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VulgarandStupid posted:https://www.amazon.com/WIN-150W-Mini-ITX-Black-BQ656T-AD150TB3/dp/B01LVV6WVU I've been looking at those. I had an old inwin case years ago and the build quality was great. I guess reusing an old Atx psu isn't as important as size. Thank you!
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Oct 28, 2018 11:05
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So, I am working on this build in a Fractal Design Nano S, with a 9600k chip. I was planning on just air cooling it, but I am looking now and between the size of decent CPU coolers, limited space int he case and the fact I would be spending 50-80 on a cooler anyway, I am wondering if it makes more sense to use an AIO. Can anyone advise on if reasonable AIO's can be had in that price range? Or is the reality that I need to get over 100 for them to be decent? any advice is appreciated.
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Oct 31, 2018 16:07
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emocrat posted:So, I am working on this build in a Fractal Design Nano S, with a 9600k chip. I was planning on just air cooling it, but I am looking now and between the size of decent CPU coolers, limited space int he case and the fact I would be spending 50-80 on a cooler anyway, I am wondering if it makes more sense to use an AIO. A cooler master master liquid 240 lite can be had for 55$ or so, and you won't really get appreciably better performance until you double that. The fans run a little louder than normal for that, but Tom's hardware only clocked it at 40db which is well within "quiet" for me. Watch out though, there's also a rbg version which is ~15 dollars more, for that money I'd rather just get the biggest noctua I can and be done with it.
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Nov 1, 2018 01:27
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The nano-s has sufficient room for the biggest, baddest air coolers. It will be tight, but they fit. If you really want to strap an AIO on to something in there, I suggest the GPU.
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Nov 1, 2018 11:33
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Filthy Monkey posted:The nano-s has sufficient room for the biggest, baddest air coolers. It will be tight, but they fit. I have an H200i which is a similar case and I approve. I have a 8086K and a RTX 2080, with a Noctua D15s on the CPU and I’m waiting on the EVGA Hybrid Kits because the GPU’s thermal is the bigger issue!
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Nov 3, 2018 18:26
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Thanks for the replies guys. I went ahead and ordered all my stuff except for the GPU, still musing on that one. I settled on a Be Quiet Dark Rock 4 for the CPU. Once things arrive and get assembled I'll report back with pics. Super excited to get it all together. Thanks again for all the input.
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Nov 3, 2018 18:32
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Thinking about building a small computer I can use in the office at work. 2400g w/ stealth cooler Streacom F1C Evo WS Black ASRock AMD B450 ITX 970 evo 500GB 120W nanoPSU and AC/DC adapter block (Streacom) That look like it'll work? I've got 2x4GB of DDR4 already. The stealth cooler is the max height that fits that case. I wonder how much clearance it has between the top of the fan and the case top panel. I may use a Noctua low profile cooler instead. I just want a machine I can code on with a few browser windows open and basic poo poo like FTP clients. The APU should handle basic gaming OK, for the nights I'm in a hotel. GRINDCORE MEGGIDO fucked around with this message at 17:45 on Nov 4, 2018 |
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Nov 4, 2018 17:43
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So with BF5 coming out and actually having a job, I think I want to take advantage of holiday sales to build a new computer. I have had the same huge, black Lian Li case for like 10 years (LxWxH without feet or screws is 19.75 x 8.25 x 19.75 inches). I want something that isn't as much as a visual sink, and probably want to make use of watercooling because my wife and I share a home office and I don't like hearing my fans drone on. I have been reading this thread a bit and I really dig Filthy Monkey's stuff he's been posting the last couple of pages. It doesn't seem like the smallest solution, but I don't need something ultra tiny, just a little smaller would be nice. It doesn't look like they make the Fractal Design Nano S in white, but that's okay. That's what vinyl is for. So this is what I have so far. Like I said, I have't built a computer in like 10 years so I have got no fuckin' clue. I've never watercooled before either, so I'm kind of flying by the seat of my pants with that. PCPartsPicker List: https://pcpartpicker.com/list/V6HkRJ CPU: Intel - Core i7-7700 3.6GHz Quad-Core Processor CPU Cooler: Corsair - H115i PRO 55.4 CFM Liquid CPU Cooler Motherboard: ASRock - H270M-ITX/ac Mini ITX LGA1151 Motherboard Memory: G.Skill - Trident Z RGB 16GB (2 x 8GB) DDR4-3600 Memory GPU: EVGA - GeForce GTX 1080 8GB FTW Hybrid Gaming Video Card Case: Fractal Design - Define Nano S Mini ITX Desktop Case PSU: Corsair - 760W 80+ Platinum Certified Fully-Modular ATX Power Supply This comes out to a little shy of 1700 bucks excluding tax. I figure this is a starting point to have you guys tear apart and help me figure out what works. Ideally I'd like to bring the cost down to around 1400 or so, and I think I'm probably going overboard with watercooling my CPU and having a hybrid GPU as well. I've never used anything but the cheapest fans, so if I can air cool with nicer, quieter fans that would be great. Also, I'd like to be able to keep that modular sound panel on the top of the case on, if possible.
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Nov 4, 2018 21:17
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You didn't tell us your monitor resolution and refresh rate. Besides selecting a 2 generation old chip, you're not too far off base. Here's my adjustment. You can also save good money going with 3200 mhz memory for not much loss in performance. I felt the 1070ti was a good cash/performance tradeoff as well. If you go into the build, the graphics card selection is based on a filter that has some 1080's in it. Buy windows in SA-Mart, you may well want some fans as well if quiet is the goal. I like the Be Quiet! Pure Wings as a medium price/performance balance. https://cpu.userbenchmark.com/Compare/Intel-Core-i7-7700-vs-AMD-Ryzen-5-2600X/3887vs3956 PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant CPU: AMD - Ryzen 5 2600X 3.6GHz 6-Core Processor ($209.99 @ Amazon) CPU Cooler: Corsair - H110i 113.0 CFM Liquid CPU Cooler ($115.99 @ Amazon) Motherboard: MSI - B450I GAMING PLUS AC Mini ITX AM4 Motherboard ($118.99 @ Newegg) Memory: G.Skill - Trident Z RGB 16GB (2 x 8GB) DDR4-3600 Memory ($177.98 @ Newegg) Storage: Western Digital - Blue 1TB M.2-2280 Solid State Drive ($149.89 @ OutletPC) Video Card: EVGA - GeForce GTX 1070 Ti 8GB SC GAMING ACX 3.0 Black Edition Video Card ($429.99 @ Amazon) Case: Fractal Design - Define Nano S Mini ITX Desktop Case ($77.48 @ Newegg) Power Supply: EVGA - SuperNOVA G3 650W 80+ Gold Certified Fully-Modular ATX Power Supply ($74.20 @ Amazon) Total: $1354.51 Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available Generated by PCPartPicker 2018-11-04 20:07 EST-0500
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Nov 5, 2018 02:10
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Wonder what the chance is of it hitting that speed. Might have less problem with flare x @c14 3200 for ryzen. But I'd check benchmarks for that game at the chosen Res before choosing a CPU. GRINDCORE MEGGIDO fucked around with this message at 02:23 on Nov 5, 2018 |
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Nov 5, 2018 02:19
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Whoops sorry about that. I have an Acer G246HL. It's not fancy, and I'm bad at video games anyway so I know my monitor isn't holding me back. I used to use my 720p TV as a monitor, which is why my system worked for so long, because I was running everything on such a low resolution. So, 1920x1080 native @ 60 Hz. I posted a bit in the GPU thread and I came to the conclusion that I don't want to delve into 4K right now, and with a 1080 Ti and a 2080 about the same price, I think I'm going to go with the 2080. I think this will allow me to jump to 1440p, 140 Hz if I decide to (which I will probably do after the new year, I want to kind of do this in phases.) I'll play with my partspicker thing now that I'm not phone posting and take a look. Thank you for the feedback, I'm so fuckin' out of the game it's daunting. Edit: The 2080 ups the price a bit but with a phased build it won't be too bad. I can watch and look for deals. Target Practice fucked around with this message at 02:56 on Nov 5, 2018 |
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Nov 5, 2018 02:50
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I'm building in a Nano S now (ordered stuff Thursday). It was suggested to me in this thread to use an sfx PSU and an adapter, as the clearance between the PSU and GPU is really tight if you use a full size PSU. I chose to go that route and you might consider it yourself. Keep an eye one your total power consumption though, as you can only get so large an sfx PSU.
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Nov 5, 2018 02:59
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emocrat posted:I'm building in a Nano S now (ordered stuff Thursday). It was suggested to me in this thread to use an sfx PSU and an adapter, as the clearance between the PSU and GPU is really tight if you use a full size PSU. Yeah that's a main concern. This is the card I was looking at, straight from EVGA it's $699. https://www.evga.com/products/product.aspx?pn=08G-P4-2080-KR
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Nov 5, 2018 03:25
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Streacom da2 will 100% be in my future. Looks like a really nice case.
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Nov 5, 2018 23:30
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The faux-Mac look of it is slick. That's probably where i'm going next, because the CPU cooler restrictions of the SG13 are being felt with my non-k i7 8700.
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Nov 6, 2018 01:05
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Okay so bear with me here. PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant CPU: AMD - Ryzen 5 2600X 3.6 GHz 6-Core Processor ($209.99 @ Amazon) CPU Cooler: Corsair - H90 94.0 CFM Liquid CPU Cooler ($100.00) Motherboard: MSI - B450I GAMING PLUS AC Mini ITX AM4 Motherboard ($118.89 @ OutletPC) Memory: G.Skill - Trident Z 16GB (2 x 8GB) DDR4-3200 Memory ($124.99 @ Newegg Business) Storage: Western Digital - Blue 1TB M.2-2280 Solid State Drive ($139.89 @ OutletPC) Video Card: EVGA GeForce RTX 2080 GAMING, 08G-P4-2080-KR, 8GB GDDR6, RGB LED P/N: 08G-P4-2080-KR ($699 @ EVGA) Case: Fractal Design - Define Nano S Mini ITX Desktop Case ($77.48 @ Newegg) Power Supply: EVGA - SuperNOVA GM 650W 80+ Gold Certified Fully-Modular SFX Power Supply ($129.99 @ B&H) Case Fan: Noctua - NF-P14s redux-1500 PWM 78.7 CFM 140mm Fan ($14.95 @ Amazon) Total: $1615 I'm trying to think about how to build this thing, without removing the top modular sound panel. Does this airflow/card idea work? I don't really want to shell out for water cooling on both the GPU and CPU, and it seems like the CPU would need it more? This card is $700 from EVGA, and it seems like it would be able to remove the shroud on the card in the event of dust and stuff in the fins. Alternate layout: use a full 280mm cooler for the CPU, and put an intake fan on the bottom of the case as close to the blower fan as I can get, to draft right into the card. It looks like a fan can be mounted on the bottom there.
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Nov 6, 2018 06:44
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Target Practice posted:I don't really want to shell out for water cooling on both the GPU and CPU, and it seems like the CPU would need it more?
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Nov 6, 2018 06:59
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Llamadeus posted:I think it's the opposite, GPUs with 120mm radiators outperform every air cooled GPU due to size and weight limitations on the card (and a blower is the worst GPU cooling you can get). Whereas larger CPU coolers easily outperform 120 and 140mm radiators. I'm not familiar with water cooling GPUs, would there even be enough room in there? I like the Nano S because its a pretty good size (I don't need ultra tiny), but I'd just be worried about fitting a PSU and card and cooling block and cpu cooler all in that vertical space. Maybe I should look into another mini ITX case?
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Nov 6, 2018 07:21
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Maybe? There are examples of people using AIOs for the CPU, the GPU or both on PCPartPicker (though none of the 20xx hybrids are out yet afaik): I'm 90% sure that a blower cooler is still worse than open air cooling even with an ATX PSU blocking some of the airflow. Llamadeus fucked around with this message at 07:56 on Nov 6, 2018 |
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Nov 6, 2018 07:34
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Target Practice posted:I'm not familiar with water cooling GPUs, would there even be enough room in there? I like the Nano S because its a pretty good size (I don't need ultra tiny), but I'd just be worried about fitting a PSU and card and cooling block and cpu cooler all in that vertical space.  I put the radiator exhausting out the top which causes the fans to overlap the memory sockets, but apart from having to remove the fan if I need to swap out the modules it's not a huge problem. 
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Nov 6, 2018 09:51
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Neat watercooling setup. I've never really messed with it, but I can appreciate the results from those who do. The sf600 platinum review is out from jonnyguru. It is pretty much the sf600 gold, but with better efficiency and cables. I have the gold, and can confirm it is excellent. I am sure this thing will make it into plenty of SFF systems. http://www.jonnyguru.com/modules.php?name=NDReviews&op=Story&reid=567 If you can fit an SFX-L in your system, like with a nano-s, I think that the new seasonic gold unit is a fine option too. https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817151224&cm_re=seasonic_sfx-_-17-151-224-_-Product
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Nov 6, 2018 13:55
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Man that water-cooled setup is cool, it makes me super nervous to try and set something like that up though 
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Nov 6, 2018 16:43
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I would love to setup something like that for my computer too, but the H200i is not the best designed case for a full water cooling setup. I would only be able to have one radiator on it, because I don't think I could get a 120 to fit on the top or back.
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Nov 6, 2018 16:50
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Is a setup like that fairly quiet? I wouldn't want to open the top panel of the Nano S for noise control reasons, so that's why I wasn't considering two large radiators. If that's not an issue, I would shell out for nice quiet fans and do something like that. Is it a lot more complicated than like those one piece AIO setups?
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Nov 6, 2018 16:59
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Target Practice posted:Is a setup like that fairly quiet? I wouldn't want to open the top panel of the Nano S for noise control reasons, so that's why I wasn't considering two large radiators. If that's not an issue, I would shell out for nice quiet fans and do something like that. Is it a lot more complicated than like those one piece AIO setups? It's definitely a bit trickier to fit than an AIO, but not hard. Do a lot of test fitting and figure out how to route things before you start buying stuff. I bought a whole lot of fittings that ended up unused because I didn't check what I actually needed before I started. I used soft tubing which is pretty easy to work with, just make sure you get the fittings properly seated and tightened on the hoses to avoid leaks. The only real headache with non-AIO water cooling is you need to drain and replace the liquid occasionally. I've run mine for almost a year and haven't seen any evidence of leaks or algae growth, but I've seen it recommended to drain, flush and replace the coolant at least once a year regardless.
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Nov 6, 2018 17:43
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buglord posted:The faux-Mac look of it is slick. That's probably where i'm going next, because the CPU cooler restrictions of the SG13 are being felt with my non-k i7 8700. I'm going to put my 2700x into it, with air cooling. And a water cooled gpu with a 140mm rad, if there's enough clearance with an Atx psu. The mounting system looks neat. Super flexible.
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Nov 7, 2018 01:49
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Decluttered my SG13 by replacing the SSDs with a M.2 drive. Things look slightly less gross inside because of it. I sort of built myself into a corner because I have a NH-L12S CPU cooler which covers a lot of the ASUS Z370 board I have, and needs to come off entirely so I can unscrew the dumb gaming heatsink ASUS has on top of the M.2 port. I really wish these cases were easier to work in. Or better yet, had something like my old, very un-SFF HAF932, where you could remove part of the panel behind the motherboard to add things on the rear.
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Nov 13, 2018 00:52
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buglord posted:Decluttered my SG13 by replacing the SSDs with a M.2 drive. Things look slightly less gross inside because of it. I sort of built myself into a corner because I have a NH-L12S CPU cooler which covers a lot of the ASUS Z370 board I have, and needs to come off entirely so I can unscrew the dumb gaming heatsink ASUS has on top of the M.2 port. I really wish these cases were easier to work in. Or better yet, had something like my old, very un-SFF HAF932, where you could remove part of the panel behind the motherboard to add things on the rear. The z370-i also has a m.2 port on the back of the board
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Nov 13, 2018 01:16
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If anyone wants a Fractal Design Define Nano S (non window version) for free + shipping, let me know. I need the closet space and it's boxed up. It's in good shape and all the bits and bobs are inside it. Should be about 14 lbs shipping weight according to Amazon. EDIT: I'm in the US, 18052. owls or something fucked around with this message at 05:35 on Nov 13, 2018 |
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Nov 13, 2018 05:26
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How much to ship to 93612? I’ll take dibs on it.
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Nov 13, 2018 06:14
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buglord posted:How much to ship to 93612? I’ll take dibs on it. This is what UPS's site gave me using your zip code and mine with Amazon's listed weight and dimensions. 
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Nov 13, 2018 06:26
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Looks good to me. PayPal or?
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Nov 13, 2018 06:27
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buglord posted:Looks good to me. PayPal or? Sent ya a PM.
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Nov 13, 2018 06:32
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I think it's probably time to replace my core 2 duo E8500 and Radeon 4800. I mean it's only been 8 years or so. I'm currently using a Dell 2407wfp-hc monitor which is 1920x1200 and has a DVI connection. I'd like to play current games and have some future proofing (in case I keep this one for 8 years, too). I do some software development and wouldn't mind spending a bit extra on a GPU for some deep learning performance, too. Right now I have a mid tower that sits in a cabinet under my desk. I'd like to end up with the case on top of my desk instead. If I went SFF, how noisy are they in general? That Dan A4 looks super clever and tiny. Is it loud? I'm not concerned with price, but I'm looking for a sweet spot rather than top performance. It's been 8 years since I built something. Intel something? 32 gigs ram? 1080 or 1080ti? Dan A4 or something better? I've read lots of posts here, but I think I'm past the point of obsessing over this stuff like I used to, so it's hard to tell what's important. Thanks!
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Nov 16, 2018 03:30
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My H200i is very quiet at idle. It gets a little louder at load but I have headphones on so I don't really hear it.
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Nov 16, 2018 07:11
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A bigger ITX case is not "better" but it can have soundproofing and room for quieter cooling parts that take more room, but the size difference is quite enormous next to a Dan. The Dan A4 is great if you want your computer to be as small as possible while using standard parts (vs. something like the S4 mini that is even smaller but needs short GPUs and notebook-like PSUs), but the size limits you nonetheless. Since the A4 doesn't use any soundproofing it's at most roughly as loud as the parts in it under full load - so it depends on what you perceive as "loud" and what parts are in it. While it's possible to build a PC with the new i9 9900k and a founder's edition RTX 2080 Ti in a Dan A4, it's not going to be very quiet under full load because you can't use any huge air cooler or AIO, and most GPUs 1080 Ti and faster that are also reasonably quiet use 2.5 or even 3 slot cooling, which is too large for the A4. A setup with efficient mid-range components with an emphasis on quiet parts will not be "loud" to most people, though. I have an A4 with a i7 7700k and a GTX 1050 Ti, when it's idle it's completely silent but in stress tests the little 92mm fan on the tiny cooler runs at 2500rpm - very audible, but not loud in an annoying way to me. In games it's somewhere in the middle, audible but not loud by any stretch - however, I don't have it sitting right next to my ear on a desk. Either way, a Ryzen 7 2700 comes on a socket that AMD plans to keep for about two more CPU generations and it's alright to cool with eg. a Noctua L9a-AM4 in a Dan. You can also do the 2700X in a larger case with larger coolers. Or start with a Ryzen 5 2600 (6 cores) and upgrade the CPU again later. Either is not as fast as the new Intel 8-core i7/i9 but they're also much cheaper, and with some modern games using all the cores they can (eg. Battlefield, Ubisoft games), I'd say it's more "future-proof" to get a low priced 8 core CPU than a higher clocked 4- or 6-core part, unless you plan to play e-sports titles at high refresh rates or a lot of old, badly threaded/CPU-bound games like most MMOs. 32GB of RAM is the "future proof" option, but keep in mind mini-ITX mainboards usually only have two RAM slots so you'd have to buy two 16GB sticks which cost more than 4x 8GB would. The founder's edition RTX cards all fit into a Dan A4 but they don't shut off their fans while idle yet (to be fixed by a driver later, according to Nvidia) and they're generally a bit louder than the massive 3-slot coolers on third party cards. So, for playing in 1920x1200 for now, I would get a good dual-slot open air GTX 1070 Ti, GTX 1080 or RTX 2070 for a Dan, or 2.5/3-slot parts in a larger case that supports the GPU's size. A GTX 1080 Ti/RTX 2080 or even RTX 2080 Ti could be an option but they're overkill for your current monitor in games. If you want more performance just for deep learning, go all out on a RTX 2080 or 2080 Ti 
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Nov 16, 2018 09:33
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I‘d like to point out that it is possible to buy high end components and throttle their power consumption to reduce heat and noise and gain efficiency. For example a 1080ti throttled to 65% power output would be very quiet and likely still perform better than a stock 1080. CPUs behave similarly, you could limit a 5GHz 9900k to 95W TDP and despite the throttling it would outperform a 9600k in most of not all situations while remaining quiet. The downside of all this is that you gain efficiency at the cost of performance and money. If money is not issue that can make sense, if you are looking for best value for money not so much.
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Nov 16, 2018 12:00
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Filthy Monkey posted:The sf600 platinum review is out from jonnyguru. It is pretty much the sf600 gold, but with better efficiency and cables. I have the gold, and can confirm it is excellent. I am sure this thing will make it into plenty of SFF systems.
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Nov 16, 2018 13:51
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orcane posted:Lots of helpful info It sounds like the a4 sells out everything to be as small as possible for standard parts. Does the next size up help noise any? Is that something like the ncase m1?
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Nov 16, 2018 16:06
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havelock posted:It sounds like the a4 sells out everything to be as small as possible for standard parts. Does the next size up help noise any? Is that something like the ncase m1?  (I think) made this picture: As you can see the A4 is exceptionally small for having room for standard parts - the 50 mm CPU cooler clearance is really its biggest downside. It would only take about 1" more to fit much more potent coolers (eg. Noctua's NH-L9x65 or even NH-L12S) for cooler/quieter operation. The guy is making a slightly larger case - the C4 - which can take 2.5-slot GPUs so that's great, except CPU clearance is still a disappointing 62 mm (but there's room for larger radiators at least). Most SFF cases aren't particularly soundproofed either (unlike, say, a massive ATX case like a Fractal Design Define R6), but the larger cases with a more standard layout (like the M1 or all the cubes) can end up quieter because you can use larger heatsinks/fans instead of small fans which have to work harder, and you don't have components sitting at the outside of the case next to perforated side panels in order to optimize cooling, like in the Dan. Again, the A4 is not a jet engine unless you build it like one, but it's also not going to be silent outside of Windows and the same hardware in a larger mini-ITX case has the potential of running quieter/cooler. Basically fast/quiet/small, pick two. E: Something like the H200i works too, but with 26 liters isntead of 7.2 (Dan A4) or 12.6 (Ncase M1) I hope it has much better compatibility with parts and much better thermals/lower noise - that's not very small anymore
orcane fucked around with this message at 18:38 on Nov 16, 2018 |
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Nov 16, 2018 18:22
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