Thrusting my long, elegant weapon over and over again: ask me about fencing

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Ask/Tell > Thrusting my long, elegant weapon over and over again: ask me about fencing

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dupersaurus: Aug 1, 2012; Futurism was an art movement where dudes were all 'CARS ARE COOL AND THE PAST IS FOR CHUMPS. LET'S DRAW SOME CARS.'

dupersaurus fucked around with this message at 14:21 on Aug 24, 2018

# ? Aug 24, 2018 03:43

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# ? May 10, 2024 12:21

Crazy Achmed: Mar 13, 2001

Overdrift posted:

I've decided to join up with my local Epee Fencing club and they've requested that I get a glove and wire for the first year. Obviously the club sells them but I suspect they are probably pretty inflated in price. Can anyone suggest some decent fencing suppliers I could look at for this? I'm in Canada if this matters.

I don't know which fencing suppliers are convenient for delivery to Canada, but perhaps check what the prices and shipping are like from Absolute?
https://www.absolutefencinggear.com/shopping/shop.php/cPath/15

# ? Aug 25, 2018 11:46

your friend a dog: Nov 2, 2016; by Nyc_Tattoo

dupersaurus posted:

what coach would tell their students not to counter attack?

# ? Aug 26, 2018 19:37

Ravenfood: Nov 4, 2011

your friend a dog posted:

what coach would tell their students not to counter attack?

Any foil or sabre coach.

e: Under most circumstances

# ? Aug 26, 2018 19:47

BirdOfPlay: Feb 19, 2012; THUNDERDOME LOSER

Ravenfood posted:

Any foil or sabre coach.

e: Under most circumstances

Counters are discouraged because of right of way, but they are totally part of the game at all levels. Hell, based on the fencer's athleticism, body type, etc, counters could be a very large part of an individual fencer's toolbox.

That said:

your friend a dog posted:

what coach would tell their students not to counter attack?

Coaches with fat students.

# ? Aug 26, 2018 21:25

dupersaurus: Aug 1, 2012; Futurism was an art movement where dudes were all 'CARS ARE COOL AND THE PAST IS FOR CHUMPS. LET'S DRAW SOME CARS.'

Coaches with foil students that counterattack instead of having a good defense

_{Of course I don't know anything about that}

# ? Aug 26, 2018 21:29

your friend a dog: Nov 2, 2016; by Nyc_Tattoo

You defend and then counter attack. That's what a riposte is.

# ? Aug 27, 2018 06:28

Crazy Achmed: Mar 13, 2001

I don't know the terminology for other stuff, but when olympic/sportsfencerpeople say "counterattack" we mean very specifically responding to an attack with an offensive blade motion without a parry. So much fun when it goes right but equally embarrassing when it doesn't. :hf:

dupersaurus, my distance is poo poo versus flicks

Has anyone here used STM foil blades? Allstar has them on sale and I'm thinking of snapping one or two up for when my vnitis die.

Crazy Achmed fucked around with this message at 10:39 on Aug 27, 2018

# ? Aug 27, 2018 10:35

dupersaurus: Aug 1, 2012; Futurism was an art movement where dudes were all 'CARS ARE COOL AND THE PAST IS FOR CHUMPS. LET'S DRAW SOME CARS.'

Crazy Achmed posted:

Has anyone here used STM foil blades? Allstar has them on sale and I'm thinking of snapping one or two up for when my vnitis die.

I used STM before I went to vniti. They�re a lot stiffer than vnitis, if you�ve come to rely on the whippiness you�re in for a surprise.

# ? Aug 27, 2018 13:02

Crazy Achmed: Mar 13, 2001

That sounds right up my alley. Amongst my rogue's gallery of setpiece moves is "march with my tip in the air to try and trick the other person into thinking I can actually flick, into lowline thrust".

# ? Sep 2, 2018 14:13

ImplicitAssembler: Jan 24, 2013

A nice collection of ippons from the 8th dan section of the Mikasa cup
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=30ZLAkLl_wg
These guys are typically in their late 50's/early 60s.

# ? Sep 4, 2018 02:57

Lily Catts: Oct 17, 2012; Show me the way to you
(Heavy Metal)

Can anyone tell me about kendo and what it's like in general? There are a couple near my area.

# ? Sep 4, 2018 11:52

dupersaurus: Aug 1, 2012; Futurism was an art movement where dudes were all 'CARS ARE COOL AND THE PAST IS FOR CHUMPS. LET'S DRAW SOME CARS.'

Crazy Achmed posted:

That sounds right up my alley. Amongst my rogue's gallery of setpiece moves is "march with my tip in the air to try and trick the other person into thinking I can actually flick, into lowline thrust".

Get one and try it out before going all-in, you might be surprised how much you actually make use of the whip.

# ? Sep 4, 2018 13:56

Cephas: May 11, 2009; Humanity's real enemy is me!
Hya hya foowah!

Schneider Heim posted:

Can anyone tell me about kendo and what it's like in general? There are a couple near my area.

I did it for a couple months before medical stuff got in the way, enough to get to put on a gi but not enough to start sparring, so I can tell you a bit about the basics at most.

You train mostly with a shinai, which is made of segmented pieces of bamboo so that it has some flexibility. There is a bit of kata that you practice with a bokken (basically a katana except made out of a solid piece of polished wood). Compared to something like karate, where the kata are these very elaborate sequences of movements, kata in kendo is extremely practical--stuff like "I strike at your head, you sidestep and counter with a strike to my abdomen. Okay on to the next kata."

Most of the early training is based on getting your footwork down and on learning to hold the sword without tensing your body up. You learn to swing loose instead of of muscling through your strikes.

There is a lot of sparring, maybe 1/4 to 1/2 of a training period at the place I went to. You put on the armor and have a couple minutes with a partner before switching off. I never did this part. Until you get to wear armor yourself, you can still practice sparring against others who have their armor and they won't strike you, they'll just defend or give you targets to hit.

The thing in kendo is that there are only 4 attacks--head, wrist, abdomen, and throat (and attacks to the throat are considered a more advanced technique that you don't use as often). So there's a ton of repetition, practicing these moves over and over again to get them as close to perfect as possible. The complexity of the martial art comes from a thousand little things that make a difference, from your spacing to how aggressive you are to the subtle ways you tilt your blade to block off angles of attack.

The other major thing in kendo is that it's very uniform. An attack scores a point if a judge deems it does. That means your posture, attack form, follow-through, and shout (there's a lot of shouting) have to fit the kendo style. More than any other martial art I've tried, kendo is very formal. Lots of bowing, drawing the sword in a certain way, putting down the sword a certain way, and so on. The kendo uniform also takes above average amounts of effort to take care of, because the hakama is pleated and because it often is made with indigo dye that takes some tlc.

That said, it's a load of fun and I'd go back to it if I had a good opportunity to. There's nothing quite like the feeling of swinging a kendo sword. At the same time, I think the first thing any kendo club tells people is that it's not like a samurai movie, you aren't going to learn to do awesome flashy attacks. The kendoka I've met have no delusions about being samurai, but they do take kendo training pretty seriously because it takes a lot of mental and physical discipline and has competition built into its core so that there's little room for ego.

# ? Sep 4, 2018 14:09

ImplicitAssembler: Jan 24, 2013

Schneider Heim posted:

Can anyone tell me about kendo and what it's like in general? There are a couple near my area.

Cephas probably has a better perspective than me, as I started some 18 years ago

.

I will say that it's much more than just a 'sport'. While competitions will certainly be a major factor in many clubs, it stretches way beyond that.

In short:
- The etiquette can seem excessive (and some clubs do go a little overboard), but it'll become second nature soon enough.
- It can take anywhere from 6-12 months to get into armour (depending on club). University clubs will typically put you in gear much earlier.
- Shinai's are considered disposable. A basic one will cost ~$30. Depending on style of practice, etc, they can last as little as a month, mine tend to last 3-4 months. If you buy 3-4 at a time, you can swap out broken slats and extend their lifespan, if you are on a budget.
- Uniform will be ~$200 for a decent starter set. Cheaper is available, but you'll regret it.
- Armor will be $500+. Your club should be able to help you out with type, etc, but spend as much as you can afford. My men (helmet) is 12 years old, I got a pair of kote (gloves) going on 15, but they also cost accordingly.

- Competitions, especially in North America, as an adult, can be very demoralizing, as you'll end up competing with people who started as kids...it takes quite some time to be able to 'compete'. Europe, in general, the majority will have started as adults and it's easier to see the progression you need to take.

You'll also find that you'll make friends all over the world and will be welcomed with open arms whenever you visit a place that has a kendo club.
Your partner, on the other hand, will hate you for always travelling with an additional 30lbs of luggage

# ? Sep 4, 2018 21:17

Verisimilidude: Dec 20, 2006; Strike quick and hurry at him,
not caring to hit or miss.
So that you dishonor him before the judges

https://www.oregonlive.com/portland/index.ssf/2018/09/man_stabbed_through_the_eye_by.html

quote:

A 35-year-old man who says he was stabbed in the eye by his instructor during a sword-fighting class at the Milwaukie Elks Lodge has filed a $9 million lawsuit against his instructor and the organization that offered the class.

Jeremiah DuPrau describes in his lawsuit how his life has been irreparably changed: The sword not only pierced his eye but also his brain and shattered the bones of his face.

He now is legally blind, unable to see through his right eye and retaining only some of his vision in his left, according to his attorney, John Coletti.

DuPrau�s lawsuit lists the instructor of his sword class, Jason Romandelle Brown, as a defendant along with Swordguild Portland and the Elks� Milwaukie Portland Lodge No. 142 as defendants. Brown couldn�t be reached for comment, and Swordguild Portland didn�t return a message.

Thomas Rask, a Portland attorney for the Elks lodge, declined comment Wednesday, citing the pending litigation.

DuPrau's lawyer said his client was attending his third class as a beginner student on March 9, 2017. That's when the instructor called DuPrau over to use as a prop to demonstrate a move for the rest of the class and jutted the sword into DuPrau's eye, according to the lawsuit.

Coletti said Brown didn�t warn DuPrau to put on his protective headgear and face screen beforehand.

�He�s unable to drive, unable to ride his bike, unable to hike,� Coletti said of DuPrau. �He actually had to give his dog away because he was unable to take care of it.�

DuPrau suffered a stroke after the sword entered his brain -- leaving the left side of his body partially paralyzed and making walking and balance difficult, Coletti said.

DuPrau worked as an educational aide for Portland Public Schools, Coletti said. School district officials couldn�t immediately verify whether DuPrau was back at work.

This is why you always practice with a mask

# ? Sep 6, 2018 14:40

your friend a dog: Nov 2, 2016; by Nyc_Tattoo

Yikes, how do you manage to do that. Poor guy.

# ? Sep 7, 2018 04:55

Overdrift: Jul 17, 2006; This is Fatherman! He fights crime to earn Sonboy's respect! Is it working?

I made it through my first Epee lesson, and it was pretty fun. I ended up with a pretty rough bruise on my wrist from where the weapon was digging into my hand. Is this a case of needing to toughen up or was I using the wrong sized weapon/grip?

# ? Sep 7, 2018 15:05

Crazy Achmed: Mar 13, 2001

Oh hell no, you should never sustain injuries or discomfort from just holding your weapon. What part of it is causing the problem?

# ? Sep 8, 2018 07:04

Overdrift: Jul 17, 2006; This is Fatherman! He fights crime to earn Sonboy's respect! Is it working?

I believe this is the grip I was using, and it is the tip closest to me that was digging into my palm. I'll have to do some looking around at the clubs weapons to find one that fits me better I guess.

# ? Sep 8, 2018 08:41

Siivola: Dec 23, 2012

If you have smaller hands, those things can get in the way. A couple of people at my club just hacksaw theirs down to an inch.

But if you got an actual bruise, my guess is you're death-gripping the epee real hard and need to relax. Try not to bend your wrist, it should be relaxed and neutral.

# ? Sep 8, 2018 09:38

Crazy Achmed: Mar 13, 2001

I've been told that you should hold a weapon like a small bird, tight enough that it won't escape but not so tight that you crush it.
[edit]Yeah, also there should be pretty much a straight line from your elbow to your tip. The bit that's giving you difficulty should be curving around the side of your palm and floating just next to the inside of your wrist.

# ? Sep 9, 2018 13:30

Hazzard: Mar 16, 2013

Crazy Achmed posted:

I've been told that you should hold a weapon like a small bird, tight enough that it won't escape but not so tight that you crush it

That is the only description I constantly hear about holding a sword.

Also, my club is gradually getting into smallsword. I cobbled one together from Leon Paul pieces, then we met Jerzy at Fightcamp (One of the Polish Sabre guys who is different to Marsden) and he is making modular pieces. So we're going to be getting a better hilt than a French grip.

Also, to reignite the tournament discussions. It's another way to test skill. It shouldn't be the be-all, end-all of how good you are at fencing. In more informal sparring you can discuss with your opponent how useful particular blows would be. In my experience doing broadsword vs rapier. We would talk about how good a blow is.

When we started doing benny hill as I lunged past the point of his rapier, we realised his cut to my body would probably do gently caress all. And I probably didn't have great edge alignment when hitting his arm, so when it happened again, I went for his head. Or tried to grab his arm, but grabbing his arm when you're both running is hard.

Also, as a recommendation for gloves for anyone with a basket/cup that means the opponent's blade will never touch your hand, consider a sport fencing glove. It has a little padding, so you're not going to get hurt from a blow to the basket stinging your hands, but you still have all the dexterity in your fingers for anything that requires shifting your grip, like I often do when moulinetting.

# ? Sep 13, 2018 15:10

Neon Belly: Feb 12, 2008; I need something stronger.

Penn State fencing assistant coach placed on administrative leave after sexual misconduct violations surface

quote:

Penn State fencing assistant coach George Abashidze was placed on administrative leave by the university, Penn State Intercollegiate Athletics spokesperson Jeff Nelson told The Daily Collegian.

The U.S. Center for SafeSport, a nonprofit organization seeking to end abuse within American athletics, lists sexual misconduct and sexual harassment violations under Abashidze�s name within its database of disciplinary records.

A SafeSport representative declined to provide a comment on specifics in the matter, as well as whether those violations apply to a single incident or multiple. According to the same database, the violations are not final and are subject to appeal.

�We take matters of this nature very seriously. We are aware of this situation and continue to gather information,� Nelson said.

Abashidze would have been entering his 10th year as an assistant coach with the Nittany Lions. He was previously an assistant at Ohio State.

Abashidze, who brought a bevy of international competing and coaching experience, was also suspended by USA Fencing for three years on Aug. 1, a spokesperson from USA Fencing confirmed. That suspension is also subject to appeal.

At the time of publication, Abashidze still appeared in Penn State�s directory and remained on Penn State Athletics� online fencing roster page.

# ? Sep 13, 2018 15:20

Xiahou Dun: Jul 16, 2009; We shall dive down through black abysses... and in that lair of the Deep Ones we shall dwell amidst wonder and glory forever.

Penn State again, really?

# ? Sep 13, 2018 15:42

barkbell: Apr 14, 2006; woof

Lol the sca guy meltdown

# ? Sep 13, 2018 16:01

HEY GUNS: Oct 11, 2012; FOPTIMUS PRIME

Xiahou Dun posted:

Penn State again, really?

the newest catholic thing is out of pennsylvania as well so by this point i just think the entire state should be placed on a list somewhere

# ? Sep 13, 2018 16:08

Xiahou Dun: Jul 16, 2009; We shall dive down through black abysses... and in that lair of the Deep Ones we shall dwell amidst wonder and glory forever.

Is sexual misconduct in the water like god drat Hep A?

# ? Sep 13, 2018 16:12

HEY GUNS: Oct 11, 2012; FOPTIMUS PRIME

Xiahou Dun posted:

Is sexual misconduct in the water like god drat Hep A?

pennsylvania, dude

# ? Sep 13, 2018 16:20

DandyLion: Jun 24, 2010; disrespectul Deciever

Honestly I'd be more suprised to hear that a Penn Athletic coach wasn't molesting kids......

# ? Sep 13, 2018 19:25

Xiahou Dun: Jul 16, 2009; We shall dive down through black abysses... and in that lair of the Deep Ones we shall dwell amidst wonder and glory forever.

Protip : longsword to the thumb loving hurts.

Still very happy with this hobby. Gonna buy some real hefty gloves for next time an idiot decides that their turn holding Longpoint in a practice drill is their opportunity to practice cutting hands.

This post brought to you entirely by my left hand in what I presume to be a novel reason in the history of the internet.

# ? Sep 16, 2018 02:34

P-Mack: Nov 10, 2007

Xiahou Dun posted:

Protip : longsword to the thumb loving hurts.

Still very happy with this hobby. Gonna buy some real hefty gloves for next time an idiot decides that their turn holding Longpoint in a practice drill is their opportunity to practice cutting hands.

This post brought to you entirely by my left hand in what I presume to be a novel reason in the history of the internet.

Get good gloves, it is extremely worth it.

# ? Sep 16, 2018 03:16

Xiahou Dun: Jul 16, 2009; We shall dive down through black abysses... and in that lair of the Deep Ones we shall dwell amidst wonder and glory forever.

Yeah I know. I�m just salty cause the club has loaner gloves that we weren�t wearing cause the exercise really didn�t need them and this was another student being dangerous for no reason. Like if I punched someone during a math test levels of unexpected and not needed.

Like not even salty at anyone cause the club is good intentioned and the other student is obviously dumber than a box of hair. Just generally sour.

Okay. Slightly salty at her.

# ? Sep 16, 2018 03:26

Liquid Communism: Mar 9, 2004; Out here, everything hurts.

Hands, eyes, and throat/cervical spine, man. The three things that must be properly protected if some dumbass is going to be swinging a sword near you, no matter how good their intentions. Groin is a close fourth but that won't cripple you for life.

# ? Sep 16, 2018 04:46

Crazy Achmed: Mar 13, 2001

This has come up distressingly often but do not fence/spar/practise with anyone if you are not both wearing proper protective gear, seriously

# ? Sep 17, 2018 14:31

your friend a dog: Nov 2, 2016; by Nyc_Tattoo

barkbell posted:

Lol the sca guy meltdown

guessing you're a hema guy who feels called out but doesn't have either the skill or experience to say something useful in his defense

# ? Sep 20, 2018 07:31

barkbell: Apr 14, 2006; woof

i challenge you to a duel at dawn on the hill behind the church, no seconds.

# ? Sep 20, 2018 12:48

DandyLion: Jun 24, 2010; disrespectul Deciever

Pick a place to die where its high and dry

# ? Sep 20, 2018 21:01

bessantj: Jul 27, 2004

Xiahou Dun posted:

Protip : longsword to the thumb loving hurts.

Still very happy with this hobby. Gonna buy some real hefty gloves for next time an idiot decides that their turn holding Longpoint in a practice drill is their opportunity to practice cutting hands.

This post brought to you entirely by my left hand in what I presume to be a novel reason in the history of the internet.

There's a guy in my school that broke a few fingers and both thumbs at different times because no matter how many times he was shown and we practised blocking with the blade for some reason he insisted in blocking with the grip.

# ? Sep 20, 2018 21:11

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# ? May 10, 2024 12:21

your friend a dog: Nov 2, 2016; by Nyc_Tattoo

bessantj posted:

There's a guy in my school that broke a few fingers and both thumbs at different times because no matter how many times he was shown and we practised blocking with the blade for some reason he insisted in blocking with the grip.

Don't you guys wear armored gauntlets when doing longsword?

# ? Sep 20, 2018 21:12

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Ask/Tell > Thrusting my long, elegant weapon over and over again: ask me about fencing

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