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dissss posted:All the 4th and 5th gen wagons (and coupes) were made in the USA and then exported from there. They even got special 'Honda of America' badges for the Japanese market. The 3rd Gen coupe was made stateside too.
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Oct 29, 2018 18:24
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KakerMix posted:Dunno how many highschool-level teenagers you guys know but the ones I know think CUVs are lame as all hell not unlike minivans or even wagons before that. I hope as things move towards EV's that it becomes super cheap and easy to slap EV motors and batteries into old cars and we see a bunch of really front-heavy Volvo station wagons driven by 20-somethings.
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Oct 29, 2018 18:30
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KakerMix posted:Dunno how many highschool-level teenagers you guys know but the ones I know think CUVs are lame as all hell not unlike minivans or even wagons before that. I love boxy designs. Those 80s/90s fastbacks are my favourite kinds of cars. Along with S13s. It’s the reason why I bought my new Jetta.
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Oct 29, 2018 19:18
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I’m glad 80s cars finally got the respect they deserved. They were generally really simple shapes and uncluttered.
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Oct 29, 2018 20:17
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davebo posted:I hope as things move towards EV's that it becomes super cheap and easy to slap EV motors and batteries into old cars and we see a bunch of really front-heavy Volvo station wagons driven by 20-somethings. Yeah I hope this legitimately becomes an area of modification, I'd happily swap a car or two of mine over to electric.
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Oct 29, 2018 20:27
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Frond posted:I’m glad 80s cars finally got the respect they deserved. They were generally really simple shapes and uncluttered. As far as I'm concerned the 1987 Honda Accord my parents had when I was growing up was peak automotive design - low bonnet, pop up headlights, huge glasshouse with excellent visibility. Obviously as unsafe as hell compared to a modern car but it was just so nice to look at and be in.
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Oct 29, 2018 21:00
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Also seems like it'd be a hell of a lot easier updating the head unit in old cars to some fancy double-din android auto carplay deal than modern cars with their looks-like-it-should-but-doesn't-retract touch screens and dozen steering wheel buttons that might not all map properly to a third party unit. If you gut the engine and electrics on most 80's cars what's the next worst component, heat/aircon?
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Oct 29, 2018 21:10
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Frond posted:I’m glad 80s cars finally got the respect they deserved. They were generally really simple shapes and uncluttered. The respect 80's cars deserved in general was to be melted down for razor blades
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Oct 29, 2018 21:36
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Frond posted:Yes. I like wagons too but the market speaks. Marketing speaks.
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Oct 29, 2018 22:10
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davebo posted:
The actual structure of the car. No way electric conversions of old cars is going to work because they'll simply never be safe enough.
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Oct 29, 2018 23:59
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dissss posted:The actual structure of the car. No way electric conversions of old cars is going to work because they'll simply never be safe enough. They can work just fine, just will be understood they are unsafe compared to modern cars in terms of crash safety. Kinda like people who drive around old cars right now.
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Oct 30, 2018 00:22
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KakerMix posted:They can work just fine, just will be understood they are unsafe compared to modern cars in terms of crash safety. Kinda like people who drive around old cars right now. An aging fleet is a problem already actively being worked on in many parts of the world - if older vehicles stop dropping out of the fleet then there will have to be some serious disincentives to cover the extra health costs.
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Oct 30, 2018 01:11
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Just install a full roll cage during the conversion 
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Oct 30, 2018 01:27
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dissss posted:An aging fleet is a problem already actively being worked on in many parts of the world - if older vehicles stop dropping out of the fleet then there will have to be some serious disincentives to cover the extra health costs. If personal cars remain a thing in society then manufacturers are going to have to make cars that people want and can afford otherwise it doesn't matter how ~worked on~ the problem is. I also don't think the idea that young kids are putting electric drivetrains in old cars as a matter of needing transport, but done more as a style thing ala rat rod or whatever. Kids hate cars these days, you know? Electrify them and get them excited about it then they can bring their electric Delta 88 to Cars and Coffee.
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Oct 30, 2018 02:07
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dissss posted:As far as I'm concerned thing from my childhood is best thing. I realize nostalgia is a hell of a drug, but some self-awareness would be nice to see around here occasionally. Nothing personal, half the forum does it. Like what you like but at least acknowledge it.
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Oct 30, 2018 05:02
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I didn't say I'd drive round in a 1987 Accord now, just that the design is far more appealing to be in than anything modern.
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Oct 30, 2018 05:50
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Its just a basic 3 box design shat out with a Prelude nose. It is so bland beige paint thinks its too boring. As godfucking awful the new Civic is to me thats at least got real personality. The 1987 Accord is the car Glenn from accounts drives before having dinner and watching whatever boring rear end sitcom was on TV then and going to bed at exactly 930pm.
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Oct 30, 2018 07:18
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The Accord Aerodeck in design terms is a really nice looking car, 80s Hondas were all understated, good-looking cars and if you don't appreciate that these days then you probably shouldn't be critiquing car design.
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Oct 30, 2018 08:03
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CAT INTERCEPTOR posted:Its just a basic 3 box design shat out with a Prelude nose. It is so bland beige paint thinks its too boring. Compare Glenn's 1987 beige Accord to the cars of today and it stands out basically screaming. Everything today looks like the new Civic which is why the simple box shapes from before are coming back in terms of appreciation. Glenn today drives some swoopy silver creased-up Hyundai SUV/CUV, and his boss drives a BMW X5. Also silver. When everything is a whoopy cushion with speed vents covered in aluminum foil a basic 3 box design with a wedge nose is refreshing as heck.
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Oct 30, 2018 08:12
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CAT INTERCEPTOR posted:
Nah that would have been a Camira. Maybe a Commodore if Glenn had a raise that year.
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Oct 30, 2018 08:34
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Is there actually any space for good creative design in the car industry today? Has it all been regulated away by safety standards etc. or are manufacturers just lazy and creatively bankrupt? I used to think it was the former but then, things like the Disco Volante exist..
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Oct 30, 2018 08:42
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Grakkus posted:Is there actually any space for good creative design in the car industry today? Has it all been regulated away by safety standards etc. or are manufacturers just lazy and creatively bankrupt? I used to think it was the former but then, things like the Disco Volante exist.. It's a multi-layered issue I'd imagine. From car sketches increasingly looking like those exaggerated pencil figure fashion sketches and design seeming to be insular and circular where they crib another design but exaggerate it in a kind of feedback loop, Marketing and Manufacturers not wanting to commit to an actually unique shape for both cost and marketing reasons, regulations and simple physics dictating designs that would 100% objectively be safer but limit design space and so on.
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Oct 30, 2018 11:52
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Grakkus posted:Is there actually any space for good creative design in the car industry today? Has it all been regulated away by safety standards etc. or are manufacturers just lazy and creatively bankrupt? I used to think it was the former but then, things like the Disco Volante exist.. Safety standards affect a lot of things on modern cars, from bumper heights, bumper attack angles, headlight placement, bonnet angles and sizes, wingmirror profiles, windscreen angles... The list is truly loving nuts. This is why most cars are similarly shaped and the only real variation you get is the amount of creases your body panels have and how much plastic you have covering fake vents. High volume models will invariably be boring, design-by-numbers cars because they have to adhere more stringent standards because they're more numerous on the roads. Cars like the Disco Volante are such small runs that the rules are more lax, it's highly unlikely these will be around too much to annihilate a pedestrian's shins in a crash sending their skull through the windscreen. This is how Lamborghini get away with not actually having what normal people would describe as 'bumpers' and instead just all being body. Basically if you're rich you get more choice because designers are able to go more outrageous and have it actually stand a chance at being built (because gently caress poor people's safety). Every company has designers that can put out pretty cars but a combination of safety standards, market restriction and the dreaded design committee forcing lovely trends means cars these days are mostly bollocks outside of high end stuff. Olympic Mathlete fucked around with this message at 12:12 on Oct 30, 2018 |
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Oct 30, 2018 12:07
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dissss posted:As far as I'm concerned the 1987 Honda Accord my parents had when I was growing up was peak automotive design - low bonnet, pop up headlights, huge glasshouse with excellent visibility. Obviously as unsafe as hell compared to a modern car but it was just so nice to look at and be in. Fitting song: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8FM6b1cLC84 I'm partial to the gen after that:  Such a pure, honest 90s design. Also, glass headlamp covers that never, ever go cloudy like the plastic poo poo on 99% of today's cars.
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Oct 30, 2018 12:22
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https://twitter.com/joelfeder/status/1057232339795894273quote:The eCOPO Camaro was built in partnership with Hancock and Lane Racing, which have been one of the few trailblazers of electric vehicle drag racing. The electric COPO Camaro Concept is entirely electric, driven by an electric motor providing the equivalent of more than 700 horsepower and 600 lb-ft of torque supplied from GM’s first 800-volt battery pack.
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Oct 30, 2018 13:05
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Rigged Death Trap posted:It's a multi-layered issue I'd imagine. From car sketches increasingly looking like those exaggerated pencil figure fashion sketches and design seeming to be insular and circular where they crib another design but exaggerate it in a kind of feedback loop, Marketing and Manufacturers not wanting to commit to an actually unique shape for both cost and marketing reasons, regulations and simple physics dictating designs that would 100% objectively be safer but limit design space and so on. Olympic Mathlete posted:Safety standards affect a lot of things on modern cars, from bumper heights, bumper attack angles, headlight placement, bonnet angles and sizes, wingmirror profiles, windscreen angles... The list is truly loving nuts. This is why most cars are similarly shaped and the only real variation you get is the amount of creases your body panels have and how much plastic you have covering fake vents. I guess I'll just keep driving old cars with personality then (until I can afford a Disco Volante!)
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Oct 30, 2018 13:26
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I agree that safety requirements limit how cars can be designed, but I think it's important to remember that the safety requirements are... more important than looking good and I'm glad we have them.
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Oct 30, 2018 13:54
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KillHour posted:I agree that safety requirements limit how cars can be designed, but I think it's important to remember that the safety requirements are... more important than looking good and I'm glad we have them. Nah, safety standards are only a requirement if you crash your poo poo. It's like putting a condom on when you wake up just in case you accidentally fall dick-first into loving during the day  (Also the reaction you get flashing pop up headlights at kids staring at your car on the roads is the single best reaction and totally worth driving a 'lovely' by modern standards car  )
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Oct 30, 2018 14:15
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Agreed, I'd rather live in a world with stringent driving tests and frequent retesting, that allow for cars to have more relaxed safety standards. But oh well, no point daydreaming.Olympic Mathlete posted:(Also the reaction you get flashing pop up headlights at kids staring at your car on the roads is the single best reaction and totally worth driving a 'lovely' by modern standards car Try driving a Citroen and bobbing your suspension up and down at them at a stoplight
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Oct 30, 2018 14:22
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Olympic Mathlete posted:Nah, safety standards are only a requirement if you crash your poo poo. It's like putting a condom on when you wake up just in case you accidentally fall dick-first into loving during the day 
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Oct 30, 2018 14:31
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Grakkus posted:Agreed, I'd rather live in a world with stringent driving tests and frequent retesting, that allow for cars to have more relaxed safety standards. But oh well, no point daydreaming. it's not like europe, which has significantly more stringent driving tests, is some beautiful land of mexican-style automotive safety standards
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Oct 30, 2018 14:36
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Olympic Mathlete posted:Nah, safety standards are only a requirement if you crash your poo poo. It's like putting a condom on when you wake up just in case you accidentally fall dick-first into loving during the day You might be a great driver, but that won't save you from an idiot glued to their phone T-boning you.
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Oct 30, 2018 14:45
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Godzilla07 posted:You might be a great driver, but that won't save you from an idiot glued to their phone T-boning you. I know, I was kidding hence the smiley face at the end of that sentence. I'm still gonna drive lovely old cars though, the fear of death at every turn just makes them more fun.
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Oct 30, 2018 14:47
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KYOON GRIFFEY JR posted:it's not like europe, which has significantly more stringent driving tests, is some beautiful land of mexican-style automotive safety standards
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Oct 30, 2018 14:49
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Can’t wait until technology gets to the point where everybody can just stay home
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Oct 30, 2018 14:54
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BMW didn't force anyone to buy the X6, they bought it because they liked how it looks. You're just old and out of touch with current tastes. Sorry.
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Oct 30, 2018 15:08
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Grakkus posted:I'm not sure what you mean? I'm not implying that average European driving tests are up to the standard I would have them in my utopian alternate reality, in a lot of countries they are pretty lovely. But there is a correlation between thoroughness of driving tests and frequency of crashes. If the quality of the average driver was high enough, there wouldn't be a need for as overwhelming safety regulations as there are now. I think he just means that in Europe, where driving tests are better than they are in the US, they still have relatively high safety/crash standards for design.
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Oct 30, 2018 15:20
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Throatwarbler posted:BMW didn't force anyone to buy the X6, they bought it because they liked how it looks. You're just old and out of touch with current tastes. Sorry. Nah, it's ugly as gently caress and I give every single one I see a look of disgust in hopes that the owner might peel their eyes off their phone and see me.
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Oct 30, 2018 15:32
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Grakkus posted:If the quality of the average driver was high enough, there wouldn't be a need for as overwhelming safety regulations as there are now. This is a stunningly stupid argument. Even the most highly-trained people make mistakes, or experience mechanical failures, because humans and machines are both imperfect. Improving driver training is absolutely something that should be done, but it's a complete non sequitur to say that if we lower the incidence of crashes we should then roll back safety regulations.
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Oct 30, 2018 15:34
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I'm not saying it would be rolled back to the 60s "what are seatbelts" levels, but not every car would have to be a giant, slit-windowed, expensive blob-tank. Which is not to say that they couldn't continue to exist for those who prioritise safety, of course.
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Oct 30, 2018 16:17
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