeks ago 
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Aug 20, 2018 17:51
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comedyblissoption posted:Also keep in mind that "At-will employment" is the default policy in all 50 states. Ah yes, it appears I did confuse right to work and at will employment, ...if at will emplyoment is the default in all 50 states then workers rights in the US are actually worse than i had thought. shut up blegum posted:People in the US also have this weird culture of being proud of 60-80 hour workweeks. Like it's a sign of weakness if you don't put in a bazillion hours of work/week. Seems the weirdest thing ever to be proud of, but I'm just a lazy European I guess? https://www.gov.uk/maximum-weekly-working-hours
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Aug 20, 2018 17:52
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ate all the Oreos posted:But in exchange you get the right to leave whenever you want, you can just quit any time!!!!* I can, however, announce I'm leaving and then take any vacation days I haven't taken yet and be paid for them. I actually had a super-decent boss who when they let me go reminded me I had vacation days I hadn't taken and said there were no hard feelings if I used them up in the two-week period. Moridin920 posted:But yeah, being afraid to call in sick because of retribution either by firing or a cut in hours is a Real Thing. Many people can't afford to call in sick either, because paycheck to paycheck. Dad is American, there's a chance he coulda stayed over there instead of moving here. There but for the grace of God go I, I guess. Calico Heart has issued a correction as of 18:01 on Aug 20, 2018 |
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Aug 20, 2018 17:56
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Chomp8645 posted:lol you're over-thinking this.
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Aug 20, 2018 17:59
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 Great images everybody
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Aug 20, 2018 17:59
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Calico Heart posted:I can, however, announce I'm leaving and then take any vacation days I haven't taken yet and be paid for them. I actually had a super-decent boss who when they let me go reminded me I had vacation days I hadn't taken and said there were no hard feelings if I used them up in the two-week period. PTO isn't a legal right in the US, if you have extra PTO, they can most definitely refuse to give you those vacation days.
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Aug 20, 2018 18:02
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Iron Crowned posted:PTO isn't a legal right in the US, if you have extra PTO, they can most definitely refuse to give you those vacation days. At my last job someone did the whole "give two weeks notice then go on vacation" thing so they fired them after one day out as one last gently caress-you I guess
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Aug 20, 2018 18:03
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You know just putting myself in the mindset I think if I were loving vomiting and feeling sick as hell but knew if I phoned in my boss might fire me so I have to drive to work feeling like poo poo and spend all day in an office where my head hurts and ears are buzzing and I know I have a lovely constitution so I'll be like this all goddamn week and you tell me that in the UK you can just phone in sick and it's nbd I'd probably have to find some lie to tell myself about Europe too Iron Crowned posted:PTO isn't a legal right in the US, if you have extra PTO, they can most definitely refuse to give you those vacation days. Yeah poo poo like this would make me need to believe Europe was some kind of hellhole or I'd paint the lawn with my brains
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Aug 20, 2018 18:03
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