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ToxicSlurpee posted:Every single time a new edition of D&D comes out there's a holy war over it. I vaguely remember there being arguments over it when 4 was getting established, but I didn't realize SA was a focal point of the "battle" over it.
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Oct 3, 2018 02:04
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Absurd Alhazred posted:I vaguely remember there being arguments over it when 4 was getting established, but I didn't realize SA was a focal point of the "battle" over it. I don't think it actually was a major focal point but I can't help but assume there were arguments over it here. I haven't played since 3.5 so I don't even know what the rules of 4 are. I do however remember a lot of people losing their drat minds when 3 was announced before they even knew what the rules were. Then 3.5 happened and there was screeching about how it was ruining everything. Hell there are people who were losing their minds when Pathfinder came out. I heard 4 kind of sucked but have been out of the game too long to have any real opinion on 4 or 5. This sort of thing confuses me because, like...if you don't like the new edition...just don't play it?
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Oct 3, 2018 02:12
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ToxicSlurpee posted:This sort of thing confuses me because, like...if you don't like the new edition...just don't play it? Why would you do this when you can buy all of the stuff, give the people you hate money, and then bitch about it non stop for the next several years on some obscure forum. Do you even know how the internet works dumbass?
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Oct 3, 2018 02:16
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Absurd Alhazred posted:Anybody know what this is about? The short form: the Traditional Games forum on SA is extremely angry about D&D 5th Edition and very defensive of D&D 4E. Some of this is due to personal/political issues with D&D 5E (the 5E lead brought in several extremely unpleasant edition-warrior-type figures as "consultants," including one with a long history of harassment of LGBT community members who drove a trans designer/SA Tradgames poster out of the hobby entirely), some of it is complaints about game design and balance, and some of it is just pure grognardery. It's still kind of risky over there to have any anti-4E sentiment; I recently got jumped on for mentioning in the chat thread why I hadn't really liked that edition, even with tons of equivocation about it just being my own experience. Tradgames is a pretty good community for other games and elements of the hobby, but it's a pretty bad place to talk about Dungeons & Dragons. Edit, because it may need clarification: SA "lost" the edition war because D&D 5E was more like 3E than 4E, and SA is apparently the biggest 4E boosters left online? I honestly don't know that many details about this because my approach to D&D is "play it sometimes and have a fun time" Antivehicular has a new favorite as of 02:21 on Oct 3, 2018 |
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Oct 3, 2018 02:19
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It doesn’t sound like the kind of drama that makes for fun and funny reading.
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Oct 3, 2018 02:35
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Yeah when 4e came out there was almost unanimous opposition to it. Less that people didn't like it (sales wise it did well) but RPG circles online tend to embody the hardcore, and the "old guard" didnt care for it being "like WoW" (simultaneously a fair point that it did take some ideas from MMO design but also a really reductionist take). SA was the only community unanimously supporting it, a major reason being that it gave fighters something to do other than just hit stuff and pass their turn. 5th edition came and took a lot more inspiration from 2e and 3e design and TG never really got over it. They're a...passionate bunch.
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Oct 3, 2018 02:38
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El_Elegante posted:It doesn’t sound like the kind of drama that makes for fun and funny reading. I’m a big fan of nerds venting rage based on their own personal life disappointments projecting that onto how a certain race of elf is depicted so I’d be down for some of that. If it’s pages long of people clawing at each other because of a change in a spell that decreases dexterity I would probate everyone commenting on it past the third reply personally
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Oct 3, 2018 02:38
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Aesop Poprock posted:I’m a big fan of nerds venting rage based on their own personal life disappointments projecting that onto how a certain race of elf is depicted so I’d be down for some of that. If it’s pages long of people clawing at each other because of a change in a spell that decreases dexterity I would probate everyone commenting on it past the third reply personally It's the latter; the concerns are almost all mechanical. It's really, really dry and uninteresting, frankly, aside from the parts with community drama that are mostly just depressing.
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Oct 3, 2018 03:02
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El_Elegante posted:It doesn’t sound like the kind of drama that makes for fun and funny reading. Trad RPG drama is both incredibly vicious and incredibly boring to anyone who doesn't have at least a passing familiarity with the subject matter. I haven't posted on online trad game communities for a long time because edition warriors never loving die, they just vary in volume.
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Oct 3, 2018 03:07
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Antivehicular posted:The short form: the Traditional Games forum on SA is extremely angry about D&D 5th Edition and very defensive of D&D 4E. Some of this is due to personal/political issues with D&D 5E (the 5E lead brought in several extremely unpleasant edition-warrior-type figures as "consultants," including one with a long history of harassment of LGBT community members who drove a trans designer/SA Tradgames poster out of the hobby entirely), some of it is complaints about game design and balance, and some of it is just pure grognardery. It's still kind of risky over there to have any anti-4E sentiment; I recently got jumped on for mentioning in the chat thread why I hadn't really liked that edition, even with tons of equivocation about it just being my own experience. Tradgames is a pretty good community for other games and elements of the hobby, but it's a pretty bad place to talk about Dungeons & Dragons. This surprises me given that the Trad Games 5E and Pathfinder threads are both way more active than the 4E thread. There's no shortage of 5E and PF fans here. Although I guess there's a difference between visibly liking 5E/PF and visibly disliking 4E. RagnarokAngel posted:Yeah when 4e came out there was almost unanimous opposition to it. Less that people didn't like it (sales wise it did well) but RPG circles online tend to embody the hardcore, and the "old guard" didnt care for it being "like WoW" (simultaneously a fair point that it did take some ideas from MMO design but also a really reductionist take). I'm pretty sure every edition of D&D released after the first has had a loud contingent of grogs screaming that (a) it's too much like $VIDEO_GAME (4E was WoW, I think 3E was Diablo, and I'm not sure what 5E was) and (b) it's making GBS threads on Gygax's vision and/or legacy as perfectly embodied in $PREVIOUS_VERSION¹. The release of 4E seemed to generate the most screaming, though; I don't know if this is because a lot of people were really invested in 3E, or because the internet wasn't as pervasive and horrible when 3E came out. ¹ The release of 4E saw a lot of people saying this with a completely straight face, which is baffling given that Gygax had no involvement with the design of 3E and repeatedly stated his dislike of it.
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Oct 3, 2018 04:49
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Aaaahhh it’s happening in here now!! I roll a d20 for abort conversation
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Oct 3, 2018 04:54
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ToxicFrog posted:This surprises me given that the Trad Games 5E and Pathfinder threads are both way more active than the 4E thread. There's no shortage of 5E and PF fans here. Although I guess there's a difference between visibly liking 5E/PF and visibly disliking 4E. The Pathfinder/3.5 thread has people who genuinely like those systems. The 5e thread maybe has a few, but it's dominated by a circlejerk of people who vehemently hate it, which is why the problem came up in the first place.
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Oct 3, 2018 04:55
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Aesop Poprock posted:Aaaahhh it’s happening in here now!! I roll a d20 for abort conversation Ah, a Book of Vile Darkness fan, I see. 
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Oct 3, 2018 04:56
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monte cook did nothing wrong
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Oct 3, 2018 05:00
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Absurd Alhazred posted:Ah, a Book of Vile Darkness fan, I see. Wait, no, which one was the real creepy one with the sex stuff? Was that an OGL thing?
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Oct 3, 2018 05:06
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Absurd Alhazred posted:Wait, no, which one was the real creepy one with the sex stuff? Was that an OGL thing? Is it F.a.t.a.l which was on the SA main page and has a chart for how big a baby’s butthole is? (I think?) https://www.somethingawful.com/dungeons-and-dragons/fatal-worst-rpg/1/ or is it the vampire masquerade one with the strap on anal rape with blood on a urinal https://www.somethingawful.com/dungeons-and-dragons/vampire-artwork-montreal/12/
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Oct 3, 2018 05:09
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F.A.T.A.L. is the game with the infamous circumference tables and I hate the fact that I know that.
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Oct 3, 2018 05:10
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Absurd Alhazred posted:Wait, no, which one was the real creepy one with the sex stuff? Was that an OGL thing? BoVD has a bit but it's mostly glazed over with general 'pleasures of the flesh' type prose. You're probs thinking of the notorious Book of Erotic Fantasy.
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Oct 3, 2018 05:11
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Aesop Poprock posted:Is it F.a.t.a.l which was on the SA main page and has a chart for how big a baby’s butthole is? (I think?) https://www.somethingawful.com/dungeons-and-dragons/fatal-worst-rpg/1/ No, no, I remembered there was one that was more-or-less D&D compatible. It's the Book of Erotic Fantasy, it was an OGL thing. But apparently Book of Vile Darkness also has sexpest nonsense. In short, OGL was a land of contrasts. e: fb (erotically: hosed bugbear)
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Oct 3, 2018 05:11
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One big factor is that 3.5 had very permissive licensing, to the point where anyone could create adventures, character classes, rules systems etc. that were compatible with 3.5 and sell them as add-on books. After 4e came out and was radically different, the companies making these add-on books were stuck with a lot of product they were in the middle of working on that was going to be totally worthless if everyone switched to the new edition - to the point where one of the larger publishers took 3.5, made some largely superficial changes, and released it as their own system that they could use all their half-finished content with. Depending on who you ask, these publishers might have merely created a nice echo chamber to magnify anti-4e sentiment, or they might have actually astroturfed a whole bunch of it to push people away from 4e and prop up their new business. Jabor has a new favorite as of 05:17 on Oct 3, 2018 |
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Oct 3, 2018 05:12
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roll for anus diameter
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Oct 3, 2018 05:15
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Third World Reggin posted:roll for anus diameter I got a natural twenty! By the way, is it okay if I name my character Kirk?
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Oct 3, 2018 05:17
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Screaming Idiot posted:I got a natural twenty! By the way, is it okay if I name my character Kirk? “What is that man doing to his anus?” “Make a perception check.”
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Oct 3, 2018 05:25
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fool_of_sound posted:BoVD has a bit but it's mostly glazed over with general 'pleasures of the flesh' type prose. You're probs thinking of the notorious Book of Erotic Fantasy. Was that the one whose major selling point was "this literally has elf porn?" I've never even seen a copy of that in person but I remember there being a huge kerfuffle over it. WotC was apparently like "oohh nooooo somebody made a sex book as a D&D book with our official open license? WHOEVER COULD HAVE SEEN THAT COMING?!?!?" even though 2nd edition had the unofficial book of carnal knowledge. If a game exists somebody, somewhere will want to cram tits and dicks in it. In the case of the Book of Vile Darkness it did gloss over the worst of it and sometimes even went out of its way to say "by the way this is a source book for hideously evil stuff and you are a bad person if you think any of it is good. This is VILLAINOUS STUFF FOR VILLAINS. It is BAD." It also wasn't as lovingly crafted into absurd tables with all of the seriousness of F.A.T.A.L. I really very badly don't want to know what through process led to somebody making F.A.T.A.L.
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Oct 3, 2018 05:29
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Kind of a point of contention is that most of the anti-4e people have never in good faith read the books or tried to play the game and most of the common complaints about it are literally made up and easily debunked by five minutes of research, irrelevant or things that were ten times worse in the previous edition they're defending.Jabor posted:One big factor is that 3.5 had very permissive licensing, to the point where anyone could create adventures, character classes, rules systems etc. that were compatible with 3.5 and sell them as add-on books. Yeah, it's hard to exactly quantify but a lot of it was also egged on by third party publishers (mostly Paizo) pushing their own literally the-trademarked-material-filed-off system, because the open licensing for 3rd edition was hilariously poorly thought out.
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Oct 3, 2018 06:15
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ToxicSlurpee posted:Was that the one whose major selling point was "this literally has elf porn?" I've never even seen a copy of that in person but I remember there being a huge kerfuffle over it. WotC was apparently like "oohh nooooo somebody made a sex book as a D&D book with our official open license? WHOEVER COULD HAVE SEEN THAT COMING?!?!?" even though 2nd edition had the unofficial book of carnal knowledge. If a game exists somebody, somewhere will want to cram tits and dicks in it. FATAL is basically borderline outsider art, generally held as infamously hilariously horrible because it embodies seemingly every worst possible aspect of RPG design and writing, and has probably never been played in good faith by anyone except maybe its creator. (in part because it's so amazingly poorly designed it's impossible to play)
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Oct 3, 2018 06:16
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fuckin' nerds give yourselves a massive swirly
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Oct 3, 2018 09:42
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Weatherman posted:fuckin' nerds Go burn down a city about it
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Oct 3, 2018 11:34
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Absurd Alhazred posted:Anybody know what this is about? Mikan was harassed off the internet by people offsite Grognards.txt superstar and literal nazi TheRpgPundit and stalker Zak S was hired on as a consultant of 5e by Mike Mearls. When complaints were brought to Mike he looked into it by giving the names of all the people to Zak, who drove a mob onto those people Now Mike has a rainbow twitter avatar and is aggressively pushing inclusivity. Because those crusty shitheads can only guy the game once
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Oct 3, 2018 12:43
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SHY NUDIST GRRL posted:Mikan was harassed off the internet by people offsite 
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Oct 3, 2018 14:02
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Whenever I played D&D with my friends back in high school we bent or broke the rules all the time because a) it's more important that people are having fun and exciting encounters rather than remembering precisely what cantrips your Wizard can play on this round, and b) we were dumb teenagers who were too stupid to memorize the rulebook anyway. The idea that people lose friendships over AD&D litigation seriously boggles the mind.
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Oct 3, 2018 14:24
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exquisite tea posted:Whenever I played D&D with my friends back in high school we bent or broke the rules all the time because a) it's more important that people are having fun and exciting encounters rather than remembering precisely what cantrips your Wizard can play on this round, and b) we were dumb teenagers who were too stupid to memorize the rulebook anyway. The idea that people lose friendships over AD&D litigation seriously boggles the mind. Yeah, if anything playing 4E made me realize how much we used to play around 3.5E because of how clunky it was, and then I just stopped playing D&D for years, going into an L5R campaign and then a homebrew for a bit.
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Oct 3, 2018 14:40
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Absurd Alhazred posted:No, no, I remembered there was one that was more-or-less D&D compatible. It's the Book of Erotic Fantasy, it was an OGL thing. But apparently Book of Vile Darkness also has sexpest nonsense. I'll never get people that want to have an erotic adventure at a dungeons and dragons table. Like I'm good for sex fun, and I don't even mind that much if you are a bit weird about it because tbh humans like sex and that's ok, but I can't think of anything less erotically charged than talking about sex with cheetoh dave, greasy steve, guy who smells like cat pee and the one girl in the gaming group who looks like an uncooked ham and spends most of the time eating her hair and drawing unicorns (Always plays bard for some reason).
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Oct 3, 2018 15:13
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What derails a thread faster, 4e or 50 foot ant?
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Oct 3, 2018 15:29
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lifg posted:What derails a thread faster, 4e or 50 foot ant? Tipping your well done circumcised hot dog sandwich with ketchup on it. That's what.
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Oct 3, 2018 15:31
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ToxicSlurpee posted:Tipping your well done circumcised hot dog sandwich with ketchup on it. That's what. Anything about food seems to derail goons like nothing else.
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Oct 3, 2018 15:41
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Rhymenoserous posted:I'll never get people that want to have an erotic adventure at a dungeons and dragons table. Like I'm good for sex fun, and I don't even mind that much if you are a bit weird about it because tbh humans like sex and that's ok, but I can't think of anything less erotically charged than talking about sex with cheetoh dave, greasy steve, guy who smells like cat pee and the one girl in the gaming group who looks like an uncooked ham and spends most of the time eating her hair and drawing unicorns (Always plays bard for some reason). At least one of these people is really horny and has poor to no ideas of boundaries
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Oct 3, 2018 15:49
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Ghost Leviathan posted:At least one of these people is really horny and has poor to no ideas of boundaries It's Greasy Steve. He's slowly banging his way through the local cabal of Wal-Mart greeters, oddly enough.
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Oct 3, 2018 15:59
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ToxicSlurpee posted:Tipping your well done circumcised hot dog sandwich with ketchup on it. That's what. But is it okay to put pineapples on it?
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Oct 3, 2018 16:06
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BurntCornMuffin posted:But is it okay to put pineapples on it? Only if you wipe front to back
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Oct 3, 2018 16:14
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